Unanswered Sarm cycle with msten kicker?

[Fartknocker]

So the deal is ill be placing an order here soon for a future cycle. Wanted to try another sarm run. Was thinking a fairly long 10-12week rad140 cycle since it seems to treat me well. Probably something like 15/20/20/20/20/30 for the rest. Wanted to add in yk11 for the second half or maybe a bit sooner. And starting mk677 throughout and a couple months post cycle. My main question is the 12 weeks of cardarine i have and about 3 weeks worth of msten laying around. Should i run the cardarine through whole cycle into pct? And does the msten have a place here as a kickstart or leave it out of this run? Will probably pick up some 3ad and start it when the lack of motivation kicks in. My thought was a fairly less toxic cycle but the more i type it seems not really . Any input is appreciated.

 

[Matthersby]

Questions.
How much is 3 weeks worth?
Do you know YK or Rad will shut you down and require pct?
Seems like a lot thrown in the pot for Sarms. The idea seems to be simplicity and lack of sides. Card, YK, mk677, and rad, plus Msten?? May as well just get some test prop and MK, run it for 8 weeks and kick it with the msten low dosed stretched to 5 weeks. Probably would be easier with less sides, but I don’t know. Sarms don’t make a ton of sense to me, but I hear Rad and S4 are really good ones.

 

[aman88]

I did lgd and that shut me down worse than any PH Ive taken... I was also taking epi andro with it... Also did not really do much for me. Certainly not worth how I felt.

 

[Fartknocker]

Questions.
How much is 3 weeks worth?
Do you know YK or Rad will shut you down and require pct?
Seems like a lot thrown in the pot for Sarms. The idea seems to be simplicity and lack of sides. Card, YK, mk677, and rad, plus Msten?? May as well just get some test prop and MK, run it for 8 weeks and kick it with the msten low dosed stretched to 5 weeks. Probably would be easier with less sides, but I don’t know. Sarms don’t make a ton of sense to me, but I hear Rad and S4 are really good ones.

Yeah i know ill be shut down. Last cycle was msten and td trest. Just wanted to stay somewhat less toxic. Ive done rad a couple times and at 20mg i get nice gains and leaning with zero sides. Tbh i felt fine on msten at 20mg even without trest. Also dont want to do another super short 4 week cycle. So thats why i wanted to go for 12 weeks rad. Id keep the msten at 15mg for a few weeks or not at all. Idk im just kinda throwin ideas at the wall here and see what sticks. Card just for lipids and heart basically and a little extra endurance towards the end. I could take or leave the mk677. Also after the trest i dont really wanna deal with estrogen for a while.

 

[Matthersby]

Yeah i know ill be shut down. Last cycle was msten and td trest. Just wanted to stay somewhat less toxic. Ive done rad a couple times and at 20mg i get nice gains and leaning with zero sides. Tbh i felt fine on msten at 20mg even without trest. Also dont want to do another super short 4 week cycle. So thats why i wanted to go for 12 weeks rad. Id keep the msten at 15mg for a few weeks or not at all. Idk im just kinda throwin ideas at the wall here and see what sticks. Card just for lipids and heart basically and a little extra endurance towards the end. I could take or leave the mk677. Also after the trest i dont really wanna deal with estrogen for a while.

@Hyde would be helpful here.
MK would be fine. The more I learn the more I realize how badly we all need growth and IGF in our lives.
What’s the goal with the cycle?
Staying only on the legal side of cycling?

Rad 25/day 8-10weeks
Cardarine - suggested dose for lipid health 8-10
Msten 10mg/5 weeks (I’ve ran more oral cycles than I can count and I would always go 5 weeks with a lower dos on any drug. Without a doubt)
MK- find a good deal for bulk and run it 6 months.

That should be nice, but personally, I’d rather $180 for test prop and winstrol for 8-10 weeks would smoke that stack, comparable sides other than a little joint pain and lipid wreckage.

 

[aman88]

@Hyde would be helpful here.
MK would be fine. The more I learn the more I realize how badly we all need growth and IGF in our lives.
What’s the goal with the cycle?
Staying only on the legal side of cycling?

Rad 25/day 8-10weeks
Cardarine - suggested dose for lipid health 8-10
Msten 10mg/5 weeks (I’ve ran more oral cycles than I can count and I would always go 5 weeks with a lower dos on any drug. Without a doubt)
MK- find a good deal for bulk and run it 6 months.

That should be nice, but personally, I’d rather $180 for test prop and winstrol for 8-10 weeks would smoke that stack, comparable sides other than a little joint pain and lipid wreckage.

