anabolic diet confusion

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  1. Yea true what botch said. My fats been lower than normal, just 10-30gr, and I do look "flater" than usual
    Serious Nutrition Solutions Representative


  2. Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    Thamks, Emo. I lowered cals already without having lost any weight. So, we'll see. 3100 cals is a little low for 290lbs. I'll give it a go.
    3100 for 290? I would think you normal maintenance would be closer to 5100. Where did you start out at calorie wise? Could it be he isnt getting enough calories?
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  3. Started at 4500. Strength has remained the same. Weight all the way down to 289. I feel that 3100 is too low as well, but wasn't seeing results. 3480 being X 12, I brought it down 300 cals, all from fat. So, I'm eating 345 p, 190 f.

  4. What's your bodyfat?


    You can 'safely' lose 31 calories per pound of fat a day before you start burning LBM for fuel.

    So if you're 25% BF X 290 LB's = 72.5

    72.5 x 31 = 2232

    You can go 2232 below maintenance and still pretty much retain your LBM.

    For all intensive purposes I wouldn't go as low as possible and risk possible LBM, so maybe cut 1500-2000 (max). That yeilds 2000 x 7 = 14000 calories a week which is about 4 solid LB's of fat lost a week with virtuall no LBM lost... you may lose strength but most likely due to lower glycogen when you lift.

    You have to adjust this eventually, and you have to know roughly your true maintenance level based on activity bodyweight, etc.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    What's your bodyfat?


    You can 'safely' lose 31 calories per pound of fat a day before you start burning LBM for fuel.

    So if you're 25% BF X 290 LB's = 72.5

    72.5 x 31 = 2232

    You can go 2232 below maintenance and still pretty much retain your LBM.

    For all intensive purposes I wouldn't go as low as possible and risk possible LBM, so maybe cut 1500-2000 (max). That yeilds 2000 x 7 = 14000 calories a week which is about 4 solid LB's of fat lost a week with virtuall no LBM lost... you may lose strength but most likely due to lower glycogen when you lift.

    You have to adjust this eventually, and you have to know roughly your true maintenance level based on activity bodyweight, etc.
    I gauge my BF at closer to 20%. SO, I get the number 1800. If my maintenance is 5220(X18). The number I get is 3400. I ate 3400 for 5 weeks and made little progress, which is when I went down to the current 3150 or so. Only this week did the scale move(2lbs.) If I feel that I'm losing too much strength or weight, I'll bump it up 200 cals/week or so. If you think something different, by all means, share. THank you EMO for the calculations. I'm starting to at least feel a little better that the scale moved. I understand completely it's not about the scale, but like to get a little momentum, unresonable to think my weight's gonna stay the same while my BF continues to decline. Too much to lose to believe that.

  6. The diet can also cause you to get 'backed up' so to speak. So if you increase your fiber intake and get rid of the 'back up,' you may lose another 5 lb's, lol.


    You could always keep your cals around 3400, be more sated, but then do enough cardio to burn the extra 250 cals a day, which would be like a 15-20 min jog or less.

  7. Had a sh1tty refeed last weekend, was in AC and had a bunch of drinks and really not enough to eat. Anyway, seems my strength went up this week as I used the 140lb dumbells for incline, and went to the 125 dumbells for arnold presses. Was a little discouraged by the scale again as it read 290. This morning, however, I took another waist measurement and it read I was down 2". I see it, down 2", just having trouble believing strength going up, waist going down and scale not moving. Now I'm baffled for good reasons, it appears.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    Had a sh1tty refeed last weekend, was in AC and had a bunch of drinks and really not enough to eat. Anyway, seems my strength went up this week as I used the 140lb dumbells for incline, and went to the 125 dumbells for arnold presses. Was a little discouraged by the scale again as it read 290. This morning, however, I took another waist measurement and it read I was down 2". I see it, down 2", just having trouble believing strength going up, waist going down and scale not moving. Now I'm baffled for good reasons, it appears.
    Brosif in 10 weeks I lost about 3.5" off my waist and minimal size everywhere else. Strength dropped a tad at the beginning and then started coming back up twords the end. Endurance however was terrible.
    Serious Nutrition Solutions Representative

