What should I try aside from transdermal?

[RawCalm]

Hey Everyone,

Years ago I ran a successful LGD cycle (just 3mg daily) and recovered from it nicely.

Since then I’ve had 3 kids, started a company, and while I haven’t completely let myself go I figured it was time for a boost.

After doing some research I bought some dermacrine and alpha 7, applied them this morning, then while reading I realized the danger this could cause to my wife and kids. From my reading it sounds like some transdermals have been shown to transfer up to 12 hours after application. I don’t think it’s something I can risk for my family.

What would be recommended for an oral run? Am I back to sarms? Unfortunately I cannot inject test as I promised the wife I wouldn’t. Without that base should I just forget about running this stuff now?

All thoughts appreciated, thanks.

 

[SSJ4GOD]

Run them in places they would touch like tops of feet which will be in socks and under a shirt. I think realistically transfer after it’s completely dry is a pretty low risk anyways.

 

[RawCalm]

Run them in places they would touch like tops of feet which will be in socks and under a shirt. I think realistically transfer after it’s completely dry is a pretty low risk anyways.

According to this source and study even after it’s dry contact can completely affect hormones.

Hyperandrogenism after transfer of topical testosterone gel: case report and review of published and unpublished studies

Abstract. Topically applied testosterone gels are a widely used mode of testosterone replacement therapy. A concern associated with the use of testosterone

academic.oup.com

Honestly I feel great after dermacrine today, but reading over that I’m not certain this would work. It sounds like I would need to shower before any contact in those areas.

I have read a few people theorize that you can actually shower an hour after application and be okay, but later sweat can cause it to come back out.

Maybe I’m being paranoid but that source I posted really freaked me out.

 

[SSJ4GOD]

I promise you are paranoid. The risk for transdermal testosterone itself isn’t even something to really worry about. Let alone these products. You gotta think even medical Td test absorbs like 50%. And that’s direct on your skin rubbed in contact. Any amount that transfers after is dries will be so inconsequential.

 

[RawCalm]

I promise you are paranoid. The risk for transdermal testosterone itself isn’t even something to really worry about. Let alone these products. You gotta think even medical Td test absorbs like 50%. And that’s direct on your skin rubbed in contact. Any amount that transfers after is dries will be so inconsequential.

I have wondered if testosterone would cause worse problems than DHEA and in this case androsterone,
Have you ran transdermals while living with someone without issue then?

 

[SSJ4GOD]

I have wondered if testosterone would cause worse problems than DHEA and in this case androsterone,
Have you ran transdermals while living with someone without issue then?

Yup. I got a wife. I got kids. I run TD epiandro, 3AD, and even at one point some TD test. No issues at all. I prioritize where I place them. In your case, the most detrimental for transfer would be the androsterone so I would rub that on the tops of my feet. It will be dry and have socks on top so zero transfer risk! I wouldn’t even concern myself with dermacrine but behind the knees is a good spot. But regardless, once they are dry, I never even give it a second thought. Dry=gone as far as I’m concerned.

 

[RawCalm]

Yup. I got a wife. I got kids. I run TD epiandro, 3AD, and even at one point some TD test. No issues at all. I prioritize where I place them. In your case, the most detrimental for transfer would be the androsterone so I would rub that on the tops of my feet. It will be dry and have socks on top so zero transfer risk! I wouldn’t even concern myself with dermacrine but behind the knees is a good spot. But regardless, once they are dry, I never even give it a second thought. Dry=gone as far as I’m concerned.

Interestjng, thank you, maybe I will continue this run.
They do cite a study showing that 15 minutes of abdomen to andomen contact between couples with one on gel test showed significant transfer even at 12 hours, but that risk went away with a shower, also obviously there is heavy sweat and friction Contact which I assume may have been the big difference.

On my feet you are right, I will not have much issue with that and dermacrine is not nearly as dangerous to my family although I will be just as careful.

Thank you, I’d be happy to hear any other thoughts on the subject as well.

 

[SSJ4GOD]

Interestjng, thank you, maybe I will continue this run.
They do cite a study showing that 15 minutes of abdomen to andomen contact between couples with one on gel test showed significant transfer even at 12 hours, but that risk went away with a shower, also obviously there is heavy sweat and friction Contact which I assume may have been the big difference.

