- 09-15-2005, 12:25 AM
- 09-15-2005, 12:27 AM
09-15-2005, 12:32 AM
I did and didn't find anything. If it's been discussed already, sorry guysOriginally Posted by Matthew D
09-15-2005, 12:43 AM
09-15-2005, 12:44 AM
09-15-2005, 12:51 AM
To add...this also discounts those that directly mediate estrogen related-side effects. Anadrol might not aromatize, but its a no-no.
09-15-2005, 01:30 AM
09-15-2005, 11:38 AM
09-15-2005, 05:38 PM
09-15-2005, 08:28 PM
anavar is a great addition to tren, as well as OT and to a lesser extent winny (go with the inj if you can). Winstrol is in theory very anabolic but in real world it results with very few mass gains but more of a hardening effect, in a nutshell it shouldn't be used as a standalone, either oral or injectable Go for the var, that's what I would do, altough its not the most cheap gear, you can get powder for cheap on some good sources....
09-16-2005, 11:07 AM
09-16-2005, 01:09 PM
1-Testosterone may not be as good as tren but it's an decent option and you get zero estrogen conversion
09-16-2005, 01:57 PM
deca may not aromatize to estrogen but will give you all the same problems that are typically associated with excess estrogenOriginally Posted by Gethuge
09-16-2005, 07:31 PM
09-16-2005, 07:36 PM
09-17-2005, 01:36 PM
09-17-2005, 03:18 PM
Yeah, I would too...but can't seem to find much if any info in it. I'll try and do some more searching when I get a chance bud...it seems like an interesting compound to say the least.
09-19-2005, 02:59 AM
most anabolic w/o aromatizing? anadrol. keep in mind that not that many steroids aromatize. best for stacking with tren? um...test of course, EQ is ok, cant go wrong with var....why do you want non-aromatizing steroids anyway? worried about tren gyno? just use letro and you'll be fine.
09-19-2005, 03:03 AM
Originally Posted by same_oldOpposite direction from where I'm trying to goIt has been suggested that the estrogenic effects of oxymetholone may not be as much mediated by estrogen, as by oxymetholone itself activating the estrogen receptor.
Edit: Also, tren gyno is caused by elevated prolactin levels. I wasn't aware that letro affected circulating prolactin?
09-19-2005, 04:09 PM
I believe that prolactin can only cause gyno when estrogen is present. So I guess that if you keep your estrogen down w/ letro, than tren won't give you gyno. Why not do your tren w/ test, bromocriptine, and nolva. That'll keep the man boobs away.Originally Posted by noctorum
09-20-2005, 07:32 AM
Not only that, androgens decrease prolactin levels. The chance of having a lot of circulating prolactin on tren is non-existent. Prolactin is just another fairy-tale invented by morons who can't explain something.
09-20-2005, 07:49 AM
09-20-2005, 09:42 AM
Yes, androgen levels decrease prolactin levels, making any and all involvement of prolactin highly unlikely. On top of that, as bobby pointed out, they have not been known to play any role in the development of breast tissue in the absence of circulating estrogen.
No estrogenic effects have been noted with trenbolone. If there were such effects, they would most likely resemble those of nandrolone. Nandrolone was shown to be 60% as estrogenic as estradiol itself, but neither an aromatase or a progesterone receptor blocker had any effect, and an estrogen receptor blocker had very little effect. Turned out that it was nandrolone activating estrogen-related transcripts via the androgen receptor. Ironic to say the least, since you now had a drug that was more estrogenic than it was anabolic, and the only way to block its estrogenic effects was to block its anabolic effect ...
09-21-2005, 11:45 AM
09-21-2005, 05:23 PM
If you have a leeky tit, perhaps you had low androgen levels and prolactin issues prior to your androgen use.
If such issues occur they can also be the result of poor post-cycle combined with starting a new cycle too soon, leaving you with prolonged periods of time with low androgens, high estrogens and high prolactin levels.
If you have a tit, regardless, I wouldn't be so worried about prolactin and lactation, I'd be more concerned with resolving the problem and therefore treating it with an anti-estrogen ...
09-30-2005, 09:11 PM
09-30-2005, 10:17 PM
10-03-2005, 09:50 AM
10-03-2005, 10:59 AM
deca is great if you use it responsibly.
and big cat i dont buy what you're selling about prolactin and progestinic steroids. too many documented cases, plus clinical trials that show progestins as estrogen agonists and gyno facilitators.
just use your anti-e's, kids, and look into cabergoline on deca.
10-03-2005, 11:13 AM
Feel free to point me in the general direction of these 'documented cases'.Originally Posted by same_old
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