Does mk actually work?

 

[Matthersby]

Does mk actually work?

Multiple labs to back it up on another thread, MK at suggested dose was equivalent to 2-3iu’s growth. This guy did an amazing job testing his Growth levels while using GH for years and then MK regularly for a year. I’m a believer for sure.
There’s a few guys out there saying MK and CJC/DAC give them better results than growth did, for a lot cheaper.

 

[Matthersby]

Bloodwork study of 4iu GH vs peptides & MK677 (similar to 2-3 iu GH)

Bloodwork study of 4iu GH vs peptides & MK677 (similar to 2-3 iu GH) - AnabolicMinds.com

UPDATE: year 2022, Part II: please post here: Thread continued here with 7 blood works taken with mk677 over a 5 year period, like 4iu of pharm grade HGH...

anabolicminds.com

 

[aman88]

Multiple labs to back it up on another thread, MK at suggested dose was equivalent to 2-3iu’s growth. This guy did an amazing job testing his Growth levels while using GH for years and then MK regularly for a year. I’m a believer for sure.
There’s a few guys out there saying MK and CJC/DAC give them better results than growth did, for a lot cheaper.

Very interesting... but taking it for 6 months seems expensive haha...

 

[Hyde]

Kickers don’t make sense in oral only cycles - there’s no delay for full blood saturation like waiting for an estered oil to release.

Fundamental cycling principle: doses/potency should go up as time goes on to continue gains as the body adapts to the blast. Msten is your biggest gun here - it belongs at the finale.

10 weeks RAD. 8 weeks 3AD. 4-6 weeks YK. 3 weeks Msten. All layered in starting back to front. Can you dig it?

You can use Mk throughout the whole cycle, into PCT even.

 

[Chrisbenches]

Kickers don’t make sense in oral only cycles - there’s no delay for full blood saturation like waiting for an estered oil to release.

Fundamental cycling principle: doses/potency should go up as time goes on to continue gains as the body adapts to the blast. Msten is your biggest gun here - it belongs at the finale.

10 weeks RAD. 8 weeks 3AD. 4-6 weeks YK. 3 weeks Msten. All layered in starting back to front. Can you dig it?

You can use Mk throughout the whole cycle, into PCT even.

@Hyde dropping knowledge bombs like a boss!

 

[Matthersby]

@Hyde dropping knowledge bombs like a boss!

He’s my go-to for life advice and stacking multiple drugs.

 

[Fartknocker]

Kickers don’t make sense in oral only cycles - there’s no delay for full blood saturation like waiting for an estered oil to release.

Fundamental cycling principle: doses/potency should go up as time goes on to continue gains as the body adapts to the blast. Msten is your biggest gun here - it belongs at the finale.

10 weeks RAD. 8 weeks 3AD. 4-6 weeks YK. 3 weeks Msten. All layered in starting back to front. Can you dig it?

You can use Mk throughout the whole cycle, into PCT even.

I appreciate the input thanks. Im probably wrong but my thought was you most likely feel the worst the last 3 weeks of a cycle of orals and maybe not the best time to add in something like msten. In my experience i can kinda feel rad after a week but its not fully kicked in until 2-3 weeks so im not sure its the same as an oral ph or ds as far as no build up time.

Not running msten the same time as yk was my intention as they are the hardest on liver and bp in this stack. And yk11s myostatin inhibition would go well in the second half as it builds up.

Then again i have a lot to learn so ill do it as you layed out. My only concern is ill be a bit run down after 7 weeks on and wont want to run the msten, which is fine by me.

 

[Chrisbenches]

He’s my go-to for life advice and stacking multiple drugs.

Lol! We should start calling him “Dr. Hyde!”

 

[Hyde]

@Hyde dropping knowledge bombs like a boss!

I was taught that stuff by the late Snagency on here - a good mentor, as well as Danger Dave. Lots to be learned from those who came before!

He’s my go-to for life advice and stacking multiple drugs.

I’m just trying to do it all the best I know how, like you lol

I appreciate the input thanks. Im probably wrong but my thought was you most likely feel the worst the last 3 weeks of a cycle of orals and maybe not the best time to add in something like msten. In my experience i can kinda feel rad after a week but its not fully kicked in until 2-3 weeks so im not sure its the same as an oral ph or ds as far as no build up time.

Not running msten the same time as yk was my intention as they are the hardest on liver and bp in this stack. And yk11s myostatin inhibition would go well in the second half as it builds up.

