Say NO to Powerfull pre-bed?

[TheUnlikelyToad]

Why are we stimulating GH release prior to bed when sleep is naturally GH releasing?

Could be wasting a Powerfull dose?

 

[workout8485]

Why are we stimulating GH release prior to bed when sleep is naturally GH releasing?

Could be wasting a Powerfull dose?

because u r trying to increase whatever that natural level of GH release is....

 

[TheUnlikelyToad]

because u r trying to increase whatever that natural level of GH release is....

But is this an optimal time considering you'll get some release anyway?

My thinking is that you may get more bang for tha buck if you take at other times throughout tha day when GH generally isn't released... away from your workout, away from bedtime.

 

[SilentBob187]

You've got a point Toad. I just don't think I could stand being drowsy all day. When taking PFull I couldn't do the preworkout dose either due to drowsiness.

If you can dig it, more power to you.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

It ends up being the most practical due to nocturnal GH-release being the most unperturbed; at other points in the day, Insulin is being released at least every two hours if one's diet follows the normative standards!

 

[Guest]

But is this an optimal time considering you'll get some release anyway?

My thinking is that you may get more bang for tha buck if you take at other times throughout tha day when GH generally isn't released... away from your workout, away from bedtime.

The HGH peak on PowerFULL is significant.

Just speaking from years of personal use and years of consumer feedback. The waking up fresh from the deep deep sleep from PowerFULL is indirect evidence that taking PowerFULL before bed provides a significant HGH surge over just natural nocturnal production.

 

[bioman]

You mean "refreshed 2 hours earlier than normal with a raging boner"


lol

 

[Force of Green]

If you don't want to end up drowsy with a daytime dose, take it with a stim. Something like 1 RPM cap and a few Powerfull caps.

 

[giantbrandon]

ive been using it for 2 months now and my sleep has been sooooo deep i sleep through all my alarms in the morning

 

[mmorpheuss]

My line of thinking would be that if you take powerfull during periods that you don't normally produce GH (i.e. besides workout and sleep) you run the risk of disrupting your naturally occurring release patterns and thus the times such as sleep when your body would be used to normally producing GH could be adversely affected.

In other words, you would be "robbing Peter to pay Paul".

It makes sense to me to dose according to directions, pre-exercise and before bedtime, in order to boost your normal production to higher than normal levels while at the same time staying within the natural framework of hormonal events.

This would seem to be the best way to avoid running contrary to your body's natural production patterns, and risking a homeostatic event that runs against what you are trying to accomplish. I feel that attempting to stimulate a significant GH release during a time that your body knows it shouldn't be releasing GH in significant amounts will most assuredly cause your system to reel things back in.

 

[borobulker]

It makes sense to me to dose according to directions, pre-exercise and before bedtime, in order to boost your normal production to higher than normal levels while at the same time staying within the natural framework of hormonal events.

I completely agree. :cheers:
Reps bud...

 

[Steveoph]

Just a reminder to do an on/off pattern (Eg. 5 days on, 2 days off) to avoid adaptation.

 

[TheUnlikelyToad]

My line of thinking would be that if you take powerfull during periods that you don't normally produce GH (i.e. besides workout and sleep) you run the risk of disrupting your naturally occurring release patterns and thus the times such as sleep when your body would be used to normally producing GH could be adversely affected.

In other words, you would be "robbing Peter to pay Paul".

It makes sense to me to dose according to directions, pre-exercise and before bedtime, in order to boost your normal production to higher than normal levels while at the same time staying within the natural framework of hormonal events.

This would seem to be the best way to avoid running contrary to your body's natural production patterns, and risking a homeostatic event that runs against what you are trying to accomplish. I feel that attempting to stimulate a significant GH release during a time that your body knows it shouldn't be releasing GH in significant amounts will most assuredly cause your system to reel things back in.

Would this hold true or a common practice for injecting as well?

Just curious, really I have no idea...


