Its Known Tha Traditional AAS>DS.. Curious why some still choose DS

[nixon0808]

Whats up fellas, my first post here but im active on many other boards. Please don't take what Im about to say the wrong way, I honestly am just curious as to why some of you choose designer steroids as oppsosed to traditional AAS.

I understand that DS are the big thing here on AM, but I just can't comprehend why anyone would take such a gamble with their health for far inferior results. Traditional AAS have been studied for years upon years and with the exception of a few (tren, EQ) are approved for the use in humans. It just kills me to see these guys running these elobarate stacks of DS with no real medical documentation or clinical studies documenting ANYTHING about the drug, let alone its safety profile.

Im sure those of you who have studied extensively know that this isn't the first time a lot of these DS have been looked into. Many of them have been looked into and first discovered by big pharma back in the 60's 70's but were dropped from further research because of A) their safety profile or B) Simply were not effective as the AAS already available.

Now don't get me wrong, there have been some designer steroids that have been developed that rival traditional oral AAS in terms of effectivness. Superdrol and M1T come to mind. There safety profile however is another story.

So I guess my overall point is why take the gamble with your health when there are clinically studied traditional AAS that big pharma has extensively researched and spent litteraly billions of dollars on to determine not only the effectivness of these AAS but also there safety profiles.


Nixon

 

[Machmood]

I think a huge part is the simplicity and ease of use/purchase. It's easy to go online, click a button and get a bottle of pills shipped to your house then take 3 a day and thats it. Also when buying online you pretty much know EXACTLY what you are buying. When it comes to steroids you have to find a trusted source which can be hard because after all they are illegal. Then once you find the source a good cycle is MUCH more expensive then a DS cycle. Then ontop of all that you have to inject yourself for 2-3 months where a DS cycle is usually 1 month and results are very similiar.

 

[soontobbeast]

i wont even go further than just calling you an idiot.

 

[baitslinger]

Offhand I can think of a few reasons -

Pros:
1. DS are 'legal'

2. DS are readily obtainable, and are cheap.

3. People read reviews and logs about these PH/DS, where bros generally have good experiences, and that's good enough for some people. Who needs controlled scientific studies when you've got broscience, right?

4. There are a few reasonably reputable companies making these things, with reasonably good track records, from what can be seen

Cons:

1. Are they pharma grade? Hell no.

2. Is there any kind of quality control used in their manufacturer processes? Is the product free from contamination? Who knows

3. Here's the worst one - Are they an intro to Steroids for a lot of young people? Hell YES

 

[mark118]

Whats up fellas, my first post here but im active on many other boards. Please don't take what Im about to say the wrong way, I honestly am just curious as to why some of you choose designer steroids as oppsosed to traditional AAS.

I understand that DS are the big thing here on AM, but I just can't comprehend why anyone would take such a gamble with their health for far inferior results. Traditional AAS have been studied for years upon years and with the exception of a few (tren, EQ) are approved for the use in humans. It just kills me to see these guys running these elobarate stacks of DS with no real medical documentation or clinical studies documenting ANYTHING about the drug, let alone its safety profile.

Im sure those of you who have studied extensively know that this isn't the first time a lot of these DS have been looked into. Many of them have been looked into and first discovered by big pharma back in the 60's 70's but were dropped from further research because of A) their safety profile or B) Simply were not effective as the AAS already available.

Now don't get me wrong, there have been some designer steroids that have been developed that rival traditional oral AAS in terms of effectivness. Superdrol and M1T come to mind. There safety profile however is another story.

So I guess my overall point is why take the gamble with your health when there are clinically studied traditional AAS that big pharma has extensively researched and spent litteraly billions of dollars on to determine not only the effectivness of these AAS but also there safety profiles.


Nixon

1: inferior results? which anabolics are you comparing, or just making a sweeping statement about everything?

2: much less research is done on the OTC stuff yes, however, a lot of people have had completely hormone panels done on this stuff where you can see the impact its had on test, oest, liver, lipids, prolactin etc....

3: safety profile? if you run SD for the suggested 3-4 weeks at a 10-20-30 dosage scheme with the appropriate cycle support i see now reason, or heard of before, why you'd be in danger anymore than running dbol at a typical cycle.

