Blasting while on TRT

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by iparatroop View Post
    Not sure where you sustain your t-level with the gels, but as I mentioned before I am on a lower dose of test-c (100mg/wk). Test Cypionate and its European equivalent (Test Enanthate) are, for all intents and purposes, the same. It's less messy but your levels will fluctuate a little more with once weekly injections. At a TRT dose you shouldn't have to worry much about hematocrit levels, which seem to be the main concern with injectables.
    From what I gather -- I still need to substantiate this -- it appears that the high hematocrit levels were more common with every 2, every 3, and every 4 week injections (latter phased out from the recommendations) than every week or biweekly. That supraphysiologic surge really bothered some people in terms of sides, and based on our current discussion, it seems like something we can both appreciate
    "I'm not fat, I'm big boned!"


  2. Quote Originally Posted by trn450 View Post

    Probably Testosterone undecanoate. It's apparently great for TRT. I just reviewed a paper on it last night. 4 injections a year, assuming a good dosing schedule always in physiologic range without the ups and downs of the shorter esters like cyp and enanthate (especially prop).
    Ah, I misread. I was thinking he was getting a three month supply at once, and not an injection that was good for 3 months. This is news to me. Research time.

  3. Quote Originally Posted by trn450 View Post
    Probably Testosterone undecanoate. It's apparently great for TRT. I just reviewed a paper on it last night. 4 injections a year, assuming a good dosing schedule always in physiologic range without the ups and downs of the shorter esters like cyp and enanthate (especially prop).
    You only inject this 4 times a year and there are no ups and downs I've heard the exact opposite, the more frequent injections equals to less ups and downs
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  4. I'd like to know where this information is coming from. I read up on this quite a bit when I first started and everything I found had the half life at 16-17 days. Obviously longer than cyp that most of us use, but also harder to control sides on apparently. I'd love to read other data on it if it shows this being a quarterly schedule and limited sides that we know how to control with cyp.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by jiggero View Post
    You only inject this 4 times a year and there is no ups and downs I've heard the exact opposite, the more frequent injections equals to less ups and downs
    It depends on the pharmacokinetics of the drug, and in this case the various testosterone esters clear the body at different rates. Suspension needs the shortest inject times, priopionate is next and needs to be injected more frequently than enanthate and cypionate, undecanoate needs to be injected far less frequently than the other three. From what I gather, the half life itself isn't that much longer than cypionate and enanthate at 16 days. But, I'm not a pharmacist or pharmacologist and don't know the exact kinetics of this molecule. However, it's well documented in the literature to produce stable blood levels over 3 month periods.


    Testosterone undecanoate in the treatment of male hypogonadism.


    Edelstein D, Basaria S.Source

    Johns Hopkins School of Medicine, Division of Endocrinology and Metabolism, Baltimore, MD, USA.
    Abstract

    IMPORTANCE OF THE FIELD:

    Testosterone undecanoate (TU) represents an exciting new testosterone replacement therapy for hypogonadal men due to its convenient dosing schedule and favorable pharmacokinetic and safety profiles.AREAS COVERED IN THIS REVIEW:

    Clinical, pharmacokinetic and safety characteristics of TU will be reviewed. The characteristics of currently approved testosterone therapies will be reviewed and compared with those of TU in order to determine which therapy most appropriately meets the clinical objective of properly matching a patient with a therapy that is best able to deliver physiological levels of testosterone for prolonged periods of time, while at the same time being safe, effective, inexpensive, simple to use, and with few side effects.WHAT THE READER WILL GAIN:

    TU represents the first long-acting injectable with an excellent safety profile that can be administered only four times annually to produce stable levels of testosterone. Long-term studies have validated the clinical efficacy of TU in maintaining therapeutic levels of testosterone. Patient preference for the convenient dosing schedule might also lead to better compliance and therapeutic benefit. No serious side effects have been noted with the use of TU, including long-term data on patients treated with TU over 8 years.TAKE HOME MESSAGE:

    TU is both a desirable and safe option for the treatment of hypogonadal men. Patients will benefit from the stable testosterone levels and fewer required injections, while achieving the desired benefits of androgen replacement.
    "I'm not fat, I'm big boned!"

