Please critique my upcoming westside routine

[ktw]

I want all opinions on this, as it is the first Westside template I have designed myself. I was on WSB for skinny bastards for 12 weeks and would like to change.

Dynamic bench day
Bench
week 1- 50% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 60%
week 2- 55% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 65%
week 3- 60% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 70%
No bands, cycle percentages every 3 weeks

Tri/lockout excercise:
Rack lockout
4 sets of 4 to 8 reps, progressively loading with each set

Shoulder exercise:
Incline Dumbell press (considered a shoulder exercise by Jim Wendler. Thinking of switching this out for the push press or Bradford press)
4 sets 6 to 8 reps

lats/upper back:
chest supported rows
4 to 5 sets of 10 to 15
On the standard template article by Wendler, he reccomends doing low intensity high volume for all back work, but I've always read the benefits of doing heavy low volume work

Max Squat/DL
box squat

hamstring excercise:
Romanian deadlifts 4 sets of 8 to 15

lower back: (hamstring exercise should cover lower back well enough)

Abs
Weighted curls on stability ball
work up to 3 sets of 5 reps

Max Bench day
1 board press

Triceps:
pushdowns
4 sets of 12 to 15

Shoulders:
Rear Delt flys
4 sets of 12 to 15

lats:
Pullups
4 sets of 12 to 15

Dynamic Squat day
Box squat
week 1- 60% for 12 sets 2 reps (adding 10% to the standard amount because I lift raw)
week 2- 65% for 10 sets 2 reps
week 3- 60% for 8 sets 2 reps
Cycle percentages every 3 weeks, no bands or chains at this point

Good mornings
4 sets of 2 to 6 reps

Quads
Leg press
4 sets of 10 to 15

Abs
Hanging pikes

Any reccomended changes that I should make? All accessory movements will be cycled out at the 4 week mark, maxes at two weak mark and will be based on weak points. I got the rep ranges by using Tate's article on conjugated periodization from t nation. I plan on bumping up the number of sets by 1 after the first 4 weeks. I'm leaning towards higher volume accesory work due to the fact that right now accumulating extra mass would greatly aide my lifts. After the 2nd period of 4 weeks is over, another set will get added to the high volume low intensity days. The high intensity low volume ranges will stay the same

 

[ktw]

bump. anyone please?

 

[guyfromkop2]

sorry man, i dont train westside

 

[ktw]

what do you train? a 5x5 style program?

 

[guyfromkop2]

a very basic powerlifting routine that works, i'm all about making things simple. but here is my routine basically laid out

monday - legs,posterior,abs
wed-bottom end bench work, light shoulders, grip work
friday - deadlift variation, posterior, abs, back, and biceps if i feel like it which half the time i dont do them
saturday-top end bench work w/ boards

my rep ranges stay low and they get changed for my big 3 lifts and rows depending if i'm getting stronger or not, and all my posterior, ab, and shoulders stay high reps. check out my journal. it's very simple yet very effective. i get trained by a guy who squats low 9's, benches mid 6's, and pulls high7's low 8's. beeze and poobah know him from other boards. he's old and knows his stuf

 

[Shopclown]

KTW: How long were you on WSB for skinny bastards? I started about a month ago, so far I have been very happy with the results, first time training with low rep stuff. As far as your WSB routine I don't know enough to comment on it. I'm still doing my research . But I'm pretty sure you could drop the leg press . It looks like they really don't train quads directly.

 

[ktw]

Quad training is reccomended once a week, high volume low intensity in a standard 4 day a week Westside program. I was on WSB for skinny bastards for 12 weeks. I went from 188 to 204 on the program with dramatic strength increases. I want to add dynamic days because I feel that they would help improve my lifts even more as I have speed problems on bench.

 

[ivydude]

I want all opinions on this, as it is the first Westside template I have designed myself. I was on WSB for skinny bastards for 12 weeks and would like to change.

