My World Is Crashing Around Me

[bigpetefox]

Goodbye James...

 

[Cuffs]

It was not my intention for this thread to turn into a shitfest. I know people have their own opinions on things, not that I may agree with them. Please dudes, I don't want this thread to be closed. It is one of the things that is helping me get through this.

 

[Cuffs]

Goodbye James...

Thanks BP. I didn't see that last post until after he was banned.

He must have been my last marriage counselor...LOL. At least I have my sense of humor still.

 

[bigpetefox]

Thanks BP. I didn't see that last post until after he was banned.

He must have been my last marriage counselor...LOL. At least I have my sense of humor still.

Making a point is one thing, being a dick about it won't fly here.. I've been in an emotional situation similar to yours, so reading his posts pissed me off royally..

 

[Matthew D]

Funny I was thinking that they were pissing me off and I came in way after the fact.. B5150, I liked you post.. you are a wise one my friend

Cuffs.. just hang in there.. there are a lot of compassioned guys here because at one time or another we have been in similar situations and we know that they have to be the hardest of hard to handle.. and if it helps, KEEP POSTING away.. Pete and I will keep the assholes off the thread...

 

[max silver]

Here's to wishing you well Cuffs. I too can understand how it feels like your very soul has been ripped out right now. Let it be known that assclowns like James are definitely in the vast minority, matter of fact I think he's a one of a kind, especially on this board. I wish you the best in the times to come, whether it's with repairing the damage done to your marriage, or hanging onto custody of your son, or any possible fallout that may be ahead of you.

 

[UHCougar05]

Cuffs my friend, you will be in my prayers. I pray that God help you through this trying time. All the best to you brother. I'll leave you with this:

One night I dreamed I was walking along the beach with the Lord. Many scenes from my life flashed across the sky.​

In each scene I noticed footprints in the sand. Sometimes there were two sets of footprints, other times there was one only.​

This bothered me because I noticed that during the low periods of my life, when I was suffering from anguish, sorrow or defeat, I could see only one set of footprints, so I said to the Lord,​

“You promised me Lord,​

that if I followed you, you would walk with me always. But I have noticed that during the most trying periods of my life there has only been one set of footprints in the sand. Why, when I needed you most, have you not been there for me?�

The Lord replied, “The years when you have seen only one set of footprints, my child, is when I carried you.â€? ​

​

You're never alone, remember that.

 

[Beelzebub]

damn bro, just got back on the comp and saw the thread. there ain't much in the words of wisdom i can offer but just to hang in there and keep a level head. if you need anything from me bro, you've got my email.

 

[BULK_CITY]

I hate to see a fellow brother in iron go through such hard times. I am only 21 yrs and have never been in love but really look forward to it... I sometimes day dream about meeting the "perfect" girl and I cannot even imagine how hard it would be to find her then have her pull this **** on me...

My only advice, since I do not know "love," would be to clear your head. You are thinking about 100000 things right now? what if this happened? what would i do? did she do this? why is that happening? etc etc

do some meditation or something and clear your mind so when she does come back you can talk things out. Do not call her repeatedly... no one likes desperation and no girls find it flattering (unless they have severe self esteem issues... who would want to be with someone like that anyway?)

My impression was that she is either having life problems (ie- is this really how i want to live the rest of my life? new job stress? life goals stress etc) or that she found someone else... she may or may not be cheating on you with him, it won't matter if she leaves you, either way she is gone, but think of it rather that she is not ready for marriage even if it took her 9 years to figure it out. Realise that if you really love her, you would want the best for her, regardless if it is with you (and you think this is true) or if it's with someone else.

Clear your head, think of all the things you want to say to her and let her know how much you love her and how much her actions have hurt you but that you are understanding, etc

good luck brother, keep us informed

 

[Neuromancer]

I think I speak on behalf of the majority of users here, if you need anything Cuffs don't hesitate to ask. Be strong and things usually work out for the better in the future.

But if you do need some comic relief, I always have the Wedding singer running through my head in times of relationship troubles.. "Love stinks!! Yeah...yeah.."

Hang in there my friend!

 

[Iron Warrior]

And don't get me wrong, finances and material possessions mean nothing to me. I would give it all up in a heart beat for her. I'm just glad I didn't do what she wanted me to do a while back. She wanted me to quit my job, and go back to school to get my teaching credential like I've always wanted. That would have been fucked. No job, school loan, no wife, no income. I'm glad that didn't happen.

