Monsterbox is powered by P-Plex
- 01-07-2009, 07:14 PM
Monsterbox is powered by P-Plex
Just started by New Year Bulk. Its been 90 days since my 3wk Havoc run. Ready to hit it hard with P-Plex.
5' 8'' - 184.5lbs, 10-11% BF, 15.5inch arms
200lbs, 9-10%, hit 16+inches
The Cycle Layout:
P-Plex - 20/30/30/40
Possibly Havoc - 0/0/0/30/30/40
Cissus Bulk - Pre/On/Off 5g/day morning/night
Bulk 1-Carboxy (Powerfull) - Pre/On 1/3tsp morning/night
Hawthorne Berries - 560mg - Pre/on 2x day
B6 - 50mg 3x day pre/on
Fish Oil - 10g Pre/On/Off daily
Milk Thistle - 1000mg Pre/On/Off daily
Toremifene Citrate - 90/60/60/30
Reversitol - 0/0/3/2/2/1
What I hate about most logs are the lack of pictures. Don't tell me how much mass you've gained if you can't back it up...pictures are definitely worth at least a few hundred words.
Right After Havoc...most current front shot..I look pretty much the same, maybe a little more muscular in my shoulders
Current Back Shot
- 01-07-2009, 07:17 PM
Day 2: 20mg P-Plex
Have been taking 20mg/day P-plex spaced out...wakeup and 3pm w/ 5grams of fish oil each dose and high fat meal.
All I notice is I feel alot smaller since I've come off of creatine...no pump and less endurance.
Feel nothing so far...
Should I bump up to 30mgs yet? I remember having a pump from havoc start as early as first dose.
01-07-2009, 07:25 PM
plex half life is longer than havoc if i remember also what cycle is this 3 right? i don't know if you can realistaclly expect 15lbs on your third cycle. usually gains go down. Not trying to be a downer just don't want you to be disappointed. although of course this all depends on how close to genetic potential you are at. Remember for Pros on a TON of Juice 15lbs a year is a big gain just for perspective. Don't get me wrong because i know your diet and training are on point. But you gained so much in the last year that it's going to get harder to make the same gains in the same amount of time.
01-07-2009, 07:30 PM
I'm about 6 days into my PPlex cycle, Im running 20/20/30/30.
I havent felt to much yet in the gym. Although today I started feeling a kind of warm sensation throughout my body, and a little anxiety. Also Ive noticed increased appetite, and Im thristy as hell all day!
Good luck on your journey!
01-07-2009, 07:44 PM
Subbed for another log of yours
ADVANCED MUSCLE SCIENCE
Strongest On The Market
RECOVERBRO: Est. Post #3222
01-07-2009, 07:54 PM
If you aren't worried about possible gyno complications then bump it to 30 right away, otherwise take more time to let the levels build up slowly.
Phera takes a little bit longer to kick in, in terms of strength... I noticed weight gains very quickly however. Strength lagged and then picked up a noticable amount in week 3. I ran 30mg straight through in that cycle.
Monster, i love your goals. I say screw "realistic" goals, aim HIGH, always aim high. Never be satisfied, haha. I've made strong gains off of sometimes what I think is just mental confidence.
Mostly answered PM's
Don't post on my profile, I don't read that stuff, PM me instead
<------ Hard to believe, but I wasn't on any anabolics in the avatar shot
01-07-2009, 11:16 PM
I have alot more stength to gain which makes me believe i'm not close to a strength wall...thus meaning I have alot more size to put on.
I'm only putting up 85's dumbell press for 12...and squatting 315 on smith machine...I mean I should be able to do alot more before I'm maxing out my genetic potential. Theres tons of smaller guys that are WAY stronger than me...my size is way ahead of my stength. This leads me to believe that I have much more room to grow and thus any PH/Steroid should work out well.
I don't believe in the consecutive cycles reduces gains...this only should happen if you run long cycles without proper time period to allow testosterone to return. Short, lightly suppressive cycles shouldn't hinder gains. However, when you have reached your genetic limit and are using steroids to surpass that, then certainly the gains will have diminishing returns.
Shoulder workout went great today. The last reps really really burn because I'm used to being on creatine. Can't wait for this crap to kick in!
01-07-2009, 11:49 PM
i hear what you mean man, i can put up the 80 lb dumbells for 10 (with help on the last two) and theres this dude up at la where i go who seems to be about 5 inches shorter than me and just as skinny, whos putting up the hundo's no problemo! it kinds pisses me off really.
01-08-2009, 02:08 AM
I really believe it has something to do with muscle maturity...even if you have lots of LBM, this doesn't mean the muscles are matured and as dense as possible. Probably why my strength doesn't correspond to size. I feel like steroids get your big and somewhat strong, but the muscles that look great, feel big and dense, just aren't as mature as if you've worked for them for years and years.
Anyhow, should I start expecting a constant pump feeling like creatine soon? I miss walking around feeling jacked. I know havoc did this in 3 days.
01-08-2009, 09:07 AM
ill go along for the ride even tho i have trouble following logs, having so many on my sub list.
just because one guy is stronger and smaller than you doesnt mean you arent close to your genetic peak, everyone has different genetic peaks whether it be size or strength. One guy may have a very high peak for size but another guy 50lbs smaller has a higher peak for strength. Strength is also genetic.
