BigVrunga starts his T1cycle...

**BigVrunga** · 03-20-2003, 12:45 AM

Started my T1 cycle yesterday. First time using 1test, so Im going with the moderate dosage (4 squirts a day). Im planning on starting Formasin after the 1st week. I dont need all that bloat, and since the Formasin should only block about 50% of the Estrogen in my system, I think that Ill have enough to see whatever benefits may come from it.

Planning on going for 4weeks, with 6-oxo/FUZU/ZMA for post cycle. I know there are better, cheaper alternatives to 6-OXO, but Im on this cycle with my brother, and he's on probation. Everything has to be 100% legal and OTC.

Just wanted to let everyone know, Ill keep this thread posted with my progress. Looking for 15-18lbs or so, 10lean lbs retained.

Later,
BigV

**scotty2** · 03-20-2003, 01:46 AM

Don't be scared of the bloat. The bloat is good, you'lll be shocked at the strength gains. Don't forget about your diet.

**BigVrunga** · 03-20-2003, 07:13 PM

Thanks scotty2...maybe Ill hold off on the Formasin unless I notice any nipple soreness/puffyness. I got that on Anabol-X and it scared the crap out of me.

Ive got the diet covered, I started keeping a diet log a long time ago. Im at 3500cals, 220g protien until Monday, when Im going to 4000cals a day with 350g protien. (after it fully kicks in)

I felt a little stronger at the gym today, got a few extra reps...still holding steady at 210lbs, although pumps are great and I do look fuller.

**scotty2** · 03-21-2003, 01:00 AM

Originally posted by BigVrunga
when Im going to 4000cals a day with 350g protien. (after it fully kicks in)

I

Unecessary

**BigVrunga** · 03-21-2003, 04:31 PM

What is unnecessary? The 350g of protien? I thought 1.5g of protien and 20-22cals per lb of body weight was optimal on cycle? Assuming that's lean bodyweight, for me it should still be up around 300g and 4000cals per day.
What would you recommend?

**scotty2** · 03-22-2003, 01:58 AM

The protein. IMO it's too much. If you feel ok with it, go nuts. I had some digestive problems at that intake.

**BigVrunga** · 03-22-2003, 02:33 AM

I think Im going to go nuts for the next month and see how far I can push it

I know what you're talking about...too much protien in my system (liquid whey sources like NLarge2, specifically) give me the ****s like no tomorrow

Ive found that standard anti-diareahh pills containing L-Loperamide fix this up completely. When digestive problems flare up, Ill take 1pill per 1/2 serving of NLarge2, and my gut settles right down.
I also try streaming the protien in several small meals throughout the day. I usually end up eating 10-12 times, just because I never have time to actually sit down and chow down on a big meal.

Thanks for the reply,
BigVrunga

**andro69** · 03-22-2003, 02:50 PM

I guess the amount of protein you take in to make gains is an individual thing. I've tried 300 grams a day versus 200 grams and didn't see anymore of a gain even when on the sauce. That's good for me as far as I'm concerned as it save big bucks on food or protein powders. I was planing on using T1 for the last 3 weeks of my cycle. Could you tell me how much T1 and 4ad is in 2 squirts. Thanks and good luck with your cycle.

**BigVrunga** · 03-22-2003, 03:19 PM

Hey andro69,
T1 has 85mg 1test and 166mg 4AD per 2squirts.
I think that if I push myself the the absolute limit on this cycle, then the extra protien will be utilized. I want to see just how much 1test increases recovery time

Ive just got to make sure all other factors are optimal...sleep, diet, etc.
Im planning on doing this once, so Ive got to make it count!

Thanks,
BigVrunga

**BigVrunga** · 03-22-2003, 04:32 PM

Just wanted to drop back in and say that on this, the 4th day of T1, Im already starting to see strength improvements. 80lb DB's for 5 on the shoulder press, Im shooting for 100's by the cycle's end.
Shoulders have always been my weak point so, for me, this is impressive.