On my feet you are right, I will not have much issue with that and dermacrine is not nearly as dangerous to my family although I will be just as careful.

Thank you, I’d be happy to hear any other thoughts on the subject as well.

I will also add that dermacrine is dhea and pregnenolone which women can also use in lower doses so a little transfer wouldn’t necessarily be a bad thing.

 

[Smont]

I have no clue why you keep quoting testosterone gel studies when you're not using testosterone gel. Those studies have no relevance to the supplements you are taking, and the things your taking can also be used by females. Dhea, pregnolone, 7 keto dhea. All acceptable supplements for females.

 

[SSJ4GOD]

I have no clue why you keep quoting testosterone gel studies when you're not using testosterone gel. Those studies have no relevance to the supplements you are taking, and the things your taking can also be used by females. Dhea, pregnolone, 7 keto dhea. All acceptable supplements for females.

The 7 keto also has 200mgs a serving of androsterone in it fyi.

 

[Rad83]

Hey Everyone,

Years ago I ran a successful LGD cycle (just 3mg daily) and recovered from it nicely.
.

Recovered from what? 3mg = placebo

 

[Smont]

The 7 keto also has 200mgs a serving of androsterone in it fyi.

Still not a big deal. If a female was applying 200mg daily she might run into issues. But the 3 or 4 mg that might transfer, not a concern

 

[Smont]

Recovered from what? 3mg = placebo

Lgd at 3 to 5 mg, also used by females

 

[RawCalm]

Recovered from what? 3mg = placebo

Lol

I have no clue why you keep quoting testosterone gel studies when you're not using testosterone gel. Those studies have no relevance to the supplements you are taking, and the things your taking can also be used by females. Dhea, pregnolone, 7 keto dhea. All acceptable supplements for females.

This is a good point, I think I’m just surprised at the level of transference that these people had, just freaked me out thinking of my kids.

 

[Smont]

Lol




This is a good point, I think I’m just surprised at the level of transference that these people had, just freaked me out thinking of my kids.

I have kids, I use to use a lot of these things, as long as your not all sweaty and hugging them it's not a concern.

His point on the 3mg was that Your results were probably placebo effect. Most men use 20+ mg per day. I've seen females use up to 10mg of lgd. I've used up to 40mg oral lgd and 60mg injectable lgd

 

[RawCalm]

I have kids, I use to use a lot of these things, as long as your not all sweaty and hugging them it's not a concern.

His point on the 3mg was that Your results were probably placebo effect. Most men use 20+ mg per day. I've seen females use up to 10mg of lgd. I've used up to 40mg oral lgd and 60mg injectable lgd

I understand his point, I disagree that it was placebo but it’s not worth arguing about something I ran 5 years ago.

Edit: I also appreciate the point about your kids as it really does help put my mind at ease.

 

[Smont]

I understand his point, I disagree that it was placebo but it’s not worth arguing about something I ran 5 years ago.

Edit: I also appreciate the point about your kids as it really does help put my mind at ease.

Wake up, hot shower and apply to areas that will be covered in clothes. Later in the day if you think yiur gonna play with the kids and get sweaty "personally I wouldn't worry too much" But if you're really worried then just take a shower 1st. You have already absorbed pretty much all of it and it's already in your system doing its thing.

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

first.. at the bottom:
"The results of this study are in contrast with our case report and others"

then:
"In light of the widespread use of testosterone gels and the paucity of reports on inter-person transfer, the actual risk of causing clinically relevant hyperandrogenism in contaminated women or children is probably limited."


have you read some of the opposing articles? I have, and there is little to no proof of any transfer after 45 mins doing anything.

for one, in this study they look at contents on the skin after administration. how is that going to penetrate the skin of someone else if there is no carrier for it to happen with? they themselves admitted the alcohol that's used to open the skin is evaporated.

Im not saying it can't happen but like everyone else has said, it's pretty much a stretch.

the woman in this case is probably a snuggle bug who was putting on some kind of skin cream before bed that was allowing the leftovers to actually penetrate.

putting it into perspective, there is something being left out of the equation here.

