Yes another H-Drol Thread, least I done my Homework

[bashman]

Been training seriously around 2 yrs Planning H-Drol cycle in 2 wks - 1st cycle. Im 22, around 160lbs 11% bf - Not that heavy I know, but hope to achieve couple more lbs of muscle to be around my ideal weight of 170lbs, then will start focusing more on discrepancies such as shape/width. Will try to grab my friends camera and upload some pics tonight.

Currently training for strength approx last 3 weeks, to then take advantage of my strength gains on cycle where I will go back to training for size (8 - 12 rep range).

Cycle layout:- (pre-load cycle assist for 1 week prior)

H-Drol - 50/75/75/75/75/75
CEL Cycle Assist: 8/8/8/8/8/8

Fish Oil Tabs x 12 daily
Taurine 2 x 5g daily
Vit B6 - P5P - 150 - 200mg daily (to prevent prolactin gyno)
Joint Support x 2 daily

PCT:-

Nolva - 20/20/10/10 (maybe 40 first 2 days??)
Competitive Edge Labs PCT Assist - 0/6/6/6/6
DS Lean Extreme - 0/1/1/1/1

Flax Seed Powder 25g (taken B4 Bed, apparently assists in estrogen control)
Himalaya Liver care (Liv52)
Creatine Monohydrate
Jack3d
Controlled Labs GlycerGrow

I will be taking 1 25mg early, then 1 25mg late at the 50mg dose. 75mg dose, I will be taking 25mg early, 25mg Pre-wrkout and 25 mg late.

Training Split (thinking change to 4-day split) I always start/focus on compound moves, I squat, front squat, dead lift and bench etc...

Legs + Chest (chest is strong point, reason why I train at end)
Back + Biceps
Shoulders + Triceps
Rest
Repeat

Diet:- Training days are around 3200 kcal - 280 Protein, 300+ carbs, 80 - 90g Fat
Will bump this up further when on cycle to about 3500+ kcal.

I have just a couple of Qs:-

1) Having maybe had a little puberty gyno, does this put me more at risk and is there anything I can do as prevention? (e.g. p5p) Heard it is bad idea to take an AI with H-Drol, as it will drive estrogen too low, creating a rebound. Can source Cabergoline if really necessary.

2) Is there a best time to take Nolva e.g. with morning meal, empty stomach, at night etc....... and should it be well separated from Liv.52 intake?

Im buzzin to start at the same time Im kinda nervous. I will try log progress if I have enough time to do so properly or will defiantly make a final review at the end. Thanks guys.

 

[cowboy007]

PCT is a bit overloaded for H-drol

 

[ZamaMan]

Cycle looks awesome. Looks like you have done your homework. If you have had gyno before you might get it again so be watchful. Don't use an Ai the whole time only if you notice something starting.
It does not matter when you take nolva. It has a very long Half life so once a day is fine.
Never used uk pharmacy.

Lastly be careful with Stims if you have high blood pressure issues. H drop may not jack your BP up too badly though but if it does jacked will only stress your body out more.
Can't wait to see your results.

 

[schwellington]

Cycle looks awesome. Looks like you have done your homework. If you have had gyno before you might get it again so be watchful. Don't use an Ai the whole time only if you notice something starting.
It does not matter when you take nolva. It has a very long Half life so once a day is fine.
Never used uk pharmacy.

Lastly be careful with Stims if you have high blood pressure issues. H drop may not jack your BP up too badly though but if it does jacked will only stress your body out more.
Can't wait to see your results.

Please- Do not yes I said DO NOT use an AI at all- use ur nolva at 10 mgs if gyno symptoms appear-

I know this is coming- here is why


AI- they KILL estrogen- completley cut it to almost nothing- you might say- well hey thats good! No actually its not

Estrogen plays a very important part in a mans body- we just dont want to much of it and we want it to perform the task its ment too- thus an AI will further destroy your hormone levels (which you dont need since ur on cycle) and when you stop taking the ai guess what? Your estrogen is going to go SKY HIGH- thus giving you an even greater chance for gyno


Now then

Nolvadex- is a SERM but im sure you already knew that! A serm (Selective Estrogen Reuptake Modulater) what this serm does is it allows estrogen production to continue (unlike the AI) but it keeps the estrogen from binding and thus giving you gyno- to put it simply- you will have estrogen in ur body at a CONTROLLED level- and will not get gyno


Hope this helps!