4: billions?

5: buying the AAS you're talking about is illegal, and in some cases illegal to possess

6: OTC stuff is purely oral, sublingual, or topical, which makes it a lot more attractive for those who dont want to inject

7: there are a variety of illegal orals, eg dbol and anavar which are effective, but once again, illegal to buy.

8: the benefits seen in a 3-6 cycle of many otc anabolics such as hdrol, epi, sd, m1t, pplex, m14add, tren, mlmg (im sure im missing a few) can yield dam impressive results considering the length of the cycle and their actual legal status, and easily comparable to the old traditional stuff you're referring to

9: toxicity applies to many of the traditional and otc stuff, ie if you abuse it, problems arise. kind of a moot point dont you think?

10: otc stuff, you know what you're getting, CEL does 3rd party COAs, whereas the traditional stuff... there are dozens are thread made on each board as to whether a particular product is fake or not. not a chance i'd like to take, especially when injecting it.

 

[schwellington]

I think a huge part is the simplicity and ease of use/purchase. It's easy to go online, click a button and get a bottle of pills shipped to your house then take 3 a day and thats it. Also when buying online you pretty much know EXACTLY what you are buying. When it comes to steroids you have to find a trusted source which can be hard because after all they are illegal. Then once you find the source a good cycle is MUCH more expensive then a DS cycle. Then ontop of all that you have to inject yourself for 2-3 months where a DS cycle is usually 1 month and results are very similiar.

bull**** your info is WAY off

i wont list prices but i can promise you three months of test, and some dbol is the same price as two bottles of DS

and results?


I have used DS before i jumped into illicit AAS


AAS have put better size on me- period- this is just MY experience



it aint set in stone

 

[nixon0808]

1: inferior results? which anabolics are you comparing, or just making a sweeping statement about everything?

2: much less research is done on the OTC stuff yes, however, a lot of people have had completely hormone panels done on this stuff where you can see the impact its had on test, oest, liver, lipids, prolactin etc....

3: safety profile? if you run SD for the suggested 3-4 weeks at a 10-20-30 dosage scheme with the appropriate cycle support i see now reason, or heard of before, why you'd be in danger anymore than running dbol at a typical cycle.

4: billions?

5: buying the AAS you're talking about is illegal, and in some cases illegal to possess

6: OTC stuff is purely oral, sublingual, or topical, which makes it a lot more attractive for those who dont want to inject

7: there are a variety of illegal orals, eg dbol and anavar which are effective, but once again, illegal to buy.

8: the benefits seen in a 3-6 cycle of many otc anabolics such as hdrol, epi, sd, m1t, pplex, m14add, tren, mlmg (im sure im missing a few) can yield dam impressive results considering the length of the cycle and their actual legal status, and easily comparable to the old traditional stuff you're referring to

9: toxicity applies to many of the traditional and otc stuff, ie if you abuse it, problems arise. kind of a moot point dont you think?

10: otc stuff, you know what you're getting, CEL does 3rd party COAs, whereas the traditional stuff... there are dozens are thread made on each board as to whether a particular product is fake or not. not a chance i'd like to take, especially when injecting it.

Response to #1) Yes, Im referring to the greatly inferior results of ANY DS compared to that of even a simple injectable cycle. (basic testosterone only cycle) Now you add in another injectable as is advisable for intermmediate/advanced users and you're in a whole other league. Scratch that, you're already in a whole other league with a simple testosterone only cycle in comparison to designer steroids.

#3) Yes you're right, the effects on blood pressure/lipids of both DS and traditional ORAL AAS are comparable. Thats not the point im trying to make regarding safety. Obviously any methylated compound is going to have these effects, legal or not. Im speaking of the safety of INJECTABLE AAS in comparison to DS.

#8) Im assuming here you've never ran an injectable cycle, as that last sentence would never come out of the mouth of someone who has. Im not taking anything away from DS, as I said before, yes they can lead to great results but only in comparison to other traditional ORAL AAS (Dbol, anadrol).

#10) This is a valid point, but only for someone who doesnt do the proper research.

