Prepping for first cycle, Helladrol

[SuperPro]

I'm planning on trying out my first PH cycle in about a month and a half and I'm going to start ordering what I need for it. I have the basic stuff I think I want to use planned out but I'm no expert on this stuff so I'd like to see opinions on my plans. Nothing on hand right now so everything can change, want to do 6 week cycle. I'm looking to gain 6-8lbs lean mass, but of course the more the merrier lol. Here is what I was thinking:



Helladrol - 50/50/75/75/100/100 (Thinking on maybe starting at 75 on first two weeks)

Taurine - Going to take for anti-pumps, I already get lower back pumps without using a PH so this could be useful now, not sure what dosage to take though.

N2 Guard - Taking as cycle support was planning to start a week before the hella.

Sustain Alpha - For PCT. I thought this would be good over Forma because of the trans resveratrol, which i heard is more of an estrogen regulator than blocker. I wonder however if this is strong enough to be my only AI and if it will be effective to use if I get any negative effects on cycle.

NMDA - For PCT. I have regular bulk DAA powder on hand but thought this would be better, not 100% on this but I've heard it's much stronger than regular DAA.

Torem - SERM for PCT. Not sure how to dose this but I heard you can take it orally and I read a lot of posts saying SERMs are extremely important.



Also I will probably be taking Animal Paks and fish oil, and of course lots of protein along with this, all of which I already take now. My main concerns are dosing of everything and I'd like to know if anyone thinks there's any of this stuff I'll need more than one bottle of. Thanks.

 

[mondata]

I'm planning on trying out my first PH cycle in about a month and a half and I'm going to start ordering what I need for it. I have the basic stuff I think I want to use planned out but I'm no expert on this stuff so I'd like to see opinions on my plans. Nothing on hand right now so everything can change, want to do 6 week cycle. I'm looking to gain 6-8lbs lean mass, but of course the more the merrier lol. Here is what I was thinking:



Helladrol - 50/50/75/75/100/100 (Thinking on maybe starting at 75 on first two weeks)

Taurine - Going to take for anti-pumps, I already get lower back pumps without using a PH so this could be useful now, not sure what dosage to take though.

N2 Guard - Taking as cycle support was planning to start a week before the hella.

Sustain Alpha - For PCT. I thought this would be good over Forma because of the trans resveratrol, which i heard is more of an estrogen regulator than blocker. I wonder however if this is strong enough to be my only AI and if it will be effective to use if I get any negative effects on cycle.

NMDA - For PCT. I have regular bulk DAA powder on hand but thought this would be better, not 100% on this but I've heard it's much stronger than regular DAA.

Torem - SERM for PCT. Not sure how to dose this but I heard you can take it orally and I read a lot of posts saying SERMs are extremely important.



Also I will probably be taking Animal Paks and fish oil, and of course lots of protein along with this, all of which I already take now. My main concerns are dosing of everything and I'd like to know if anyone thinks there's any of this stuff I'll need more than one bottle of. Thanks.

I cannot answer all of these questions but other people will most certainly chime in. For dosing the Hella I would kick it up to 75 mg for week 2 if you do not have any issues with the 50. I am currently in the second week of my hella run and I have not had any sides to note but of course everyone is different. Taurine and N2Guard look fine. I do not know much about the Sustain Alpha so I cannot help you there. I chose to run erase as my A.I. For DAA I have read some mixed reviews of the NMDA so to be safe you might just consider running bulk DAA at 3g/day. However, the NMDA might work great for you so thats just a preference. Torem is a great choice for a SERM and should be dosed at 90/60/60/30. Good Luck!

 

[Airborne42]

I cannot answer all of these questions but other people will most certainly chime in. For dosing the Hella I would kick it up to 75 mg for week 2 if you do not have any issues with the 50. I am currently in the second week of my hella run and I have not had any sides to note but of course everyone is different. Taurine and N2Guard look fine. I do not know much about the Sustain Alpha so I cannot help you there. I chose to run erase as my A.I. For DAA I have read some mixed reviews of the NMDA so to be safe you might just consider running bulk DAA at 3g/day. However, the NMDA might work great for you so thats just a preference. Torem is a great choice for a SERM and should be dosed at 90/60/60/30. Good Luck!

Agreed... Sustain alpha is good to go. Get an AI... Like mondata said... Erase. Torem looks good. I would stick to daa at 3g a day. Other than that looks solid

 

[Drizzie88]

How about some stats though... age/height/weight/how long you have been lifting...

Are you 16 years old? If so, don't run a cycle. Other than that, I hope you see good gains man. I'm planning a hella cycle after I run this natty cycle and then cut with anabeta/alphaT2...

Have you ran a natty test stack before?