  9. Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    Had a sh1tty refeed last weekend, was in AC and had a bunch of drinks and really not enough to eat. Anyway, seems my strength went up this week as I used the 140lb dumbells for incline, and went to the 125 dumbells for arnold presses. Was a little discouraged by the scale again as it read 290. This morning, however, I took another waist measurement and it read I was down 2". I see it, down 2", just having trouble believing strength going up, waist going down and scale not moving. Now I'm baffled for good reasons, it appears.
    Your strength is rediculous. 125 lb dumbells for arnold presses? Wtf? lol

  10. Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    Your strength is rediculous. 125 lb dumbells for arnold presses? Wtf? lol
    ^^^^Holy Jeebus...I shoulder press the 85lb DBs and the old guys at the gym look at me like im freaking nuts!!! My gym doesnt even have 125lb DBs
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  11. Quote Originally Posted by JDF View Post
    ^^^^Holy Jeebus...I shoulder press the 85lb DBs and the old guys at the gym look at me like im freaking nuts!!! My gym doesnt even have 125lb DBs

    And arnold press is harder than a shoulder press IMO, so you'd probably do 10-15 less with an arnold press.

  12. Lol.. Imagine 125lb arnold presses??? If I could do those Id have a nelly body!!

  13. Quote Originally Posted by Wolfenstein View Post
    Lol.. Imagine 125lb arnold presses??? If I could do those Id have a nelly body!!
    One can dream....

  14. I hear ya about the endurance. I feel like vomiting after those arnolds and especially any leg work. End up taking about 4 minutes between sets on those exercises.(I know it's too long..no choice)

  15. Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    One can dream....
    HAHAHA.. Funniest **** ive heard all week

  16. Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    Had a sh1tty refeed last weekend, was in AC and had a bunch of drinks and really not enough to eat. Anyway, seems my strength went up this week as I used the 140lb dumbells for incline, and went to the 125 dumbells for arnold presses. Was a little discouraged by the scale again as it read 290. This morning, however, I took another waist measurement and it read I was down 2". I see it, down 2", just having trouble believing strength going up, waist going down and scale not moving. Now I'm baffled for good reasons, it appears.
    Thats great to hear man! You are an animal. I see guys at my gym hitting the 140's on incline and I sit there and get all excited when I get 95's for a set of 5, lol. Keep it up bro the diet seems to be paying off for you.

  17. Scale read about 287.5 this morning. Slow going, but, at least strength not decreasing. Considering going down to 2900 cals next week. I know it sounds WAYYYY to low, but 3100 for the last 2 weeks hasn't made a great impact. Anyone have an opinion, I'm all ears. A little clarification on the arnold presses. It is not a textbook arnold, as I don't start with the DBs in front of me. My palms face me but I only bring the DBs to about the top of the pec off to the side, so, I cheat a touch, close enough

  18. Update: end of week 14. I'm baffled once again. Brought my calories all the way down to 2800-2900. Cardio up to 5x/week.(all elliptical, 45 minutes/session, burn roughly 500 cals/session) Neither the scale nor the tape has moved in almost 2 weeks. What gives? If I get no suggestions, I'm taking the cals down to 2700.

  19. Um, I'd cut the cals. I diet on way lower than that.

  20. He's probably lowering the cals too slow and allowing his metabolsim to adjust.


    I'd have a 2 day refeed, then cut cals to 2000. Then lets she what happens in a week. Remeber to weigh yourself on the same day, same time of day, etc.

  21. WHen you get really strict on AD you can try some tactics like,

    Between meals have a BCCA shake, but space meals out farther apart. Have ALL carbs come from green vegeies like spinach.


    So eat 4 - 5 hundred cal meals a day. Drink a bcaa shake between each meal with 10-15 bcaa's. Drop your carb instake closer to 20 a day, some of the bcaa's with gluconegenesize.

  22. Me personally what I find to work is to drop to just one cheat meal a week and up the cardio (7 days/week). This is assuming calories are decently low. Calories likely should be in the low 2000 range. cardio should be low intensity so you're burning fat instead of carbs. If you can't drop fat with this then something is seriously wrong.

