NOxidant Write-Up

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  1. So now it's okay to take NOxidant preworkout? My reasoning, however flawed it may be, was that it would prevent NO from forming more potent pro-oxidants which would reduce ROS induced damage. Perhaps wrongly, I assumed that the increased pump was an indication that there was less conversion of NO to peroxynitrite or other oxidants. But then I've been told that ROS induced damage is necessary to muscle growth so I'm actually inhibiting my gains by taking it pre. This is all so confusing.


  2. Quote Originally Posted by Wanderlei View Post
    So now it's okay to take NOxidant preworkout? My reasoning, however flawed it may be, was that it would prevent NO from forming more potent pro-oxidants which would reduce ROS induced damage. Perhaps wrongly, I assumed that the increased pump was an indication that there was less conversion of NO to peroxynitrite or other oxidants. But then I've been told that ROS induced damage is necessary to muscle growth so I'm actually inhibiting my gains by taking it pre. This is all so confusing.
    We're honing in on the absolute best recommendation and I am currently experimenting with a LOWER DOSE preworkout.

    There is evidence of a sweet spot equilibrium that will prevent excessive formation, while still allowing maximum messenger signaling to trigger growth.
    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Flawless Skin Couture - We give you the tools to make you Flawless
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by Wanderlei View Post
    So now it's okay to take NOxidant preworkout? My reasoning, however flawed it may be, was that it would prevent NO from forming more potent pro-oxidants which would reduce ROS induced damage. Perhaps wrongly, I assumed that the increased pump was an indication that there was less conversion of NO to peroxynitrite or other oxidants. But then I've been told that ROS induced damage is necessary to muscle growth so I'm actually inhibiting my gains by taking it pre. This is all so confusing.
    We've been doing a ton of research on this as of late. It would seem that the best time to take this product is actually before bed at night. You do want a degree of ROS/RNS induced damage after a workout to trigger new muscle growth.

    It would seem in the research that i've done that allowing for this to happen and then halting free radicals in their tracks before their damage effects outweigh the benefits. The majority of information and evidence i've seen supports this approach.

    As far as taking it pre-workout, more research needs to be done. I would think that a milder dose early on in the day could help keep ROS/NRS in check and actually produce better workout results/muscle damage as a result. (See one of the abstracts above about lowered ROS/RNS and increased muscle contraction) This would allow for a greater amount of muscle damage and subsequent free radical formation to enhance the fact. Following that up with a dose a night would seem to be the last piece of the enhanced anabolic puzzle.

    More research to be done, but the theory holds a lot of promise in my mind.

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  4. Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  5. Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    That's a good chart...interesting to note is NO's reaction with iron to exert effects.

    I wonder how many people with ED have their iron levels checked?
    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Flawless Skin Couture - We give you the tools to make you Flawless

  6. Quote Originally Posted by dsade View Post
    That's a good chart...interesting to note is NO's reaction with iron to exert effects.

    I wonder how many people with ED have their iron levels checked?
    I thought the same thing. It would seem to be a big factor in enhanced effect.

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  7. For all those people that don't understand how Nitric Oxide is a cell signaling molecule, here you go:

    http://www.ias.ac.in/currsci/nov251998/articles10.htm

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  8. As far as taking it pre-workout, more research needs to be done. I would think that a milder dose early on in the day could help keep ROS/NRS in check and actually produce better workout results/muscle damage as a result. (See one of the abstracts above about lowered ROS/RNS and increased muscle contraction) This would allow for a greater amount of muscle damage and subsequent free radical formation to enhance the fact. Following that up with a dose a night would seem to be the last piece of the enhanced anabolic puzzle.