 

[SuperPro]

I was thinking about running erase or erase pro so I may do that. Should I run them on cycle and PCT or just during PCT? I think bumping up the hella to 75 on week two sounds good. Running bulk DAA may be better for me anyway since I already have some. Thanks for the info.

How about some stats though... age/height/weight/how long you have been lifting...

Are you 16 years old? If so, don't run a cycle. Other than that, I hope you see good gains man. I'm planning a hella cycle after I run this natty cycle and then cut with anabeta/alphaT2...

Have you ran a natty test stack before?

I'm 24, 5'7", 165lbs and have been lifting for a year seriously, though there were some shorter stints where I lifted for a few months here and there before that. I have a really high metabolism and have a lot of trouble gaining mass. I went from 140 to 165 over the last year, but for the last 6 months or so I've been 160-170. Every time I hit 170 or close(it's usually about 168) I have a lot of trouble gaining any more weight, at my best time for my diet I was intaking about 3500-4000 calories a day with ~220g of protein usually.

I ran a light natty cycle over the past month, just DAA and Scifit ES3(which I wouldn't recommend, don't think it does crap hadn't done much research before I bought). I had some good increases on my squat and deadlift and have now maxed at 315 on both. My bench is what I would like to increase most, I work my chest really hard, usually 25-30 sets of chest with a lot of emphasis on upper chest(I can decline a lot more than I can flat or incline) but I still haven't had a good increase in my bench which sits at a lowly 185. I've tried doing several things with that like forced reps with up to 245, lower weight and more reps, negatives, drop sets, pause sets for instance but I have a lot of trouble with chest.

 

[Drizzie88]

Shoulda ran Erase...Check out my log.. It's good ****. Ask my workout partner how much I've increased over him...

 

[mondata]

I was thinking about running erase or erase pro so I may do that. Should I run them on cycle and PCT or just during PCT? I think bumping up the hella to 75 on week two sounds good. Running bulk DAA may be better for me anyway since I already have some. Thanks for the info.



I'm 24, 5'7", 165lbs and have been lifting for a year seriously, though there were some shorter stints where I lifted for a few months here and there before that. I have a really high metabolism and have a lot of trouble gaining mass. I went from 140 to 165 over the last year, but for the last 6 months or so I've been 160-170. Every time I hit 170 or close(it's usually about 168) I have a lot of trouble gaining any more weight, at my best time for my diet I was intaking about 3500-4000 calories a day with ~220g of protein usually.

I ran a light natty cycle over the past month, just DAA and Scifit ES3(which I wouldn't recommend, don't think it does crap hadn't done much research before I bought). I had some good increases on my squat and deadlift and have now maxed at 315 on both. My bench is what I would like to increase most, I work my chest really hard, usually 25-30 sets of chest with a lot of emphasis on upper chest(I can decline a lot more than I can flat or incline) but I still haven't had a good increase in my bench which sits at a lowly 185. I've tried doing several things with that like forced reps with up to 245, lower weight and more reps, negatives, drop sets, pause sets for instance but I have a lot of trouble with chest.

Super,

Here are some options:

Run forma-stanzol while on your cycle (6 weeks) for estro control and a bump in IGF-1 levels - I do 8 pumps/day split into 2 doses
*You could run the sustain-alpha during the cycle as well but I believe it works best for PCT whereas many people have good results running the forma both during and after
Run erase during you PCT for your A.I. - I would run it at 1/2/3/3/3/1
*You can find erase for $20 a bottle - You would need 2 bottle to run it at the above dosage
*You could run erase pro but you cannot taper it.
Run you DAA at 3g/day for 4 weeks then continue to run your erase two weeks after (see above)
I would also include a cortisol control product like lean extreme, etc.

They way I did it is I ordered everything for my cycle one month then ordered all my PCT stuff the next month so it wasn't so much to buy in a single month. It definitely gets costly.

 

[SuperPro]

I think I'll run erase the whole time then... When you say like 1/2/3/3/3/1, do you mean 1 as one serving or one pill? I think on cycle I could stick to one a day unless I get sides then bump up for pct.

 

[Airborne42]

1 pill. Don't use on cycle. Just pct

 

[SuperPro]

1 pill. Don't use on cycle. Just pct

Thanks. I know it might sound stupid but why not on cycle at all? I've heard that hella is aromatizing(mildly I think), so if I were to experience any sides with it on cycle shouldn't I take something?

Also doing some product research and I was thinking maybe Arimidex instead of erase as an AI. I saw that I could get it for about the same price as erase, thoughts?

 

[Airborne42]

Arimidex is good too. If on cycle that happens take a low dose of nolva. Erase is just cortisol control and prevents rebound

 

[SuperPro]

Alright that makes sense, thanks a lot.