Cals still at 3500/day. 250g protien/400g carbs (>75% of that complex, at least Im tryin')/and 90g of fats, mostly from flax and olive oil.

In addition to that:
15 Uni-Liver/Day
2g VitaminC/Day
Calcium600mg/Day
2g Glucosamine + MSM/Day
Saw Palmetto 8caps/day
Creatine 10g/day

Hope it works out well...

**RippedForce** · 03-22-2003, 04:46 PM

Originally posted by BigVrunga
Started my T1 cycle yesterday. First time using 1test, so Im going with the moderate dosage (4 squirts a day).

I believe 4 squirts a day is considered "Lost your mind dosing." Check out the sticky in the prohormones section titled "Dosing!!"

**xXx** · 03-22-2003, 05:32 PM

I think "lost your mind dosing" is for T-1 Pro not T1.

**RippedForce** · 03-22-2003, 09:58 PM

Ohhh yeah thats right, sorry, didn't notice that it was T-1 only.

**Draven** · 03-22-2003, 10:31 PM

Hey BigV, how you finding the liver tabs?

I say this cause I just started them last week and I've cleared my girlfreind out of the room about 6 times tonight already.

How's your training look?

**BigVrunga** · 03-23-2003, 12:44 AM

Hey Draven -
Ive been taking livertabs ever since I read about them in BigCat's article at bb.com: 'Top Ten Supplements for Bulking'. That was about a year ago. I think they are the most important supplement I take (next to food, of course!), and I can't really explain how. I know that when I have stopped taking them, I definately notice the difference. That's one way you can tell a supplement is working

One effect of liver tabs is that the help you retain water and volumize your muscle cells. In my opinion, they're more effective at this then creatine. I always feel fuller, get better pumps, and able to squeeze out a few extra reps with my trusted Uni-Liver. And they're cheap as hell

As far as the rancid gas goes, after a good year or so of taking them, I think my system has adjusted to them. One thing to do is take them with food, and try to space them as far apart as possible. You could even try taking one every hour or so, although I still take them in 5 pill sets, 3 times a day.

In short - if I could only have one supplement other than good food and a multi - it would be Uni-Liver.

And thats what I think about that

BigVrunga

Hey man you had me freaked with your first post!! I almost ran to the bathroom and checked my hairline!

**BigVrunga** · 03-23-2003, 03:33 AM

About the training - about 2 months ago I read everything I could about every training program I could find, and then put together a routine. It was sort of like the routines in Arnold's encyclopedia in terms of volume, but I like hitting each bodypart once a week as hard as I can, and then allowing a full 7 days for rest and recovery. I did Bi's and forearms twice a week, calves 3days on/1 off, and abs every day.
I pushed until I almost overtrained myself. Then I took a week off, and came back heavy/low volume. (maybe 12-15 sets per muscle group). My strength actually went up a lot a lot, I knew I was in a new period of growth, and I started the T1.
So Im planning on doing the above mentioned routine for weeks 1&2, and then increasing the volume again for weeks 3 and 4. If I dont see any negative sides, I may go for a 5th week, because Im not planning on another 4 week cycle.

BigVrunga

**Draven** · 03-23-2003, 12:30 PM

Originally posted by BigVrunga
Hey man you had me freaked with your first post!! I almost ran to the bathroom and checked my hairline!

My first post?

**RaulJimenez** · 03-23-2003, 05:48 PM

Lol draven you made my day there, I actually had the same problem , but it was worstwith the liver tablets, my sister was the one running away from my room all night LOL!

**BigVrunga** · 03-23-2003, 11:31 PM

My first post?

Sorry Draven! I meant RippedForce, you guys both have the badass-looking back shot as your avatar and I got confused

BigVrunga

**BigVrunga** · 03-23-2003, 11:33 PM

Got on the scale today - 214! Im getting over a cold, too. Could be water weight from the creatine...I certainly look a lot fuller. Bodyfat looks the same...