  6. they said the same thing about test cyp that it lasts 3-4 weeks. In reality it barely lasts 8 days.
    My doctor started me on 200mg every 2 weeks by day 9 my T levels were in the tank like it was in day one. He said to wait 5 days till next injection I said are you crazy?lol
    So his 200mg every 2 weeks was out, and in the end I've been doing 150mg a week just to keep me normal.
    These ppl forget that test is used by the body according to how much muscle repair it's need it. So if you kill it in the gym you need more test and the half lives and dosages are out the window.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by vassille View Post
    they said the same thing about test cyp that it lasts 3-4 weeks. In reality it barely lasts 8 days.
    My doctor started me on 200mg every 2 weeks by day 9 my T levels were in the tank like it was in day one. He said to wait 5 days till next injection I said are you crazy?lol
    So his 200mg every 2 weeks was out, and in the end I've been doing 150mg a week just to keep me normal.
    These ppl forget that test is used by the body according to how much muscle repair it's need it. So if you kill it in the gym you need more test and the half lives and dosages are out the window.
    Actually the official guidelines explicitly state that no longer than every three weeks, and preferably every week for cyp/enan for more stable blood levels. I just reviewed the UpToDate guidelines. We know it doesn't "last" three to four weeks, some folks just prefer to take the shot less frequently and get loaded with a supraphysiologic dose (e.g. 300 mg/3wk) that will keep you above low for the majority of the duration of three weeks.

    Are you talking day 9 after initiation of therapy? If so, I don't know what in the world anybody was doing checking levels anyway. Of course it'd be low. It takes 5-6 half lifes, for any drug, to approach steady state. For cyp/enan that's nearly two months.
    "I'm not fat, I'm big boned!"

  8. Quote Originally Posted by trn450 View Post
    Are you talking day 9 after initiation of therapy? If so, I don't know what in the world anybody was doing checking levels anyway. Of course it'd be low. It takes 5-6 half lifes, for any drug, to approach steady state. For cyp/enan that's nearly two months.
    Furthermore, once shut down takes place, t levels will be lower than they were initially anyway since you're relying solely on the treatment and your body is no longer naturally producing.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by vassille View Post
    lol
    so nuts and seeds dont really cause much inflamation then, unless there are other issues.
    Some nuts are inflammatory, such as peanuts, while others are anti inflammatory, such as almonds. There is a lot of info on this.
    My current UNsponsored PES EP cutting log:http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplement-reviews-logs/234161-adonisbelts-pes-erase.html

  10. Quote Originally Posted by AdonisBelt View Post
    Some nuts are inflammatory, such as peanuts, while others are anti inflammatory, such as almonds. There is a lot of info on this.
    The peanut is not a nut it is a legume.

  11. Thank you all for the advice/help. Looks like I will see Thai Dr and start TU quarterly injections. I will monitor T levels and post here for anyone interested. Thanks again....

  12. Good lord this thread is all over the place.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by jiggero View Post

    The peanut is not a nut it is a legume.
    Sonofa...
    My current UNsponsored PES EP cutting log:http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplement-reviews-logs/234161-adonisbelts-pes-erase.html

  14. Quote Originally Posted by AdonisBelt View Post
    Sonofa...
    LOL that's what i said when someone told me that.

  15. Got my blood work back today....so one month,after my blast test level was 427. The problem is my hemoglobin level came back elevated at a 55. The doc really did not like that

  16. Doing a little research shows that dehydration and extreme physical exertion can cause high hemoglobin. So i probably do not need to get my blood work done after a night shift followed by cardio and a back workout with deadlifts.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by bigt405 View Post
    The problem is my hemoglobin level came back elevated at a 55. The doc really did not like that
    that's your hematocrit level big fella. high hemoglobin's are in the 19-20 range.

    my hematocrit was a little higher than that when i was on 75 twice a week.

    hated it so went down to 50 every 4 days...

  18. Quote Originally Posted by bigt405 View Post
    Doing a little research shows that dehydration and extreme physical exertion can cause high hemoglobin. So i probably do not need to get my blood work done after a night shift followed by cardio and a back workout with deadlifts.
    Yes, if you did those things prior to lab draw, it's likely you were hemoconcentrated. Losing sweat but not red blood cells increases the hematocrit fraction, but it is transient as rehydration will again dilute the blood. Only one way to know for sure though!
    "I'm not fat, I'm big boned!"

