2.5mg m1t

[realsoundjim]

sup bro's. i have a question for a friend of mine. He has been very inquisitive of m1t bla bla bla. i telll him it is extrememly suppresive (from experience) lethargy, shut down, etc. so he says how bout in an extremely small dose? so i tell him even 5mg will shut u down hard. i mean, i took 15 - 20 and it was a kick in the ass. so his question is what if u lowered the dose to like 2.5 per day (2wkon/2wkoff/2wkon). would that yeild any results or really nothing to justify its use? i told him nomatter what he decides to do, proper pct w/ nolva and mix in some 4ad as well.

 

[Skark]

I think the results would be OK, without many sides......assuming this guy doesn't have much experience. It all depends on what is expected. Maybe the guy could keep 3-4 lbs over a months cycle.

 

[Scottyo]

I think thats taking it a little to far. I think going below 5m will just shut you down without giving beneficial effects. There's a sig. difference between 15-20mg (with some going as high as 40) and 2.5mg.

 

[realsoundjim]

ok, both u guys have diff views. scotty, so what u r saying is that it take X amount of m1t to completely shut u down, even if it is only 2.5mg's. ur saying that after the shut down however there isnt enough of the hormone to produce gains. so , in essence the only thing u are doing is shutting urself down and thats it. is this correct? anyone one else with their opinions. agree , disagree.?

 

[ersatz]

I'd agree with Scottyo but there's only one way to find out.

 

[bioman]

I see no reason not to try. If it doesn't start yeilding gains then up the dose to 5 - 10 whatever.

 

[Scottyo]

Im sorry, but I see significant reasons not to try. If your supressed, and their's not enough active androgen then I think your pretty fked. Pretty much comparable to post-cycle without your hormones normalizing. And "gains" can be misleading, especially for a first time user. If he's worried, start with 5m or use another substance. Safety is one thing...but 2.5mg is a bit far.

 

[Iron Warrior]

I agree with Scottyo. If you're gonna be suppressed you might as well get good gains. Start with 10 mg.

 

[bioman]

How the hell do you guys "know" that 2.5 mg isn't going to cut it for a first timer?

Seriously?

If you can answer that definitively, then fine I'll conceed.

People vary considerably in their sensitivities to androgens..particularly first timers. There's no harm in starting low, especially on the most potent methyl we have out there. I started and 5mg and gained fast and well, I bet I could have gained on 2-3 mgs as well since I'm not a seasoned juicer.

I see your logic about suppression but he can always adjust the dosage. If he's clueless about what's water and what's actual LBM then he shouldn't be using M1T at all.

 

[realsoundjim]

is their a consensus out there on the amount that indefinitely shuts u down within a few days. ? for example, no matter how much u take 2.5, 5, 25 mgs, is it always x amount that shuts you down and then after that amount u would need more for actual muscle production, gains, etc? i think that is what scotty is sayin, ami right? some people are disagreeing too. turning into a decent debate.

 

[Greenguy]

I think it would be a an interesting experiment. Make sure he has Nolva on hand for PCT before he starts. Let us know the results.

Greenguy

 

[realsoundjim]

well, i spoke to my friend and told him bnout the on going debate. his past experience had been 2 cycles of one and super one+. he said he was wondering if he could use the super one+ and throw in 2.5 mg of m1t for 3 weeks. at first i told him it was a lil monotonus since there would be so much one test from both products, but then i started theorizing in my head. lol i realize that super one has one test in it and m1t is one test, but doesnt the methylation actauallly make it almost a different compound? so would their be any benefit in getting hit by the different forms of 1test or is it really just overkill? i told my bud to hold off till we sort this out

 

[SonOfThor]

Yes, methylation makes it an entirely different compound.

 

[realsoundjim]

Yes, methylation makes it an entirely different compound.

so then, son of thor, would you say that the stack mentioned above may have a decent benefit? does anyone else agree or disagree with him?

 

[bioman]

First off,(Scottyo and IW) sorry if my last post sounded testy. I'm sitting here with a shoulder injury, out of commission and feeling like a catabolic cortisol factory.

As far as a consensus about what amount shuts people down I think we only have a few blood tests from SuperSoldier and others that were higher doses(10-30mg) if I recall correctly. Those tests revealed that they were shut down in a matter of 24-48 hours at those dosages. I would go out on a limb and just assume for safety that even 2-5 mg would do the same. It would be nice to know for sure.

I've stacked 5mg of MIT with 4AD/1T/ 4oht(which in hindsight was probably overkill) and it produced decent results. I only gained a total of 4 pounds but leaned out significantly and got a very nice body comp change. I would not say that this stack was significantly better than M1T/4AD just that the 4oht alleviated many of the sides, increased aggression and sex drive. It was pretty tough to recover from however.

 

[realsoundjim]

bioman, how did u incorporate m1t into that cycle? 4 weeks, 2on 2off etc, or what?

anyone else?

 

[bioman]

The stacking and cycle length options are endless however I would advise to NOT run M1t any longer than 4 weeks max unless you run blod work throughout the cycle and well into PCT.

When stacking with 4ad people either run the entire stack for 3-4 weeks or run the M1T in the middle two weeks only as many simply can't stand being on M1T for more than 14 days. Some run a M1T/4ad stack for 2 weeks on, 2 weeks off then 2 on again. I'm not a fan of the last method as the gains are diminished with each consecutive cycle since they are so close together but to each their own.

eg.
Weeks 1-4: M1T/4AD (and whatever else, 4oht, 1T)

OR

Week 1: 4AD/oht/1t
Week 2 and 3: M1T/4Ad/4oht/1t
Week 4: 4Ad/oht/1t

My cycle was a total of 6 weeks with M1T added at the first week and the last weeks only(total of 2 weeks M1T "on time"). I was simply experimenting with ways to stack it since it was new at the time.

