The Lean Gains / IF learning and Discussion Log

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by sandys View Post
    @MrKleen73 - thanks for the reply.
    My schedule is a little crazy these days, so I have no option but to workout at around 6 in the evening - which is why (as you correctly guessed), I am opting for the 20/60/20 schedule.
    I am now planning to use the following worksheet (inspired by Dreamweaver):
    BMR X 13 + 20% calories at 50/25/25 (prot/carb/fat) on workout days with a 20/60/20 schedule for working out in the evenings.
    BMR X 13 - 20% calories at 50/20/30 (prot/carb/fat) on rest days
    Yah I am just coming off a lean bulk where I was + 26% and -10%, as I start to cut it will be more like +20 -20 I think it's +18 -18 to be precise...
    Unremarkable is no way to go through life... Doug


  2. I started lean gains yesterday. I must say that the 16 hour fast was a lot easier than I was expecting. Just wanted to say thanks to those that contributed to this thread already...you guys sold me on giving LG a try. I spent several days on the LG website reading Martin's blogs and all the information before I finally decided to commit. Anxious to see what the coming weeks bring.
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by Quil View Post
    I started lean gains yesterday. I must say that the 16 hour fast was a lot easier than I was expecting. Just wanted to say thanks to those that contributed to this thread already...you guys sold me on giving LG a try. I spent several days on the LG website reading Martin's blogs and all the information before I finally decided to commit. Anxious to see what the coming weeks bring.
    Yah really you just skip breakfast and that's about it. Doesn't seem like 16 hours..
    Unremarkable is no way to go through life... Doug

  4. This has peaked my interest, I have a lot of catching up to do.

    Im a fat kid with carb sensitivity...I need to cover my azz with good nutrition.

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  5. Quote Originally Posted by TurningGreen View Post
    This has peaked my interest, I have a lot of catching up to do.

    Im a fat kid with carb sensitivity...I need to cover my azz with good nutrition.

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    I see you found the thread
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by mattrag View Post
    I see you found the thread
    Ha! right after I posted the question to you.
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Quil View Post
    I started lean gains yesterday. I must say that the 16 hour fast was a lot easier than I was expecting. Just wanted to say thanks to those that contributed to this thread already...you guys sold me on giving LG a try. I spent several days on the LG website reading Martin's blogs and all the information before I finally decided to commit. Anxious to see what the coming weeks bring.
    Enjoyvthe ride man. Its a lifestyle change that is much easier than it sounds for sure with great results.
    Recoverbro Elite
    "This is what we've been working on"

  8. ok Im read up. Lets see if I understand this correctly. I'd like to recomp during PCT so Im to eat 20% below maintenance on off days and 20% above on workout days. I am an evening lifter, so from what I have gathered my schedule should look like this.

    Wake(around 0730-0800hrs)
    Break Fast at 1200hrs (20% of total daily calories)
    Pre workout BCAA at 1500hrs
    Workout at 1530-1645hrs (approximate)
    Meal 2 post workout (60% of total daily calories)
    Meal 3 within 8hr window (20% total daily calories)

    Does this look correct? This is very new to me, and I like to have all my ducks in a row before I go messing around with foreign concepts.

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  9. Quote Originally Posted by TurningGreen View Post
    ok Im read up. Lets see if I understand this correctly. I'd like to recomp during PCT so Im to eat 20% below maintenance on off days and 20% above on workout days. I am an evening lifter, so from what I have gathered my schedule should look like this.

    Wake(around 0730-0800hrs)
    Break Fast at 1200hrs (20% of total daily calories)
    Pre workout BCAA at 1500hrs
    Workout at 1530-1645hrs (approximate)
    Meal 2 post workout (60% of total daily calories)
    Meal 3 within 8hr window (20% total daily calories)

    Does this look correct? This is very new to me, and I like to have all my ducks in a row before I go messing around with foreign concepts.

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    Yup, that's almost the same exact layout I'm using with good results so far.
    :blindfold:

  10. Quote Originally Posted by monstermash View Post
    Yup, that's almost the same exact layout I'm using with good results so far.
    Thanks MonsterMash, I ll get the math done later today. I'm looking forward to getting away from my old style of eating (every 3hrs) should make for an interesting next four weeks of my PCT log.

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  11. Ive been doing morning cardio too around 0900hrs. Should I just stay on the fast through this, or get some BCAAs pre cardio as well?

