PapaPump's CJC-1295/GHRP-6 6-month Run

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by Bobaslaw View Post
    Papa, the best way to get back to the levels you want would be:

    1)via matrix, figure out your current systemic level of CJC using the 10% daily degradation level as posted by DAT.

    2)Postpone further doses of CJC until you current systemic levels drop to the baseline of your original protocol, then continue your desired dosages.

    3)Continue GHRP at the proposed dosages throughout.

    Take Care.
    Yes, I like this approach and it's exactly what I'm going to do.

    I'll post my results when I finish crunching some #s.

    Thanks Bob for chiming in. Good to see you man


  2. Ok, I have spent quite some time today working on decay rates and CJC-1295 accumulation rates when dosed ED. I am trying to determine how many days off from CJC I need in order to reach the concentration I SHOULD have been at if my protocol was followed.

    Below is a basic decay rate of CJC based on 10% loss ED. Again, as I noted Dat's thread, this is asymptotic meaning the line approaches zero, but in theory, will never reach zero unless you define a "decimal stopping point" such as, 0.00001. Enough of that crap.



    The next graph basically shows the Actual & Expected [CJC] (CJC concentrations) as a function of time and how long I have to wait until I can start dosing CJC again.




    Source data attached (zipped Excel workbook)
    Attached Images Attached Images   
    Attached Files Attached Files
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by papapumpsd View Post
    Ok, I have spent quite some time today (on my day off from work) working on decay rates and CJC-1295 accumulation rates when dosed ED.

    Below is a basic decay rate of CJC based on 10% loss ED. Again, as I noted Dat's thread, this is asymptotic meaning the line approaches zero, but in theory, will never reach zero unless you define a "decimal stopping point" such as, 0.00001. Enough of that crap.

    The next graph is how the CJC's concentration accumulates over a 14 day period. Note the dose used everyday is 300mcg.

    Now, below is data that shows my approximated current (10/10/2008) concentration of CJC-1295. Note: I took only one shot of 250mcg today (this morning). That is when I figured out the vials were mislabeled.

    Source data attached (zipped Excel workbook)
    im not seeing any graphs bro.

  4. EDITED POST ABOVE (ADDED GRAPHS): Ok, sorry for the delay. I had to find a stupid mistake in my calculations. I accidentally had a "sum" function that was artificially inflating the [CJC]. Sorry.

    Pumb, thanks for catching and not telling anyone about my 5th grade mistake

  5. Don't worry bro...I saw it too. I'm just too busy working to point it out.

  6. Quote Originally Posted by SoCo4Fun View Post
    Don't worry bro...I saw it too. I'm just too busy working to point it out.
    LOL! JFC you guys....really b-slapping Papa today huh? I have been staring at my damn Excel data for hours.....multi-tasking between graphs and whatnot. Eeesh.

    Anywho, as my data suggests, I will have to wait 3 days before my CJC levels drop to where they should be. That will in no way inhibit GH release because there will obviously be PLENTY of CJC floating around to work w/my GHRP-6.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by papapumpsd View Post
    LOL! JFC you guys....really b-slapping Papa today huh? I have been staring at my damn Excel data for hours.....multi-tasking between graphs and whatnot. Eeesh.

    Anywho, as my data suggests, I will have to wait 3 days before my CJC levels drop to where they should be. That will in no way inhibit GH release because there will obviously be PLENTY of CJC floating around to work w/my GHRP-6.
    us men multi-tasking, is that possible?lol.

    nice graphs papa, it was worth it in the end.

    oh the 3 days may allow the pituitary tumour to shrink a bit too.

  8. Good to hear you'll be back on track in no time.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by pumbertot View Post
    oh the 3 days may allow the pituitary tumour to shrink a bit too.
    LMFAO, Pumbertot!!!!

    PS- Papa, I knew when I gave the suggestion about figuring the decay rate you would be coming up with your extraordinarily meticulous and beautifully crafted visual aids! I was really looking forward to it. Nice Bro, real nice.

  10. I think there is a good possibility that you DID NOT mix up vials in the first place.

    You can not compare freeze-dried powder volume between vials and expect to get an accurate assessment of the amount/weight of peptide inside.

    If you look at vials of the same color you will notice variability even among the same peptide. Trying to compare vials of different peptides by visual inspection is worse.

    Although the powder is suppose to be devoid of moisture, it is likely not and this may more or less account for volume changes. In addition some powder is simply denser then others.