 

[Airborne42]

For sure bro

 

[mondata]

1 pill. Don't use on cycle. Just pct

Exactly. Only use the erase for PCT. I am just running it for the 4 weeks of PCT + 2 additional weeks since I am using the DAA. This was a recommendation made by a couple of more experienced members.

 

[mondata]

Thanks. I know it might sound stupid but why not on cycle at all? I've heard that hella is aromatizing(mildly I think), so if I were to experience any sides with it on cycle shouldn't I take something?

Also doing some product research and I was thinking maybe Arimidex instead of erase as an AI. I saw that I could get it for about the same price as erase, thoughts?

Two things:

1) Change the erase to 1/2/3/3/2/1 - I made a typo earlier - you want to taper up then down. You may experience some dry joints at 3 pills/day so just something to watch.

2) For on-cycle estrogen and progesterone forma-stanzol will help (and its the same price as the sustain alpha you were going to buy). This is why I said try the forma ON-CYCLE and use the Erase for PCT. Forma (or formestane) is not a super strong compound but its perfect for on-cycle support and it has some other benefits as well. Google to read more on it.

 

[Airborne42]

Exactly. Only use the erase for PCT. I am just running it for the 4 weeks of PCT + 2 additional weeks since I am using the DAA. This was a recommendation made by a couple of more experienced members.

You heard correctly the extra 2 weeks are to protect you from rebound estro from your SERM

 

[Airborne42]

Mondata did his homework or we have talked before lol

 

[SuperPro]

I think I'm just going to take the sustain out and use forma on cycle, then erase or arimidex for pct(not sure which yet).

I think my only question left is spacing everything. What times of day should I take the hella and erase?

 

[mondata]

I think I'm just going to take the sustain out and use forma on cycle, then erase or arimidex for pct(not sure which yet).

I think my only question left is spacing everything. What times of day should I take the hella and erase?

If you have not purchased the sustain I highly recommend using the forma on cycle. Some people start it week 2 or 3 and run it into the first week of PCT then start with the erase. Again, I am running mine the entire length of the cycle and then into the first week of PCT as I add in the erase. I do not know anything about Arimidex but I know erase works well and its cheap.I am not sure what times work best for the erase but I would just space out your dosing. I hate to be the only one to respond but I did 6 weeks of solid research before I tried hella so I know the basics on how to run an effective cycle.

As far as timing you just want to space the hella and your support supps 4 hours apart. I do 50 mg of hella at 7:00 a.m then support supps at 12:00 p.m. then 25 mg hella at 5:00 p.m. then support supps again before bed (usually 11ish).

 

[Drizzie88]

If you have not purchased the sustain I highly recommend using the forma on cycle. Some people start it week 2 or 3 and run it into the first week of PCT then start with the erase. Again, I am running mine the entire length of the cycle and then into the first week of PCT as I add in the erase. I do not know anything about Arimidex but I know erase works well and its cheap.I am not sure what times work best for the erase but I would just space out your dosing. I hate to be the only one to respond but I did 6 weeks of solid research before I tried hella so I know the basics on how to run an effective cycle.

As far as timing you just want to space the hella and your support supps 4 hours apart. I do 50 mg of hella at 7:00 a.m then support supps at 12:00 p.m. then 25 mg hella at 5:00 p.m. then support supps again before bed (usually 11ish).

Is this common to spread out your Hella Dosing? I'm planning on running a Hella/katanadrol2.0 cycle eventually...once I think I've plautue and think I need it... Probaly after this natty test cycle and an Anabeta/alphaT2 recomp...

While taking two PHs do you spread them out the same way?

 

[SuperPro]

Sounds pretty solid probably going to run it just like that and then just up the second Hella to 50 in the last couple weeks.

 

[SuperPro]

Been looking at the site I have for torem, its only a 60mL bottle... I thought that's only like one dose? Or is it like 60 to 90 some other measurement for a dose?

 

[lumipz]

Is this common to spread out your Hella Dosing? I'm planning on running a Hella/katanadrol2.0 cycle eventually...once I think I've plautue and think I need it... Probaly after this natty test cycle and an Anabeta/alphaT2 recomp...

While taking two PHs do you spread them out the same way?

From what i've read it depends on the PH half life & your cycle (liver) support. According to the broscience.., the support could reduce the effects of the PH. Some logs have Hella in the AM and in the PM with the support somewhere inbetween (4 hours apart?). I would imagine the spreading of the two different PH depends on which ones also. Kat2.0 i've seen people spread twice/day, every few hours or around workouts.

 

[jtracy33]

Been looking at the site I have for torem, its only a 60mL bottle... I thought that's only like one dose? Or is it like 60 to 90 some other measurement for a dose?

What is the mg per ml? I'm going to guess it's 60mg/ml. So a 60ml bottle is 60 1 ml doses of 60mg.