As far as issues with food, it's not a problem for me. I prescribe to Norton style of eating... every 4 hours. I've always done this since day 1 and has recently validated my success.

As far as maximizing pre-bed. I'm still young, not old like Jacob. Maybe when I get to his age I'll reconsider...

Tha only reason I ask is because I've been playing around with times/dosages and what I suggest seems to be working well.

 

[jakellpet]

If you don't want to end up drowsy with a daytime dose, take it with a stim. Something like 1 RPM cap and a few Powerfull caps.

1 cap? try 4!

Zap is a great stim option for PowerFull as well

 

[raginfcktard]

i haven't really looked into powerfull from what i've read good'ol l-dopa from whoever the hell sells it is provides the same results as far as gh production...question..what if any are the additional benefits to powerfull over straight l-dopa?

 

[RamboMass]

The HGH peak on PowerFULL is significant.

Just speaking from years of personal use and years of consumer feedback. The waking up fresh from the deep deep sleep from PowerFULL is indirect evidence that taking PowerFULL before bed provides a significant HGH surge over just natural nocturnal production.

I can definately attest to the sleep benefits, someone mentioned their sleep being deep enough to sleep through alarms... I have found the exact opposite, I naturally wake up after less hours of sleep than I was planning but completely refreshed which makes me believe that the sleep I am getting is just incredibly deep and dense in HGH

 

[jakellpet]

I can definately attest to the sleep benefits, someone mentioned their sleep being deep enough to sleep through alarms... I have found the exact opposite, I naturally wake up after less hours of sleep than I was planning but completely refreshed which makes me believe that the sleep I am getting is just incredibly deep and dense in HGH

Whether it delivers on the GH or not, I found it delivered quality sleep on reduced hours or broken sleep over a 6 month period - believe me, I had newborn twins at the time. PowerFull protected my sanity!

Also assisted in shredding 18kg of fat as well - nice little bonus.

 

[mmorpheuss]

Would this hold true or a common practice for injecting as well?

Just curious, really I have no idea...


As far as issues with food, it's not a problem for me. I prescribe to Norton style of eating... every 4 hours. I've always done this since day 1 and has recently validated my success.

As far as maximizing pre-bed. I'm still young, not old like Jacob. Maybe when I get to his age I'll reconsider...

Tha only reason I ask is because I've been playing around with times/dosages and what I suggest seems to be working well.

The difference between powerful and exogenous human growth hormone administration via injection is that users generally realize and accept that at some point in time their body is going to quit producing GH internally once it figures out that it doesn't have to because it is being administered via an external source.

Whereas HGH would be the equivalent of gasoline in your car, Powerful would be more like nitrous oxide- Good for a boost, but not something you replace gasoline with all together.

This is all assuming that administration of an l-dopa-like compound in and of itself isn't already serving to confuse your bodys natural hormonal interaction.

 

[Force of Green]

Whereas HGH would be the equivalent of gasoline in your car, Powerful would be more like nitrous oxide- Good for a boost, but not something you replace gasoline with all together.
QUOTE]
Too much NOS and you could blow a head gasket or piston rod.

 

[justreading]

I am thinking of just taking it pre-bed (4caps old formula) as my only daily dosage during PCT for increased test and GH.

I have one bottle super filled with part of another left over and figure I have 4-5 caps a day to use...

Does this sound like a good way to do it?

 

[strategicmove]

I am thinking of just taking it pre-bed (4caps old formula) as my only daily dosage during PCT for increased test and GH.

I have one bottle super filled with part of another left over and figure I have 4-5 caps a day to use...

Does this sound like a good way to do it?

I would consider starting with three capsules pre-bed, if you want to dose it just once a day. After a week or two, you may try four, although I would be hesitant to recommend that much at once. If you ever try four pre-bed, a five-day-on-two-day-off regimen is certainly useful, in my opinion.