    I just pulled out CJC-1295 2mg vials; GHRP-6 5mg vials and MT-II 10mg vials and compared.

    There was a LOT of variability in the GHRP-6 vials. There was a fair amount of consistency among the CJC-1295 vials as well as the MT-II vials.

    However comparing among peptides was difficult. 10mgs of MT-II did not look much bigger the 2mgs of CJC-1295 and comparing GHRP-6 5mgs to CJC-1295 2mgs was an exercise in futility.

    You are VERY VERY lucky because one set of vials is green & the other blue. In fact they were labeled for you. Now ALL you need to do is double check with the seller by color code.

    If you are unable to do that let the CJC-1295 clear and then choose one vial and take a little.

    Look for:
    • a hunger effect = GHRP-6
    • lethargy = CJC-1295
    • solid sleep but no wacky dream = GHRP-6
    • deep sleep and wacky dreams = CJC-1295


    OR if you have a very sensitive scale capable of measuring .001 grams (and if you play with powders you should) then open one of each and weigh the contents of each.

    * - By-the-way I'm not immune to these types of hassles either. Some of my GHRP-6 are blue & my CJC-1295's are blue. When I just pulled them out for a comparison I may have mixed up one of the vials. Oh well.
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  11. i think dat may be right.just looked at mine, cant tell them apart due variances.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by datBtrue View Post
    I think there is a good possibility that you DID NOT mix up vials in the first place.

    You can not compare freeze-dried powder volume between vials and expect to get an accurate assessment of the amount/weight of peptide inside.

    If you look at vials of the same color you will notice variability even among the same peptide. Trying to compare vials of different peptides by visual inspection is worse.

    Although the powder is suppose to be devoid of moisture, it is likely not and this may more or less account for volume changes. In addition some powder is simply denser then others.

    I just pulled out CJC-1295 2mg vials; GHRP-6 5mg vials and MT-II 10mg vials and compared.

    There was a LOT of variability in the GHRP-6 vials. There was a fair amount of consistency among the CJC-1295 vials as well as the MT-II vials.

    However comparing among peptides was difficult. 10mgs of MT-II did not look much bigger the 2mgs of CJC-1295 and comparing GHRP-6 5mgs to CJC-1295 2mgs was an exercise in futility.

    You are VERY VERY lucky because one set of vials is green & the other blue. In fact they were labeled for you. Now ALL you need to do is double check with the seller by color code.

    If you are unable to do that let the CJC-1295 clear and then choose one vial and take a little.

    Look for:
    • a hunger effect = GHRP-6
    • lethargy = CJC-1295
    • solid sleep but no wacky dream = GHRP-6
    • deep sleep and wacky dreams = CJC-1295


    OR if you have a very sensitive scale capable of measuring .001 grams (and if you play with powders you should) then open one of each and weigh the contents of each.

    * - By-the-way I'm not immune to these types of hassles either. Some of my GHRP-6 are blue & my CJC-1295's are blue. When I just pulled them out for a comparison I may have mixed up one of the vials. Oh well.

    Ok, this is getting me all jacked up in the head. I would REALLY like to get this straightened out. I was already told that supplier of my peps can switch tops and uses what ever is avail.

    And YES, I have quite a bit of variability in volume of powder among GHRP and CJC.

    LOL Dat, I too have mixed up vials when I was comparing them! Wow was that pissing me off.

    Well, I'll just use one pep. at a time and look for your "indicators" above. Thanks for helping!


  13. Quote Originally Posted by papapumpsd View Post
    Ok, this is getting me all jacked up in the head. I would REALLY like to get this straightened out. I was already told that supplier of my peps can switch tops and uses what ever is avail.

    And YES, I have quite a bit of variability in volume of powder among GHRP and CJC.

    LOL Dat, I too have mixed up vials when I was comparing them! Wow was that pissing me off.

    Well, I'll just use one pep. at a time and look for your "indicators" above. Thanks for helping!


    IMO, the best immediate short term side to judge CJC is the distinct dose dependant "niacin like flushing". At least 400mcg would give some minor flushing for me. Not quite as intense as the days of bi weekly 1mg injects tho..
    Knowing this expected symptom, I can even detect it slightly when taking 200mcg if I pay close attention...