    This pre bed dose is a very good idea. In fact the smaller dose early in the day will support the pre bed dose. I think you can look at dosing this type of product like maintaing a postive nitrogen balance. Steady doses of protein throughout the day will work much better then haphazard meals and/or a few big protein doses.
    This type of product can be viewed in the same way. smaller steady dosing will keep the antioxidants available when they are needed. Remember, these can be stored to some extent, so what isnt stored may be excreted. Now of course there will be ideal times to take this. Prebed, post work out etc. It all depends on circumstance.
    It seems that people get caught up to much in semantics, especially w/ supplements. People asking about the science of cell expression and nitric oxide production and get confused about it are often the ones that to just need to follow the directions on the label and then see what works best for them.
    In reality, would you get confused about the best time to have an apple, some blueberries and an orange would be - probably not.
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  9. Quote Originally Posted by Good Shepherd View Post
    This pre bed dose is a very good idea. In fact the smaller dose early in the day will support the pre bed dose. I think you can look at dosing this type of product like maintaing a postive nitrogen balance. Steady doses of protein throughout the day will work much better then haphazard meals and/or a few big protein doses.
    This type of product can be viewed in the same way. smaller steady dosing will keep the antioxidants available when they are needed. Remember, these can be stored to some extent, so what isnt stored may be excreted. Now of course there will be ideal times to take this. Prebed, post work out etc. It all depends on circumstance.
    It seems that people get caught up to much in semantics, especially w/ supplements. People asking about the science of cell expression and nitric oxide production and get confused about it are often the ones that to just need to follow the directions on the label and then see what works best for them.
    In reality, would you get confused about the best time to have an apple, some blueberries and an orange would be - probably not.
    Good post. I agree that the dose before bed would seem to be the most beneficial overall. The thing is, you don't want to completely destroy free radicals, you just want to keep their numbers in check.

    I think that a small dose early in the day would help potentiate better results in the end myself. If this theory of slightly decreased ROS/RNS prior to workout does in fact contribute to better overall muscle contractions, this would equate to more significant muscle damage and subsequent hypertrophy in the end. However this is largely dependent on the anabolic environment remaining stable.

    By taking this pre-bed dose it should shut down any extended damaging free radical effects after they've served their overall purpose of enhancing muscle growth during the post-workout setting.

    We're working on figuring out the most optimal timing for desired effects. Thusfar, this would seem to be the best method of attack.
    Last edited by Trauma1; 06-19-2008 at 12:38 AM.

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  10. Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    Good post. I agree that the dose before bed would seem to be the most beneficial overall. They think is you don't want to completely destroy free radical, you just want to keep their numbers in check.

    I think that a small dose early in the day would help potentiate better results in the end myself. If this theory of slightly decreased ROS/RNS prior to workout does in fact contribute to better overall muscle contractions, this would equate to more significant muscle damage and subsequent hypertrophy in the end. However this is largely dependent on the anabolic environment remaining stable.

    By taking this pre-bed dose it should shut down any extended damaging free radical effects after they've served their overall purpose of enhancing muscle growth during the post-workout setting.

    We're working on figuring out the most optimal timing for desired effects. Thusfar, this would seem to be the best method of attack.
    Any thought to delivery systems for the product? like something might buffer stomach acid ....

  11. Quote Originally Posted by Good Shepherd View Post
    Any thought to delivery systems for the product? like something might buffer stomach acid ....
    looking at several approaches, so far the absorption data is inconclusive so we're not sure it is necessary yet.
    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Flawless Skin Couture - We give you the tools to make you Flawless

  12. Quote Originally Posted by dsade View Post
    looking at several approaches, so far the absorption data is inconclusive so we're not sure it is necessary yet.
    I was always intereested in either a muti or a antoxidant formula that was done in an effervesant deliver system. I understand it would be difficult to package a product like this and keep it stable. But still interested none the less.

    Im very interested in the pre workout formula you mentioned in an earlier post, dsade. I hope its not a kitchen sink product filled w/ unnecessary stims...ie noexplode

  13. Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  14. I'm still doing a lot of research on this guys. I'm holding strong at this point in taking the NOxidant 3 capsule dosing before bed. Much of the research i've found points to this dosing approach for best effects.

    I would like to hear any feedback also from those who have already been taking NOxidant for roughly a months time.

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  15. Just ordered two bottles of this goodness in a cap... (along with some DCP and poseidon)

    I was just wanting to know, is there any problem in taking this long term (ie, should it be cycled to maintain effectiveness) or not?

    cheers guys, between you and USP labs I don't have any cash left.... gits

  16. Quote Originally Posted by Flyboy View Post
    Just ordered two bottles of this goodness in a cap... (along with some DCP and poseidon)

    I was just wanting to know, is there any problem in taking this long term (ie, should it be cycled to maintain effectiveness) or not?

    cheers guys, between you and USP labs I don't have any cash left.... gits
    Taking this everyday would be very beneficial overall. It helps your body maintain adequate stores of anti-oxidants that in itself has SOO many benefits. Let us know how everything goes.