Then again i have a lot to learn so ill do it as you layed out. My only concern is ill be a bit run down after 7 weeks on and wont want to run the msten, which is fine by me.

I can see why you would think that when you are starting to see/feel effects and sides is when you think a compound is kicking in, but I assure you all orals, even SARMs, are active right away. It’s in your blood and it’s causing physiological process changes immediately.

My suggested layout causes the slowest shutdown of natural test production as well as produces the biggest, strongest, fullest package at the finale of the cycle - the greatest peak result, with the fastest hormonal recovery time from the available scenario. With only Rad starting out, production will begin declining immediately but you will not be at 0 for some time. 1-3 weeks probably before things are totally offline. And a dry DHT like 3AD isn’t very suppressive either. But a 19-Nor like YK certainly will be, as will such a potent compound as Msten.

The liver will also only be under strain for the 4-6 weeks you run the YK (which encompasses the Msten blast), vs starting with Msten, then finishing with YK has you on 7-9 total weeks of methylated compounds. 4-6 a bit more intense vs 7-9 more continuous load.

You could run it that way if you prefer, and it will be easier on sides at the end, but realize the gains from this cycle will be a flatter curve. This may be desirable for longterm gain-retention, or for someone not interested in producing as dramatic a transition. Maybe milder is the way to go for you - it’s individual preference. The lone drawback is being totally shut off by end of week 1 vs perhaps week 3, and implications for ease of HPTA recovery afterward.

Lol! We should start calling him “Dr. Hyde!”

Greg “I’m NOT a doctor” Doucette, IFBB Pro

 

[Matthersby]

I was taught that stuff by the late Snagency on here - a good mentor, as well as Danger Dave. Lots to be learned from those who came before!



I’m just trying to do it all the best I know how, like you lol



I can see why you would think that when you are starting to see/feel effects and sides is when you think a compound is kicking in, but I assure you all orals, even SARMs, are active right away. It’s in your blood and it’s causing physiological process changes immediately.

My suggested layout causes the slowest shutdown of natural test production as well as produces the biggest, strongest, fullest package at the finale of the cycle - the greatest peak result, with the fastest hormonal recovery time from the available scenario. With only Rad starting out, production will begin declining immediately but you will not be at 0 for some time. 1-3 weeks probably before things are totally offline. And a dry DHT like 3AD isn’t very suppressive either. But a 19-Nor like YK certainly will be, as will such a potent compound as Msten.

The liver will also only be under strain for the 4-6 weeks you run the YK (which encompasses the Msten blast), vs starting with Msten, then finishing with YK has you on 7-9 total weeks of methylated compounds. 4-6 a bit more intense vs 7-9 more continuous load.

You could run it that way if you prefer, and it will be easier on sides at the end, but realize the gains from this cycle will be a flatter curve. This may be desirable for longterm gain-retention, or for someone not interested in producing as dramatic a transition. Maybe milder is the way to go for you - it’s individual preference. The lone drawback is being totally shut off by end of week 1 vs perhaps week 3, and implications for ease of HPTA recovery afterward.



Greg “I’m NOT a doctor” Doucette, IFBB Pro

I watched 3 of his videos today! He’s coming up fast in google searches on proviron, weak body part training, everything.
You know why Danger Dave and all those 2006-2013 guys knew so much? They were always learning. Every cycle I learn something. Everyone else’s cycle I learn something, every time I read about something I think I know everything about, I learn more. And the guys that were on here a decade ago, were happy to share their knowledge, they never condescended, and they always were just secretly coming on here to learn more.

 

[Fartknocker]

Ok i really appreciate all of everybodys input. Im now thinking of probably dropping either msten or the yk and finish with just one of them. I kinda went crazy with the order and got enough for at least 2 different cycles. The fun part is just figuring out what to put together and when

 

[Fartknocker]

Whats the upper limit dose wise for yk that anyones ran? I ran it at 10 mg as part of a premade stack but it seemed very underdosed.

 

[Hyde]

Whats the upper limit dose wise for yk that anyones ran? I ran it at 10 mg as part of a premade stack but it seemed very underdosed.

Just anecdotally, haven’t used, I have heard guys going up to 20mg.

I think it has a short half life so would split the dosing.

 

[Matthersby]

Whats the upper limit dose wise for yk that anyones ran? I ran it at 10 mg as part of a premade stack but it seemed very underdosed.

Maybe start at 10 go up from there. Time is on your side since you can run it a few months.

 

[Smont]

I'd be willing to bet your gonna have really low estrogen towards the back end of this cycle and feel like crap.

