My take on IGF-1
- 10-22-2006, 12:50 AM
- 10-22-2006, 01:35 AM
7 mgs will last me 525 days at E3D
I'm actually just starting a Monday, Wednesday, Friday rotation with it as I'm combining it with another little helper. It should last longer this way actually. I'll let you know as I ascertain results. I can compare to my past ED protocols, I've ran 7mgs that way as well. 25 on, 25 off.
- 10-22-2006, 01:40 AM
10-22-2006, 01:44 AM
in theory you can run E3D protocols indefinitely. This very thread is trying to find out what is best. The other standard protocol is 25 days on, 25 off, using up 1mg in 25 days with 40mcg split bilaterally/day.
10-22-2006, 10:42 AM
oh ok, I was wondering, since i workout every 2 days, mabye I should try 30mcg post-workout E2D
monday chest/shoulders/tris - inject tris
wed legs - inject quads
friday - back/bicep - inject bicep
sunday - chest/shoulders/tricep = inject shoulders
total 120mcg for 7 days
very similar to 40mcg E3D
monday - inject
thur - inject
dimanche - inject
total - 120mcg for 7 days
what do u think grunt? or others
10-22-2006, 02:41 PM
Yes that also looks good. Depending on your LBM this might be run indefinitely or you may get slowly diminishing results.Originally Posted by r1ck
How long postworkout are you planning on pinning?
10-22-2006, 02:54 PM
I started training 3 years ago at 128 lbs with 20% bf,Originally Posted by Grunt76
had only 100lbm
Today im 165lbs 12% bf 145 lbm with natural diet/training
I did try a tbol only cycle and stop it after 2 weeks, because I was getting joint pains and hair lines wow
gained around 40lbs of muscle, I have small bones(wrist,ankles), hard to put more, igf1 is my option to try to get to 10% bf and gain mabye a couple of lbm to shape up.
I have 1mg of igf-1, not sure if eod(30mcg) or e3d(40mcg) would be better without any gut increase. I train every 2 days. I might change my workout routine to accommodate e3d igf1.
what do you think, Thanks
p.s. im 24 years old, 25 next summer
10-22-2006, 04:12 PM
Yes those dosages both look good. No need to go higher than that for sure.Originally Posted by r1ck
10-22-2006, 05:00 PM
thanks masterOriginally Posted by Grunt76
I did a search and couldnt find the answer
If I have puffy nips (little gyno) from puberty since im 12 years old
the days ill inject igf1lr3 in my pecs will it aggravate my puffy nips? wondering
10-22-2006, 06:50 PM
No, unless your estrogen is really high to begin with, and that's another matter entirely for sure.Originally Posted by r1ck
10-23-2006, 01:08 PM
should use some armidex .5 ed to stay estrogen lowOriginally Posted by Grunt76
and since I have low lbm should i go stick 20mcg eod instead
10-23-2006, 02:03 PM
Now there is a smart man. Start with 20mcg and run the first half of your mg at that dose if you get some good effects. Then kick it up to 30 if you feel you need more. :bb:Originally Posted by r1ck
10-23-2006, 06:40 PM
Very interesting thread. Perhaps I'm missing something and this is a stupid question, but...
Since Long R3 IGF-1 is localized and binds to the closest receptors first, is it ideal to rotate the point of injection within a single muscle? In other words, if one is injecting pecs, should he just always inject in the center of the pectoral or should he sometimes inject on the upper portion, sometimes on the lower, etc? Thanks.
10-23-2006, 08:09 PM
10-23-2006, 08:22 PM
If I want a systemic effect can I pin sub q. I ask because I worry about intestinal growth, but I'd only be pinning twice/week at 40 mcg or maybe 3 times/week at 30 mcg.
10-23-2006, 08:33 PM
Thanks for the tip. I was just using pecs as an example though. Basically, I'm wondering if just injecting in the center of each muscle (pecs or otherwise) is sufficient and the IGF will be distributed throughout the muscle, or if it's preferable to inject in different areas on each injection to ensure effects are evenly distributed throughout that muscle.Originally Posted by Jaxxx
10-23-2006, 11:03 PM
I had wondered this, and tried different locations per muscle group. It can't hurt. Pecs, I keep one inch inside the nipple and go up from there accordingly. I keep to the thickest part of the pec.Originally Posted by TeamSavage
10-24-2006, 01:16 AM
It is not ONLY localized. It was first designed to be a systemic drug and it will have some degree of systemic effect no matter what we do. Some slight systemic effect should be preferred, as it will help maintain tendons, cartilage, bone, internal organs and most soft tissue in good repair. The rest of the effect we want in the muscle. Too much systemic effec means that some of the LBM we are gaining comes from enlarged abdominal organs. I feel that rotating injection sites within a muscle is no effort at all, so why not.Originally Posted by TeamSavage
Systemic effect is the best way to grow guts. Injecting inside the muscle immediately postworkout ensures that it will primarily affect your muscle. That's what you want.Originally Posted by mywetnightmares
10-24-2006, 03:49 AM
10-24-2006, 02:00 PM
W000h000 Someone loves me!Originally Posted by Ubiquitous
OK, I'm putting away the rat poison now...