Dynamic bench day
Bench
week 1- 50% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 60%
week 2- 55% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 65%
week 3- 60% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 70%
No bands, cycle percentages every 3 weeks

Tri/lockout excercise:
Rack lockout
4 sets of 4 to 8 reps, progressively loading with each set

Shoulder exercise:
Incline Dumbell press (considered a shoulder exercise by Jim Wendler. Thinking of switching this out for the push press or Bradford press)
4 sets 6 to 8 reps

lats/upper back:
chest supported rows
4 to 5 sets of 10 to 15
On the standard template article by Wendler, he reccomends doing low intensity high volume for all back work, but I've always read the benefits of doing heavy low volume work

Max Squat/DL
box squat

hamstring excercise:
Romanian deadlifts 4 sets of 8 to 15

lower back: (hamstring exercise should cover lower back well enough)

Abs
Weighted curls on stability ball
work up to 3 sets of 5 reps

Max Bench day
1 board press

Triceps:
pushdowns
4 sets of 12 to 15

Shoulders:
Rear Delt flys
4 sets of 12 to 15

lats:
Pullups
4 sets of 12 to 15

Dynamic Squat day
Box squat
week 1- 60% for 12 sets 2 reps (adding 10% to the standard amount because I lift raw)
week 2- 65% for 10 sets 2 reps
week 3- 60% for 8 sets 2 reps
Cycle percentages every 3 weeks, no bands or chains at this point

Good mornings
4 sets of 2 to 6 reps

Quads
Leg press
4 sets of 10 to 15

Abs
Hanging pikes

Some suggestions:

1. I wouldn't start the week with dynamic bench day. Always start with a ME day-usually LB, then ME bench, then DE lower, DE bench...but starting with ME bench is fine too.

2. Get rid of the pullups and do a different horizontal row, i.e. BB rows, Cable rows, 1 arm Db rows, etc. Any of these will help your bench more than pullups will.

3. On DE bench use 2 grips, 4 sets CG and 4 sets medium. Don't do those other sets after the 8X3.

4. You need more lower body assistance work and don't bother with the leg press. Throw in some legged squats, BB lunges, pause squats. You definitely need more hamstring work in the program--try SLDLS, GHRS, SLDLs from a deficit, etc.

5. Cheap plug here...but check out this handy page for more exercises and routine tips. http://anabolicminds.com/forum/powerlifting-strongman/40695-westside-training-articles-database.html

6. Don't do the tricep pushdowns...try CG bench, weighted dips, some variation of skulls, etc.

Best of luck.

 

[ktw]

Well the heavy good mornings should cover the posterior chain pretty well. My gym doesn't have a GHR machine or anything so that's not an option. I have romanian (stiff legged) deadlifts on one of my days. yah, i switched the program days around so dynamic is not at the start of the week. I could replace the leg press with single legged squats or something. One tri day is supposed to be low intensity, high volume, but I could do that with skull crushers or dumbell extensions, or even tate presses. The sets of 2 by 5 are from Jim Wendlers basic template article on elitefts, but I'm going to delete them I think or add them later. I have chest supported rows one day, do you think 2 days of rows would be more beneficial?

 

[ivydude]

I have chest supported rows one day, do you think 2 days of rows would be more beneficial?

Yep. 2 days of horizontal rows.

 

[guyfromkop2]

first of all great post ivydude, i'd give you reps if i knew how to.

and ktw, do pause squats instead of 1 legged squats, these will help A LOT with your squats, builds great leg strength and explosive power out of the hole

 

[ktw]

pause squats as in with a barbell? so basically an iso hold at the bottom position for lets say 5 seconds? Thanks for the help ivydude, I will definately add in some sort of horizontal rows for another day. I was thinking either Face Pulls or 1 arm dumbell rows. I've been doing bent over barbell variations for a long long time now and I wanted to try something different for the first 4 weeks at least.