At the end of the day, every user of traditional AAS as well as DS is shutting their HPTA down. We're not talking about creatine here, these drugs can be very taxing on the body. Don't you think it would be wise to make the most out of this time? Im a firm believer that with proper pct, most users can return to normal HPTA status, but after how many cycles can the body jolt itself back into homeostasis without having permanetly lowered levels? 4, 5, 10 cycles? No one can answer that, obviously it greatly varies user to user.

But when I see these guys running 4-6 week cycles of orals only, running a pct, then hoping back on for another 4-6 weeks I hope that they realize they are playing a very risky game. For me, and a lot of knowledgable users who are not trying to be on HRT at 30, shut their HPTA down at MAX two times per year, preferably one if you want to play it safe. Which brings me back to my original post of why a longer 10-12 week injectable cycle gives you more bang for your buck so to speak. If you're shuting you HPTA down, you might as well make it worth it.

Thats my 2 cents. I feel that a lot of younger guys feel that because they can go down to their local GNC and buy these DS that they are somehow intrinsicly safer than traditional injectable AAS, when in fact it is the exact opposite. I Hope I don't offend anyone as I know you guys here on AM love you're DS haha.

Nixon

 

[mark118]

Response to #1) Yes, Im referring to the greatly inferior results of ANY DS compared to that of even a simple injectable cycle. (basic testosterone only cycle) Now you add in another injectable as is advisable for intermmediate/advanced users and you're in a whole other league. Scratch that, you're already in a whole other league with a simple testosterone only cycle in comparison to designer steroids.

#3) Yes you're right, the effects on blood pressure/lipids of both DS and traditional ORAL AAS are comparable. Thats not the point im trying to make regarding safety. Obviously any methylated compound is going to have these effects, legal or not. Im speaking of the safety of INJECTABLE AAS in comparison to DS.

#8) Im assuming here you've never ran an injectable cycle, as that last sentence would never come out of the mouth of someone who has. Im not taking anything away from DS, as I said before, yes they can lead to great results but only in comparison to other traditional ORAL AAS (Dbol, anadrol).

#10) This is a valid point, but only for someone who doesnt do the proper research.

At the end of the day, every user of traditional AAS as well as DS is shutting their HPTA down. We're not talking about creatine here, these drugs can be very taxing on the body. Don't you think it would be wise to make the most out of this time? Im a firm believer that with proper pct, most users can return to normal HPTA status, but after how many cycles can the body jolt itself back into homeostasis without having permanetly lowered levels? 4, 5, 10 cycles? No one can answer that, obviously it greatly varies user to user.

But when I see these guys running 4-6 week cycles of orals only, running a pct, then hoping back on for another 4-6 weeks I hope that they realize they are playing a very risky game. For me, and a lot of knowledgable users who are not trying to be on HRT at 30, shut their HPTA down at MAX two times per year, preferably one if you want to play it safe. Which brings me back to my original post of why a longer 10-12 week injectable cycle gives you more bang for your buck so to speak. If you're shuting you HPTA down, you might as well make it worth it.

Thats my 2 cents. I feel that a lot of younger guys feel that because they can go down to their local GNC and buy these DS that they are somehow intrinsicly safer than traditional injectable AAS, when in fact it is the exact opposite. I Hope I don't offend anyone as I know you guys here on AM love you're DS haha.

Nixon

I'm going to discuss each point with reference to the title/subject of your thread ie why people choose OTC over injectables/traditional stuff

1: do you not think its a moot point to compare any oral DS to injectable? It is obvious that injectables can produce better results, but with that comes the need to inject, and they are illegal to buy. hence why so many people choose OTC DS. no injections, run 3-6 weeks with relative ease and legal too.

2: once again, its a moot point. injectables are illegal, and as such its a big risk to source, and even then you're a lot less sure you're getting a legit product compared with an OTC product, risk of sepsis with improper/unsterile technique, just as there's a risk with Orals ie excessive use can result in hepatotixicty. BUT, they both have different risks. its not black and white.

3: my point referring to the old stuff was comparing to the old orals, which you didnt make clear when you 1st started the topic. modern day orals are able to produce easily comparable results to traditional orals. however, to compare an injectable with an oral pointless given everything i've referenced already.