Looking good for a shorter guy, definately alot of potential there. You may be able to compete someday, do you have desires to do so? You look like you have a good frame for it.
I see no reason why you cant use an NO booster or something for a pump while you wait. If you are impatient i think you can go to 30mg pplex now. Pplex is not as strong mg for mg as the OG AX pheraplex was. (30mg was alot)
01-08-2009, 09:32 AM
i wouldnt use torem with reversitol
Torem has been shown in a few studies to lower E2. Basically this means, as well as it works as a SERM it has AI properties.
So adding Reverstiol in the mix may lower E2 even lower and inhibit libido.
my suggestion is to Run PCS or another test booster with NO AI in it along side the Torem
01-08-2009, 09:37 AM
01-08-2009, 09:47 AM
01-08-2009, 09:55 AM
i get a lose of libido in just about any pct and i always thought it was from the serm, i mean its a med designed for women....
01-08-2009, 09:56 AM
didnt find it yet but came across this....
Effect of anti-estrogens on the androgen receptor activity and cell proliferation in prostate cancer cells.
[My paper] Hidenori Kawashima, Tomoaki Tanaka, Jed-Sian Cheng, Syozo Sugita, Kazuyoshi Ezaki, Takeshi Kurisu, Tatsuya Nakatani
Department of Urology, Osaka City University Graduate School of Medicine, 1-4-3 Asahimachi, Abenoku, Osaka 545-8585, Japan. [email protected]
Although some anti-estrogens have been reported to inhibit the proliferation of prostate cancer cells, few studies on the mechanism by which they suppress the growth of prostate cancer have been reported. We investigated, for the first time, whether anti-estrogens modulate the transactivation activity of the androgen receptor (AR) in prostate cancer cells. In DU-145 cells transfected with AR, the transactivation activity of AR was inhibited by tamoxifen and toremifene, even in the presence of 10 nM of DHT. On the other hand, in LNCaP cells having an endogenous AR mutation at codon 877, the activity of AR was suppressed by faslodex in the presence of 10 nM DHT, whereas it was not inhibited by tamoxifen nor toremifene. In PC-3 cells, both the cell growth and the AR activity were remarkably inhibited by tamoxifen at 50 microM. Faslodex and toremifene inhibited AR activity to some extent, but they seemed to function as agonists at higher concentrations. In PC-3 cells, the inhibition of cell growth by flutamide, faslodex and toremifene was much less than their suppression of AR activity. We also demonstrated that a synthetic estrogen diethylstilbestrol and progesterone-related drugs such as chlormadinone acetate and allylestrenol dose-dependently inhibited the activity of AR in DU-145 and PC-3 cells. These results highlight the anti-androgenic aspect of anti-estrogens and estrogens in regard to the AR-mediated transcription of the relevant genes in prostate cancer.
01-08-2009, 10:11 AM
Hormonal effects of toremifene in breast cancer patients.
Számel I, Vincze B, Hindy I, Kerpel-Fronius S, Eckhardt S, Mäenpää J, Grönroos M, Kangas L, Sundquist H, Hajba A.
National Institute of Oncology, Budapest, Hungary.
The effect of toremifene treatment on the serum levels of sex steroids (estradiol, progesterone, testosterone), FSH, LH, prolactin, TSH, T3, T4 and SHBG was investigated. Basal prolactin level and the "prolactin reserve capacity" of the hypophysis was also studied by the TRH functional test. Steroid hormone receptors were detected in the patients where a tumor biopsy could be obtained. In a randomized trial patients were treated by 60 and 300 mg of toremifene per os, daily. Hormone levels were assayed prior to treatment and at the 2nd, 6th, 8th and 12th week of tormifene therapy. The hormonal effects of toremifene were the most marked at the 2nd and at the 8th week. Estradiol decreased continuously, SHBG increased slightly and the high initial value of basal prolactin level decreased. The TRH-induced prolactin release was suppressed by tormifene after an 8-week period. No clinical response-related tendency was found.
01-08-2009, 10:57 AM
01-08-2009, 11:00 AM
I want to avoid estrogen rebound...which is my reason of running reversitol. It also contains the main ingrediant of PCS, tran-resveratrol and tongkat-ali which will help with boosting natural test. I have had great results with it at 3 caps/day = increase in libido.
I really like the fact that torem also lowers E2, I do not think it will act against me because I am starting the Reversitol against a ramped down dosage of Toremifene.
3caps + 60mg of toremifene probably wont cause to much estrogen suppression...well see
01-08-2009, 11:13 AM
01-08-2009, 11:52 AM
I agree with nateo...your a serious lifter scratch the smith machine and use free weights learn to squat ass to the floor and the weight will come...there are many leg workouts where this is all i do!
01-08-2009, 11:53 AM
01-08-2009, 12:33 PM
01-08-2009, 12:41 PM
hey buddy, im not too knowledgable on reversitol, but i hear some bad things about it. would that be a guaranteed way to avoid the rebound more so than a serm and natty test. booster such as stoked or dth?
01-08-2009, 03:12 PM
natty test booster just helps raise test...an AI is needed to eliminate any free-floating estrogen thats been blocked by the SERM when coming off the SERM
01-08-2009, 03:29 PM
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