 

[bashman]

Okay cool guys thanks for great input. If I get the next month off work I will create a daily log. If not, then I will at least make a full decent review at the end.

Im going to order everything tonight, the Nolva is going to take at least a week, so if all goes to plan, should be able to start soon

Please chime in if anyone has anymore advice for me.

 

[Aldross]

Looks good so far though I would really take your chest off legs day. You should push so hard on legs that you can't do anything else. The bigger you get them wheels the easier it is to get the upper body bigger.
Also take that source from your post before a mod sends you packin.

Just noticed your stats. You may really want to consider putting on another 10# natty. No reason to short yourself in the long run. Tortoise and the Hare my man. Slow, steady and smart wins this race. Glad to see you atleast doing you own research.-----------------------------------------------------^

 

[Nothingman]

Dont be surprised if NOLVA makes your nipples burn. I got scared and thought it was gyno lol. I only realized it was my nolva when I changed doses again and it happened.

I'll be watchin

 

[bashman]

Dont be surprised if NOLVA makes your nipples burn. I got scared and thought it was gyno lol. I only realized it was my nolva when I changed doses again and it happened.

I'll be watchin

Sound advice, exactly the kind of stuff I need to hear, as I think the main reason why some guys fail on cycle is due to the emotional/physiological aspect.

E.g. 1st week people are pinching nipples because of weird sensations, when it is probably just down to increase in the body's hormonal activity.

I know this will be difficult for me as a 1st timer. Just got to remember to keep my cool, no pinching - I'll tie my hands together if I have to.

 

[bashman]

Looks good so far though I would really take your chest off legs day. You should push so hard on legs that you can't do anything else. The bigger you get them wheels the easier it is to get the upper body bigger.
Also take that source from your post before a mod sends you packin.

Just noticed your stats. You may really want to consider putting on another 10# natty. No reason to short yourself in the long run. Tortoise and the Hare my man. Slow, steady and smart wins this race. Glad to see you atleast doing you own research.-----------------------------------------------------^

Yea to be honest I will likely go for a 4-split with legs on their own. Edited my post - I thought just links where not allowed sorry

I'm a clean bulker - just makes more sense - that being said I gain average 2 - 3 pounds a month - hence another 10lbs natty will probs take me till November. I read that cycles don't negate from natural potential.

I'll see what others say, if most think I should stay natty a bit longer, then I will postpone cycle.

 

[bashman]

Just noticed that 2 of my supplements contain B6

Animal PAK - Vitamin B6(as Pyridoxine AKG, Pyridoxine HCl) 180mg

CEL Cycle Assist - Vitamin B-6 (Pyridoxine HCL) 200mg

Do you guys think that the P5P will still be necessary? I might just order some caber with the Nolva.

 

[Nothingman]

Sound advice, exactly the kind of stuff I need to hear, as I think the main reason why some guys fail on cycle is due to the emotional/physiological aspect.

E.g. 1st week people are pinching nipples because of weird sensations, when it is probably just down to increase in the body's hormonal activity.

I know this will be difficult for me as a 1st timer. Just got to remember to keep my cool, no pinching - I'll tie my hands together if I have to.

This is exactly why I failed at my M-drol cycle, I thought I was prepared for shutdown, but the nut pain scared the hell out of me.
I now know so much more then when I started this.

 

[hmower]

Is that jacked the pre workout or jacked the pro hormone??

 

[bashman]

Is that jacked the pre workout or jacked the pro hormone??

Its the pre workout jacked, which I think Im goning to cut out and replace with MusclePharm Bullet Proof.

 

[bashman]

For any interested, checkout whfoods for the study of estrogen related properties of flaxseed - good read.

