Blasting while on TRT - AnabolicMinds.com - Page 7

Blasting while on TRT

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    Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    Regardless of the fact that it is well within normal range, did he ask how you felt and if it was addressing your symptoms?
    Yep, this.
    Everyone is so concerned with a number...patients want it higher, docs want it lower

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    Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    "So, you practice doing something you don't understand. I appreciate you being honest with me so I know not to trust you with any of my other ailments and can find someone that does."
    hahaha, yeah pretty much. I go to my cardiologist for my heart of course, but this guy I just dictate to him what I need/want and he usually complies ("just tell me how much you want of the gel and what brand and I'll write the script" lol)...he doesn't want me on test shots? since "clinically" I look "fine"? and I did not complain about ED or lethargy etc? Fine, put me on the gel and I'll get my level in the 7-800's that way. Does not matter to me, until I get tired of all that gel and demand a referral to a proper endo.....but this guy is essentially useless. Both my parents were using him and they both "fired" him eventually and warned me about him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kmfj View Post
    I just got a call from my doc.100mg ew put me at 762 and 20.2. He felt it was a little high. But said we will keep the dose the same and do more bloodwork in 6 weeks.
    Awesome, I was pretty spot on. But I was using guesstimates from personal experience and from others I know personally or on the boards, so no real skill there lol That is not "too high" btw....1100 is top of the scale? (off the top of my head) if so then 750 is dead in the middle of 350 and 1150, the top and bottom of normal. So essentially the mean average of the normal portion of the scale is "too high". Wow, guess this is why he chose not to go into brain surgery....
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    My endo has always said he's happy with my levels hovering around 1000. I'll be getting bloods taken Wednesday to see how the blast is coming along. I've decided to blast for 9 weeks instead of 12 since I've already put on about 25lbs into week 5. And I'm still really lean with no bloat. I was surprised today I got irritable for the first time since I started the blast, I've had no negative sides luckily besides today. No telling what I could do if I could really force feed myself! I've always had the drive to lift hard and heavy, but can't force enough food that I need. Around 4k-5k calories max for me during the blast. I'm surprised I'm getting that much! Once it's over I'll probably drop it down to 3500 calories and 265g of protein.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lexmuscle View Post
    My endo has always said he's happy with my levels hovering around 1000. I'll be getting bloods taken Wednesday to see how the blast is coming along. I've decided to blast for 9 weeks instead of 12 since I've already put on about 25lbs into week 5. And I'm still really lean with no bloat. I was surprised today I got irritable for the first time since I started the blast, I've had no negative sides luckily besides today. No telling what I could do if I could really force feed myself! I've always had the drive to lift hard and heavy, but can't force enough food that I need. Around 4k-5k calories max for me during the blast. I'm surprised I'm getting that much! Once it's over I'll probably drop it down to 3500 calories and 265g of protein.
    Your gains are insane!
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    Quote Originally Posted by lexmuscle View Post
    My endo has always said he's happy with my levels hovering around 1000. I'll be getting bloods taken Wednesday to see how the blast is coming along. I've decided to blast for 9 weeks instead of 12 since I've already put on about 25lbs into week 5. And I'm still really lean with no bloat. I was surprised today I got irritable for the first time since I started the blast, I've had no negative sides luckily besides today. No telling what I could do if I could really force feed myself! I've always had the drive to lift hard and heavy, but can't force enough food that I need. Around 4k-5k calories max for me during the blast. I'm surprised I'm getting that much! Once it's over I'll probably drop it down to 3500 calories and 265g of protein.
    I feel you, 3500-4K is my limit....its just not humanly possible for me to do any more...even with liquid assistance since that just bloats me and makes me even less hungry. So I don't gain as much as I probably should. Although I am a 175-200 lb guy so 4K isn't that bad. But yeah, my GP is an idiot...but he agrees that top end (like 750-900's) is a legit #...I bet if I approached 1K he'd probably be like OK thats high. He does also mention getting RBC checked, but nothing about estrogen....so he seems informed on about half of the stuff we are aware of. It upsets me that I (we) know more about this stuff than he does, yet he's getting paid big bucks for doing nothing and prescribing flawed trt protocols.
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    He asked me if I felt like it was too high. I told him I felt better than I have in months. He did want me to come by sooner than the six weeks so he could check rbc and e2 and make sure that dose wasn't causing any problems on that side. He does tend to lean more to the conservative side though.
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    Nothing wrong with that, as long as it isn't interfering with you and how you feel. Many times doctors are thinking of themselves and situations in general, so they don't take the time to really see the individual. For instance, my doctor has a lot of TRT patients and I am one of only about 5 that he allows to self inject he said because I am reasonable and discuss things openly with him. It took a long time, but I have moved out of the "general" category.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    For instance, my doctor has a lot of TRT patients and I am one of only about 5 that he allows to self inject he said because I am reasonable and discuss things openly with him. It took a long time, but I have moved out of the "general" category.
    Man, that's weird. My doc started me off on injections and I did the first one myself in front of his assistant. They sent me home with a script for cyp and a bag full of needles. Funny how different things can be from one doc to the other.
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    Quote Originally Posted by iparatroop View Post

