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Another Hockey Thread...Ovechkin v Crosby

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  1. It will be a good series, Mullet. And it's nice to see a rematch in the cup finals.

    I think it's going to be a better series than last season, but I believe in my team, and I'm looking forward to us being the first team to repeat as Stanley Cup Champions since... well... the Red Wings


  2. Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    It will be a good series, Mullet. And it's nice to see a rematch in the cup finals.

    I think it's going to be a better series than last season, but I believe in my team, and I'm looking forward to us being the first team to repeat as Stanley Cup Champions since... well... the Red Wings
    Nice, hah! I was waiting to see how you'd respond to that!

    I feel it depends primarily on the play of our back-end - in other words, if they cannot navigate past the suffocating Detroit neutral-zone trap, and enter the O-Zone, then we will have no success. To that end, the health of Gonchar will play a large part here, as Letang has not shown success in navigating between the blues.

    This being said, Detroit simply cannot contain Crosby and Malkin. It is nearly impossible to sustain momentum when the best player in the world is on one shift, and an individual not too far behind is on the very next shift: the fact that Malkin is playing his best hockey at a time when he disappeared last year is also indicative of a Pens win!

    Finally, history is on our side: the last two teams to rematch in the Cup Final were the Islanders and the Oilers, with a young Oilers team losing the first year only to dismantle the Islanders the next year!
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  3. I was reading an blog by Buccigross over at ESPN and it got me thinking about this question: if the Wings repeat, is Osgood a HoFer?

    Objectively, when you look at the numbers, it's a push (he'll have over 400 wins and a 2.47 GAA), but he would have 4 cups.

    Personally, I say not at all because I don't think of him when I am asked the elite goalies of the past 15 years.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys


  4. Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    I was reading an blog by Buccigross over at ESPN and it got me thinking about this question: if the Wings repeat, is Osgood a HoFer?

    Objectively, when you look at the numbers, it's a push (he'll have over 400 wins and a 2.47 GAA), but he would have 4 cups.

    Personally, I say not at all because I don't think of him when I am asked the elite goalies of the past 15 years.
    He is quite the enigma, for precisely the sentiment contained in your last sentiment. The fact is this: any above-average goalie could have won cups with those Detroit teams; preview their defensive statistics from their cup years to verify this! In fact, Ty Conklin, a less-than-average goalie [see: his years in Edmonton] carried Detroit to the second seed in a tough Western Conference this year!

    If you truly want to judge Osgood, take a gander at his PK statistics from this playoffs: an .889 save percentage and a phenomenal amount of goals against. Detroit wins in spite of, and not because of, Osgood.

    By the way, he is from my birthplace of Medicine Hat, a place I lived for the middle fifteen years of my life; even people there do not feel he is a good goalie! P.S., Trevor Linden was also from Medicine Hat.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by Mulletsoldier View Post
    He is quite the enigma, for precisely the sentiment contained in your last sentiment. The fact is this: any above-average goalie could have won cups with those Detroit teams; preview their defensive statistics from their cup years to verify this! In fact, Ty Conklin, a less-than-average goalie [see: his years in Edmonton] carried Detroit to the second seed in a tough Western Conference this year!

    If you truly want to judge Osgood, take a gander at his PK statistics from this playoffs: an .889 save percentage and a phenomenal amount of goals against. Detroit wins in spite of, and not because of, Osgood.

    By the way, he is from my birthplace of Medicine Hat, a place I lived for the middle fifteen years of my life; even people there do not feel he is a good goalie! P.S., Trevor Linden was also from Medicine Hat.
    His overall playoff GAA is 2.11. He was amazing last year in the playoffs and, IMO, should have won the Conn Smythe.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys

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  6. Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    His overall playoff GAA is 2.11. He was amazing last year in the playoffs and, IMO, should have won the Conn Smythe.
    Yes, but GAA is not an individual stat, it is a team statistic: it depends upon the defensive play of an entire team, which was more or less the thrust of my argument above.