A little off topic, but if you want to get a teaching credential at home, working at your own pace while you hold another job than check out National University, kinda pricey but a good option if you don't want to take classes at a campus http://www.nu.edu/

 

[joecski]

Cuffs, glad to see you are getting the advice and support you deserve. You are a great asset to this community! Not to sound like a broken record, but a theme I see in the thread is to sit back and relax. Whatever is going to happen is beyond most of your control. There is no action you can take at this point, you can only react, and the way you react could change the outcome. So, take a deep breath and decide what YOU want to happen, and what you will do if it doesn't go your way. I know it is almost impossbile to look at this objectively, but once you do the issue seems somewhat smaller.

And if you get really pissed off - you can always come here to rant instead of losing your temper there! :rant:

Good luck!

 

[Matthew D]

A little off topic, but if you want to get a teaching credential at home, working at your own pace while you hold another job than check out National University, kinda pricey but a good option if you don't want to take classes at a campus http://www.nu.edu/

IW, just be very careful about if those classes will count... I have a person I work with that will not be getting her pay raise due to the fact that they State Dept of Ed does not recognize her classes are legit... so check before you get to far into the program

 

[B5150]

B5150, I have to say man, that I have seen you give some of the best advice on this board by far - be it for working out or life in general.

I should have commented on this when I first read it.

These words really absorbed into me. They are words that every person should know, and learn from.

I really appreciate what you have posted B5150, and I hope to become a better person having read it.

We all have experiences to go through. Some are unbearable. We aften get caught up in the "what is happening to me" mentality it can seem as these experiences have no purpose. When we turn our perspective into the "what is happening with me" mentality we can capture and own and embrace a purpose in and from the situation.

From my experience in the past; people, friends, family and sometimes strangers told me my ex was going to take me to the cleaners. We agreed to a non lawyer divorce with no child support, not alimony, no nothing. It was a walk away. People told me she was playing me and I was going to get railed. Long story short...for the last 11-12 years I have freely deposited money into her account to support my children, we have raised two beautiful children together (joint custody...I had primary custody for several yaers at a time by her desire) 2200 miles apart and she is my closest friend and greatest supporter and advocate. I love her and she loves me. We demonstrate it but are not "in love".

Another experience was finally getting sober. It took me going to prison (putting the above greatly at risk) for 8 months. Yep...that was me, nothing in moderation. The very next most painful situation of my life. I wanted to run, I wanted to hide, but I knew I needed to come to terms with my "issues" once and for all for the rest of my life. For goodness sake I was 36 years old and still had childhood issues. So with some help from a councelor, and a support group while in prison I worked through my issues. The point is that in this case I needed to go through all of it "eyes, ears and heart wide open" and "feel" every bit of it...no matter how unbearable. I commited to stay "in that place of bearing all that my soul could bear" (bearing my soul and all my sould could bear) until it was time to "be delivered". Once I was delivered...I have never returned.

The moral to my point is that we all have experience but it is not what happens to us but what happens with us...

B5150, I liked you post.. you are a wise one my friend

...that makes us wise. I keep working on it daily butI find it wise to share what I have learned

God bless us

 

[Iron Warrior]

IW, just be very careful about if those classes will count... I have a person I work with that will not be getting her pay raise due to the fact that they State Dept of Ed does not recognize her classes are legit... so check before you get to far into the program

Oops, you're right. I know it's compliant in California, good catch Matt.

 

[ryansm]

I missed this thread.

Cuffs you and I are a lot alike, I have been through this myself, and now don't trust women. I hope that this doesn't happen to you, and I am thinking of you bro.

 

[B5150]

It is biblically accurate when one suggests that divorce is an option in the case of infidelity: Matt 19:3-9

Do keep in mind that the guy who said this also gave His live for me on the cross so my 'transgressions' could be 'forgiven' and I could be 'reconciled' with His Father. :welcome:

 

[wranglergirl]

I read this and I am sad.....really some good women are out there, ( raising hand)......But i also understand that every time we get hurt, we become somewhat jaded......Cuffs, your in my thoughts !!! I wish I could take away your hurt, pain, and make it better, just remember we are dealt only what we can deal......Seriously...I look at all my posts......starting at a young age, my sister was murdered......and from there to the most recent posts........( which are my medical issues)..........I can only say one day at a time, and I really do hope in the end things work out for you....(((HUGZ)))))))))

 

[Cuffs]

Well, last night we talked and I felt good about it. Even my wife said she felt good. Then I fucked up. I went to the gym, and told her to go out with her classmates and have a good night. While at the gym, I ran into the wife of the dude I had thought she had been having an affair with. This lady thought the same thing was going on. It turns out we were both wrong. I had said some things about her husband out of anger, and I don't even know the dude. So, I decided to talk to this lady, to introduce myself.