Sorry I cannot paste a direct link, not made enough posts

 

[Nothingman]

Im pretty sure he is talking about the Jack3d pre w/o, I just used it tonight. I dont notice anything from it myself. My heart races and I loose my breathe after excercises, bringing it back for my money back, EST TEST DRIVE OWNS pre workout

 

[hmower]

I figured as much but a friend of mine took the prohormone for a month thinking it was the pre workout. He's like dude i gained 15 lbs in a month!! I was like yeah u just used a steroid dumb **** lol. But anyways to the op this whole cycle is OVERKILL for hdrol. Save most of the support supps and pct for a real cycle. In alot of cases an otc pct product will suffice. its good ur being thorough but most of that is unnecessary. Tryin to save u some money bro. I use most of that on a daily basis anyhow but if u bought specifically for this cycle i would save it till u run something stronger.

 

[Nothingman]

Thats what Im looking forward to in an H-drol cycle. Eliminating Cycle Assist, That **** is expensive. What could he get away with? Just Milkthistle?

Also a Headsup, There was a thread recently where a dude got gyno while on h-drol (rare) but he took an AI and it went away and saved his cycle. I'll try to find that thread Im curious how its going for him.

 

[Nothingman]

PCT is a bit overloaded for H-drol

I quote UNREALMACHINE "OVERKILL IN PCT IS NEVER A BAD THING" just on the wallet maybe lol.

 

[hmower]

I would just use otc pct but he can use nolva at a low dose for a couple wks just to be safe. Yeah milk thistle, otc pct, mono and joint support is all i would use for hdrol. Like the taurine and b6 he shouldn't need. I dont know its alot of money for something he ma end up being disappointed with but we'll see

 

[hmower]

I quote UNREALMACHINE "OVERKILL IN PCT IS NEVER A BAD THING" just on the wallet maybe lol.

Oh i absolutely agree but lets b real this is hdrol. He isnt gonna get gyno especially prolactin related gyno haha. All of this for a few pounds he can do easily just by eating more

 

[bashman]

Oh i absolutely agree but lets b real this is hdrol. He isnt gonna get gyno especially prolactin related gyno haha. All of this for a few pounds he can do easily just by eating more

Thanks for advice man, and I'm up for cutting out anything unnecessary to save burning a hole in my tiny wallet. Almost all the support supps listed I use as a staple throughout the year, so I have most now and buy in bulk to save.

The Thing regarding PCT is that I have to at least have Nolva on hand, and its a lot cheaper than all if no most of the decent OTC PCT, so why not just use something that is also tried and tested right? I've read loads of decent H-Drol logs by respected forum members and the average gain seems to be 10+lbs which I think is decent. The ideal weight I would like to achieve is around the 175 mark, hence why I am starting the cycle now, but might postpone a month of 2 to get a couple more lbs natty.

Again I appreciate your advice and everyone else who have taken the time to input. Gotta say this forum rules compared BB.com.

 

[bashman]

Thats what Im looking forward to in an H-drol cycle. Eliminating Cycle Assist, That **** is expensive. What could he get away with? Just Milkthistle?

Also a Headsup, There was a thread recently where a dude got gyno while on h-drol (rare) but he took an AI and it went away and saved his cycle. I'll try to find that thread Im curious how its going for him.

Today as I was having breakfast, I checked my Animal PAK Ing. which have updated as of August and wow man - the amount of stuff they include that are needed on cycle is impressive - e.g.

Uni-Liver 4080mg
Hawthorn (Berry) 250mg
Inositol 125mg
Milk Thistle 500mg
Oriental Ginseng (Root) 250mg
Para-Aminobenzoic Acid 400mg
Pyridoxine A-Ketoglutarate 200mg
Alpha Lipoic Acid (ALA) 100mg
Citrus Bioflavonoids 1000mg
Coenzyme Q10 (CoQ10) 5mg
Grapeseed Extract 50mg
Pine Bark Extract 200mg

To state a few..... I'm think I can just cut my 2 bottles of Cycle Assist down to one and take 1/2 dosage as Animal PAK would make up the rest.

I have seen that thread on the dude getting Gyno 4th week from H-Drol, reason why I am being so cautious. I PM'ed him but has not replied back yet. Hope hes alright.

