Going off TRT - can't afford to see anymore Docs. =(

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  1. Charlos - good luck

    How long were you ON TRT?
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  2. Well, I've been sorta on again/off again for a year now, but at first it was with creams which I didn't think did anything. I went off TRT for 3-4 months, then tried injections and have been on those for I'd say ~6 months now. We started out w/ 120mg total per week and my test was in the 1000 range and E2 was ~60 so we backed off to 80mg. I've been on that for about two months now and only recently have added an AI which has really been ****ing w/ how I feel. I honestly felt better with high E2. Normal?
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by CharlosCarlie View Post
    Before I make this post, thanks Matrix for the good advice on my old threads. It really got me thinking about how I don't want to be stuck on TRT for good if it isn't necessary. I was planning on contacting the doc you recommended, but money is really really tight right now (another reason I want to go off TRT).

    A short summary: Original labs were ~600 and my doc put me on TRT for what likely is just a stress/sleep issue. I've been on a very mild protocol for the past ~6 months of 80-100mg Test C/wk, 250 IU HCG 3x/wk, and I just recently added Arimidex at .25 mg 3x/wk for the past month or so. E2 was in the 60 range before the Arimidex and I honestly felt better despite the high levels.

    Anyways, I was just hoping for any advice on a reasonable PCT/Restart protocol given what I currently have left which is:

    - ~5000 IUs of HCG
    - Plenty of Aromasin and Arimidex.

    I know this situation is going to be FAR from optimal and I really wish I had the money to see a legit doc, but ANY advice at all would be greatly appreciated.
    if your on HRT/TRT because you have natty low levels then your kinda of stuck with ethe rHRT/TRT or having low T levels and slowly having your health deteriate before you along with mental issues like depression etc.

    If you cant afford to see the TRT doc then get your own test and that alone will save you 90% of costs. (100-200mg ew) and go in for a blood test 3-4 times a year to check levels and go from there.
    unless covered I dont ever see myself paying for my endo and TRT compounds from pharmacy, thay are abusing use witht he prices when it should not cost more then 10-20$ MAX for 100mg of test. not 200-400$
    its just no right.
    look into omnadren250 or noma teste, there found fairly cheap if you know your stuff and there pharm grade.
    LG Sciences Board Rep
    These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA, do not constitute medical advice, and are not official or authorized comments by LG Sciences, LLC.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Fever is natural response to an infection why you would want to stop it? Let nature run its course. If fever gets to 106 then seek medical attention
    EXACLY!! I dont F-ing understand these people giving and taking them selv's tylonal for fever and other flue/cold simptoms.
    TYLONAL IS LIVER TOXIC AND BAD FOR YOU!
    read up on it and howmany people die EVERY year from using Tylonal. and im nt talkign junkies im talkign normal people.

    a fever isa natural responce to HELP KILL THE INFECTION!!
    popping this pill is NOT goign to help you nore kill off anything, they tell you that so yYOU feel liek ou got some kind of edvice and YOU bug them less about it.
    the only time you want to stop it is when it gets soo high it may cause brain damage or organs to shut down. and i assure you its not tylonal they will be giving them lol.
    LG Sciences Board Rep
    These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA, do not constitute medical advice, and are not official or authorized comments by LG Sciences, LLC.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Very true,
    What done is done and he needs to let his body restabliize on its own the suggestions I made will help him out greatly to keep things as stable as they can be.
    whoa i missed this. this is not super low, 200 may below. but if your free T levels are somewhat normal and the rest is at 600 , Im not sure why the doc put you on it.
    or am i missing somthing?
    LG Sciences Board Rep
    These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA, do not constitute medical advice, and are not official or authorized comments by LG Sciences, LLC.
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  6. I do a ton of research into autism which I then apply to the general population increasing the positive out come significantly. There are several cases of children developing autism before vacinations where ever administered. Amazing fact is these childern consumed large amounts of children's tylenol. How about that one. Why do you think I know the gut and liver pathways and detoxification so detailed. Its from studying biochemistry and neurology of autism for the past 7 years. Understanding autism will lead medical professionals to a whole new world of treating their patients. Funniest part is when I get a new case or client, I evaluate them from an autistic stand point which allows for greater exploration getting to the root cause of the issue instead looking at the symptoms. I can be a dr's best friend or an insecure Dr's worst nightmare.