    The point about the PK was to illuminate that, individually, he is a slightly above-average goalie. While 5-on-5 GAA is in fact a team statistic, short-handed save percentage and GAA is far more indicative of an individual goalie's play; in that regard, Osgood has faired poorly this year and last!

    To say he was amazing last year, in my opinion, is a slight stretch as well.

  7. Detroit's penalty-kill is plodding at a meager 71% this year, with a goal allowed in twelve consecutive games at one point.

  8. I will concede that Detroit's defense this year has been awful - penalty kill included.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    I will concede that Detroit's defense this year has been awful - penalty kill included.
    5-on-5 they have been fine, but the penalty kill: whoa!

    Seriously though, their PK has been simply atrocious this playoff season; with Pittsburgh clicking at over 30% [IIRC] over the 'Canes/Pens series, D-Town could be in trouble.

  10. We shall see, Mullet. We shall see. First we just need both of our teams to close things out

  11. Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    We shall see, Mullet. We shall see. First we just need both of our teams to close things out
    You are certainly right, Tribal; I have probably jinxed us both, hah!

    Friendly wager if our teams make it to the cup, though? An NP gift certificate, perhaps?

  12. Quote Originally Posted by Mulletsoldier View Post
    You are certainly right, Tribal; I have probably jinxed us both, hah!
    A Canes vs Hawks series just doesn't seem as entertaining

    Quote Originally Posted by Mulletsoldier View Post
    Friendly wager if our teams make it to the cup, though? An NP gift certificate, perhaps?
    Absolutely! I am one broke mo-fo right now, so how about the $25 one? http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/n...ficate-25.html

  13. Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    A Canes vs Hawks series just doesn't seem as entertaining



    Absolutely! I am one broke mo-fo right now, so how about the $25 one? http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/n...ficate-25.html
    Sounds good!

  14. Deal!

    I sent you a PM btw (after I saw that your sig said use email for questions, of course).

  15. And the Penguins sweep (the conference finals).

  16. Are you shining up that NP gift certificate for me yet, Mullet?

  17. Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    Are you shining up that NP gift certificate for me yet, Mullet?
    Not quite yet, tribal. It has been a home series thus far, so I wouldn't get your hopes up for a win on Tuesday.

  18. It had indeed. I'll openly admit Detroit has looked sub-par (especially defensively) while in Pitts. I think getting Datsyuk back was a huge boost. While I would rather us parade the cup around home ice, I'll take a game 6 win as well. But I wouldn't doubt this going 7 games (as a lot of series have in this years playoffs).

  19. Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    It had indeed. I'll openly admit Detroit has looked sub-par (especially defensively) while in Pitts. I think getting Datsyuk back was a huge boost. While I would rather us parade the cup around home ice, I'll take a game 6 win as well. But I wouldn't doubt this going 7 games (as a lot of series have in this years playoffs).
    I feel a game seven is likely, given the way each team has dominated in their buildings. Obviously, this means that in order to win the Cup Pittsburgh needs to do something it has only done once in these past two Cup Finals: win a game in Detroit.

  20. Seven games is good for the NHL, TV, revenues, etc... but I can't say it's good for my blood pressure

    Neither team has looked like itself while playing away, but playoffs are unpredictable, so you never know what might happen.

    While I did believe Pitts was going to lose Saturday before the puck even dropped, I didn't think they were going to self-destruct in the fashion they did. I was quite happy to see the box score...

    Malkin - 6 PIM, 1 SOG
    Crosby - 1 SOG, -2 rating

    I think game 6 is going to be a good one!!!

  21. I thought the script of this series was going to follow the one written by the Penguins in their series against Washington - and so, I thought they were going to win last night. The psychological boost of getting Datsyuk back was obviously large, and then another defender to put on Malkin. Obviously, though, momentum means jack shit in this series, as Detroit responded beautifully from being dominated two straight games in Pittsburgh. As I said, being a home series it really now comes down to either team needing a road win to close out the series.

