SARMS vs LEGAL Pro-hormone stacks for recomp (fat loss, muscle gain)

[mad_canada]

So here we go, I'm researching again.
Just when I feel I have my **** together and knowledge, I want to learn more.

For the past eight weeks I've been doing an old school bodybuilding program called big beyond belief.

I've trained for years but this is a comebaxk attempt by me.

Going in my bloods were clean, test at 780 not bad for a 37 year old.

I've gone from 173-180 lbs with keeping bodyfat between 17-18%

I've researched the **** out of sarms and so fourteen days ago I started rad 140.

So far don't react well. Aggressive and anxious and headaches so I need to stop.

So looking at 1 andro and its effects on a recomp.

The Texas A&M study show 6-8 lbs muscle gain and 4+ lb fat loss in 4 weeks.

So with sarms on the cusp of being illegal, what's the best bet for me to go go forward as I do see progress with what I'm doing but want to see some faster gains and fat loss benefits?

Is there a better 1 andro out there?
Can someone recommend a specific company?
I have ar1macare for OCT and can use a PCT like torem (also on hand).

Thanks for any sort of help.

 

[Sam stack]

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[JoePaul39]

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[mad_canada]

I'd love to get an answer myself

 

[Sam stack]

For 1 andro, you would want to add a test base, probably demacrine or or epiandrostan. This is a good cycle. Theres no reason why you couldnt do a cycle of 1 andro, a test base, and ostarine (plus maybe s4). Ostarine and s-4 are mild sarms but they give pretty good results. Rad 140 is know for its aggression and causes lethargy after a month of using so i can see why you would want to stop. If you really want to recomp then s23 is the strongest sarm that will give you the best results. The only thing with s23 besides the complete shut down is that you need to run at least a trt dose of test or possibly just a really strong test base to counter the lethargy

 

[AnabolicGuru]

Olympus Labs andros should be pretty good. I vouch for anything with their name; great company.

 

[mikeymike85]

Personally I think 1AD wont yield those types of results.. for a recomp you should run DMZ which is still legal from what I hear.

 

[Sam stack]

Personally I think 1AD wont yield those types of results.. for a recomp you should run DMZ which is still legal from what I hear.

They actually work really well together. I just don’t recommend dmz cause the last 2 times I used it, my liver was ****ed for a while after

 

[mad_canada]

They actually work really well together. I just don’t recommend dmz cause the last 2 times I used it, my liver was ****ed for a while after

Did you use any on cycle support? I have ar1macare because not sure what rad 140 will do to me, not enough research.

 

[JoePaul39]

Olympus Labs andros should be pretty good. I vouch for anything with their name; great company.

Olympus Labs no longer manufactures the andros. I recommend he go with Hard Rock Supplements or Chaos and Pain’s 1 andro products, run it at 330 mg (like in the study), and run it for a full 8 weeks with a test base of either Epi Andro or 4 andro to reduce lethargy.

 

[JoePaul39]

Personally I think 1AD wont yield those types of results.. for a recomp you should run DMZ which is still legal from what I hear.

DMZ isn’t on the banned list, but it is illegal due to the 2014 law.

 

[mad_canada]

DMZ isn’t on the banned list, but it is illegal due to the 2014 law.

So is what IML selling not the same formula?

 

[mad_canada]

Olympus Labs no longer manufactures the andros. I recommend he go with Hard Rock Supplements or Chaos and Pain’s 1 andro products, run it at 330 mg (like in the study), and run it for a full 8 weeks with a test base of either Epi Andro or 4 andro to reduce lethargy.

So regarding chaos and pain.

I've used their stuff before, never Andros and I asked them their advice.

On facebook I was told I could use 1 andro on its own (chemical 1) with suppression that's about the same as lgd-4033 and would not need any OCT or PCT if I was OK with lgd without a PCT.

I was also told that a test base was not necessary if I could deal with the side effects of lgd energy levels.

This flies in the face of everything I've ever seen anywhere.

 

[JoePaul39]

So regarding chaos and pain.

I've used their stuff before, never Andros and I asked them their advice.

On facebook I was told I could use 1 andro on its own (chemical 1) with suppression that's about the same as lgd-4033 and would not need any OCT or PCT if I was OK with lgd without a PCT.

I was also told that a test base was not necessary if I could deal with the side effects of lgd energy levels.

This flies in the face of everything I've ever seen anywhere.

I have ran it by it’s own, but it can cause lethargy, hence why many run a test base with it. Chaos and Pain and Hard Rock both manufacture 4 andro and you can use that. You need to run PCT to keep your gains. Most on here would recommend a Serm, for legal reasons I used an OTC and recovered fine with lab work to prove it. If you just run 1 andro by itself you could get away with using something like Olympus Labs SUP3R pct and Rebirth. Here is a link to an excellent article on 1 andro (though the author insists a Serm is necessary) https://blog.priceplow.com/prohormones/1-andro

 

[mad_canada]

I have ran it by it’s own, but it can cause lethargy, hence why many run a test base with it. Chaos and Pain and Hard Rock both manufacture 4 andro and you can use that. You need to run PCT to keep your gains. Most on here would recommend a Serm, it for legal reasons I used an OTC and recovered fine with lab work to prove it. If you just run 1 andro by itself you could get away with using something like Olympus Labs SUP3R pct and Rebirth. Here is a link to an excellent article on 1 andro (though the author insists a Serm is necessary) https://blog.priceplow.com/prohormones/1-andro

I wonder what would happen if I were to run it for 4 weeks while on rad 140.