I told her I knew she was concerned about our spouses working relationship, and told her she had nothing to worry about. I told her that I would like to get to know her and her husband, so we could all feel more comfortable. I suggested some BBQ's, and whatevers. I told her the things I said about her husband, because I knew it got back to him. I told her I didn't mean it, that I was talking out of my ass. She told me things she said about my wife. We ended on a good note...so I thought.

It turns out this lady is psycho. She calls her husband and starts yelling at him for an unknown reason. He then calls my wife telling her I'm trying to destroy his marriage. My wife calls me, cursing me out and telling me that was the last straw and it's over. She wouldn't let me explain and hung up.

She called back a while later and I was able to explain what I told her, and what my intentions were. I told her that I would speak to all of them together so there was no misunderstanding. She then set it up for me to call her coworker to explain to him. So, I did. Tuurns out to be a cool dude, and thngs were smoothed out.

Spoke to my wife again (she requested me to call her) and we got it settled, and had another good conversation.

Then, she tells me she is still leaving me, but does not want a divorce. She tells me she needs time, and needs to find out what is going to make her happy. I supported her, and never questioned anything. She then brought up how I would feel after a month went past and we were not together. I told her I would wait for her. She then said 2 months, then 6 months. i told her if that length of time passes, then something needs to be decided. She said she needed to be able to come and go without having to report to someone. I said that was fine. I then told her what I didn't want was months down the line, she begin dating and become intitmate with someone. She said if that's what she wanted to do, then I had no say. I told her I understood, but we needed to file divorce papers then. She told me I could date if I wanted, but she is not at that point...yet.

Then, she brings up the house. She's worried about her dogs, and wants to use our new pool. I told her it is her house as well, and she is always welcome. I told her if I was home and she needed me to leave, I would arrange it. She then told me, no, she wanted me there if she comes over, and she wanted me to swim with her. :think: WTF??? I told her that would be too awkward, and what if I read things wrong and went to hug or kiss her and she rejected me. That would start my hurt all over again.

The bottom line is...she is very confused and doesn't know what she wants out of life right now. I am giving her the space she needs, but I can't sit back and just let her take advantage of me, or play with my emotions.

She calls me often, and sends me text messages. She ends each conversation with "I love you". I know she is feeling guilty as well, and guilty of the hurt she is causing me.

This whole thing is way too complicated, and I don't know what's going to come of it.

 

[Cuffs]

I came to realize one thing about myself last night. And that is I have not been happy with myself. This has changed me into a different type of person then I had always been. I used to be fun-loving and a little out going. Now, I'm self-concious and resereved. I'm glad I realized this because this is an area I can work to improve myself for me. And if it improves the relationship with my wife, then that's a bonus.

 

[Jeff]

I feel for you man, hang it there. It's none of my business, but I think she is playing you, it seems like she is testing you. I want a month, 2 months, then its 6 months. I want to leave but no divorse. I want to come over and swim in the pool, WTF!!! - **** that. Sounds like you should just take care of yourself and live your life for you.

 

[Cuffs]

Oh, I was finally able to force myself to eat a little something this afternoon. A piece of steak, some lettuce, some fries (yes fries),I even had a Cafe Mocha, non-fat no whipped cream. Let me tell you, I am feeling the food in my system. I'm feeling hot, and a rush like sensation. The blood is a rushin' through me. Going without food and caffeine for three days really affects you.

 

[Cuffs]

I feel for you man, hang it there. It's none of my business, but I think she is playing you, it seems like she is testing you. I want a month, 2 months, then its 6 months. I want to leave but no divorse. I want to come over and swim in the pool, WTF!!! - **** that. Sounds like you should just take care of yourself and live your life for you.

It is as if she's playing me. I'm not sure if she's testing to see how I react, or where my breaking point is. Is she wanting me to be the one to call it quits, or is she looking to see how far she can push it until I do, then call me on it as if I'm not willing to stick it out for the long haul?