 

[Aldross]

To state a few..... I'm think I can just cut my 2 bottles of Cycle Assist down to one and take 1/2 dosage as Animal PAK would make up the rest.

I have seen that thread on the dude getting Gyno 4th week from H-Drol, reason why I am being so cautious. I PM'ed him but has not replied back yet. Hope hes alright.

You should just drop the CEL Cycle and PCT Assist. Halo is the pez of DS. save yourself the money.

As far as the gyno it's very rare for someone to get gyno on Halo. Most ppl that think they have gyno are wrong. They are just paranoid. Read this if you haven't yet it should help you understand it a bit more.

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/97254-if-you-think.html

 

[Nothingman]

Oh i absolutely agree but lets b real this is hdrol. He isnt gonna get gyno especially prolactin related gyno haha. All of this for a few pounds he can do easily just by eating more

I Agree with this lol. But I have seen a few threads where guys have low test even months after using h-drol. Maybe they were just ****ed up anyway but everyones different. Its all just a shot in the dark the first time isnt it?

here is the thread where the guy had gyno on 4th week of H-drol, I wonder if he was doing something else that he wasnt admitting to?
http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/157363-gyno-4th-week.html

And Aldross is correct. I had ****ing burning left nipple and was panicing like crazy, he interluded in my thread and said chill dude you dont have gyno, read that thread he posted. It helped me calm down big time. Turns out Im pretty sure it was sid from my Nolva.

 

[Aldross]

here is the thread where the guy had gyno on 4th week of H-drol, I wonder if he was doing something else that he wasnt admitting to?
http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/157363-gyno-4th-week.html

I doubt that he was hiding anything. It was most likely that he was predisposed to gyno and the shift in his hormonal axis caused it to flare up like that. Steroids do not always give you the outcome you want and can uncover underlying issues. That is why you should always have your AI and SERM on hand before you start.

 

[pool_shark]

Nolvadex- is a SERM but im sure you already knew that! A serm (Selective Estrogen Reuptake Modulater)

This is the 2nd post I've seen where you say that.

Isn't it actually Selective Estrogen Receptor Modulator?

 

[Nothingman]

I doubt that he was hiding anything. It was most likely that he was predisposed to gyno and the shift in his hormonal axis caused it to flare up like that. Steroids do not always give you the outcome you want and can uncover underlying issues. That is why you should always have your AI and SERM on hand before you start.

Yeah I guess its like a shot in the dark the first time.

 

[bashman]

Alright guys Im putting in my order for Nolva this weekend. I can't afford any of the A.I they have (£150+), only the research bunk from a site that has apparently gone down hill since I started researching PH. Do I really need an A.I?

And would I need some sort of support some on cycle as H-Drol is Liver Toxic right?

 

[UnrealMachine]

Ok first of all the cycle layout is good

I agree with Aldross about the training, chest and legs together, **** me i'd be puking or something lol

For PCT i think it's good to stack nolva with OTC. I feel like i always recovered fine on nolva but it didn't give me HIGH levels of test like i've felt from clomid; i think it's less direct method of stimulating test production is slower and doesn't spike test that high

Support supps are always optional IMO. I think between all my cycles I've gone through 2 tubs of cycle support and 2 bottles of milk thistle and that was mostly back a couple years ago. I usually don't use any supports. But they're a good idea if you don't know what you're prone to. Like if you're prone to high Bp then in the middle of the cycle you'll find yourself getting headaches and you'll need a while before hawthorn berry can kick in.
IMO hawthorn berry preloaded and milk thistle in PCT are about all anyone should need for a simple cycle.

 

[Nothingman]

Ok first of all the cycle layout is good

I agree with Aldross about the training, chest and legs together, **** me i'd be puking or something lol

Did legs yesterday and I swear it effected my workout today lol, I don't know about you guys but i need to space a day in betweent legs and anything.

 

[bashman]

Did legs yesterday and I swear it effected my workout today lol, I don't know about you guys but i need to space a day in betweent legs and anything.

I guess I don't train my legs hard enough although my wheels aint terrible. How many sets are you guys doing?