    I would personally try a larger dosage of at least 500mcg and let the fridge be the judge. Either you get some flushing and stick your head in the freezer, or you possibly get hungry and look in the fridge instead

    I agree. Dat is right for pointing out the flawed method of visually identifying powder volume, if that is the only basis for the assumption.
  14. Thumbs up


    Quote Originally Posted by Bobaslaw View Post
    IMO, the best immediate short term side to judge CJC is the distinct dose dependant "niacin like flushing". At least 400mcg would give some minor flushing for me. Not quite as intense as the days of bi weekly 1mg injects tho..
    Knowing this expected symptom, I can even detect it slightly when taking 200mcg if I pay close attention...
    Very good! I was hoping someone would chime in with other/better ways to distinguish. That symptom is talked about a lot.

    I never really got it because I dose smaller but more frequent.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by Bobaslaw View Post
    IMO, the best immediate short term side to judge CJC is the distinct dose dependant "niacin like flushing". At least 400mcg would give some minor flushing for me. Not quite as intense as the days of bi weekly 1mg injects tho..
    Knowing this expected symptom, I can even detect it slightly when taking 200mcg if I pay close attention...

    I would personally try a larger dosage of at least 500mcg and let the fridge be the judge. Either you get some flushing and stick your head in the freezer, or you possibly get hungry and look in the fridge instead

    I agree. Dat is right for pointing out the flawed method of visually identifying powder volume, if that is the only basis for the assumption.
    Sweet, I'm all over it. I'll keep an eye out for a flush when I do a 500mcg hit.

  16. Quote Originally Posted by datBtrue View Post
    You need to let a newly reconstituted vial stand for several days to insure that the BA has killed all bacteria (assuming the BW contained .9% BA).
    Dat, isn't 0.9% BA only supposed to prevent bacteria from reproducing, rather than outright killing them?

  17. Quote Originally Posted by papapumpsd View Post
    Anyone else have significant bruising from abdominal SQ injections??? JFC, IM was 10x easier and no issues. This SQ is a joke....at least for me.
    I ALWAYS do IM bro...much easier, and hurts way less. usually always do delts.
    The LORD is my rock, my fortress, and my savior; my God is my rock, in whom I find protection. He is my shield, the power that saves me, and my place of safety.-Psalm 18:2

  18. Quote Originally Posted by ragnar View Post
    Dat, isn't 0.9% BA only supposed to prevent bacteria from reproducing, rather than outright killing them?
    As you state, that is how "bacteriastatic agent" is defined and BA is often called a "bacteriastatic agent".

    However is is also a disinfectant. At the moment I can not find the study that tested .9% BA on bacteria and found that it took 3 days to kill all bacteria. These types of studies were done to support use in human aqueous solutions & oil based solutions as well.

    For the moment here is a snippet from page 359 of the "The Veterinary Formulary" by Yolande Bishop, British Veterinary Association which states that BA may be used as a disinfectant for cows teats.

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  19. Quote Originally Posted by Bobaslaw View Post
    IMO, the best immediate short term side to judge CJC is the distinct dose dependant "niacin like flushing". At least 400mcg would give some minor flushing for me. Not quite as intense as the days of bi weekly 1mg injects tho..
    Knowing this expected symptom, I can even detect it slightly when taking 200mcg if I pay close attention...

    I would personally try a larger dosage of at least 500mcg and let the fridge be the judge. Either you get some flushing and stick your head in the freezer, or you possibly get hungry and look in the fridge instead

    I agree. Dat is right for pointing out the flawed method of visually identifying powder volume, if that is the only basis for the assumption.

    exactly what i was going to suggest bro. once again great minds.............

  20. huh huh huh...dat said "teat"...sorry that is my best Beavis and Butthead imitation...

    Good info as always dat...i've been letting my reconstituted CJC sit for a few days and Im going to try it again...luckily these huge knots (they got damn big) on my stomach are going down and the redness and heat has gone away...

  21. Quote Originally Posted by datBtrue View Post
    As you state, that is how "bacteriastatic agent" is defined and BA is often called a "bacteriastatic agent".

    However is is also a disinfectant. At the moment I can not find the study that tested .9% BA on bacteria and found that it took 3 days to kill all bacteria. These types of studies were done to support use in human aqueous solutions & oil based solutions as well.

    For the moment here is a snippet from page 359 of the "The Veterinary Formulary" by Yolande Bishop, British Veterinary Association which states that BA may be used as a disinfectant for cows teats.

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Views: 1137
Size:  71.2 KB
    Thanks, Dat!

  22. Quote Originally Posted by SoCo4Fun View Post
    huh huh huh...dat said "teat"...sorry that is my best Beavis and Butthead imitation...