If you ran the standard 90/60/60/30 it would be 1.5ml/1ml/1ml/.5ml per day for the respective weeks of pct

 

[mondata]

Is this common to spread out your Hella Dosing? I'm planning on running a Hella/katanadrol2.0 cycle eventually...once I think I've plautue and think I need it... Probaly after this natty test cycle and an Anabeta/alphaT2 recomp...

While taking two PHs do you spread them out the same way?

The main thing you want to do is space your ph dosing out from your support supps dosing. I am really unsure what would be best when combining 2 ph's but I assume you could take both together in the morning then both again in the afternoon/night. Make sure and check with someone who has ran that combo on the best timing. I am not sure where Manbeast is both he is taking both and will know the answer to that.

 

[mondata]

What is the mg per ml? I'm going to guess it's 60mg/ml. So a 60ml bottle is 60 1 ml doses of 60mg.

If you ran the standard 90/60/60/30 it would be 1.5ml/1ml/1ml/.5ml per day for the respective weeks of pct

Exactly

 

[SuperPro]

Oh okay I get the torem dosing now thanks a lot some of this stuff is so confusing at first lol

 

[lumipz]

On the same/side note of prepping for HDrol can someone give their input on this setup/combo? HDrol/Kat2.0--

How do the dosings look?
Particularily the 'Gap' after cycle, PCT.
And if anything else seems off.

Trying to get some feedback on this plan.

 

[mondata]

On the same/side note of prepping for HDrol can someone give their input on this setup/combo? HDrol/Kat2.0--
View attachment 54863

How do the dosings look?
Particularily the 'Gap' after cycle, PCT.
And if anything else seems off.

Trying to get some feedback on this plan.

1) Why the gap after the cycle? I would start PCT immediately after since the half life is so short on those compounds. It not like the real stuff where it can stay around for days.

2) I am interested to see how people dose the Erase Pro during PCT. I have never tried it but I know it is strong stuff. I think I would prefer the original so that I could taper. I might suggest getting a bottle of the original and running at 25/75/75/75/50/25 or something similar. I would run erase for 2 weeks past your DAA to avoid any estro rebound. So run erase/erase pro for a total of 6 weeks with weeks 1, 5, and 6 coming from erase and weeks 2-4 coming from erase pro. This way you could taper it. Just my thoughts

 

[Drizzie88]

1) Why the gap after the cycle? I would start PCT immediately after since the half life is so short on those compounds. It not like the real stuff where it can stay around for days.

2) I am interested to see how people dose the Erase Pro during PCT. I have never tried it but I know it is strong stuff. I think I would prefer the original so that I could taper. I might suggest getting a bottle of the original and running at 25/75/75/75/50/25 or something similar. I would run erase for 2 weeks past your DAA to avoid any estro rebound. So run erase/erase pro for a total of 6 weeks with weeks 1, 5, and 6 coming from erase and weeks 2-4 coming from erase pro. This way you could taper it. Just my thoughts

Not sure he actually meant a gap...I think he is just not sure on the doses he needs immediately post cycle...

 

[SuperPro]

Just been mulling over how much of everything I need and I saw I'll probably need two bottles of N2 Guard I think, which is pretty expensive. Anyone know a cheaper alternative for cycle support? I've noticed that Animal Paks have much of the stuff in them that some cycle support has as well, and did see a thread one time where a guy said he was taking two Animal Paks a day for cycle support, don't know if that's a good idea or not.

 

[mondata]

Just been mulling over how much of everything I need and I saw I'll probably need two bottles of N2 Guard I think, which is pretty expensive. Anyone know a cheaper alternative for cycle support? I've noticed that Animal Paks have much of the stuff in them that some cycle support has as well, and did see a thread one time where a guy said he was taking two Animal Paks a day for cycle support, don't know if that's a good idea or not.

You could run 2 bottles of A.I. Life Support. I got 2 bottles for $60
You could also run 2 bottles of Purus Labs Organ Shield and then add Hawthorne Berry for blood pressure

I purchased a bottle of each and run Life Support in the AM and Organ Shield in the PM. Total cost for me was $50

 

[SuperPro]

You could run 2 bottles of A.I. Life Support. I got 2 bottles for $60
You could also run 2 bottles of Purus Labs Organ Shield and then add Hawthorne Berry for blood pressure

I purchased a bottle of each and run Life Support in the AM and Organ Shield in the PM. Total cost for me was $50

.

Those ideas sound great. I think I might be able to swing the two bottles of Organ Shield with Hawthorne Berry for less than 50 even.

 

[SuperPro]

I've been reading a lot more and have heard some talk about a conversion chart for toremifene/toremifene citrate. The torem I'll be ordering is citrate, would the dosing of that be same as was discussed earlier in this thread?