 

[TheCrownedOne]

The bottom line is...she is very confused and doesn't know what she wants out of life right now. I am giving her the space she needs, but I can't sit back and just let her take advantage of me, or play with my emotions.

I'm glad you realize this. There is a fine line between being accommodating and letting someone walk all over you. You're in my prayers, and I know that God is going to take care of you through all of this and in the days ahead. Take comfort in knowing that you have nothing to worry about - He's in control. Be happy and take care of yourself.

 

[wranglergirl]

Oh, I was finally able to force myself to eat a little something this afternoon. A piece of steak, some lettuce, some fries (yes fries),I even had a Cafe Mocha, non-fat no whipped cream. Let me tell you, I am feeling the food in my system. I'm feeling hot, and a rush like sensation. The blood is a rushin' through me. Going without food and caffeine for three days really affects you.

I hear that when i was in the hospital last week i boycotted eating for 2 days......when i did get home and eat something.....food tasted very good

 

[Cuffs]

I did something earlier that I thought I would never do. I had to call my exwife because she is dropping off our son to me today for a two day visit while he is with her for Summer break. I'm going to fill my son on what's going on, because he will figure somethings up. So, I told my ex because it would get back to her. I was actually able to confide in her about my situation. I even told her that I love my wife more than I ever loved anyone. I also explained the love my ex and I had wasn't for not, and she chimed in and said she agreed and that we were just too young at the time.

My ex was very helpful, and offered to talk to me anytime. She even offered up her husband to speak to (which probably won't happen) but he is a cool dude.

 

[Cuffs]

I know I have said this in this thread and in PM's to others, but it gets lost in the pages of responses that this is accumulating.

I want the members here to know how much I appreciate the overwhelming responses, support, and advice I have been receiving. I am very glad this place exists for me to be, and serve as an outlet for my emotions. I have always cconsidered this board a very special place, and even though I have not actually met some of you, I consider those as friends. And you all know who I'm talking about.

I never expected this thread to receive so many responses.

Thank you all.

 

[Matthew D]

That is not a problem at all.. that is what family is for

 

[VanillaGorilla]

It's hard to form an opinion from getting one side of the story......... It really sounds like she is playing games and F'ing with your head. It's one thing to give her space it's another for her to walk all over you. My suggestion would be not to talk about it until she comes back, so you can talk face to face. You need to set some boundaries or draw a line in the sand of what you are comfortable with. From what your previous post said she wants to go out and do what she pleases ,possibly date, not have to answer to anyone with you sitting there wondering what the hell is going on. What that says to me is she was or is interested in another person or wants to see who else is out there for her. That is blatantly not fair and shows a hell of a lack of respect for you. That sure as hell not how you treat someone "you love but are not in love with" to use a jr. high term. My advise is to sit down and talk when she gets home and be firm. I would draw a line and ask her if she want to stay together or not. If she does you can give her some space but she sure as hell isn't going to be able to date and you would have to make some guide lines. From what she posted it doesn't sound like she wants to stay together but she is almost saying let me go out and look for someone else and if I can't find anyone I will come back to you. Also don't yell or get mad... For example if the subject of the cell phone comes up ask her how she would think and feel if you kept your phone on silent right and acted weird when the subject was brought up.

 

[Cuffs]

It's hard to form an opinion from getting one side of the story......... It really sounds like she is playing games and F'ing with your head. It's one thing to give her space it's another for her to walk all over you. My suggestion would be not to talk about it until she comes back, so you can talk face to face. You need to set some boundaries or draw a line in the sand of what you are comfortable with. From what your previous post said she wants to go out and do what she pleases ,possibly date, not have to answer to anyone with you sitting there wondering what the hell is going on. What that says to me is she was or is interested in another person or wants to see who else is out there for her. That is blatantly not fair and shows a hell of a lack of respect for you. That sure as hell not how you treat someone "you love but are not in love with" to use a jr. high term. My advise is to sit down and talk when she gets home and be firm. I would draw a line and ask her if she want to stay together or not. If she does you can give her some space but she sure as hell isn't going to be able to date and you would have to make some guide lines. From what she posted it doesn't sound like she wants to stay together but she is almost saying let me go out and look for someone else and if I can't find anyone I will come back to you. Also don't yell or get mad... For example if the subject of the cell phone comes up ask her how she would think and feel if you kept your phone on silent right and acted weird when the subject was brought up.

I think she does want to see who may be out there who can give her the happiness she is craving.