4: research yes, but there is a butt load more of research one has to do to see verify if an illegal steroid is legit, compared with ordering a DS from a major online seller.

5: billions of dollars in research? reference please.

6: buying the AAS you're talking about is illegal, and in some cases illegal to possess

7: I dont agree with the plan of hopping back on n off repeatedly, it is reckless and not how any steroids should be run but then again, you also get people who abuse injectables. schwellington is blasting his body with both. check out his log.

8: if you remove the illegality, and risk of sepsis/impurities, then yea, injectables are safer, BUT the key point to this thread is that not everyone is willing/wanting to go out and source this stuff and risk the consequences, when buying online orals OTC is a easy, fast, and legal.

 

[UnrealMachine]

Nixon have you tried Superdrol, Phera Plex, Epistane, Halodrol, M1T, Dymethazine, Boladrol... etc?

Have you read the logs where people gain 10-15 pounds in the same time frame that it takes test enanthate just to kick in?

Have you seen the DS liquidation sales where you can buy bottles for 10$ each? I've bought myself a handful of cycles for the cost of one vial of test.


My personal experience is that test is about as strong as like... ostarine (lol) just also providing an insane libido boost and gyno. Which to me, means it's simply not worth it's cost. A lot of DS's work sh1ttily on me too, but a handful of the good ones work amazing.

Even having run a few inject cycles, for my next I am likely going all DS again... just because I have a ton that I got dirt cheap (I'm broke btw) and I know they work.
As for health issues, a number of us have gotten bloodwork done... We know that orals are bad for your liver and generally cholesterol... Those issues are taken into account.

If you are concerned for DS abusers then you are right to be but they are just steroid abusers like any other guy that's stacking abombs and halotestin while shooting 2g of gear a week lol... There are lots of steroid abusers around and it's their choice.

 

[chocolatemilk]

Well, well, well... if it isn't the f***ing machine himself

 

[curls]

Unreal I thought you were going clean for a while?

 

[nixon0808]

Nixon have you tried Superdrol, Phera Plex, Epistane, Halodrol, M1T, Dymethazine, Boladrol... etc?

Have you read the logs where people gain 10-15 pounds in the same time frame that it takes test enanthate just to kick in?

Have you seen the DS liquidation sales where you can buy bottles for 10$ each? I've bought myself a handful of cycles for the cost of one vial of test.


My personal experience is that test is about as strong as like... ostarine (lol) just also providing an insane libido boost and gyno. Which to me, means it's simply not worth it's cost. A lot of DS's work sh1ttily on me too, but a handful of the good ones work amazing.

Even having run a few inject cycles, for my next I am likely going all DS again... just because I have a ton that I got dirt cheap (I'm broke btw) and I know they work.
As for health issues, a number of us have gotten bloodwork done... We know that orals are bad for your liver and generally cholesterol... Those issues are taken into account.

If you are concerned for DS abusers then you are right to be but they are just steroid abusers like any other guy that's stacking abombs and halotestin while shooting 2g of gear a week lol... There are lots of steroid abusers around and it's their choice.

Don't get me wrong, as I stated in my earlier post, some DS like superdrol and M1T are equivelant if not superior to any traditional oral AAS.

My point is if you're shutting your HPTA down, why not make the most of the cycle, and save your liver and lipids at the same time (not to mention FEEL 100% better if you run test) by instead of running oral, on top of oral, on top of oral, to instead choose one oral(designer or traditional) and then add a safer and superior injectable anabolic or two of your choice? Now I completely understand if legality is an issue. No issues there.

Nixon

 

[HondaV65]

You're assuming a "one size fits all" approach to usage.

Look - I'm 49 years old ... Jesus blessed me with some good genetics - but I'm no body builder and I have too many herniated disks to be a power lifter.

I also have a life and job ... and a security clearance that I really don't want to lose by being busted using illegal steroids. Mrs. Honda would flip the **** out if she found a needle anywhere in the house - or if, during one of our torrid lovemaking sessions she spotted a huge lump in my Quad or needle marks from injections.