 

[Smont]

first.. at the bottom:
"The results of this study are in contrast with our case report and others"

then:
"In light of the widespread use of testosterone gels and the paucity of reports on inter-person transfer, the actual risk of causing clinically relevant hyperandrogenism in contaminated women or children is probably limited."


have you read all of the opposing articles? I have, and there is little to no proof of any transfer after 45 mins doing anything.

for one, in this study they look at contents on the skin after administration. how is that going to penetrate the skin of someone else if there is no carrier for it to happen with? they themselves admitted the alcohol that's used to open the skin is evaporated.

Im not saying it can't happen but like everyone else has said, it's pretty much a stretch.

the woman in this case is probably a snuggle bug who was putting on some kind of skin cream before bed that was allowing the leftovers to actually penetrate.

putting it into perspective, there is something being left out of the equation here.

Everything I have read is in line with what you just said. 45min is usually enough to be safe. If it wasn't then you mine as well not use a transdermal because you would transfer it into your clothes instead of absorbing it.

Shower, apply, wait till its dry to the touch, get dressed and be on your way.

 

[RawCalm]

first.. at the bottom:
"The results of this study are in contrast with our case report and others"

then:
"In light of the widespread use of testosterone gels and the paucity of reports on inter-person transfer, the actual risk of causing clinically relevant hyperandrogenism in contaminated women or children is probably limited."


have you read all of the opposing articles? I have, and there is little to no proof of any transfer after 45 mins doing anything.

for one, in this study they look at contents on the skin after administration. how is that going to penetrate the skin of someone else if there is no carrier for it to happen with? they themselves admitted the alcohol that's used to open the skin is evaporated.

Im not saying it can't happen but like everyone else has said, it's pretty much a stretch.

the woman in this case is probably a snuggle bug who was putting on some kind of skin cream before bed that was allowing the leftovers to actually penetrate.

putting it into perspective, there is something being left out of the equation here.

Could you link to the opposing studies? I have been looking all over for them as I don’t want to have wasted money on this stuff. I’m not here to bash, just asking honest questions. I’ve got 3 kids under 6 so I’m pretty cautious.

Looking at the studies in that link I provided it showed from androgel that transfer could occur 2 hours later with skin contact. That transfer was enough to throw grown women’s testosterone out of wack, can’t imagine what it would do to a kid. I haven’t seen any other studies that say this is wrong.

You are right though that most of the case studies seem to be missing things. Seems like many of them with kids are from people letting kids sleep in their beds and I’m assuming they are applying at night.

 

[Smont]

I don't mean this in any type of way. I'm just trying to get to the point and save you some hassle.

If yiur that worried about it then don't use it. Sell it, trade it, trash it, whatever you want and you can buy all of these things in pill form.

Problem solved

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

start here:
Interpersonal testosterone transfer after topical application of a newly developed testosterone gel preparation - PubMed (nih.gov)

 

[RawCalm]

start here:
Interpersonal testosterone transfer after topical application of a newly developed testosterone gel preparation - PubMed (nih.gov)

Thank you, I actually started running dermacrine and alpha seven yesterday.

I will say that study is why it seems researches have been so surprised by transfer, although only 20 reported cases from the millions of users is a small risk.

From case studies I’ve read it sounds like the theory is transfer and then sweat causes the issue. It could be raw test transfers better in sweat than these Dhea derived chemicals. I also have noticed all cross contamination involves applying with hands which is why I’m using gloves. I think I’ll wash my clothes separate too.

hardest part now is finding enough application sites! 2 pumps dermacrine and 4 of alpha seven has me completely covered in this stuff.

 

[Renew1]

Thank you, I actually started running dermacrine and alpha seven yesterday.

I will say that study is why it seems researches have been so surprised by transfer, although only 20 reported cases from the millions of users is a small risk.

From case studies I’ve read it sounds like the theory is transfer and then sweat causes the issue. It could be raw test transfers better in sweat than these Dhea derived chemicals. I also have noticed all cross contamination involves applying with hands which is why I’m using gloves. I think I’ll wash my clothes separate too.

hardest part now is finding enough application sites! 2 pumps dermacrine and 4 of alpha seven has me completely covered in this stuff.

I don't know how many mls that translates to, but Ripper ^ , Myself, and many others use more than 6 pumps, for sure.

 

[RawCalm]

I don't know how many mls that translates to, but Ripper ^ , Myself, and many others use more than 6 pumps, for sure.

How the hell do you have places to put it?

I can fit 3 if I do my upper back, shoulders, and chest, maybe 4.

I guess my sack and feet maybe?