I'm beyond getting mad. It won't solve or better anything. I did tell her that if this does go to divorce, that I want to maintain a cordrial relationship.

 

[jenkins]

hey cuffs,
i have been on this forum along time but i got banned and i never registered again until now(although is still read it everyday). however i always appreciated the wisdom you shared and when you spoke i always listened. so i just wanted to see if i could help.

i don't know if you realized this but you are being psychologically abused. From the sound of it she loves to get you bent out of shape and then when you respond she calls you a psycho or some other insult. I had a girl do this to me before and she almost convinced me that I was the one that was psycho. It sounds like your wife is 1) Craving attention from you or 2)cheating or looking elsewhere. I doubt she is cheating and you need to get that nonsense out of your head and remain calm until you really really have a reason to believe this. There could be a good reason why she is acting like this. Do you honestly think that you make her feel secure in this relationship because she sounds very insecure with it. It sounds like she is resentful towards you. I honestly think you should take a good hard look into your relationship with her. And no matter what you do, do not speak out of desperation and do not let her know that her bullshit is manipulating you. Basically you need to give her some tough love but it is of the utmost importance to remain calm and not lose your temper because she is eating it up when she gets to you. Be strong, that is what a woman wants.

i hope i have helped a little

 

[Cuffs]

Let me through this question out and see how you would all feel about it.

What if you really loved your wife, and you knew something was not right and needed fixed. The two of you separate for some time to reflect on yourselves. During the separation, your wife begins dating different people, basically playing the field, trying to find if the marriage made her happy, or the seeing new people did. After seeing either a few people, or seeing one particular one, she then realizes she wants to remain married and wants to come back.

Here's a couple of senarios to add on:

A) She was never intimate with the others she dated. It was only cordial, maybe some kissing.

B) She was intimate with one person for a few weeks, then decided she was making a mistake.

C) It is never discussed how far the relationships went.

I know C would be the best, but would always be in the back of my mind. If/when an argument would come out, that topic may as well. As would 'B'.

Let me know how you all feel about this. I'm trying to see if I've got my head thinking in the right direction.

 

[jenkins]

cuffs,

if you let her convince you it is ok to date while you are married i am gonna e-slap you man. none of those are good options. Marriage is about the ups and downs and the being miserable together(half joking half serious here) lol. you need to put your wife in line and tell her that this is a marriage and you wll be together and with no one else, or not together at all. That is what a marriage is!!!

 

[Jeff]

cuffs,

if you let her convince you it is ok to date while you are married i am gonna e-slap you man. none of those are good options. Marriage is about the ups and downs and the being miserable together(half joking half serious here) lol. you need to put your wife in line and tell her that this is a marriage and you wll be together and with no one else, or not together at all. That is what a marriage is!!!

:goodpost: What he said

 

[DR X]

You and your wife should both read the book "Love is a decission" by Gary Smalley

It will give you a point of reference to discuss your situation together and helps you see the blind spots in your relationship.

 

[Rhyalus]

Be Careful

Cuffs,

I don't know you, but having read all of these posts, I feel compelled to throw my opinion in.

You must ignore the people in here that tell you what she is doing or feeling...they don't know her at all.

Maybe she is just plain confused, ever think of that?

Also, if I were you, I would ask her to take a long weekend away and alone with me, so that we could talk and plan.

Good luck,
R

 

[EEmain]

First off Thanks BP for breaking out the whupping stick...:box:

I don`t remember when, I spent the first 6 years of my marriage in a drunken stupor, but at some point I realized that the "In Love feeling" was gone..

Then the drinking/drugging stopped, 6 months into sobriety I swore my marriage was over.. even said this in a meeting.. planned to leave but didn`t.. at some point I realized it wasn`t that I didn`t love my wife but I was the problem.. she had endured 6 years of my insanity and when asked why she didn`t leave.."Because I love you" is all she said... Not in Love with you but I love you... there is a difference... that warm fuzzy feeling of your mate can do no wrong was replaced by something else.. something stronger and more durable... the "Lived happily ever after" is a fairytale.. it is through the troubling times we have grown together.. it is easy when everything is fine but when the chips are down you learn more about yourself and grow both spiritualy and emotionaly.. you will come through this both of you... stronger and all the better for it..

 

[AcuDoc]

First off Thanks BP for breaking out the whupping stick...:box:

I don`t remember when, I spent the first 6 years of my marriage in a drunken stupor, but at some point I realized that the "In Love feeling" was gone..