Given all that - why's it worth it for me go to injectables? Like I mentioned earlier - I'm no body builder or power lifter.

My goals with using DS are to (1) Stay legal ... (2) No HPTA shutdown (and I accomplish that with tiny cycles ... spaced FAR apart ... (3) Gain 5 or 10 pounds of lean dry muscle and pick up some strength ... (4) Get a boost in the gym from the feeling of well being I get from the DS. This breaks up the monotony of going to the gym every day - year in and year out.

I also believe my little cycles benefit me throughout the year even when I'm not on them. I just went "off" an 8 week Osta cycle about 4 weeks ago and, before that - a short two week Epi cycle. I looked in the mirror yesterday at the gym and said ... "Damn - it looks like I'm still 'on'". I think these cycles boost my natural test - or at least they keep me anabolic when I'm running natural. I feel like Visigoth and just tore Mrs. Honda down about three hours ago in one of our "Play Doctor" sessions. She says she needs more cardio to keep up! LOL.

If you choose AA's - go for it - I'm not knocking you. I'd prolly do it too if I were a younger man, in my late 20's with a real chance to compete as a BB or PL. Since I'm not - I choose not to go that route. I don't like dealing with PCT's where you're shutdown or any gyno issues. The risk is not worth these things for my goals. IMO - if you go AA you go all "in" or go home.

I really don't know why you started this thread - it's as if you seem to believe that every person is cut from one mold - with the same set of goals when clearly we live in a multi-dimensional, very diverse world where everyone is different.

Again - no one's knocking you for using AA's - if that's your preference - go for it and I wish you luck. But - at the same time - please don't assume you know what's best for everyone here when you don't know anything about us.

 

[AwfullyAmazin]

The only reason I use them is because I do not know any legit sources. If I did I would be pinning right now, lol. It's difficult to find a source, so many websites and people who will rip you off.

 

[soontobbeast]

You're assuming a "one size fits all" approach to usage.

Look - I'm 49 years old ... Jesus blessed me with some good genetics - but I'm no body builder and I have too many herniated disks to be a power lifter.

I also have a life and job ... and a security clearance that I really don't want to lose by being busted using illegal steroids. Mrs. Honda would flip the **** out if she found a needle anywhere in the house - or if, during one of our torrid lovemaking sessions she spotted a huge lump in my Quad or needle marks from injections.

Given all that - why's it worth it for me go to injectables? Like I mentioned earlier - I'm no body builder or power lifter.

My goals with using DS are to (1) Stay legal ... (2) No HPTA shutdown (and I accomplish that with tiny cycles ... spaced FAR apart ... (3) Gain 5 or 10 pounds of lean dry muscle and pick up some strength ... (4) Get a boost in the gym from the feeling of well being I get from the DS. This breaks up the monotony of going to the gym every day - year in and year out.

I also believe my little cycles benefit me throughout the year even when I'm not on them. I just went "off" an 8 week Osta cycle about 4 weeks ago and, before that - a short two week Epi cycle. I looked in the mirror yesterday at the gym and said ... "Damn - it looks like I'm still 'on'". I think these cycles boost my natural test - or at least they keep me anabolic when I'm running natural. I feel like Visigoth and just tore Mrs. Honda down about three hours ago in one of our "Play Doctor" sessions. She says she needs more cardio to keep up! LOL.

If you choose AA's - go for it - I'm not knocking you. I'd prolly do it too if I were a younger man, in my late 20's with a real chance to compete as a BB or PL. Since I'm not - I choose not to go that route. I don't like dealing with PCT's where you're shutdown or any gyno issues. The risk is not worth these things for my goals. IMO - if you go AA you go all "in" or go home.

I really don't know why you started this thread - it's as if you seem to believe that every person is cut from one mold - with the same set of goals when clearly we live in a multi-dimensional, very diverse world where everyone is different.

Again - no one's knocking you for using AA's - if that's your preference - go for it and I wish you luck. But - at the same time - please don't assume you know what's best for everyone here when you don't know anything about us.

so you had some good gains off of two weeks of epistane? a two or three week pulse might be something worth me looking into..

 

[poopypants]

Man, way to introduce yourself to the boards, lol.