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  12. Ive been doing am cardio around 0900 hrs. Should I maintain my fast through this or supplement with BCAAs pre cardio as well?

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  13. Quote Originally Posted by TurningGreen View Post
    Ive been doing am cardio around 0900 hrs. Should I maintain my fast through this or supplement with BCAAs pre cardio as well?

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    From what I read on his site 10g pre fasted cardio is a must.
    :blindfold:

  14. Quote Originally Posted by monstermash View Post
    From what I read on his site 10g pre fasted cardio is a must.
    Yah I get about 15 grams in myself...
    Unremarkable is no way to go through life... Doug

  15. don't see any advantages before cardio.

    If it is before weight lifting we can discuss, before cardio (low intensity) the only thing that i would add would be some stims if needed, nothing more that can be caloric.

    And please at leat cardio at 9 then fast break at 13, looks good! 4 hours burning some fat

  16. I have only read the basics about LG but couldn't find anywhere if the use of carbs intra workout is recommended. I would normally drink an isotonic/carb drink with about 20gms of sugars in it mixed with 10g of bcaa's. Would this be recommended?

  17. This is for powerlifting training not cardio btw

  18. I noticed on the LG website Martin says, "Meal frequency during the feeding phase is irrelevant. However, most people, including me, prefer three meals."

    I tend to get kind of sick when I eat so much all at once, Ive always been more of a grazer.

    I was wondering if anyone else has been using more frequent smaller meals in their feeding window and what kind of results youve been getting. I just started eating 5-6 smaller meals on my non training days and then on my training days eating one big meal (around 45% daily cals) post workout and 3-4 smaller meals to fill in the rest of my feeding window.

    So, if im not alone in doing this please post up your experiences.

  19. Quote Originally Posted by soontobbeast View Post
    on burn days its actually tough for me to break down and eat lol. i wanna keep fasting.
    What are the "burn" days?

  20. Quote Originally Posted by N.Woods Giant View Post
    I noticed on the LG website Martin says, "Meal frequency during the feeding phase is irrelevant. However, most people, including me, prefer three meals."

    I tend to get kind of sick when I eat so much all at once, Ive always been more of a grazer.

    I was wondering if anyone else has been using more frequent smaller meals in their feeding window and what kind of results youve been getting. I just started eating 5-6 smaller meals on my non training days and then on my training days eating one big meal (around 45% daily cals) post workout and 3-4 smaller meals to fill in the rest of my feeding window.

    So, if im not alone in doing this please post up your experiences.
    I typically eat immediately post-workout and then every 2 hours or so until I eventually go to sleep. What you pointed out is actually accurate on two levels -- meal frequency is irrelevant with a static caloric intake (3 meals vs 6 meals) whether you're talking specifically within the LG 8-hour feeding window or virtually any other meal plan.

    But for LG, the total calories consumed in the window is what's important -- although the first meal should probably still be the largest comparatively.

  21. Quote Originally Posted by SemiBulimic View Post
    I have only read the basics about LG but couldn't find anywhere if the use of carbs intra workout is recommended. I would normally drink an isotonic/carb drink with about 20gms of sugars in it mixed with 10g of bcaa's. Would this be recommended?
    Not for LG -- keep the BCAAs but hold the CHO for post-workout. There are some studies linked from the LG website discussing the impact of consuming a CHO solution beforehand as opposed to training in the fasted state.

    Quote Originally Posted by RJW719 View Post
    What are the "burn" days?
    Judging from their discussion, I believe he means non-training days where fat loss is the primary focus and total calories are under maintenance.

  22. Yeah, I have just been calling them burn days it is much easier. That and on burn days a lot of us choose to extend the fast and have two bigger meals which is more in line with other IF approaches but not a true Lean Gains approach. That and saying workout day and not workout day became cumbersome. A Burn and Build day just seems easier to explain for me.