Then the drinking/drugging stopped, 6 months into sobriety I swore my marriage was over.. even said this in a meeting.. planned to leave but didn`t.. at some point I realized it wasn`t that I didn`t love my wife but I was the problem.. she had endured 6 years of my insanity and when asked why she didn`t leave.."Because I love you" is all she said... Not in Love with you but I love you... there is a difference... that warm fuzzy feeling of your mate can do no wrong was replaced by something else.. something stronger and more durable... the "Lived happily ever after" is a fairytale.. it is through the troubling times we have grown together.. it is easy when everything is fine but when the chips are down you learn more about yourself and grow both spiritualy and emotionaly.. you will come through this both of you... stronger and all the better for it..

I agree with this although it takes two to make it work. The difficult emotional work needs above all, trust. It is only when you fully trust your mate that you can explore those very painful areas we have inside of us. The other person needs to be there, or as my wife says, to be a witness. That moment when you're terrified and in terrible pain and want to say what you're feeling, it is trust which will let it come out. It is love which will let your partner witness it.

As Joseph Campbell once wrote that if love is like fire, then in the begining of the relationship love burns like a bonfire but in marriage it should be a steady low burn. That is a fire which doesn't burn out.

That is the love, the deep current of respect and trust, which keeps marriage alive. Without it then, whether two people are together or not, the marriage is dead.

 

[AcuDoc]

I just talked about this thread with my wife (who is from Europe) and she had an interesting comment I though I'd share.

She said that American women are told by the media, by the society, that they should always be happy. Their life should be full of fullfilment and if there is unhappiness then it must be someone's fault.They see life as one big chick-flick and if it doesn't conform to that, they bail.

My wife knows that this is a gross generalization but there is some truth to this. She also shrugged her shoulders and said " In Europe unhappy couples get lovers, in the U.S. they get divorced. Two sides of the same coin."

I don't know if any of this is even slightly helpful but I know when I am struggling even mindless banter is reassuring.

 

[LCSULLA]

I just talked about this thread with my wife (who is from Europe) and she had an interesting comment I though I'd share.

She said that American women are told by the media, by the society, that they should always be happy. Their life should be full of fullfilment and if there is unhappiness then it must be someone's fault.They see life as one big chick-flick and if it doesn't conform to that, they bail.

My wife knows that this is a gross generalization but there is some truth to this. She also shrugged her shoulders and said " In Europe unhappy couples get lovers, in the U.S. they get divorced. Two sides of the same coin."

I don't know if any of this is even slightly helpful but I know when I am struggling even mindless banter is reassuring.

Makes sense to me. Cuffs your good guy and your one of my favorite people on this board, but I think that you need to spend some time on yourself while your wife is away. Too many people feel the need for their happiness to come from external source. But true happiness come from withen. I think you need to spend to some quaility time with that great guy Cuffs and get to know him better.

 

[Malek256]

Let me through this question out and see how you would all feel about it.

What if you really loved your wife, and you knew something was not right and needed fixed. The two of you separate for some time to reflect on yourselves. During the separation, your wife begins dating different people, basically playing the field, trying to find if the marriage made her happy, or the seeing new people did. After seeing either a few people, or seeing one particular one, she then realizes she wants to remain married and wants to come back.

Here's a couple of senarios to add on:

A) She was never intimate with the others she dated. It was only cordial, maybe some kissing.

B) She was intimate with one person for a few weeks, then decided she was making a mistake.

C) It is never discussed how far the relationships went.

I know C would be the best, but would always be in the back of my mind. If/when an argument would come out, that topic may as well. As would 'B'.

Let me know how you all feel about this. I'm trying to see if I've got my head thinking in the right direction.

Don't do this. It is a choice that cannot have a good ending. If it is going to go that far, end the relationship flat out. That way, if you do get back together, what is done when you've both "called it quits" cannot come back to haunt you as you've alluded to.

 

[Cuffs]

I just talked about this thread with my wife (who is from Europe) and she had an interesting comment I though I'd share.

She said that American women are told by the media, by the society, that they should always be happy. Their life should be full of fullfilment and if there is unhappiness then it must be someone's fault.They see life as one big chick-flick and if it doesn't conform to that, they bail.

My wife knows that this is a gross generalization but there is some truth to this. She also shrugged her shoulders and said " In Europe unhappy couples get lovers, in the U.S. they get divorced. Two sides of the same coin."