I honestly have to say the only reason for me to use OTC orals is straight up legality issues.



On a completely diff note.... Theres no chances with orals of injecting oil directly into a vein which CAN then make its way to your lungs and suffocate you.....

Lol basically my only fear that I know can be avoided by proper aspiration....

 

[morry]

Man, way to introduce yourself to the boards, lol.

I honestly have to say the only reason for me to use OTC orals is straight up legality issues.



On a completely diff note.... Theres no chances with orals of injecting oil directly into a vein which CAN then make its way to your lungs and suffocate you.....

Lol basically my only fear that I know can be avoided by proper aspiration....

Well said.

 

[jason1000]

bull**** your info is WAY off

i wont list prices but i can promise you three months of test, and some dbol is the same price as two bottles of DS

and results?


I have used DS before i jumped into illicit AAS


AAS have put better size on me- period- this is just MY experience



it aint set in stone

3 months of test at what dosage a week?

 

[Sklander]

Why can't people just understand that not everyone wants to A) inject something into their body - something they've probably never done before, B) cannot get the desired injectable product - and if they can, they have no idea if they are being ripped off or not, and C) are not okay with blatantly going out and purchasing illegal drugs - due to a job, school, career, etc...

If you can inject your long chain esters good for you, but it doesn't make you better than anyone else using DS orals to achieve similar results. Get off your high horse and offer some help instead of pushing your ideals that injectables are so much better that anything else is just for ignorant losers.

 

[BarbellBeast]

It's all personal preference. DS/PH work. I've got great results from SD/Phera. More gains than Test? Sure. More keepable than Test? Sometimes not if you don't know what you're doing. Using SD then rolling on 500mg of Test for 12 weeks was the most keepable gains I've ever had. Short 3-4 weekers of SD and usually you will lose most of it in PCT. You can't pack on 20lbs of muscle in 3-4 weeks. Just alot of water.

 

[jason1000]

Both are good but orals aren't as good as injectables for long term muscle gain. Great for very quick gains though.

 

[ZamaMan]

bull**** your info is WAY off

i wont list prices but i can promise you three months of test, and some dbol is the same price as two bottles of DS

and results?


I have used DS before i jumped into illicit AAS


AAS have put better size on me- period- this is just MY experience



it aint set in stone

OH this made me laugh. Are you really gonna compare your legal cycles to that stupidly harsh/reckless cycle? The reason yku say illegal aas is better is because your running as many illegal compounds as some bodybuilders.

 

[mark118]

bull**** your info is WAY off

i wont list prices but i can promise you three months of test, and some dbol is the same price as two bottles of DS

and results?

I have used DS before i jumped into illicit AAS

AAS have put better size on me- period- this is just MY experience

it aint set in stone

using schwell as an example of a complete lack of objectivity. fact is that schwell, and many others, are in denial

1: your injectables, and the old fashioned orals eg dbol, anavar, are illegal

2: otc anabolic are legal to buy

3: less risk of fraud with buying the otc

4: injections are not pleasant, and are a huge deterrant for many. it does not make you any less of a man for not wanting to pin

5: look at the evidence, and i mean actually look. there are 10000s reviews and logs on the internet from users who have used otc orals to great effect ie cutting, recomp, bulking in a range of 3-6 weeks

6: just because 1 user has tried a few orals and did not work, and jumped ship to injectables, does not mean orals dont work. its like saying creatine mono didnt work for me, therefore its rubbish.

7: sourcing OTC is easy, whereas sourcing your illegals is a lot harder and riskier... because they're illegal and so that comes with risks when trying to find a legit source.

8: fact is, both otc stuff and the illegals have their place, risks and benefits but to write off otc stuff and pointless is a faulty argument because of the reasons i listed above, and of course there are more reasons but

 

[oli]

with illicit AAS, most likely you'll get huge gains whereas with DS's/PH's the gains won't be as dramatic. i've seen some guys say that putting on an excess of 15-20+ lbs in a fairly short amount of time would be a f*ckin no-go in their line of work. it all depends on what the user wants. modest gains that could be easily explained/"lied about" or dramatic gains that would def. be harder to explain.