 

[glenihan]

ivydude and I do GHR's on the seated calf raise machine .. throw a few 45's on the back and face away from it .. it works well enough if the seat is big enough

 

[ivydude]

pause squats as in with a barbell? so basically an iso hold at the bottom position for lets say 5 seconds? Thanks for the help ivydude, I will definately add in some sort of horizontal rows for another day. I was thinking either Face Pulls or 1 arm dumbell rows. I've been doing bent over barbell variations for a long long time now and I wanted to try something different for the first 4 weeks at least.

We do a 3 second pause, 5 reps, 3 sets. It helps to have someone count the pause.

 

[ivydude]

first of all great post ivydude, i'd give you reps if i knew how to.

It's the karma button on the left bro.

 

[CDB]

It's the karma button on the left bro.

It wouldn't let me give you reps, apparently I got to spread them around. This thread and your sticky especially were great additions to the board though. I'm reading through the PDFs over at the WSB site, thinking of trying this routine sometime in the near future.

 

[ktw]

wait, so the little seated calf raise machine that you sit down on that has the pad that goes on top of your knees that you put plates on? How is that tall enough off the ground. **** I'll try it if it works, just doesn't seem like the range of motion is there

 

[guyfromkop2]

We do a 3 second pause, 5 reps, 3 sets. It helps to have someone count the pause.

that's exactly what a guy who squats low 9's told me to do

 

[ktw]

What day do you reccomend I try the pause squats on and do you reccomend it as an accessory movement or a main lift? Again, thank you for the help.

 

[ivydude]

wait, so the little seated calf raise machine that you sit down on that has the pad that goes on top of your knees that you put plates on? How is that tall enough off the ground. **** I'll try it if it works, just doesn't seem like the range of motion is there

You kneel on the pad and lock your heels behind the bar that your knees usually go under. Fall forward keeping the arch in your lower back tight at all times. You'll want to have a partner spot you because in all likelihood (99% of people) you won't be able to make it to parallel and back up without breaking form the first time. Have your spot "catch" you on the way down and give you a little push on the way up. If you don't have a spot, you can place a large exercise ball in front of where you "fall" and use that for a little spring action, but I would use the spot.

The most important thing to keep in mind so that you're not breaking form is to really "fall" forward. Without a spot, yea that's a bit scary even if you're only two feet off the ground.

 

[ivydude]

What day do you reccomend I try the pause squats on and do you reccomend it as an accessory movement or a main lift? Again, thank you for the help.

Do it as a supplemental lift on DE squat days, immediately after DE squats.

 

[ivydude]

It wouldn't let me give you reps, apparently I got to spread them around. This thread and your sticky especially were great additions to the board though. I'm reading through the PDFs over at the WSB site, thinking of trying this routine sometime in the near future.

Haha. Thank you, I appreciate it. I'm still trying to make that spreadsheet work with my program. Maybe my log will help you out with planning out your WSB program.

 

[CDB]

Haha. Thank you, I appreciate it. I'm still trying to make that spreadsheet work with my program. Maybe my log will help you out with planning out your WSB program.

PM or post specifics for me, if you want it weekly, how many weeks, etc. Takes me about three minutes to set up the sheet from one of my templates.

 

[ktw]

Hey CDB, if I post my final program, can you make a spreadsheet for me? It would be much appreciated and you will receive some reps for it.

 

[ktw]

Alright here is a revised program

Max Bench day
1 board press

Triceps:
Tate presses
5 sets of 10

Shoulders:
Rear Delt flys
2 sets of 10

Seated Dumbell cleans
4 sets of 8

lats:
1 arm dumbell row


Dynamic Squat day
Box squat
week 1- 60% for 12 sets 2 reps (adding 10% to the standard amount because I lift raw)
week 2- 65% for 10 sets 2 reps
week 3- 60% for 8 sets 2 reps
Cycle percentages every 3 weeks, no bands or chains at this point