That just makes me nervous though.

 

[JoePaul39]

I wonder what would happen if I were to run it for 4 weeks while on rad 140.

That just makes me nervous though.

It really doesn’t kick in for a few weeks. I guarantee nearly everyone on here would recommend 8 weeks or don’t run it at all. I know the study was for 4 weeks, but the subjects were under perfect conditions. I can’t soeak about running it with sarms...never did it, but I don’t see why you couldn’t. Of course if it is going to make you worried all the time I would just run it alone so you don’t worry yourself to death, plus if you run it alone you will be able to better judge it’s effectiveness . If you are worried about taking 4 andro andr weigh it S a test base because it can aromatize into estrogen, consider Epi Andro as it does not.

 

[Wobmarvel]

I am in the midst of a sd and Lgd cycle. I have found that putting on size with just lgd is a challenge but when kickstarted with sd I have put on 14-17lbs then the lgd helps keep it there whilst maintaining my fairly lean composition doing maintenence workouts an eating 4000 cals a day. I seem to be able to cruise on it and am about onto week 9 of the cycle. Don't get bloods done though so for all I know my balls left town ages ago. But I feel fine. Used dermacrine from week 2 to week 7.

 

[mad_canada]

I am in the midst of a sd and Lgd cycle. I have found that putting on size with just lgd is a challenge but when kickstarted with sd I have put on 14-17lbs then the lgd helps keep it there whilst maintaining my fairly lean composition doing maintenence workouts an eating 4000 cals a day. I seem to be able to cruise on it and am about onto week 9 of the cycle. Don't get bloods done though so for all I know my balls left town ages ago. But I feel fine. Used dermacrine from week 2 to week 7.

Sorry for the ignorance, sd is superdrol? I thought this was banned. Is that maybe AD and a typo?

 

[Wobmarvel]

Sorry for the ignorance, sd is superdrol? I thought this was banned. Is that maybe AD and a typo?

No superdrol. I live in the UK.

 

[Renew1]

Sorry for the ignorance, sd is superdrol? I thought this was banned. Is that maybe AD and a typo?

It would help people to give you better answers if you were able/willing to explain why you are concerned with the legality of compounds. Is it.....being able to acquire the compound, or more of a legal aspect of it....such as......prior legal issues, government job, etc.?

 

[Sam stack]

Did you use any on cycle support? I have ar1macare because not sure what rad 140 will do to me, not enough research.

Yes I used liver gaurd but I didn’t use TUDACA which was a big mistake. But I was dozing up to 60mg a day at one point so sides are to be expected.. I didn’t think dmz was too crazy tho. Some people seem to love it

 

[mad_canada]

It would help people to give you better answers if you were able/willing to explain why you are concerned with the legality of compounds. Is it.....being able to acquire the compound, or more of a legal aspect of it....such as......prior legal issues, government job, etc.?

It is a personal issue, but things that are scheduled, I want to avoid. This means that I would rather not even order modafinil and have it come through customs and get a government "love letter" from border patrol.

I live in the USA, despite the username.

 

[Renew1]

It is a personal issue, but things that are scheduled, I want to avoid. This means that I would rather not even order modafinil and have it come through customs and get a government "love letter" from border patrol.

I live in the USA, despite the username.

I also live in the USA, and I order domestic. No Love letters, etc. However, I've also ordered from Greece several times, and I have considered ordering from a source in England several times (where the safe delivery percentage appears to be 100%).....but I've never even had to because everything is available in the US.

But if you want to strictly follow the letter of the law, I can respect that. .........just understand that will cut out almost all of the compounds discussed in this section.

 

[mad_canada]

I also live in the USA, and I order domestic. No Love letters, etc. However, I've also ordered from Greece several times, and I have considered ordering from a source in England several times (where the safe delivery percentage appears to be 100%).....but I've never even had to because everything is available in the US.

But if you want to strictly follow the letter of the law, I can respect that. .........just understand that will cut out almost all of the compounds discussed in this section.

Well, things like superdrol I do not think I want to really try after reading the hepatoxicity of it. Is it worth it to get 10 lbs of mass in 4 weeks vs 4-5 if I can forego terrible liver problems?

Either way, yes I understand and wish that there was an anonymous way to get stuff here. Just does not seem to be, and they're now drafting that legislation towards sarms too.

Seems that if a guy wants to do completely outlawed AAS, anyone can get a domestic dealer, but orals and stuff for those not ready to go pin? **** you, we are outlawing them too cause why should a consumer have a choice.

 

[Wobmarvel]

On paper actual AAS are safer and more effective than orals and have been what all bodybuilders have built cycles on for years. I am pretty sure there are no professional open bodybuilders who have built their physiques purely on orals. Having said that I am sure they all use orals as well. I am not a fan of injections so I always go the oral route. They are in and out of your system pretty quick and if you experience bad sides you can stop and have them out of your system in a few days. If you inject a long ester and start suffering bad side effects then you have weeks to wait. Not to mention getting the injection wrong, causing infection hitting a vein etc. If I was on a mission to get bigger and bigger year on year then I believe you would have to go the injection route because everyone knows oral cycles are mainly fast acting but temporary. I'm 43 and just run different experiments. Some years I want to put size on others I want to drop 20lbs and lean out and other years I want to do absolutely nothing so oral cycle suit me.