    Man, that's weird. My doc started me off on injections and I did the first one myself in front of his assistant. They sent me home with a script for cyp and a bag full of needles. Funny how different things can be from one doc to the other.
    I'm in the same boat except he wants me in the 500's. Me next appt I might casually mention not needing an appointment for 12 months
    Edit.
    He also scolded me for doing gluteal inj by myself. It's dangerous he said. Quads only he said. Next time, I will say my wife pins the glutes for me
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    Quote Originally Posted by threeFs View Post

    I'm in the same boat except he wants me in the 500's. Me next appt I might casually mention not needing an appointment for 12 months
    Bwahahahaha, let us know how that goes. You might get fired from the program.
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    Quote Originally Posted by iparatroop View Post
    Man, that's weird. My doc started me off on injections and I did the first one myself in front of his assistant. They sent me home with a script for cyp and a bag full of needles. Funny how different things can be from one doc to the other.
    Actually, if you read around on here, the majority of patient's frustration is with not being allowed to inject. Also, keep in mind that mindset is changing quickly. I started this over 2 years ago and that is ages in TRT with how far doctors have come.

    If you actually have a doctor that allows you to self inject, you are in the minority and should consider yourself lucky.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post

    Actually, if you read around on here, the majority of patient's frustration is with not being allowed to inject. Also, keep in mind that mindset is changing quickly. I started this over 2 years ago and that is ages in TRT with how far doctors have come.

    If you actually have a doctor that allows you to self inject, you are in the minority and should consider yourself lucky.
    Oh, no, I get it and I've heard/read about the experience that others have had/are having. I consider myself very fortunate to have been referred to the endo that I'm seeing. He didn't want to do the gel because it's expensive, messy and because of the bio-availability. The orals were out of the question for him d/t bio-avail and possible liver issues. He actually suggested injections as the best possible outcome and I was already on that page. He even understands the peaks and valleys of the e2w inj cycle and is willing to adjust if as I feel necessary once we get to that point (I'm only three pins in). He already changed my prescription needles from 21x1 to 23x1 at my request because I was concerned about leakage.
    I just find it weird that there's such a difference between docs and how they go about treating people. I know TRT is still on the newer end of the spectrum as far as medical treatments go, but damn, it doesn't seem all that difficult to me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post

    Actually, if you read around on here, the majority of patient's frustration is with not being allowed to inject. Also, keep in mind that mindset is changing quickly. I started this over 2 years ago and that is ages in TRT with how far doctors have come.

    If you actually have a doctor that allows you to self inject, you are in the minority and should consider yourself lucky.
    That blows my mind, who would drive to their doc twice a week for a test shot? I'd probably just use the gel instead.
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    ^^^she got bronchitis
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    Nobody would drive to a doc twice a week and I doubt there is a doc that would inject you twice a week. It's only once you get prescribed to self inject that you truly can customize your schedule to what works best. When you are at the mercy of the doc, you are just doing what you can to get as close to optimal, and that is usually just once a week- at best.

