how many sets per exercise and workout?
- 02-21-2012, 11:21 AM
- 02-21-2012, 11:28 AM
If your main goal is attaining MASS, then you don't need an exact number of sets. Let intensity dictate whether you start your workout with 3,4, or 5 sets of a compound exercise such as deadlift or squat. Once your heavy lifts are done you could stick to four sets of each following isolation exercise to further stimulate the target muscle you annihilated with the compound exercise. Try this for some lean mass.
- 02-21-2012, 11:42 AM
Originally Posted by SuperMachoMan
02-21-2012, 12:04 PM
I'll go day by day, then an over all comments:
I always suggest avoiding the smith machine, especially if your goal is to develop the chest as it lends to excessive lateral and horizontal forces (iow: the triceps and delts pressing against the shaft to raise the bar, versus the pecs moving it vertically).
Skull crushers should make up the crux of your tricep training. These recruit the long head to the greatest degree, which does not recieve adequate work during pressing.
Put more emphasis on dips and less on flys.
Nothing beats bent over barbell rows (prone grip) and pull ups for developing the back. I think your program should start with these.
I'd sub in rack pulls in place of hyper extensions.
Do shrugs on this day...they are over all part of the back.
Once again, sub the smith machine for a standing strict military press. Nothing is better at developing overall deltoid mass.
I don't see the need for so many versions of side laterals. If anything, add in some single arm over head DB presses.
This is a light day, and a good opportunity to add in ancillary/fixator/stabilizer work (more on that later).
What are front raises? Are these leg extensions?
I think you need to squat. Squats should be a staple in any routine.
You also need more hamstring work centered on hip extension. Take out the seated HS curls and add in rumanian dead lifts or good mornings.
Over all comments:
Upper body balance. Make sure every horizontal pressing movement you perform (i.e. chest press) is balanced out by a horizontal pulling movement (row). Flys should be matched with rear deltoid work. Over head presses and lateral raises should be matched with pull ups.
In addition, I always suggest more ancillary pulling work to counteract the strong scapula protractors (delts and pecs). Perform supine rows, face pulls, band pull aparts, etc. All these can be done on your shoulder day.
In addition, exercises to strengthen the lower traps, for two reasons. 1. They do not recieve adequate work in typical bodybuilding programs and play an integral role in shoulder stability (and thus your ability to hypertrophy the large muscle - pecs, etc.). 2. If you step on stage and have developed lower traps, people will be like "WTF?!?!" So, add in scapula dips, scapula pull downs, and prone scaptions.
Next, get some external rotator cuff work in. 2-3 sets of external shoulder rotations with bands, cables or dumbbells will do wonders for your shoulder health.
As for the lower body, I think you need to add in some hip abductor work (banded lateral walks, hip abd machine, etc.) for hip health. Also, some direct glute max work: dumbbell swings, hip pull throughs, hip thrusts. Doing these will increase your squat and deadlift, and thus allow you to further hypertrophy the "judged" lower body muscles - quads, hammies, etc.
Next, you need some core work...and not just spinal flexion (crunches, etc.). A few sets of prone and side bridges every workout session will do wonders for your abdomen and spinal health.
02-21-2012, 03:09 PM
02-21-2012, 03:33 PM
i do 3 sets if im super setting 4 if im not
02-21-2012, 03:46 PM
The older I get, the more I think that for the first 3-4 years, lifters should focus on strength and technique. There is no reason why anyone that is 160 lbs should be doing leg extensions and cable crossovers. Focusing on the compound lifts has started to slowly subside and I rarely see people doing lots of dips, pullups, deadlifts, standing overhead press, BB rows, etc.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
02-21-2012, 05:12 PM
02-21-2012, 06:00 PM
Depends....I train and program via movements, not muscles.
So I could do a push/pull for upper body. Chest/delts/tris and back/bis
Or a horizontal: chest and horizontal rows (i.e.: traps/rhomboids: barbell, tbar rows, etc.) and vertical: over head presses and pull ups/dows (lats/teres)
Right now I train my team with this split:
Dead lifts, horizontal pulling
02-21-2012, 10:34 PM
I believe it was you ZiR RED that posted the horizontal emphasis/vertical maintenance; quad emphasis/posterior chain maintenance routine at one point. I remember viewing it. It was either you or another guy. Personally, that style of training is my favorite. I love training with 2x a week frequency with basic compound movements and having a high rep day and a low rep day.
Former Marine, UT-BSN, NSCA-CPT, NASM-CPT, CSCS
02-22-2012, 04:59 AM
I made a thread asking about this.Originally Posted by Rodja
This just pin pointed it a bit....