BigV

**scotty2** · 03-24-2003, 07:20 PM

How are strength gains?

**BigVrunga** · 03-24-2003, 07:31 PM

like you said scotty2 - shocking.

**BigVrunga** · 03-25-2003, 03:41 AM

Another thing - I look leaner - and Im up to 3800 cals/day. I think this stuff is quite impressive so far. I cant wait to see what Ill be lifting in a few weeks.

Scotty2 - how much of that strength do you keep?

BigV

**scotty2** · 03-25-2003, 03:53 AM

Originally posted by BigVrunga
Another thing - I look leaner - and Im up to 3800 cals/day. I think this stuff is quite impressive so far. I cant wait to see what Ill be lifting in a few weeks.

Scotty2 - how much of that strength do you keep?

BigV

Keep cals up and take your anti-e, should keep most.

**BigVrunga** · 03-25-2003, 03:54 AM

sweet...

**Champ** · 03-25-2003, 11:27 AM

Originally posted by BigVrunga
[Ive found that standard anti-diareahh pills containing L-Loperamide fix this up completely. When digestive problems flare up, Ill take 1pill per 1/2 serving of NLarge2, and my gut settles right down.
BigVrunga [/B]

Digestive Enzymes like Wobenzyme etc will help also...

**Jarconis** · 03-25-2003, 02:01 PM

Originally posted by BigVrunga
Thanks scotty2...maybe Ill hold off on the Formasin unless I notice any nipple soreness/puffyness. I got that on Anabol-X and it scared the crap out of me.

Wow, if you got nipple soreness from anabolx ( 19nor - 5aa ) you must be incredibly predisposed to gyno my friend.

**BigVrunga** · 03-25-2003, 08:18 PM

Wow, if you got nipple soreness from anabolx ( 19nor - 5aa ) you must be incredibly predisposed to gyno my friend.

I dont know if I am or not...that I was taking 750mg 4ad/day (megabol-x)too (orally, however). They did get sore. There were actually a lot of reports of nipple soreness/puffyness on that cycle(the bigcat stack)...a lot of people were taking viratase to take care of it at the time...

I think these tender nips of mine might be because I got some T1 on them.

Im watching though - if they get worse or start getting puffy, Im going to start on the Formasin that I have and order some liquid nolva.
BigV

**BigVrunga** · 03-26-2003, 07:46 PM

Up to 4000cals a day, and Im keeping it really clean. I have also upped the dosage of T1 to 5 squirts a day. Im taking Uni-Liver and Creatine, and ontop of the water retention from those the bloat from the 4AD is starting to kick in. Its uncomfortable. Ive started Formasin at 2caps/day. This is a low dose, and should help reduce some of the bloating without affecting total lean gains.

They werent kidding about the increased recovery on this stuff...my muscles just arent getting sore...and at the gym it seems I can just keep going and going. I can see why GVT is a favorable technique while on cycle - trying to get the necessary intensity in with a partner is difficult. You have to be really focused.

Its been a week today and Im definately impressed,especially since things are just getting going...

Ordering some liquid-nolva for post cycle to stack with the 6-oxo.

BigVrunga

**tatortodd** · 03-27-2003, 02:26 AM

Originally posted by BigVrunga
I know what you're talking about...too much protien in my system (liquid whey sources like NLarge2, specifically) give me the ****s like no tomorrow Ive found that standard anti-diareahh pills containing L-Loperamide fix this up completely. When digestive problems flare up, Ill take 1pill per 1/2 serving of NLarge2, and my gut settles right down.

Thanks for the reply,
BigVrunga

For the last 6 or 7 years, I used to go through a Sam's Club size box of L-Loperamide a month, but about four months ago I found a combination that's a lot more natural and healthier. I take 1 tablespoon of psyllium husks with my morning shake, and 1 tablespoon of psyllium husks with my bedtime shake. Additionally, I take one digestive enzyme capsule with shakes and sometimes with meals.

