- 08-01-2011, 09:40 AM
- 08-01-2011, 09:45 AM
- 08-01-2011, 09:50 AM
In my opinion the most damning thing you can say about a company is that what they are selling to consumers is not what consumers think it is. You don't have a problem with saying Taurus is lying about the contents of their product, yet you haven't seen any proof? I just think if someone was accusing you guys of the same thing without proof you might be a little upset.
Again, not trying to start any type of flame war and I could really care less who "wins" this battle...but as a consumer and supplement user I think I'm entitled to more than just rumor on something as serious as this accusation.
08-01-2011, 09:58 AM
Let me be clear here. It is not the issue of "bringing it up" that was dishonorable, it was the manner (un backed inuendo and "Don't hold me responsibile. I'm just saying" thing that IMO is "dishonorable." Then rather than come up with something to challenge the validity of my position you 1) Try to dismiss it as an Emotional Appeal (Heartwarming, I believe was the term you used), 2) Then you feigned being personally offended (at least I hope you were feigning, because if some one who holds no real meaning in your life describing your behavior in an unfavorable gets to you, then you have much bigger issues then WTF is in 7 Keto.) 3) I try to clarify that I was describing the behavior and not you personally and you "read between the lines" as you put it, being all offended. (Let me be perfectly clear, I some times describe my own behavior as being "*******ish" because it can be. Does that mean I think I am an *******? Nope, just my behavior can be. In that sense, I most certainly describe some one else as behaving like a slime ball and being weasel like and not be calling them a weasel or slime ball per se. As you noted, I don't know you. 4) Then you try to insult my intelligence by mocking the way I spelled "honour" which is laughable to me in that although no longer used in modern English, it is more than acceptable in olde English and there by technically correct. All of this grand illusion of misdirection (points 1-4) do absolutely nothing to invalidate my description of the way this has been handled nor defend your handling of it.
"I have no credibility? I think a lot of people would disagree with that view. You are certainly entitled to hold that opinion though.
Have a nice day y'all."
In this particular matter, yep. Because you have provided no evidence to back a serious accusation and seem content to engage in misdirection rather than to address the issues with your claims.
You seem to be implying that my wish for you to have a god day was insincere. I assure you, it was not. Why would it be. I hold no grudge against you. No internet spat is worth renting head space over. Just not worth it. I will take your well wishes with a positive attitude and thank you sir, for I intend to have a great day INDEED!
Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
08-01-2011, 10:03 AM
08-01-2011, 10:11 AM
08-01-2011, 10:14 AM
08-01-2011, 10:20 AM
As Henry knows I have been interested in this type of product. I hadn't looked at Taurus as Genomyx are having stock arrive in the UK but it may take longer than I need as I have a photoshoot coming up so the Taurus spray could be in the running as Genomyx won't ship to a customer in England directly.
Maybe it would clear the air if the banter was set aside and if someone explains the potential legal ramifications of each scenario?
As an interested consumer I would be interested in knowing the results. If the results cannot be declared by PA or EPharm rep without facing a possible lawsuit then of course they will not do it, even if an ideal world would met them.
Hypothetically could the person who sent the bottle to PA publish the results on here as they are a paying consumer with no obvious ulterior motive?
Just bringing some rational questions to the table to get to the bottom of this.
08-01-2011, 10:21 AM
Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
08-01-2011, 10:22 AM
08-01-2011, 10:39 AM
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20355167The product Orastan-A from Gaspari Nutrition was analyzed for its steroid content. According to the labeling, it is supposed to contain "5a-Androstano[2,3-c]furazan-17b-tetrahydropyranol ether", also called furazadrol-THP ether. The GC-MS analyses of the liberated steroids (after extraction from the capsule matrix and cleavage of the THP ether, TMS-derivative and underivatized) revealed mass spectra of two components, both inconsistent with the labeling. Thus, the steroids were characterized by different analytical techniques such as mass spectrometry, nuclear magnetic resonance spectroscopy and X-ray crystal structure analysis. They were identified as 17beta-hydroxyandrostano[3,2-c]isoxazole and -[2,3-d]isoxazole.
Two preparations, EPISTANE and P-PLEX, were obtained from the Internet so that their contents could be investigated.