    Remember that it is really those of us that self inject that have the luxury of injecting twice a week.
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    Quote Originally Posted by iparatroop View Post
    Oh, no, I get it and I've heard/read about the experience that others have had/are having. I consider myself very fortunate to have been referred to the endo that I'm seeing. He didn't want to do the gel because it's expensive, messy and because of the bio-availability. The orals were out of the question for him d/t bio-avail and possible liver issues. He actually suggested injections as the best possible outcome and I was already on that page. He even understands the peaks and valleys of the e2w inj cycle and is willing to adjust if as I feel necessary once we get to that point (I'm only three pins in). He already changed my prescription needles from 21x1 to 23x1 at my request because I was concerned about leakage.
    I just find it weird that there's such a difference between docs and how they go about treating people. I know TRT is still on the newer end of the spectrum as far as medical treatments go, but damn, it doesn't seem all that difficult to me.
    get your needles/syringes on your own, no need to conform to what they prescribe for you (like that harpoon LOL).
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    Quote Originally Posted by threeFs View Post
    I'm in the same boat except he wants me in the 500's. Me next appt I might casually mention not needing an appointment for 12 months
    Edit.
    He also scolded me for doing gluteal inj by myself. It's dangerous he said. Quads only he said. Next time, I will say my wife pins the glutes for me
    He thinks 500's is "optimal"????
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnabolicHolic View Post

    He thinks 500's is "optimal"????
    He won't be my doc forever. And check your source post
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnabolicHolic View Post

    get your needles/syringes on your own, no need to conform to what they prescribe for you (like that harpoon LOL). GPZ is fast and efficient and they have been around for a decade or more. any gauge/length and combination you need. Only way to go.
    He already changed the prescription at my request, and I'm sure he'll do it again if 23x1 won't cut it for me. He's a pretty understanding dude. I pay nothing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by threeFs View Post
    He won't be my doc forever. And check your source post
    its just pins, and not a link or full name. I wouldn't call it sourcing, but rather assisting someone who is on legit trt find the proper equipment..... then again I'm not the sheriff here he is the ghoul in the grim reaper outfit. Ok .....I thought about it and I'll change it LMFAO......
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    Quote Originally Posted by iparatroop View Post
    He already changed the prescription at my request, and I'm sure he'll do it again if 23x1 won't cut it for me. He's a pretty understanding dude. I pay nothing.
    23g is not bad actually.....25g is better for quads and delts at least. But 23g for glutes is actually correct. I try to make it as thin and sharp and short as possible, not a needle fan (though not "scared of them" by any means).
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnabolicHolic View Post

    23g is not bad actually.....25g is better for quads and delts at least. But 23g for glutes is actually correct. I try to make it as thin and sharp and short as possible, not a needle fan (though not "scared of them" by any means).
    I've only stuck my quads. So easy and convenient.
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    I was rxd 21's for flute not because of of what it would do to me, but, as the nurse said, because its harder to draw out of smaller guages. F that, even with my insurance, its cheaper to obtain needles on my own. I draw with 18 and pin glute with 21x1.5"

    I need a trt doc who lifts.......
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    At 500mg/week, test is over 1500, e2 is 136. Erase is worthless.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lexmuscle View Post
    At 500mg/week, test is over 1500, e2 is 136. Erase is worthless.
    That sucks man. Same thing that happened to me. I think Erase may be good for TRT purposes, with smaller doses of test, but nothing more...at least that what bloodwork seems to show.
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    Update:

    Up to about 193 on the scale. That's about 14 pounds up from cycle low of 179. It's all lean mass so I'm enjoying that. My pants are fitting much larger in the waste, and my sleeves are still full ; )

    Can't complain.

    Been using aromasin at about 12.5mgs/ day or EOD, depending how I feel, for about 2.5 weeks. Libido is high, mood is good, and strength/ endurance is better than it's ever been.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lboston View Post
    Update:

    Up to about 193 on the scale. That's about 14 pounds up from cycle low of 179. It's all lean mass so I'm enjoying that. My pants are fitting much larger in the waste, and my sleeves are still full ; )

    Can't complain.