10-24-2006, 04:21 PM
10-24-2006, 06:10 PM
I would say no, because at low dosage 20mcg or 30mcg eod e3d you will destroy it in urine if you exceed what u need, your not going to take 100mcg a day of course because ull get the coleman gut of the beast, but ill let grunt ze master answer.Originally Posted by joikd
10-24-2006, 08:12 PM
10-24-2006, 09:24 PM
Thanks for your previous response. Another issue on which I require clarification:
Let's say one is not focusing on a specific lagging muscle but wishes to hit most or all of the muscle groups...
I'm assuming the receptor downregulation only occurs on the muscle injected. Is this accurate? So if this is the case, then could you avoid downregulation even at 40mcg ED provided that each specific muscle group was only pinned E7D?
On a related issue, if one were pinning 40mcg ED but only hitting each muscle E7D, would you still recommend limiting to 4 week cycles?
10-25-2006, 01:21 AM
There seems to be this huge problem with the idea that IGF-1 is both local and systemic. When you inject immediately postworkout in the muscle trained, most of the effect will go to the intended muscle, and there will be some degree of systemic spillover depending on your dosage.Originally Posted by TeamSavage
For this reason, an EOD or E3D protocol is best. That is, not for any given muscle, but for any IGF-1 at all. You may get increased results by pinning the same muscle twice a week, provided you keep to an EOD or E3D pinning scheduled as indicated above.
10-25-2006, 07:19 AM
It's been awhile since I been here(months). I've been reading up on all of this good info recently. I go and try to give Grunt some reps and I get denied. I have to spread it around before I can give anymore to you G. Good info on the IGF-1.
10-25-2006, 02:48 PM
I would like to preload my syringe before going to gym to pin post-workout, but im not quite understanding what you are saying about the discharging, u need foil?Originally Posted by Grunt76
10-25-2006, 02:52 PM
When the syringe is preloaded, obviously accidentally pushing on the plunger in transit will push out the precious IGF-1. So I make a spacer between the barrel and the end of the plunger to keep it from being pushed accidentally. Load up a syringe and you will see what I mean.Originally Posted by r1ck
10-25-2006, 02:53 PM
10-25-2006, 04:43 PM
One day I didn't use a spacer and realized I had wasted all my precious IGF in my secret compartment pocket.. in my pants.... I was pissed.
10-25-2006, 06:47 PM
I bought some 0.3cc syringe, but the women told me thats it's never going to reach IM cuz the pin is too small? is that true?
she told me its insulin syringe and they are only for under skin
im like i know , but i still asked her if they can reach IM, she said no because of the thickness of the skin, I know they will reach my IM in my biceps but im not sure about my pecs since they have more skin and not sure about my shoulders and legs
10-25-2006, 07:45 PM
a lot of o.3cc syringes automaticaly come with a 5/16" needle but if you look around you can find 1/2"Originally Posted by r1ck
10-25-2006, 07:46 PM
that woman is a jackass. Unless you're a fat SOB you can hit small amounts of depot IM with 1/2" 29g needles. You picked a good size barrel too..3/10 is the shizzy. Just use 1/2" instead of the 5/16's or whatever they are.
10-25-2006, 07:51 PM
Someone should manufacture a slin pin with a 1" needle so fat SOB's can slim down with IGF-1. Maybe even a 2" version for the morbidly obese.Originally Posted by Ubiquitous
10-25-2006, 07:54 PM
rofl im not fat, but my pecs have a little fat on them, if I mesure them with a body fat caliper it'sOriginally Posted by Ubiquitous
my biceps 1mm lol,
im around 12% BF,
how much mm is 5/16 ?
10-25-2006, 08:03 PM
Try this...Originally Posted by r1ck
Inch/Millimeter Converter -- Technical Notes
(There's a little-known website you can use to find this sort of information. It's called Google.com. Learn it, love it, use it.)
Remember that the calipers measure the fat layer folded over, so the caliper measurement is actually two layers of fat, twice the thickness of the single fat layer as it normally rests atop the muscle.
Still, just get a 1/2" pin. The big pharmacy chains sell them for $3/10.
10-25-2006, 08:40 PM
10-25-2006, 09:14 PM
10-25-2006, 10:40 PM
10-25-2006, 10:47 PM
Is this the only reason you don't preload? I've read a few direction on mixing & they say not to preload. Is there other reasons like down regulation of the igf? Or does it destory it after setting this way after awhile?Originally Posted by Grunt76
I'm talking about mixing it w/ aa then adding the sodium.
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