    Quote Originally Posted by Blergs View Post
    EXACLY!! I dont F-ing understand these people giving and taking them selv's tylonal for fever and other flue/cold simptoms.
    TYLONAL IS LIVER TOXIC AND BAD FOR YOU!
    read up on it and howmany people die EVERY year from using Tylonal. and im nt talkign junkies im talkign normal people.

    a fever isa natural responce to HELP KILL THE INFECTION!!
    popping this pill is NOT goign to help you nore kill off anything, they tell you that so yYOU feel liek ou got some kind of edvice and YOU bug them less about it.
    the only time you want to stop it is when it gets soo high it may cause brain damage or organs to shut down. and i assure you its not tylonal they will be giving them lol.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.

  7. Minor update:

    I did cheat almost exactly two weeks ago and injected 50mg of T. Other than that, I've stayed away from everything else. Had a couple of bad binge drinking nights that really had me feeling like ****, but I feel relatively decent now. I'm sleeping a little better (harder to get out of bed though), energy levels are a little lower, and anxiety is a little higher. Sex drive seems lower but not having any problems getting erections so far *knocks on wood* (ha ha).

    I am now supplementing P5P, Zing, Magnesium, Niacin, and Vitamin D. Seems to help but obv could be just in my head. When would you guys wait to test my blood levels? Should I still expect to start feeling worse as the weeks go on since I did semi-cheat a couple weeks ago?

  8. You listed one of my stables It works incredible well too..

    Quote Originally Posted by CharlosCarlie View Post
    Minor update:

    I did cheat almost exactly two weeks ago and injected 50mg of T. Other than that, I've stayed away from everything else. Had a couple of bad binge drinking nights that really had me feeling like ****, but I feel relatively decent now. I'm sleeping a little better (harder to get out of bed though), energy levels are a little lower, and anxiety is a little higher. Sex drive seems lower but not having any problems getting erections so far *knocks on wood* (ha ha).

    I am now supplementing P5P, Zing, Magnesium, Niacin, and Vitamin D. Seems to help but obv could be just in my head. When would you guys wait to test my blood levels? Should I still expect to start feeling worse as the weeks go on since I did semi-cheat a couple weeks ago?
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.

  9. Moving to Canada tomorrow so obviously been under quite a bit more stress than usual. I'm handling things relatively well but I still am having occasional bouts of depression-like symptoms. It's bearable though and I at least know the reason for it.

    One surprising positive change: Morning erections (actually erections/orgasms in general) have been much better which seems really odd. Does this mean T levels are likely within at least the "normal" range? It's been almost 3 weeks since my last injection now.

  10. Quote Originally Posted by CharlosCarlie View Post
    Moving to Canada tomorrow so obviously been under quite a bit more stress than usual. I'm handling things relatively well but I still am having occasional bouts of depression-like symptoms. It's bearable though and I at least know the reason for it.

    One surprising positive change: Morning erections (actually erections/orgasms in general) have been much better which seems really odd. Does this mean T levels are likely within at least the "normal" range? It's been almost 3 weeks since my last injection now.
    Up vitamin D may be suggested..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.

  11. how much vitamin D?

  12. Quote Originally Posted by fanzdslpwr1
    how much vitamin D?
    I'm thinking you would need to know you current level to know how much is needed for optimal levels.
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  13. I was slightly vitamin D deficient in my original pre-TRT labs, so that does seem like a good idea especially considering I'll be in Canada and haven't lived outside of Texas my whole life.

    I know it would help to know my levels now, but what would be a good amount to start with? How much is too much?

  14. who wants to pay for bloodwork for vit D?

  15. I'm pretty sure nobody does. If you have insurance ask your doc to add it to labs.
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  16. Quote Originally Posted by CharlosCarlie
    I know it would help to know my levels now, but what would be a good amount to start with? How much is too much?
    I was slightly deficient too and started taking 5000iu a day. Its been a month but I haven't had it checked since.

    http://www.vitamindcouncil.org/about...pplementation/

    I should probably take more.
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  17. Quote Originally Posted by breezy11 View Post
    I was slightly deficient too and started taking 5000iu a day. Its been a month but I haven't had it checked since.

    I should probably take more.
    Yeah I did some googling and it looks like 5000 seems fairly standard. I was only taking 1000, so maybe bumping it a bit will be helpful.