As far as cost goes:
- I use Fitness Lab's Psyllium Husks and it costs me $4.59 per month.
- Lindberg's Complete Digestant and it costs me $13.00 to $19.50 per month depending on how many I take a day.
Both products are available at NutritionExpress.com or their in-person store Lindberg Nutrition (Torance, CA). Trader Joe's also has similar products (for less money) that I plan to try when my current stock runs out.

~Todd

**BigVrunga** · 03-27-2003, 02:41 AM

Hey Todd - Thanks so much for the info! Im actually still using the same little box of L-Loperamide I bought last summer,as the runs from protien dont flare up too much anymore...but I would definately prefer a more natural route.

Thats a great post man, I really appreciate it. Karma for that one!

Thanks again,
bigV

**BigVrunga** · 03-28-2003, 12:09 AM

Did chest today - lifts are up almost 20lbs! This is the first chest day since I started the T1. I have also gained another 3lbs, making it a total of 8lbs gained in 8days.
I was starting to look leaner, until the 4AD kicked in...

The water smoothed me out a bit.

My brother is also using T1 right along with me, and is seeing similar gains.

BigVrunga

**PoolMan** · 03-28-2003, 08:25 PM

We started at the same time, BV. Well, the 18th for me.

I am right at 7lbs gained right now.

"I was starting to look leaner, until the 4AD kicked in... The water smoothed me out a bit."

Couldn't have said it better myself.

**BigVrunga** · 03-29-2003, 03:17 AM

Hey Poolman - about the water retention...I know its beneficial, but at times it gets too much. I bought some formasin to use as an on cycle-anti-e. I had never used it, but let me tell you this stuff works and it works REAL WELL. I took 2 formasin, and 4 hours later the water retention was gone. I took another 2 the same time the next day, and the 'perky nips' also subsided.
Its working great to control the estrogen, I would definately recommend it. Im only going to use it when the e-sides become uncomfortable.

One thing thats cool - I woke up the next morning with the bloat gone, and I weighed the same as I did 2 days before when I felt like a baloon

What's your diet look like? What weight are you going for?

Good luck bro!

BigVrunga

**PoolMan** · 03-29-2003, 03:41 AM

That's good to hear! My diet is around 4000 cal. Trying to get at least 200 of protein also. Mostly eggs, oatmeal, tuna, and chicken. My start weight was 160, and want to end around 175. I know that's not much being 6 foot, but 180 is about my total goal. I was a little heavier (168), but a kidney stone sidelined me a little while back.

I really enjoyed the results the first week. I gained pretty good, very solid with little bloat. Looked ripped and lean (my BF is around 10%). Now I look a little soft. It's ok, I'll just add all the size I can while "on," then work at getting the water down. I also have to drink around 2.5 to 3 gallons of water a day (I have passed 6 kidney stones since I was 20....I'm 27 now). That probably doesn't help.

I don't have access to formasin, so I'll have to cross my fingers. The nips haven't really gotten too puffy yet, but they are sensitive as hell. Hope my luck is good!

How are you doing with the applications? I started the first 4 days or so alternating my shoulders and upper arm, then my stomach area. Now I am just applying it to my left shoulder and outside arm in the morning, then the right side for the evening. It's worked pretty good, and I am watching my skin like a hawk for anything odd (excessive dryness, etc.) The stomach was nice, but sucked when I took a shower. That **** just ran down with the water into my crotch. Penis and 1-test don't mix. Hehe, I've gotten it on my cheeks a couple of times too. And once on my forehead (no clue how), and that **** burned! Let me know what your routine is.

**BigVrunga** · 03-29-2003, 04:51 AM

Hey again poolman-

dpsnutrition.com has Formasin for like $24 a bottle! It is also supposed to exert a small anabolic effect, although I dont know if you'd even notice alongside the 1test and 4AD.