 

[Fartknocker]

I'd be willing to bet your gonna have really low estrogen towards the back end of this cycle and feel like crap.

Idk if it works like this but i also have plenty of td trest ace. I know ill feel good with that with estrogen to spare. Idk if methyl estrogen serves the same physiological purpose. Or some dhea maybe which i have laying around as well

 

[Smont]

Idk if it works like this but i also have plenty of td trest ace. I know ill feel good with that with estrogen to spare. Idk if methyl estrogen serves the same physiological purpose. Or some dhea maybe which i have laying around as well

I think a little trest would be a good add on

 

[JoePaul39]

Subbed for knowledge seeking purposes.

 

[Matthersby]

I think a little trest would be a good add on

Second this.
Favorite for feel good and easy to run and and cruise without issues other than sweating at night. Works great as a test base.
Doesn’t even mess with my lipids.

 

[Fartknocker]

I did pick up a few bottles of ralox, some exem and even letro just in case in my last order but i was planning on shelving the td trest for quite a while as i recently found out we are having another kid and i dont wanna risk td trest around a pregnant woman or a newborn that ill be holding all the time and changing diapers. So i think i might even just go with just mk677, rad and 3ad. At least i have a pretty good stash hidden away.

 

[Hyde]

Even DHEA or 4DHEA could be used on the back end with no AI to keep estrogen present easily.

 

[HooliganNoire]

Kickers don’t make sense in oral only cycles - there’s no delay for full blood saturation like waiting for an estered oil to release.

Fundamental cycling principle: doses/potency should go up as time goes on to continue gains as the body adapts to the blast. Msten is your biggest gun here - it belongs at the finale.

10 weeks RAD. 8 weeks 3AD. 4-6 weeks YK. 3 weeks Msten. All layered in starting back to front. Can you dig it?

You can use Mk throughout the whole cycle, into PCT even.

What dosage of Msten would you suggest for those last 3 weeks? But mind you I have enough Msten to run 4-5 weeks

 

[mixedup]

I think your setup is too complicated with 2 many compounds I would try to pick say 3 compounds

 

[Hyde]

What dosage of Msten would you suggest for those last 3 weeks? But mind you I have enough Msten to run 4-5 weeks

Msten is typically dosed like superdol. 10-30mg for 20-45 days based on dose, expectation, support & tolerance.

I won’t be going over 20mg the next time I use it. 20 was great and 30mg was way too much. YMMV. I definitely wouldn’t advise someone to try 30mg for 5 weeks. You may be fine, but I wouldn’t be.

I think your setup is too complicated with 2 many compounds I would try to pick say 3 compounds

Probably, but this is a 7-month old thread so he’s probably moved on one way or the other already.

 

[HooliganNoire]

Msten is typically dosed like superdol. 10-30mg for 20-45 days based on dose, expectation, support & tolerance.

I won’t be going over 20mg the next time I use it. 20 was great and 30mg was way too much. YMMV. I definitely wouldn’t advise someone to try 30mg for 5 weeks. You may be fine, but I wouldn’t be.



Probably, but this is a 7-month old thread so he’s probably moved on one way or the other already.

I was thinking 20mgs the last 3-5 weeks of the last of a 8 weeks rad140, Lgd4003, gw50516, S4, but the S4 don't even count I would imagine cause it only 25mgs, I was dumb and bought 3 bottles of medfit zues and 3 bottles of rad, I really appreciate the response thank you

 

[Hyde]

I was thinking 20mgs the last 3-5 weeks of the last of a 8 weeks rad140, Lgd4003, gw50516, S4, but the S4 don't even count I would imagine cause it only 25mgs, I was dumb and bought 3 bottles of medfit zues and 3 bottles of rad, I really appreciate the response thank you

Sounds pretty solid to me. Make sure not to go too hard on the GW. I believe a tab of Zeus has 20mg, which is most anyone should consider touching IMHO.

 

[HooliganNoire]

Sounds pretty solid to me. Make sure not to go too hard on the GW. I believe a tab of Zeus has 20mg, which is most anyone should consider touching IMHO.

yeah I've heard the same, I was already worried about taking it with all the conflicting arguments and the study's, I quarter the tabs for the first 3 days, so that's like 5mg, and Now I'm doing a half tab now which is 10mg of GW, might keep it there, but damn I really like to take a whole tab to get that 10mgs of LGD..that's why I just had to throw rad 140 at 15mgs, ( I like rad, it done me good last time) So far I can really tell a difference in my stamina in my workout! The Msten will be the cherry on top. one thing is for sure, I will alway buy single compounds and not goofy concoctions again.