  22. As Mike Babcock has said multiple times this playoff year "I don't buy into momentum". I really think he's right.

    Having Datsyuk and Zetterberg (both Selke caliber forwards) gives Babcock the option to roll Z with Crosby and Datsyuk with Malkin, or if Bylsma decides Crosby and Malkin need to be out together most the game (which I suspect), we can go with Z and Datsyuk on the same line.

    Either way, don't expect as much free play for your two stars Tuesday night. While I don't think they'll be relegated to 2 combined shots like they were last night, I don't believe they're going to combine for 4 points again like they did games 3 and 4.

    Lets do it again fellas!


  23. Best of three series with two games in Detroit....I'll take the Wings!
    Always open light. Itís not what you open with, itís what you finish with. Louie Simmons

  24. Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    As Mike Babcock has said multiple times this playoff year "I don't buy into momentum". I really think he's right.

    Having Datsyuk and Zetterberg (both Selke caliber forwards) gives Babcock the option to roll Z with Crosby and Datsyuk with Malkin, or if Bylsma decides Crosby and Malkin need to be out together most the game (which I suspect), we can go with Z and Datsyuk on the same line.
    Which is unlikely, as Babcock publicly stated that the frenzy to line-match with Bylsma ruined chemistry between the other lines, and resulted in poor play on Zetterberg's behalf. Babcock will most likely stick Henrik on Crosby, but not as patently as he had the previous four games [showed again in Game 5]. The only match-up he seems keen on sticking with is Lidstrom/Rafalski on Crosby's line.

    Either way, don't expect as much free play for your two stars Tuesday night. While I don't think they'll be relegated to 2 combined shots like they were last night, I don't believe they're going to combine for 4 points again like they did games 3 and 4.

    Lets do it again fellas!
    We will see. Crosby and Malkin's play in this series, when it has been poor, is more a function of self-destructing rather than sound defensive play, as Malkin was the leading point-getter in the series irrespective of whom was defending him, and Crosby was generating a lot of chances - free ice or not, the great ones find a way to get it done. I think you are over-estimating the defensive play of Detroit in game five, and underestimating the Penguins' team meltdown. Crosby and Malkin will be fine.

    Now, if both Malkin and Crosby show up, and Staal's line dominates down-low again, you may as well trade that picture of Draper [Franzen?] in above for a nice black-and-gold clad one. Detroit simply cannot hang with Pittsburgh's center-core, and that showed in game four. Again, though: that's why they play.

  25. That's Draper holding the cup, big guy

    Your arguments hold value, but as you stated, that's why they play. We can talk all we want about what "should" happen, but that doesn't translate to a cup (or else Detroit would have taken a cup in '96 when they had 62 regular season wins).

    My prediction (using last years photos) -








  26. Quote Originally Posted by AZMIDLYF View Post
    Best of three series with two games in Detroit....I'll take the Wings!
    Uhh... if you made this statement Friday it would have been true

    It's 3-2, Wings lead, with one game at each arena remaining.

  27. Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    That's Draper holding the cup, big guy

    Your arguments hold value, but as you stated, that's why they play. We can talk all we want about what "should" happen, but that doesn't translate to a cup (or else Detroit would have taken a cup in '96 when they had 62 regular season wins).

    My prediction (using last years photos) -
    Thanks for the clarification, champ.

  28. Does anyone else find it interesting that the finals started off with 3 games in 4 nights, but now we have a two day layoff? While the time off can (hopefully) only help the Wings further recover from their injuries, I think I got spoiled by the sheer amount of hockey in a limited time frame.

    What the hell am I going to watch next week when hockey is over?

  29. I got a question for you, Mullet.

    Five times (and not since 2003) the Conn Smyth trophy has been awarded to a member of the losing team in the Stanley Cup Finals. Assuming Pitts loses, do you think Malkin should be awarded the trophy?

    He currently has 14 goals, 21 assists, 3 game winners, and 99 SOG. Nobody on the Wings roster has stats close to that.

    If a Red Wing is to take the trophy, I think the only way it would be fair (to Pitts) is to give it to Osgood (15-6, 2.00 GAA, .927 SV, 2 SO).

    Your thoughts?
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