 

[jchaffee1]

When i had my tub of bulk powerfull I actually didn't like taking it before bed. I remember it always taking longer to fall asleep and having weird dreams/waking up middle of the night. I felt like i was getting worse sleep but on the other hand I didn't feel tired in the morning. I ended up taking it mostly when i got home from work around 5 and taking a nap. Also liked taking it before workouts. Seemed to act almost like a stimulant for me. Also i never took egcg with it....wonder if i was getting too much exogenous dopamine conversion...maybe causing restlessness.

 

[aesop]

Gh release is related to Blood Glucose levels. Best time to naturally augment these levels is bedtime, because you aren't eating for 8 hours blood glucose drops and you got a GH spike. During the day blood glucose is higher you will not get the same spike, and it will make you drowsy from rising Blood glucose levels. Gh is a short acting hormone but the actions it triggers in cells (lipolysis, positive nitro retention, insulin resistance) are much longer lasting.

 

[aesop]

double post

 

[shmack]

the thing i dont understand about powerfull before bed is its supposed effects on dopamine. isnt raising dopamine before bed usually a bad idea?

 

[strategicmove]

the thing i dont understand about powerfull before bed is its supposed effects on dopamine. isnt raising dopamine before bed usually a bad idea?

As far as I recall, dopamine has been shown to not only regulate sleep-wake cycles, but also regulate brain functions. Low dopamine levels create sleep abnormalities, quite apart from the disruption in the signalling processes between neural cells. It is in fact the insufficient dopamine synthesis in Parkinson's disease that is responsible for sleep abnormalities in such patients. So, dopamine is necessary and important for sleep.

 

[shmack]

As far as I recall, dopamine has been shown to not only regulate sleep-wake cycles, but also regulate brain functions. Low dopamine levels create sleep abnormalities, quite apart from the disruption in the signalling processes between neural cells. It is in fact the insufficient dopamine synthesis in Parkinson's disease that is responsible for sleep abnormalities in such patients. So, dopamine is necessary and important for sleep.

Dopamine also is what keeps us alert and energized. This is why amphetamines keep us up and also why tyrosine is such a big preworkout supp. You know that feeling when you pull an all nighter and you feel tired but at the same time have a certain kind of energy? That's dopamine. Also USP claims that at the same time powerfull also boosts serotonin, while research shows that an increase in dopamine will DECREASE serotonin and vice versa.

Im also not clear as to how any supplement that has a significant effect in the brain could be benificial both preworkout and before bed. I get the GH side of it, but if it gives you such a good night's sleep which makes some drowsy in the morning (me included), why would this be something you want in your body before an intense workout?

 

[shmack]

bump...didn't mean to hijack this thread, just trying to clear a few things up

 

[strategicmove]

Dopamine also is what keeps us alert and energized. This is why amphetamines keep us up and also why tyrosine is such a big preworkout supp. You know that feeling when you pull an all nighter and you feel tired but at the same time have a certain kind of energy? That's dopamine. Also USP claims that at the same time powerfull also boosts serotonin, while research shows that an increase in dopamine will DECREASE serotonin and vice versa.

Im also not clear as to how any supplement that has a significant effect in the brain could be benificial both preworkout and before bed. I get the GH side of it, but if it gives you such a good night's sleep which makes some drowsy in the morning (me included), why would this be something you want in your body before an intense workout?