I don't know if any of this is even slightly helpful but I know when I am struggling even mindless banter is reassuring.

This totally makes sense. My wife is a gossip magazine fanatic, and I was thinking about all of this yesterday. Marriage in the celebrity life is made out to look perfect. And my wife see's this with each one of the 10 magazines she receives every month.

 

[Cuffs]

Here's a little update:

My wife has called me a few times since this afternoon. Each conversation was good. We talked about the same stuff basically, and I never questioned anything. I went over a few more things I need to work with for me, and told her I am going to get the ball rolling for my therapy sessions. She said she was happy I was doing this. I then asked her one thing. I asked her after I have been going to therapy, and she see's a change, if she would be willing to possibly consider going with me at one point. She told me she might if she see's this. The door opened a little at least.

We then talked about the dating issue. I told her my thoughts and what I will not accept. I told her I will not accept her "dating" anyone, unless it is over and divorce is upon us. I told her I would not mind if she went out as a friend with someone, as long as there was no intimacy. She began talking about no restictions at first and other things. She then started to tell me how she doesn't want me sitting at home, wondering what she is doing, and waiting for her. She wants me to go out and have fun, which I intend on doing. She then told me this, and this kind of floored me at first, after hearing her outlook on the seeing other people thing. She told me she wanted me to promise that if I began to go out, that I would not have a sexual relationship with another. She also followed it up by she has no intentions of a sexual relationship on her behalf, in fact, she made this promise to herself, and told her mother as well. This leads me to believe she doesn't want issues of other people to arise if/when we get back together. She's affraid I might find someone else, and she made the mistake to cause it.

I told her I have no intention of having sex with anyone else at this time, and I'm in this until the fat lady sings "it's over" and the divorce papers are presented.

She told me she didn't think we would have such good conversations right now, and she is taken by how well they have been. I told her I don't want her back here, until I have gone to some therapy sessions, and have begun my healing and changing. I told her I want to make sure I can change for the long road ahead.

She told me if she decides to come back, it's because she made the decision to be back for good, until we are old and departed. She said this may take a couple to few months.

We ended with 'I love yous'.

She then called a little while later, excited that she found a purse she was wanting for 50% off. It was a purse I was going to buy her as a welcome home present for tomorrow. She's into Dooney and Burke purses. She sounded happy and said she just needed to call to tell me. She then told me she was going to the Hard Rock Cafe and would get me and my son T-shirts.

The conversations have been going great, and she almost seems back to normal, but she also said she needs to leave to make sure she is doing the right thing.

I know what I need to do to make this relationship work. I am going to work on myself first hand, and make sure my son is not neglected. Once I get my **** straight, then I need to do what it was I did when she first fell in love with me. Basically, she needs to fall in love with me all over. If this can't happen, then I'll need to accept it, and I'm preparing myself for this.

 

[BULK_CITY]

i didnt want to bring this up but the more I read your posts the more it makes sense.... you changed after you got married, you even admitted it yourself... but you changed for the worse

when you first met her, im assuming you acted like a manly man, did what you wanted, wasn't to concerned what everyone else thought, etc etc and you say you became more reserved/quiet/wussy etc... this does not generally attract women, i mean how would you feel if your wife was all clingy all of a sudden and boring? maybe you would love that b/c that is how you are now

dont worry though, you can change how you are for the better. YOu can become more outgoing/spontaneous/charming/etc but you must do it for yourself, b/c you want a better life, not b/c you want to please some woman is that what your life is about? or is it about sharing your experiences and complimenting eachother for as long as you live?

if you like I can give you some reading on these subjects... its not easy, and it will take work, but you will be better/happier/healthier

 

[Cuffs]

Bulk, you're right. I have become a little bitch. I stepped out of myself, so to say, and took a good hard look at how I have been for the past several years. Especially the past several months. Even at work I was unhappy. Hell, I threatened to kick a coworkers ass earlier in the year and had to be restrained by a couple of good dudes looking out for me. I'm just not that type of person.

Over time, I have become jaded. With the lose of a great job I once had, that I was fired from and having knives stuck in my back from those who I thought were friends. To losing my first marriage, to the drama of child custody and court appearences, to finding a new job where I would be happy, etc.

The readings you offer are welcomed. I have one bro here, Dmitry, sending me a book, and I'm looking into another one recommended earlier. I want to do my research on how I can become the person I once was, and can be again.

Since you, and some others don't have PM access, you can email me at [email protected].