Good mornings
5 sets of 8 reps

GHR on calf raise machine
3 sets of 6 reps

Lower back
45 degree hyperextensions
3 sets of 8

Abs
Hanging pikes

Dynamic bench day
Bench
week 1- 50% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 60%
week 2- 55% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 65%
week 3- 60% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 70%
No bands, cycle percentages every 3 weeks

Tri/lockout excercise:
Rack lockout
4 sets of 4 to 8 reps, progressively loading with each set

Shoulder exercise:
Incline Dumbell press (considered a shoulder exercise by Jim Wendler. Thinking of switching this out for the push press or Bradford press)
4 sets 8 reps

lats/upper back:
chest supported rows
5 sets of 6 to 8
Decided I want to do one day of light rows and 1 day of heavy, so I'm putting the heavy day on here

Max Squat/DL
box squat

hamstring excercise:
Romanian deadlifts 4 sets of 8 to 15

GHR on calf raise machine
5 sets of 5

lower back: (hamstring exercise should cover lower back well enough)

Abs
Weighted curls on stability ball
work up to 3 sets of 5 reps

I'm also going to figure out a day to do heavy shrugs each weak at least once. Also, accesory volume is going to fluctuate each 4 week period in the pattern high/medium/very high/low (borrowed that from ivydude). I plan on doing this by adding a set or adding reps to the already high set numbers. Any final comments?

 

[CDB]

Alright here is a revised program

Max Bench day
1 board press

Triceps:
Tate presses
5 sets of 10

Shoulders:
Rear Delt flys
2 sets of 10

Seated Dumbell cleans
4 sets of 8

lats:
1 arm dumbell row


Dynamic Squat day
Box squat
week 1- 60% for 12 sets 2 reps (adding 10% to the standard amount because I lift raw)
week 2- 65% for 10 sets 2 reps
week 3- 60% for 8 sets 2 reps
Cycle percentages every 3 weeks, no bands or chains at this point

Good mornings
5 sets of 8 reps

GHR on calf raise machine
3 sets of 6 reps

Lower back
45 degree hyperextensions
3 sets of 8

Abs
Hanging pikes

Dynamic bench day
Bench
week 1- 50% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 60%
week 2- 55% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 65%
week 3- 60% for 8x3 followed by 2 sets of 5 reps with 70%
No bands, cycle percentages every 3 weeks

Tri/lockout excercise:
Rack lockout
4 sets of 4 to 8 reps, progressively loading with each set

Shoulder exercise:
Incline Dumbell press (considered a shoulder exercise by Jim Wendler. Thinking of switching this out for the push press or Bradford press)
4 sets 8 reps

lats/upper back:
chest supported rows
5 sets of 6 to 8
Decided I want to do one day of light rows and 1 day of heavy, so I'm putting the heavy day on here

Max Squat/DL
box squat

hamstring excercise:
Romanian deadlifts 4 sets of 8 to 15

GHR on calf raise machine
5 sets of 5

lower back: (hamstring exercise should cover lower back well enough)

Abs
Weighted curls on stability ball
work up to 3 sets of 5 reps

I'm also going to figure out a day to do heavy shrugs each weak at least once. Also, accesory volume is going to fluctuate each 4 week period in the pattern high/medium/very high/low (borrowed that from ivydude). I plan on doing this by adding a set or adding reps to the already high set numbers. Any final comments?

I'll see what I can do with this. West side can be a ***** to get int he sheet but I should have something by tomorrow. Right now I'm off to the ferret shop.

 

[CDB]

Check this sheet out, should work. The graphs look odd because of the lack of data. Once stats are entered they should autoupdate and scale appropriately. West side routines vary so much because of the conjugation method that it's hard coming up with a decent way to track progress. The core lifts at the bottom in blue will fee to the last graph to document any advances. Test as you will, just enter it in there and the weight should come through to the line graph.

 

[ktw]

Thanks man, I really appreciate the spreadsheet.