Although the labelling of EPISTANE indicates that it contains 17alpha-methyl-2alpha, 3alpha-epithio-5alpha-androstane-17beta-ol only, ... desoxymethyltestosterone [was] identified in the supplement. The results showed that P-PLEX contained desoxymethyltestosterone and its isomer 17alpha-methyl-5alpha-androst-3-en-17beta-ol.
Doping in Sports: Biochemical Principles, Effects and Analysis By Detlef Thieme, Peter Hemmersbach
In addition to the well documented cases above, CEL recalled a batch of M1,4ADD which I believe contained the wrong ingredient, Halodrol 50 is widely believed to have been contaminated with phera, there was the Monsterdrol XT fiasco, and Oxyguno found to be a mixture of the 11-hydroxy and -ketone compounds, I could go on and on.
08-01-2011, 10:43 AM
08-01-2011, 10:43 AM
Not to be an ass, but you keep skirting the question Henry. When did I claim that products COULDN'T be tainted or mislabeled? I'm to the point where I think you are intentionally not responding to what my posts are saying, but instead trying to post something that acts like it addresses it.
08-01-2011, 10:49 AM
08-01-2011, 06:13 PM
08-01-2011, 06:52 PM
What's with the 100 guys on one attack fest.
Who gives a crap everyone - let it go.
A-Minds HYPE-SLAYER! All posts & feedback are guaranteed to be unsolicited and legit
"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. Fools despise wisdom & instruction" Proverbs 1:7
08-01-2011, 08:53 PM
08-01-2011, 10:11 PM
08-01-2011, 10:30 PM
This is like a damn BB.com discussion. A bunch of banter lacking real information and a ****load side skirting. This situation is ridiculous, and neither side is handling it correctly IMO.
Cutting all summer, cycle in September
08-03-2011, 07:04 AM
08-05-2011, 07:44 PM
I have used PA's products (testforce2) and have recommended it to many people even though our company sells a competing product but the way
this has been handled here and on other boards has been disgusting and certainly changed my opinion on a few people in the industry.
08-06-2011, 05:13 AM
Like I've said earlier in the thread, why don't we let our bosses sort it out between themselves.
09-24-2011, 06:38 PM
Please form an orderly queue to issue apologies.Customer Service email@example.com via gateway11.websitewelcome.com
show details 4:43 PM (1 hour ago)
For any of you following the controversy, it does appear that there is a very small amount of 5a-androstanediol in our 7-KE product (roughly 3% of the active ingredient). Even though we feel that this is probably a normal situation where our supplier did give us one of the materials with less than 95% purity, we still feel like the right thing to do is advise our customers and offer a refund. We strongly feel that this trace amount isn't enough to cause ANY physiological effect, but it's the right thing to do. Please discard your unused portion.
To answer every critic on the boards this stuff happens when you rely on Chinese suppliers and has happened to many companies in the past. I hope you treat Taurus the same way you've treated them. It's regrettable, but this stuff happens and we will in act even tougher testing protocols to ensure that this doesn't happen again.
If you wish to get a refund, please email:
09-24-2011, 07:44 PM
Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
09-24-2011, 08:10 PM
Taurus threatened PA with a lawsuit for even suggesting that it contained controlled substances (even though it wasn't him that posted his results), which they've since admitted that it did.
Just about every Taurus rep chimed in here, questioning PA's ethics, suggesting that it was a ruse to sway customers in our favour.
I didn't need verification from Taurus. I knew PA had tested it, and I knew the results. I handled the situation the best I could. PA did the same, while limiting his liability for litigation. I would suggest that it was Taurus and their reps that handled the situation badly. You're welcome to disagree.
I understand customers being skeptical of a company's motives. I applaud it. We do have ulterior motives. We do want to sell you stuff. Buy Ursobolic.
09-25-2011, 01:48 AM
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PHF Rep/Celtic labs
09-26-2011, 04:36 AM
The initial response may have sparked a lot of hostility, but as angry as people want to get about it, it is true. Lesson learned for Taurus Nutrition: from now on, pay a 3rd party (such as PA) to test your raw material. Taurus had the integrity to offer refunds and admit to the error and I'm sure no harm was done, so maybe those who want to apologize can do so and let's nip this at the bud and move on.
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