02-22-2012, 11:08 AM
02-22-2012, 12:04 PM
I didn't see this mentioned in any of the total sets in this thread.
If the total set for any particular exercise...say Military, do you count the warm up sets as part of the whole number of sets?
(i.e. 2 warm-up, 3 working = 5 sets or only 3 sets?)
02-22-2012, 12:07 PM
warmup. Like if i am doing bench i do the bar, then 135 as my warmup, then i start my real sets.
02-22-2012, 12:10 PM
In my programs I only list working sets. Warm up sets are in the range of 2-5 depending on the exercise and the intensity.
02-22-2012, 02:18 PM
02-22-2012, 02:53 PM
Hey Red, would you say that if I am eating right and cycling correctly I can spend 2-4 hrs in the gym 3-4 times a week without over training?
02-22-2012, 03:13 PM
The body will adapt to just about anything, given the work is progressively increased and the recovery is provided. Will 4 hour sessions be productive.....I don't know.
02-22-2012, 03:41 PM
Jay Cutler once said in an interview about his high volume training that you can never overtrain the body IF you are eating and providing your body with proper nutrition for what you are attempting and proper rest. But this is also coming from the guy who does not eat the typical 6 meals a day. He wakes up and eats meals throughout the night tooOriginally Posted by Jerime
02-22-2012, 03:44 PM
02-22-2012, 03:50 PM
Ofcourse. That was my point when saying how he doesn't do the typical 6 meals a day an stuff. All he has to do daily/nightly is eat, train and relaxOriginally Posted by Rodja
02-22-2012, 04:01 PM
02-22-2012, 04:08 PM
I beg to differ. Just cuz a pro bodybuilder isn't trying to bench 1000lbs or whatever doesn't mean they don't do compound movements. Alot of pro bodybuilders squat, deadlift, bench.. No cleans but whatever. But yeah deff not 3 times a week I'll give you that. That's cuz a powerlifters main focuses are just the compound movements.Originally Posted by ZiR RED
02-22-2012, 04:12 PM
02-22-2012, 04:22 PM
02-22-2012, 04:59 PM
A bodybuilder doesn't worry about how much he lifts but a bodybuilder will always take his muscles to 100% failure
02-22-2012, 05:23 PM
02-23-2012, 12:23 AM
02-23-2012, 04:18 AM
I would agree with that in most instances, but 8X Mr. O Ronnie Coleman showed the world he could deadlift 800 pounds for two reps five weeks out of the Mr. Olympia contest. That is a lot of weight for anybody.Originally Posted by VS91588
02-23-2012, 10:16 AM
and franco could deadlift even more
02-23-2012, 10:23 AM
Ronnie and Franco are exceptions to bodybuilding. But b4 Ronnie Deadlift 800 for about 4 reps he previously did other sets of 15, 12, 10 reps. A bodybuilder can mix hypertrophy training and strength training together. Pyramiding the weight up
02-23-2012, 03:27 PM
Yes certainly. I just wanted to shed light on the 'no bodybuilder does low reps with high weight' stigma lol. And you gotta love Franco!
02-23-2012, 03:34 PM
Just thought I would add that Ronnie also put himself outta the game by hurting himself. Once he hurt his back he was never able to recover. All those insane lifts take a toll for sure.
He is still one my favorites but I think health wise he really made some stupid choices buts that just my opinion.
02-23-2012, 04:06 PM
Yeah it deff takes a toll on your body. I personally like deadlifting w/ dumbbells lately. I been reading up on FST-7; 7 sets with 30-40 second rest periods. After my back workout I grab 100-110lb dumbbells and perform that. It's really hard and you get more of a squeeze on the way up cuz you are not limited by a barbell.
02-23-2012, 04:17 PM
That's cool I noticed a lot of pro bbs do deads last or toward the end of there workouts to prevent injury n focus of perfect form more that the weight.
02-23-2012, 04:22 PM
Always full of knowledge.Originally Posted by VS91588
02-23-2012, 04:38 PM
Thanks dude I appreciate it. I just notice alot of ppl keep their exercises so barbaric. The basic movements are great but change up the variations, change up the intensity. Trying new things keeps your body guessing, keeps your body changing.Originally Posted by AaronJP1
02-23-2012, 06:11 PM
Doing deads last is definitely a double-edged sword though. Having fatigued upper back muscles and, even more problematic, core muscles is a recipe for disaster if you're not careful. It's night and day different between athletes (not to say BBers aren't) and BBers though, so I do understand.
02-23-2012, 07:48 PM
i do deads every other back workout. spinal erectors take a while to fully heal, so if your doin squats and barbell rows you dont need deadlifts every back.
02-23-2012, 08:54 PM
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