I only go to real failure on the last set of every exercise so about 4 - 5 sets, where squats/front squats make up half of my leg work.

 

[Nothingman]

I guess I don't train my legs hard enough although my wheels aint terrible. How many sets are you guys doing?

I only go to real failure on the last set of every exercise so about 4 - 5 sets, where squats/front squats make up half of my leg work.

Yeah I have been a loose cannon in the gym latley. I start with squats and try killing it. I always do calves cus I fear chicken legs lol. But like last night I killed it on squats so I threw in some extra sets. Some nights I find squats tough so I ***** out and kill it on the leg press.

But my leg workout is this,
Squats, Leg Press, Leg Extension triple dropset, then over to leg curl with 4th set being dropset, then calf raises until they burn to all ****in hell. Uusally cant even walk to bubbler by the end of it all. One time I tripped in the parking lot.

Google it there are cool sites that acutally have video's and many many alterations of certain excercises. When I get board of what Im doing I just research and try it out.

How are you feeling so far on the h-drol? They say you wont feel **** until week3. Or Im sorry have you started it yet? lol

 

[bashman]

Yeah I have been a loose cannon in the gym latley. I start with squats and try killing it. I always do calves cus I fear chicken legs lol. But like last night I killed it on squats so I threw in some extra sets. Some nights I find squats tough so I ***** out and kill it on the leg press.

But my leg workout is this,
Squats, Leg Press, Leg Extension triple dropset, then over to leg curl with 4th set being dropset, then calf raises until they burn to all ****in hell. Uusally cant even walk to bubbler by the end of it all. One time I tripped in the parking lot.

Google it there are cool sites that acutally have video's and many many alterations of certain excercises. When I get board of what Im doing I just research and try it out.

How are you feeling so far on the h-drol? They say you wont feel **** until week3. Or Im sorry have you started it yet? lol

Ha Ha your workout makes mine look like a walk in the park, guess I need to step it up a bit. My gym is a 20min walk with 2 big hills so I gotta make sure Im able to make it back home afterwards.

Nah bro not started yet, still need to order Nolva and still not got confirmation of holiday request off work as I really want to log this. Soon.........

 

[AwfullyAmazin]

Did legs yesterday and I swear it effected my workout today lol, I don't know about you guys but i need to space a day in betweent legs and anything.

Yeah, that's why my split will always be the same.

Day 1: Chest/Triceps
Day 2: Back/Biceps
Day 3: Off
Day 4: Shoulders
Day 5: Legs
Day 6, 7: Off

 

[bashman]

Just an update, I have placed my order for everything, cut back on a few things as suggested.

This morning I get an e-mail from my supplier of Nolva saying they're "out of stock" typical

Hopefully will receive in a couple of weeks and then should be able to make a start.

Just wanted to ask - do you guys believe I would benefit from training each body part x2 a week while on cycle, or is once a week enough?

 

[bashman]

Just an update, I have placed my order for everything, cut back on a few things as suggested.

This morning I get an e-mail from my supplier of Nolva saying they're "out of stock" typical

Hopefully will receive in a couple of weeks and then should be able to make a start.

Just wanted to ask - do you guys believe I would benefit from training each body part x2 a week while on cycle, or is once a week enough?

 

[meaj82]

Keep the volume low if you do train twice a week. That's what I'm doing. Upper/lower off repeat /off, off.

Seems to be working well for me. Give it a shot, see how your body reacts to it.

 

[bashman]

Keep the volume low if you do train twice a week. That's what I'm doing. Upper/lower off repeat /off, off.

Seems to be working well for me. Give it a shot, see how your body reacts to it.

Okay cool, I have a couple of weeks or so until my nolva arrives so have time to experiment. Was thinking:-

BACK + BICEPS
SHOULDERS + TRICEPS
REST
CHEST + LIGHT LATERALS + BACK
LEGS + BICEPS
SHOULDERS + TRICEPS
REST

I am trying bring up Medial delts for more width appearance and I have found that my biceps seem to recover very quickly, hence I just throw in a light/heavy x2 a week.

For my back, I emphasize one day around deadlift/compounds moves, then the other is mostly isolation.