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  17. sure thing boss...

    Should live to about 130 if i keep taking it, right?

  18. Quote Originally Posted by Flyboy;
    ...

    Should live to about 130 if i keep taking it, right?
    Wrong! 150!

  19. Quote Originally Posted by strategicmove View Post
    Wrong! 150!
    Exactly!

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  20. I've printed off this page, so I now have that in writing...


    I'll let you off the hook If someone intervenes with high explosives and the like, I doubt nOxidant is much use there! That however is the only exception, I expect full protection from other more mundane forms of death such as being run over by the number 53 bus from oxford.

    And hurry up and release that mullet protection system will you, I needz mah luscious locks to stay intact for all those years.

  21. Quote Originally Posted by Flyboy View Post
    I've printed off this page, so I now have that in writing...


    I'll let you off the hook If someone intervenes with high explosives and the like, I doubt nOxidant is much use there! That however is the only exception, I expect full protection from other more mundane forms of death such as being run over by the number 53 bus from oxford.

    And hurry up and release that mullet protection system will you, I needz mah luscious locks to stay intact for all those years.
    Lol - That was classic!

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  22. SideNote....be sure to pick up the September issue of PowerliftingUSA and check out the great article on Antioxidants and their role in muscle growth and contractions, with a nice feature on NOxidant.
    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Flawless Skin Couture - We give you the tools to make you Flawless

  23. Quote Originally Posted by dsade View Post
    SideNote....be sure to pick up the September issue of PowerliftingUSA and check out the great article on Antioxidants and their role in muscle growth and contractions, with a nice feature on NOxidant.
    A great article indeed!

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  24. A VERY good and VERY indepth article on Antioxidants and Oxidative Stress:

    Invited Review: Oxidation of Biological Systems: Oxidative Stress Phenomena, Antioxidants, Redox Reactions, and Methods for Their Quantification -- Kohen and Nyska 30 (6): 620 -- Toxicologic Pathology



    Here is the abstract of this article for those that may have a hard time understanding it:

    Invited Review: Oxidation of Biological Systems: Oxidative Stress Phenomena, Antioxidants, Redox Reactions, and Methods for Their Quantification
    Ron Kohen
    Department of Pharmaceutics, School of Pharmacy, the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, Jerusalem, Israel, [email protected]

    Abraham Nyska

    Laboratory of Experimental Pathology, National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences (NIEHS), Research Triangle Park, North Carolina 27709, USA

    Reactive oxygen species (ROS) and other radicals are involved in a variety of biological phenomena, such as mutation, carcinogenesis, degenerative and other diseases, inflammation, aging, and development. ROS are well recognized for playing a dual role as deleterious and beneficial species. The objectives of this review are to describe oxidative stress phenomena, terminology, definitions, and basic chemical characteristics of the species involved; examine the biological targets susceptible to oxidation and the defense mechanisms of the organism against these reactive metabolites; and analyze methodologies, including immunohistochemical markers, used in toxicological pathology in the visualization of oxidative stress phenomena. Direct detection of ROS and other free radicals is difficult, because these molecules are short-lived and highly reactive in a nonspecific manner. Ongoing oxidative damage is, thus, generally analyzed by measurement of secondary products including derivatives of amino acids, nuclei acids, and lipid peroxidation. Attention has been focused on electrochemical methods based on voltammetry measurements for evaluating the total reducing power of biological fluids and tissues. This approach can function as a tool to assess the antioxidant-reducing profile of a biological site and follow changes in pathological situations. This review thus includes different topics essential for understanding oxidative stress phenomena and provides tools for those intending to conduct study and research in this field.

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  25. Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    Lol - That was classic!

    Pleasure to be of service old chap.

    Keep it up guys, I'm looking forward to your new releases.

  26. Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    A great article indeed!
    Fully agree!

  27. Just picked up my first bottle of NoXidant with the nutra sale order. I smell a new staple along with my NOW Adam!

  28. Quote Originally Posted by OCCFan023 View Post
    Just picked up my first bottle of NoXidant with the nutra sale order. I smell a new staple along with my NOW Adam!
    Sounds like a plan to me!

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary

  

  
 

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