As you know, the pathways and actions of neurotransmitters, whether they are tyrosine-derived, serotonin-derived, or not, are significantly more complex than a mutual bidirectional dopamine-serotonin antagonism. In terms of PowerFULL or dopamine, if you get the “GH side of it”, as you put it, then you get the entire picture! PowerFULL elicits elevated growth-hormone production via a dopaminergic pathway. As you know, several classes of agents stimulate or inhibit growth-hormone secretion. In particular, the hypothalamic action of dopamine leads to an inhibition of somatostatin, allowing Growth hormone-releasing hormone (GHRH) to induce growth hormone secretions (more later). Furthermore, amines, whether catecholamines (for example, dopamine) or indolamines (for example, serotonin), can promote growth hormone secretion via alpha adrenergic stimulation (for catecholamines), beta-adrenergic inhibition (for catecholamines), dopaminergic stimulation (for catecholamines), or serotoninergic stimulation (for indolamines). The reverse cases (beta-adrenergic stimulation, alpha-adrenergic inhibition, dopamine inhibition, and serotonin inhibition) may lead to inhibition of growth-hormone release. Other factors that may stimulate growth-hormone secretion may include amino acids, the condition of hypoglycaemia, exercise, sleep, certain hormones, and so on. Of course, all these agents do not produce an equal boost in growth hormone. Dopamine, for instance, is known to be a potent growth-hormone agonist. PowerFULL uses this mechanism. Taken pre-bed, the potent GH-stimulating effects ensure a deep, restful sleep, and promotes superior repair of cellular damage. Taken pre-workout in a fasted state, growth-hormone release is equally induced, and acts in concert with the growth-hormone produced by exercise. This PowerFULL-induced growth-hormone surge pre-workout may produce lethargy in some users, requiring the simultaneous supplementation with a smooth-acting stimulant to ensure high motivation, concentration, and a laser-like focus during workout. So, PowerFULL, via its dopaminergic action, in this case, is extremely useful pre-workout and pre-bed.

I would like to add a few more comments to this, in order to address some of your other concerns. As you correctly implied, dopamine is derived from the synthesis of tyrosine. Put differently, dopamine is a tyrosine-derived neurotransmitter. As you also know, tyrosine can be incorporated into proteins, can be broken down for energy production, or can be converted into catecholamines. These catecholamines are neurotransmitters such as dopamine, norepinephrine, and epinephrine. The conversion of tyrosine into catecholamines is made possible by the action of the enzyme, tyrosine hydroxylase. The ensuing reaction produces DOPA (3,4-dihydrophenylalanine). Via the enzymatic action of DOPA decarboxylase, DOPA is converted to dopamine, which is, in turn, converted by dopamine ß-hydroxylase into norepinephrine. Finally, norepinephrine is converted by phenyletanolamine N-methyltransferase into epinephrine. However, the full conversion from tyrosine to epinephrine is only realized in the adrenals. In the brain, the conversion ends at dopamine! Furthermore, catecholamines can exhibit excitatory and inhibitory effects, which is why they can support higher metabolic activity and rest. Dopamine can act as an inhibitory and as an excitatory neurotransmitter. The dopamine receptors determine which pathway to utilize.
Dopamine has been shown severally to support growth hormone secretion via somatostatin secretion. As somatostatin blunts growth hormone secretion, the dopamine inhibition of somatostatin enhances the action of the dipeptide, Growth hormone-releasing hormone (GHRH). This leads to an elevated release of growth hormones.

On its own, serotonin (5-hydroxytryptamine) is a tryptophan-derived neurotransmitter. Although it is a monoamine neurotransmitter like dopamine, it is regarded as an indolamine, and not as a catecholamine (like dopamine). Serotonin is derived from tryptophan via a hydolation reaction (tryptophan hydroxylase) and a decarboxylation reaction (amino acid decarboxylase). Consequently, melatonin (N-acetyl-5-methoxytryptamine) is derived from serotonin in the pineal gland via the actions of the enzymes, serotonin-N-acetyltransferase and hydroxyindole-o-methyltransferase, both of which are most active in the dark. Furthermore, serotonin is primarily found in the gastrointestinal tract. Only small amounts are found in the brain. As tyrosine and tryptophan (as well as methionine, the branched-chain amino acids, and so on) depend on a neutral protein transporter to reach the brain for synthesis, a large amount of one of these can crowd-out the others, favouring its synthesis in the brain.

To summarize, dopamine is a powerful stimulus for growth-hormone secretion, via a series of steps. PowerFULL's impact on growth-hormone secretion is dopaminergic. Taken in a fasted state, PowerFULL can induce a significant increase in dopamine, and consequently, growth-hormone, whether pre-workout, or pre-bed.