  23. Fat seems to be coming off, just a WHOLE lot slower than usual or expected. Only down 6 lbs., somewhere between 3-3.5" on waist, while maintaining all strength. It's working, just don't feel like dieting for a year. I'll try the 2 day refeed followed by 2000 cals/day next week if the new caloric level is not productive.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by Neil5585 View Post
    Me personally what I find to work is to drop to just one cheat meal a week and up the cardio (7 days/week). This is assuming calories are decently low. Calories likely should be in the low 2000 range. cardio should be low intensity so you're burning fat instead of carbs. If you can't drop fat with this then something is seriously wrong.
    dont forget that you are dealing with a 280+ pound individual. As far as cardio that drops fat and not carbs......????

    While I agree with the statement in application I'm not so sure the reasoning is sound.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    Fat seems to be coming off, just a WHOLE lot slower than usual or expected. Only down 6 lbs., somewhere between 3-3.5" on waist, while maintaining all strength. It's working, just don't feel like dieting for a year. I'll try the 2 day refeed followed by 2000 cals/day next week if the new caloric level is not productive.

    Please Revisit 36-44 in your manual.


    A lot of advice given thus far has been from individuals unfamiliar with Di Pasquales diet specifically; therefore, they are unaccustomed to the things you are experiencing firsthand.

    Firstly, this is unlike many other CKDs. You will not experience the customary drastic loss of glycogen or water that you will on some of the other diets, so dont expect it.

    The reason I have implored you to reread 36-44 is to hopefully get you back on track in accordance to the book. I have sensed some trepidation that shouldn't exist, as your week to week plan is pretty much laid out for you by Dr. Di Pasquale as far as calories and reductions go.

    Establish your maintenance calories, drop 1000 the first week, and then drop 500 each additional until you are experiencing the 1.5-2 pounds of BODYFAT loss per week that is your goal.

    This is where it gets tricky. The scale doesn't discriminate. Alot of this is going to have to be something you develop over time.

    I would recommend cutting down on the weigh in sessions- weigh yourself at the same time midweek, every week- and be sure to avoid weighing during or immediately after the weekend.

    Above all, don't cut down to one carb meal. Thats a totally different diet, and we're not talking about that one.
    You may however, might want to examine what you are eating on the weekends. One, if you are truly getting your caloric requirements (as per the manual), and two, are you avoiding the junk.

    The best bet for you may be to take things back to phase one. Establish your maintenance phase, and then begin cutting in accordance to the book. Stick to the plan, don't get depressed by good things like losing inches even though the scale remains the same, and keep dropping the cals by 500 per week until the results you are looking for become evident.

  26. I must reiterate this.

    Some of these good people have gotten you off the track that the MANUAL intended you to be on.

    While they are well meaning individuals, they have provided advice that totally flies in the face of what you are trying to accomplish via the Anabolic Diet.

    After rereading the posts a few things that have stood out to me are the caloric reductions are spotty and undisciplined, weekends haven't been as productive as they should be calorically, and for some reason you included a guesstimation of bodyfat % into your math for the purposes of determining your daily calorie intake.

    Best thing (once again ) would likely be for you to start over and this time stick to the plan.
    Last edited by mmorpheuss; 04-21-2008 at 09:17 AM.

  27. Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    Most of the weight loss comes from glycogen and water weight loss. To lose fat, you first become fat adapted, and then you start cutting the fat from your diet, while protein and carbs stay relatively the same. That way your body burns fat for energy instead of glycogen.

    1) Completely untrue. 2) Wrong diet.
    That isn't good advice at all in the context of this threads topic.

  28. mmorpheuss, yeah, what I was talking about is different from the original Anabolic Diet. However what I was considering is that DiPasquale worked with Poliquin to come up with a diet, and it ends up when you're heavier, there's no PWO carbs, and just ONE cheat meal per week. That's awfully similar to Polumbo's diet, too. Also the calories I was taking into consideration DiPasquale's Radical Diet which dips much lower in calories (fat).

    But if we're going to stick to the original Anabolic Diet hardcore, then nevermind. I just figured that DiPasquale has made changes depending on different variables since then.

  29. Don't have the book in front of me, I'm assuming you refer to The Metabolic Diet and not The Anabolic Solution, asI do not have the latter. I started just as the book outlines. First 10 weeks were textbook. Nowhere did I read a suggestion for bodyweight X 10. So, there is the trepidation of which you speak. Currently, my intake has gone under the X 10 mark, which I am slightly uncomfortable with. Going to start incorporating a 2nd cardio session(did 2 30 min. elliptical sessions today).
  

  
 

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