    Have you noticed any difference in mood, etc?

  18. Quote Originally Posted by CharlosCarlie

    Yeah I did some googling and it looks like 5000 seems fairly standard. I was only taking 1000, so maybe bumping it a bit will be helpful.

    Have you noticed any difference in mood, etc?
    It's hard to say. I have too many other variables right now...started trt a few months ago and still not dialed in, came off other medication, etc. Mood and energy are slightly up but I can't attribute that solely to vitD supplementation.
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  19. Quote Originally Posted by breezy11 View Post
    It's hard to say. I have too many other variables right now...started trt a few months ago and still not dialed in, came off other medication, etc. Mood and energy are slightly up but I can't attribute that solely to vitD supplementation.
    Depends on person's ability to absorb it.
    I have many Dr's who have patients who have been taking 5,000 ius a day still testing in <30. So do not be fooled...
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix
    Depends on person's ability to absorb it.
    I have many Dr's who have patients who have been taking 5,000 ius a day still testing in <30. So do not be fooled...
    Definitely not fooled. I'd be surprised if its doing much at all considering my body's lack of ability to absorb most things.
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  21. Quote Originally Posted by breezy11 View Post
    Definitely not fooled. I'd be surprised if its doing much at all considering my body's lack of ability to absorb most things.
    This is why my emphasis is on the GI tract and liver, If you can not get the building blocks in there then you can not make hormone, neurotransmitters. I don;t know why Dr will not use common sense when it comes to things. It just baffles me..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix

    This is why my emphasis is on the GI tract and liver, If you can not get the building blocks in there then you can not make hormone, neurotransmitters. I don;t know why Dr will not use common sense when it comes to things. It just baffles me..
    Endos can't seem to grasp that concept.
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  23. Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix

    This is why my emphasis is on the GI tract and liver, If you can not get the building blocks in there then you can not make hormone, neurotransmitters. I don;t know why Dr will not use common sense when it comes to things. It just baffles me..
    I have found they have a hard time considering anything outside there specialty/comfort zone. My current endo overlooks most things in general. I haven't spoke with him yet but after my recent atch stim test he ignored my atch level of 5 (ref 10-60) via letter.
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  24. Quote Originally Posted by breezy11 View Post
    I have found they have a hard time considering anything outside there specialty/comfort zone. My current endo overlooks most things in general. I haven't spoke with him yet but after my recent atch stim test he ignored my atch level of 5 (ref 10-60) via letter.
    Again every cases is different, until you sit down and talk to the person then and only then will you see the true picture. Many times I have read something on line then person sitting there in front of you tells you pieces of the puzzle which changes the whole out come of the treatment by their DR. This is why forums can be missleading because the whole picture is not there which could resulting in making information sounding validate end up back firing on them. In case like yours I bet I am only getting 20-25% of the entire case scenerio.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix

    Again every cases is different, until you sit down and talk to the person then and only then will you see the true picture. Many times I have read something on line then person sitting there in front of you tells you pieces of the puzzle which changes the whole out come of the treatment by their DR. This is why forums can be missleading because the whole picture is not there which could resulting in making information sounding validate end up back firing on them. In case like yours I bet I am only getting 20-25% of the entire case scenerio.
    Hopefully ill be able to discuss in detail with you in the future
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  26. Quote Originally Posted by breezy11 View Post
    Hopefully ill be able to discuss in detail with you in the future
    Be good to find a good dr to get on board with add a huge part to the puzzle making things go much easier.
    Time and place for everything.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.

  27. Update:

    The move was pretty stressful, but I'm feeling a lot better after getting settled in. Have been getting strong morning erections everyday now which wasn't even happening pre-TRT. Weird.

    Only negative so far is I'm still having back acne flare-ups. I NEVER had problems with this at all pre-TRT and have been off the T for almost a month now. Is this likely just stress related?

  28. charlos what you taking to upregulate your body?

  29. Quote Originally Posted by fanzdslpwr1 View Post
    charlos what you taking to upregulate your body?
    Nothing other than Vitamin D, Zing, and Magnesium at the moment. I was taking P5P but dropped the bottle and shattered it.

  30. If you're taking vitamin D then be careful about taking antiacids, like Tums or Rolaids because they will cause your calcium levels to rise out of limits and that could be harmful to your kidneys. Vitamin D will increase absorption.
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