  19. Might want to make sure you are hydrated and include some tasty grapefruit juice into your diet. If that doesn't work, you may just need to do a blood donation.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    If that doesn't work, you may just need to do a blood donation.
    easier said than done. they all do a quick hgb and hct on you prior to letting you donate. if too high, they say thanks but no thanks.

    <----happened to me...

  21. I am going to give blood tomorrow at work and next week when i get it checked again i will do it on an off day with a lot of water intake.....might even try that grapefruit juice (yuk). Thanks for the advice guys.

  22. I scoffed at the idea of grapefruit juice working when someone posted it, and then I researched it and added it in. I was running about 52 and a solid month of gf juice dropped it to 49. Not huge, but for something that easy and delicious, I drink it every day. There are conflicting studies on it raising e2 slightly, but I have not found anything showing numbers to be concerned with.

  23. So one glass a day is all you need?

  24. Yep. I have 8-10 oz a day.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by trn450 View Post
    Actually the official guidelines explicitly state that no longer than every three weeks, and preferably every week for cyp/enan for more stable blood levels. I just reviewed the UpToDate guidelines. We know it doesn't "last" three to four weeks, some folks just prefer to take the shot less frequently and get loaded with a supraphysiologic dose (e.g. 300 mg/3wk) that will keep you above low for the majority of the duration of three weeks.

    Are you talking day 9 after initiation of therapy? If so, I don't know what in the world anybody was doing checking levels anyway. Of course it'd be low. It takes 5-6 half lifes, for any drug, to approach steady state. For cyp/enan that's nearly two months.
    I know what you mean but no, it's 9 days well within therpy. I go through test very quickly for some reason could be the intense training

  26. Quote Originally Posted by AdonisBelt View Post
    Some nuts are inflammatory, such as peanuts, while others are anti inflammatory, such as almonds. There is a lot of info on this.
    Thanks for the info, I dont eat peanuts anyway. I mostly eat almonds, walnuts and sunflower seeds.

  27. Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    Good lord this thread is all over the place.
    Deep fried is my favorite way to prepare a turkey. What do you guys prefer?

  28. Quote Originally Posted by lexmuscle View Post
    Deep fried is my favorite way to prepare a turkey. What do you guys prefer?
    I prefer Naruto to Pokemon.
    "I'm not fat, I'm big boned!"

  29. Quote Originally Posted by lexmuscle View Post

    Deep fried is my favorite way to prepare a turkey. What do you guys prefer?
    I prefer Burrito Express, and I've tried all the competitors

  30. Quote Originally Posted by threeFs View Post

    I prefer Burrito Express, and I've tried all the competitors
    No way, Ben n Jerry's peanut butter world. You can only get it at target.

  31. How long do you guys come off a blast?

  32. I'm going 12 week blast.

    12 week 400cyp
    6 week 200deca

  33. Quote Originally Posted by TRTDetroit View Post
    I'm going 12 week blast.

    12 week 400cyp
    6 week 200deca
    AI?
    And maybe prolactin prevent just in case?

  34. Yes, both threeF. Learned a lot here in these forums. Thanks again.

  35. May sound stupid but what is deca and what does it do. What is the ourpose post test?

  36. mkretz, google is your friend.

  37. Really qwang?

  38. Good thread. I was going to do the same as you. I am going to start TRT (once I find a good Doc here in Atlanta) soon. I have my blood work from another doc, but he wanted to prescribe me anti anxiety pills to sleep---not. I have a busy career and I have never slept that regular. My TEST is LOW! (230). So I thought about blasting before the TRT, but better advice says to reduce my BF% a little more. Currently at about 18%. I understand that TRT helps with the fat loss.

  39. Quote Originally Posted by Kleaver View Post
    Good thread. I was going to do the same as you. I am going to start TRT (once I find a good Doc here in Atlanta) soon. I have my blood work from another doc, but he wanted to prescribe me anti anxiety pills to sleep---not. I have a busy career and I have never slept that regular. My TEST is LOW! (230). So I thought about blasting before the TRT, but better advice says to reduce my BF% a little more. Currently at about 18%. I understand that TRT helps with the fat loss.
    Yes, TRT helps with fat loss. If you're cutting while on TRT, it will also make for a better recomp, rather than just a plain cut. This is what I've noticed so far.

  40. Thinking about doing a short pulse of SD for a second cycle...thoughts?
  

  
 

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