    Been using aromasin at about 12.5mgs/ day or EOD, depending how I feel, for about 2.5 weeks. Libido is high, mood is good, and strength/ endurance is better than it's ever been.
    Nice! Have you tried Arimadex? I wonder which is better?
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    Quote Originally Posted by lexmuscle View Post

    Nice! Have you tried Arimadex? I wonder which is better?
    I've never used Adex. Aromasin seemed to be a good fit as their is no risk of rebound estrogen and it is easier on lipids. Want to give Adex a go sometime though to compare.
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    I use aromasin(exemestane) but it's research for my rats and I'm not sure it's as good as it could be. It's supposed to have a high level of "purity" but i might have some doubts
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    Would 1mg/day of Arimadex for 7 days tank my e2? Or would it be enough to bring me from 136 down to normal 25?
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    Quote Originally Posted by lexmuscle View Post
    Would 1mg/day of Arimadex for 7 days tank my e2? Or would it be enough to bring me from 136 down to normal 25?
    thats a lot but then again with those numbers maybe you need a "blast" of arimidex to drop the numbers, then taper it to normal dosing. Kind of like loading up on clomid but doing it with arimidex. But actually, may as well just pick a reasonable dosage and ride it out at that dosage. 1mg per day is not going to go over well for extended periods though I assure you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lexmuscle View Post
    Would 1mg/day of Arimadex for 7 days tank my e2? Or would it be enough to bring me from 136 down to normal 25?
    I've never used it, but Ive heard of guys running it aggressively to get things squared away. If you start to notice negative sides, just back off a bit.
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    I view Erase as having a can of water for a campout or a TRT type dose. A cycle is like a house on fire and you are throwing a can of water on it. You need a big tanker of water like Arimadex to put it out. Use the appropriate extinguisher for the situation.
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    Honestly, is an 11:1 ratio of T to E that bad? I've never had high E or experienced the sides. I'm asking for knowledge, not to be a smart ass.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    I view Erase as having a can of water for a campout or a TRT type dose. A cycle is like a house on fire and you are throwing a can of water on it. You need a big tanker of water like Arimadex to put it out. Use the appropriate extinguisher for the situation.
    I'll know better next time. I thought that since I wasn't experiencing any negative sides, then e2 shouldn't be too high.. Man was I wrong! I'm already feeling sore and crackly in my joints from that 1mg A-dex capsule lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by iparatroop View Post
    Honestly, is an 11:1 ratio of T to E that bad? I've never had high E or experienced the sides. I'm asking for knowledge, not to be a smart ass.
    This is actually a very valid question, IMO. When they are using a range of 8-50, just as an example as each lab is different, they are also generally using a testosterone range of 250-850 (again, just an example). So, if you are blasting into the 1500+ range, I would fully expect that your e2 levels are going to increase accordingly. If you are walking around with 1500-2000 levels of testosterone, I don't see how you wouldn't expect to be seeing e2 levels in the 100 range.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post

    This is actually a very valid question, IMO. When they are using a range of 8-50, just as an example as each lab is different, they are also generally using a testosterone range of 250-850 (again, just an example). So, if you are blasting into the 1500+ range, I would fully expect that your e2 levels are going to increase accordingly. If you are walking around with 1500-2000 levels of testosterone, I don't see how you wouldn't expect to be seeing e2 levels in the 100 range.
    Even if your e2 levels are in the 100 range, if you aren't experiencing any adverse/ill/negative effects, why try to counter a number/figure if its not making you feel bad?
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    Quote Originally Posted by iparatroop View Post
    Even if your e2 levels are in the 100 range, if you aren't experiencing any adverse/ill/negative effects, why try to counter a number/figure if its not making you feel bad?
    estrogen seems like it is actually quite conducive to muscle growth in the company of high test levels, since it seems when you crush your estrogen levels (with AI's or whatever) muscle growth is diminished as well as libido.....this is provided there are no adverse effects as you stated of course. I get gyno just by looking at estrogen results that high God bless the people it does not affect whatsoever....
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    Quote Originally Posted by iparatroop View Post
    Even if your e2 levels are in the 100 range, if you aren't experiencing any adverse/ill/negative effects, why try to counter a number/figure if its not making you feel bad?
    I am agreeing with you. I hear more issues with guys trying to mess with their e2 levels than anything else and it is usually from crushing it. If someone isn't suffering from any gyno issues and aren't trying to kill someone, I wouldn't mess with it. Chasing numbers will drive you crazy.
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