    Good info as always dat...i've been letting my reconstituted CJC sit for a few days and Im going to try it again...luckily these huge knots (they got damn big) on my stomach are going down and the redness and heat has gone away...
    SoCo, what brand of pins are you using? I've had a problem similar to yours and I just switched brands yesterday. No post-injection welt today!

  23. I'm using walgreen's brand.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by SoCo4Fun View Post
    I'm using walgreen's brand.
    I had been using some cheap Easy-Touch pins for over a month and experiencing red, itchy welts on my abdomen following every injection. My source said that he was aware of others with the same problem who fixed it by simply switching to Terumo or BD pins. I thought that I'd give this a try before reconstituting with sterile water, since the latter seems a bit risky to me. So far, so good!

  25. The odd thing about it is that I'm not having problems with the 3 GHRP-6 shots I do a day...only with the CJC...it could be because I just reconn'd the CJC so we will see after the shot tonight...

  26. Quote Originally Posted by SoCo4Fun View Post
    I'm using walgreen's brand.
    I have Terumo 28.5ga 0.5cc & Ultra Comfort Monoject 29ga 0.5cc. The 29ga. pins slide in so nice

  27. Quote Originally Posted by SoCo4Fun View Post
    The odd thing about it is that I'm not having problems with the 3 GHRP-6 shots I do a day...only with the CJC...it could be because I just reconn'd the CJC so we will see after the shot tonight...
    That is odd. Do you by chance take a greater volume of GHRP-6 in each shot? If so, maybe it's too much BA for you to handle at once. If not, I hope letting the solution sit per Dat's instructions solves the problem for you!

    It may also be worth looking into new pins like those that Papa noted. I've noticed a huge difference between my cheapo (30ga) and Terumo (29ga) pins. Oddly enough, the latter slide in much more easily.

  28. BTW guys, I have not taken any CJC or GHRP since yesterday morning. None today either. I feel so much better...no high blood pressure! Love not having that freaking headache. I will do my "500 mcg" shot of one of the vials. But you know there is a dilemma at hand, correct? If I don't know the true mg/vial, how am I supposed to know how much do draw out? I will be pulling from 1mL (each vial will be reconned w/1mL BW). I will standardize that part at least.

    I will give the supplier the benefit of the doubt and assume the products were labeled correctly. Now, with that assumption, I plan to draw 25 units (25 ticks) from the assumed "CJC-1295" vial. That will yield either: A) 500mcg (CJC) or B) 1,250mcg (GHRP-6). Whether it's CJC or GHRP, I won't know unless there's a "flushing" feeling (CJC) or some other feeling from mega dosing GHRP-6 (????).

    Dat, is there any issue w/dosing potentially that much GHRP-6? I know it's way above the usual dose.

    EDIT: My other option is to dose so that my max mcg will be 500mcg and that will have me pulling 10IUs which is either: 500mcg or 200mcg. Again, it could be CJC or GHRP...can't be sure.

    Any comments?

  29. I havnt done either.... so take this with agrain of salt but from what Ive read, GHRP-6 at that high a dose may lead to tingling in the extremities and increased hunger.... Def think you should look for flushing or no flushing though considering Im not sure if the tingles can come with CJC as well....

  30. Quote Originally Posted by papapumpsd View Post
    Dat, is there any issue w/dosing potentially that much GHRP-6? I know it's way above the usual dose.

    EDIT: My other option is to dose so that my max mcg will be 500mcg and that will have me pulling 10IUs which is either: 500mcg or 200mcg. Again, it could be CJC or GHRP...can't be sure.

    Any comments?
    I'm going to look back in Dat's thread, but it seems that I've read that dosing more than about 3mcgs of ghrp per kilo of body weight at once(within the 2 and a half hours of off time that Dat mentioned), starts to become a waste. Meaning, if your body can't utilize the substance, how could it possibly effect you harmfully? Wouldn't it just dissipate? Not stealing your question Dat, just chiming in.

    I can speak personally though, and say that 200mcgs of cjc hasn't yet given me the "flush" feeling. I'm positive my stuff is legit as well. Assuming there would be no damage done if you did megadose on the ghrp, I'd stick with pulling 25 units. I don't post a lot around here, but I am a chronic reader. Flushing is by far the most prominent, and consistently seen side effect between the two peptides that I've observed from reading other's posts. I definitely agree on this being your best bet.
  

  
 

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