 

[Cuffs]

I sat down with my son this evening and informed him of what was going on. I am very close with my son, who's turing 13 soon, and we share a special relationship. I asked him what he would like to changed in me. He told me for the most part, my temper as of late. He said he becomes scared at times, and doesn't want to say anything, and doesn't know how to react. I told him thiswas an area I was focusing on, and asked him to please let me know if the "old" me starts to come out. All-in-all, we had a good, positive discussion.

My wife called again to tell me she was going to bed and wanted to tell me she was happy with our conversations, and wanted to end the night on a good note so we could each get some quality sleep.

 

[jenkins]

excellent. Now I would avoid calling your wife because she is the one that has made this decision to be apart and the ball is in her court. if she asks "why don't you call", say "because you(your wife) want to be apart right now". There is no reason to call her if SHE wants to take time off. Of course when she calls you can pleasantly talk to her and everything but she is the one making the decisions right now so i definetely would not call her trying to get her to comeback. Basically you have no control right now. She will see through your calm demeanor that you are doing well. But most important thing is let her contact you. be strong, be confident, and don't beg.

ps: i don't know if you tried to call her recently but i just wanted to post this cuz i have made some stupid (slaps self) fucking phone calls in my day.

 

[jweave23]

I just talked about this thread with my wife (who is from Europe) and she had an interesting comment I though I'd share.

She said that American women are told by the media, by the society, that they should always be happy. Their life should be full of fullfilment and if there is unhappiness then it must be someone's fault.They see life as one big chick-flick and if it doesn't conform to that, they bail.

My wife knows that this is a gross generalization but there is some truth to this. She also shrugged her shoulders and said " In Europe unhappy couples get lovers, in the U.S. they get divorced. Two sides of the same coin."

I don't know if any of this is even slightly helpful but I know when I am struggling even mindless banter is reassuring.

I agree with this 100%. It seems my girlfriend and her family/culture, who are from Armenia, understand this some also.

I hate the entitlement that American women develop, that they must have an absolutely perfect relationship or it's not "meant to be". Old people are great to talk to about this as they understand that these lifelong relationships take work, dedication, communication, and are not fairy tales and may contain some unhappy times with both, one, or neither at "fault".

 

[jweave23]

Cuffs,

I don't understand this "fall in love with me all over" thing? I've heard this many times before, but can you honestly say that you have changed that fundamentally that your wife doesn't recognize you anymore as the same person she fell in love with?

I'm also wondering how much of this was in discussion beforehand? If this was a sudden slap-in-the-face, then maybe you guys really need to focus on communication or this may happen again, as it seems to me you are more than likely still the "same guy she fell in love with", just without the new car smell

I'm just offering a quick opinion, so please take no offense, but it seems that communcation problems, realistsic expectations, and/or selfishness (from one or both of you) may be a culprit here, from my point of view. With that said, good luck in trying to work through it. I have always been of the opinion that if truly honest and willing, most couples can get through times like these.

 

[Cuffs]

Jweave, no offense taken at all dude. The only time I felt offended with a post in her was from the james007 dude who obviously had soemthing against women.

You are right in your assessment of the matter. I don't beleive I have changed that much. I've just been in a bad mood for a few months off-and-on. I think the "fall in love all over" thing is, she just needs to feel that spark, which I know is possible. She is just confused and was angry when she first called me. And when one gets angry, they say things they may not usually say, and feelings such as love get boarded up so they can still vent.

The news was a sudden slap-in-the-face for me. However, I am a person who does not like conflict, and if there is a problem in the relationship and it can be taken care of with some "sorries", flowers, a gift, hug and kiss, etc., then I don't bring the issue up again. However,, my wife piles these on top of each other. She has wanted to talk before about things. I either talk briefly with her, shrug it off, or there is no talk. Bad way of dealing with it on mypart. Communication is the key to any good/solid/long lasting marriage, and that is one area we have faltered in, which is obvious. She did tell me she has felt this way now, off-and-on for about a year. She just didn't know how to approach me with it, or used a facade of happiness to cover it up.

There were signs I would notice, such as, while doing the deed I would try to "make out" with her so to say. She didn't seem into it though. I thought this was weird, brought it up a couple of times, and then just ignored it without getting a valid answer. As far as sex, sex is always good and plentiful. Hell, she will give me a blow at the drop of a hat if I ask, which I usually don't have to because she just does it. This was all the way up to the weekend she left for her training update.