    Sik, there is actually a benefit to having 10-20 grams of protein before any cardio it actually causes more fat to be burned. I think I posted that study in this thread somewhere. If not look in The Adventures of JudoJosh thread I am almost certain it is in there. Unfortunately I can not remember via what avenue it increases the amount of fat burned but the study reflected that it did. If it is only with whole protein I would assume it probably had to do with thermic effect of protein but may simply be due to increased protein synthesis burning more calories.
    Live Hard, Laugh Hard, Love Hard and Heal Fast! - KLEEN
    Current Training Log -
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/276206-kleen-strong-body.html

  23. I take my BCAAs regardless of it being workout days or cardio. I feel its beneficial to have them before fasted cardio
    Recoverbro Elite
    "This is what we've been working on"

  24. Quote Originally Posted by MrKleen73 View Post
    Yeah, I have just been calling them burn days it is much easier. That and on burn days a lot of us choose to extend the fast and have two bigger meals which is more in line with other IF approaches but not a true Lean Gains approach. That and saying workout day and not workout day became cumbersome. A Burn and Build day just seems easier to explain for me.

    Sik, there is actually a benefit to having 10-20 grams of protein before any cardio it actually causes more fat to be burned. I think I posted that study in this thread somewhere. If not look in The Adventures of JudoJosh thread I am almost certain it is in there. Unfortunately I can not remember via what avenue it increases the amount of fat burned but the study reflected that it did. If it is only with whole protein I would assume it probably had to do with thermic effect of protein but may simply be due to increased protein synthesis burning more calories.

    Could be something like the short insulin increase with the uptake of amino acids to muscle cells causing and anti catabolism response in training coupled with the glucogon rise post insulin release? I am not sure, but I think if it did show some benefit it would be through these channels. Or I could be completely wrong....

  25. Gentlemen, I am an official fan of LG. Finished day one with a sheet ton of energy, also felt just as strong during my lift, and not to mention an overall feeling of being light with awesome vascularity as well...I could go on all night on how good I felt today. The cherry on top was eating a 1,357 cal. meal!

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  26. Quote Originally Posted by TurningGreen View Post
    Gentlemen, I am an official fan of LG. Finished day one with a sheet ton of energy, also felt just as strong during my lift, and not to mention an overall feeling of being light with awesome vascularity as well...I could go on all night on how good I felt today. The cherry on top was eating a 1,357 cal. meal!

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    Welcome to the bright side of calorie restriction.

  27. I know this was addressed earlier somewhere in the thread but am I to take my 20% deficit/increase from Basal Metabolic Rate, or Total Daily Energy Expenditure? I would go back and search, but this thread is HUGE
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  28. Quote Originally Posted by TurningGreen View Post
    I know this was addressed earlier somewhere in the thread but am I to take my 20% deficit/increase from Basal Metabolic Rate, or Total Daily Energy Expenditure? I would go back and search, but this thread is HUGE
    Based on TDEE (3,428 cal.) I will consume 4,113 cal. on workout days, and 2,742 cal. on rest days. This is a 686 cal. swing both ways (20%). I will eat 50% carbs, 30% protein, 20% fat on workout days and 50% protein, 30% fat, 20% carbs on rest days.

    BMR is 2,211

    Please correct me if I am wrong

    4wk Androhard/Androlean 4wkPCT log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  29. I hate that I'm blowing this thread up, but this is what I have arrived at. Please critique so I can make necessary alterations.

    TurningGreen Lean Gains Protocol

    BMR -2,116cal.
    TDEE -3428cal.
    20% increase/deficit -685cal.

    Workout Days -4,113cal
    50%carb, 30%protein, 20%fat
    Meal 1 20% total cal. -822cal
    Meal 2 60% total cal. -2,647cal
    Meal 3 20% total cal. -822cal

    Rest Days -2,742cal
    50%protein, 30%fat, 20%carb
    Meal 1 20% total cal. -548cal
    Meal 2 60% total cal. -1,645cal
    Meal 3 20% total cal. -548cal
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/252210-greens-climb-top.html#post4548443

  30. Quote Originally Posted by TurningGreen View Post
    I hate that I'm blowing this thread up, but this is what I have arrived at. Please critique so I can make necessary alterations.

    TurningGreen Lean Gains Protocol

    BMR -2,116cal.
    TDEE -3428cal.
    20% increase/deficit -685cal.

    Workout Days -4,113cal
    50%carb, 30%protein, 20%fat
    Meal 1 20% total cal. -822cal
    Meal 2 60% total cal. -2,647cal
    Meal 3 20% total cal. -822cal

    Rest Days -2,742cal
    50%protein, 30%fat, 20%carb
    Meal 1 20% total cal. -548cal
    Meal 2 60% total cal. -1,645cal
    Meal 3 20% total cal. -548cal
    I could be wrong but I believe the 50/30/20 on workout days is supposed to be P/C/F not C/P/F.
    :blindfold:
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