What are you doing for post cycle?

I apply to the chest and sides, and then wipe the excess on my inner bi's and on my legs. I always message it in really good. At night I start applying on the chest, and then move to the sides. Then switch for the 2nd application during the day. It burned like hell at first, but Im used to it, I dont really notice any kind of rash or anything.
Id did get a bit on the schlong, I hear you there...

Ive been rubbing some excess on my forearms to, hoping the dmso will help ease my sore tendons...(what a bitch that is...)

How did you get so many kidney stones??

Its kinda funny - we both started T1 at the same time and were the same age

(Im 27 too)

What other supps are you taking? That's great youve got your diet down - Im moving to 4500 calls/day starting tomorrow. Im trying to keep the ratio as close to 40/40/20 as I can...

Routine looks like this:

Monday - Bis/Tris
Tuesday - Legs
Wednesday - Off
Thurday - Chest
Friday - Shoulders
Saturday - Back
Sunday - Off

Hitting abs hard everyday, trying to keep the midsection toned while Im gaining all this weight.
Forearms every other day...
Calves before workout every on day, 10 sets.

8 sets for tris on chest day and 8 sets for bis on back day.

This is supposed to let you work at double volume, and that appears to be the case

33 sets today with my partner in less than 1.5 hrs!

Whats your routine look like?

BigVrunga

**BigVrunga** · 03-30-2003, 08:13 PM

Took two days off - I havent really been sleeping enough, and I figured I could use one more day of rest after a solid week of training. And, Lo and Behold, I get on the scale after work and Im 219!! That's a 14lb gain, in 11days! At least 4lbs of this was estrogen bloat, however. I took two Formasin and Ill probably be back down to 213-214 in a little while.
Upped cals to 4500 a day, I went out and bought a food scale and Im keeping it as clean as possible. Im handling the 400g of protien well...as long as I stream it in evenly throughout the day, I have no digestive problems at all.
What a difference bulking clean makes! A year ago, I figured a $.99 King Supreme from Burger King was a valid method of increasing caloric intake. I had the dimples on my ass to prove it too!

This year, at the same weight, Im so much leaner, and so much stronger its astounding. I hit 230 last year at the peak of my bulking cycle, with a max Squat of 305 for 6. When I went to cut down, this dropped almost 40lbs.
Now Im squatting 315 for 10 like nothing, with a much lower bodyfat %. Its 11days into T1, and I look friggin' huge!

This stuff is great...

BigVrunga

**PoolMan** · 03-31-2003, 01:47 AM

Yes it is great BV! I'll reply more later when I have more time.

By the way, I took 2 freaking days off also. Are we the same damn person? And I'm going to PM you about the Formasin (going to order tomorrow).

[Edit] Out of curiousity, how are your joints feeling? Mine seem to have gone down hill some in the past few days.

**BigVrunga** · 03-31-2003, 02:06 AM

By the way, I took 2 freaking days off also. Are we the same damn person?

I dont know man its kinda freaky!!

About those joints - Im taking 2000mg Glucosamine and 2000mg MSM per day (1000mg each about 12hrs apart), as well as at least 10g of Flax Oil per day.

I started that regimen about a week before I went on cycle, and my joints actually feel better now than they did before.

You might also want to add some Chondroitin to the mix, but i cant seem to find it by itself, and its expensive. There's a thread around here called 'joint care cocktail' that explains how these substances work in more detail.

Also, the DMSO in the T1 might help if you run it around the affected area (like your shoulders...)

Are you at risk for hairloss? Do you notice any hair problems with the T1?

BigV

**BigVrunga** · 04-02-2003, 03:47 AM

Just an update:

13th day into the cycle, Im definately seeing some massive gains. This is almost scary

The 'big gains' on 1test are supposed to come in the 3rd and 4th week - honestly if I stopped the cycle right now and kept what Ive gained, Id be happy.

BigVrunga

BigVrunga starts his T1cycle...

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