I'm only about 180 and I have run 5, 10, and 15 mg of M1t and saw no significant difference between the 3 dosages other than an increase in sides.

As stated earlier, your friend can play around with the dosage to see what works best for him.

There's a bajillion M1T threads you can send him to as well.

 

[Scottyo]

No probs Bioman. Like already mentioned, the only thing we can go by test wise is SS, and his showed almost immediate suppression. If 10mg of Ox will just you down, I cannot see how 2.5mg of M1T will not shut you down. There is almost NO WAY you can use a compound like M1T to piggyback your natural test levels, as M1T does not work through the same pathways. Either its effective and you will be suppressed, or its too low a dose for anything and your just pissing your money away. Don't think that a lower dose equates to less suppression, in most cases its an on/off switch.
He could always try 2.5mg, but with a couple cycles under his belt I wouldn't go below 5 or 10mg...preferably 10 IMO.

 

[Cogar]

10mg ed was too much for me, giving me sides severe enough that I quit taking M 1-T 13 days into my cycle. If realsoundjim's friend is concerned, I do not think he will go wrong at 5mg or below. I recall reading that some folks had decent results at 5mg.

 

[Iron Warrior]

First off,(Scottyo and IW) sorry if my last post sounded testy.

No problems bro, I didn't find your post offensive at all. I just recommend 10 mg. because it's a sure thing compared to 2.5, but if he wants to experiment that's up to him.

 

[bioman]

Thanks guys.

I'm toying with the idea of making an oral M1T solution so that I can dose 1mg at a time. I'd like to stack it with 4ad dermal or test base if I could ever find any, just to see if one could run a much longer cycle at a much lower dose. The goal would be to see if one could keep the gains coming over a period of 4-8 weeks with no sides, more consistency and permanence of gains and less chance of liver toxicity.

As we've seen a lot of us gain like crazy for 10 days then stop. Some people then lose all of those gains. In my mind it kinda seems like someone overdosing dbol or something and just exploding unsustainably the first few weeks.

..so you can see where my bias is coming from, lol.

 

[realsoundjim]

ok, everybody. i been brainstorming now and runnin my head in circles theorizing all this stuff and then having to explain it to my boy. anyways, heres some more things to think bout. hypothetically lets say he does take one+ and m1t together. Some would say that this is too monotonus due to the overflow of 1test in such a cycle. however, others say that methylation produces an entirely different compound, thus the 1test in the one+ is different from the methyl 1test. Questoin is do the two compounds, methyl 1 test and 1test, produce any synergistic benefit by "using 1test at differenyt angles" so-to-speak? we know that stackin certain compounds together is a good way to lower the dosages of each while enhancing gains and minimizing sides. Is there any benefit to stacking these two supposedly different compounds, utilizing them in lower doses? no one has hit the nail completely on the head yet

 

[Scottyo]

Synergistic...probably not. Additive, I'd assume so. Methylating products almost always changes them, but once they are in your body the degree that they are diff is anyone's guess (if we use the dbol example, then its significant but still...). I would still use 5m minimum regardless of whether you use one+ or not. Otherwise, you wouldn't even know which compound was giving you "gains" or not. SInce your boy has never used M1T, he has no benchmark to compare sides/etc to other then 1-test/4ad.

 

[Cogar]

ok, everybody. i been brainstorming now and runnin my head in circles theorizing all this stuff and then having to explain it to my boy. anyways, heres some more things to think bout. hypothetically lets say he does take one+ and m1t together. Some would say that this is too monotonus due to the overflow of 1test in such a cycle. however, others say that methylation produces an entirely different compound, thus the 1test in the one+ is different from the methyl 1test. Questoin is do the two compounds, methyl 1 test and 1test, produce any synergistic benefit by "using 1test at differenyt angles" so-to-speak? we know that stackin certain compounds together is a good way to lower the dosages of each while enhancing gains and minimizing sides. Is there any benefit to stacking these two supposedly different compounds, utilizing them in lower doses? no one has hit the nail completely on the head yet

We discussed that concept in another thread, and the most acceptable idea (to me, at least) was to run a more traditional cycle like 1-Test/4-AD for 4 weeks and add M 1-T during part of the cycle. Here is the thread:

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13269

 

[realsoundjim]

ok, scotty, yea i see what u mean, he really has nothing to compare it to. as for synergistic or not i see what ur saying too.......they may not work exponentially better when used together, however the addition of it may add more gains. would u recomend it as an "additive" as you say. imn curious not only for my friend now, but for me as well, as i am a more experienced ph user than he is. i still am weary bout it, but have an open mind to suggestions. anyone esles thoughts?

 

[bioman]

I'd agree its not synergistic or even additive based on my own experiences. It was different than running either M1T by itself or 1T/4ad. I would however keep the initial dosages of s1 and m1t low at first until he can dial in how much 1t/m1t he can tolerate.

I think it is a fine idea for a stack but personally its not one I'll ever do again..ie overkill for me.

 

[Skark]

Thanks guys.

I'm toying with the idea of making an oral M1T solution so that I can dose 1mg at a time.

Yeah, this is the kind of thing I want to do also. Maybe stack 1 mg M1T with say Mdien or M4OHN. Powders open up a whole world of possibility.

On the other subject, I'm sure there is some level of M1T that won't shut down natural test levels, we just don't know what it is yet. I'd love to see super soldier take on something like this.