IM very impressed with this stuff...its working great to control the perky nips and excessive bloating on my T1 cycle. I take two formasin, and 3-4 hours later the symptoms have subsided.
BigVrunga
BigVrunga
I suspect it is pretty widely carried by Internet retailers. Two I know of that do are 1fast400.com and MuscleShoppe.com. Slightly cheaper at MuscleShoppe.where can you get it?
its only to be used during cycle.. not post cycleWhat's the best dosing for taking Formasin?
2 tablets per day? Only to be used during the cycle or ok afterwards?
Yeah, they are both nuts I try not to read their posts anymore, I usually end up with a headache or chuckling.I havent read any of those arguments I try to stay out of it Those guys are brilliant and have brought us many great products, but they're both in business to make money, you know?
I havent checked out Aromazap yet, that's from Syntrax, right? I have some of their FUZU to use post cycle alongside 6-oxo/Nolva, I have heard good things about it.
I think it was Wardog who mentioned using Viratase to control bloat on a 1200mg/day 4AD cycle for cutting. He said it worked great, and from what Ive read Formasin is supposed to be more effective.
On that much 4AD, Id be have some nolva on hand too...
Later
BigVrunga
Either one sounds like a good idea. I havent read too much on 7-keto/1test though. Ill have to check it out. If I remember correctly, Wardog really liked the 4AD cutting cycle...it seems like a great idea. Simple, too.Yeah, they are both nuts I try not to read their posts anymore, I usually end up with a headache or chuckling.
Aromozap is Syntrax, yes. Haven't heard anything on it yeat, either. Wardog is who gave me the idea for the cycle, and if formasin works better than viratase than this could be a good summer cut cycle (no bloat and ready to hump any woman in sight) I'm thinking around the same doses, maybe 1000 or 1200 mg/day. It's either that or this 7-keto/1-test brew in the R&D section (or maybe some odd combo of both, who knows). Definitely nolva, gotta love liqua-solutions
I feel that 1-test is better for lean gains than 4AD, considering the water gain from 4ad has to be blocked somehow,(hence the reasons for this thread, aye?)..Originally posted by BigVrunga
Definately considering the 4AD route (with possibly a very small amount of 1test) when I get there.
From what Ive read and experienced with the two I would agree with you - but if you are sensitive to 1test's sides (like hair loss), then 4AD w/anti e might be a viable alternative - if the goal was just to help retain the lean mass that you already have.I feel that 1-test is better for lean gains than 4AD, considering the water gain from 4ad has to be blocked somehow,(hence the reasons for this thread, aye?)..
By the time i get here, PHs of all sorts will probably be banned, so I wont have to worry about it anyway.Im going to stay this way and keep growing until Im sure when I cut down Ill be ripped and over 205lbs.
But, I look good bald...
Yes, I've tried it orally in dosages ranging from 100mg to 250mg(min-max recommended dosages fyi).Have you tried it orally at all?
Somehow I knew this question was going to come upChosen5, where are you getting the raws for 6-oxo and formestane?
ok, I wouldn't recommend that though because of the fillers used in encapsulating, Chemo has some good posts regarding 6-oxo powder from caps, I'm not sure which forum they went to though, I'll look.Originally posted by chosen5
Somehow I knew this question was going to come up
I'm just going to pour the contents of the capsules into some bdc gel.
If you are going to do this, I recommend filtering the filler from the caps, before adding to the topical gel.I'm just going to pour the contents of the capsules into some bdc gel.
All that there is to filter out is the micro crystalline cellulose and i thought that the gel had been corrected so as to compensate for the filler.
If you are going to do this, I recommend filtering the filler from the caps, before adding to the topical gel.
I have done this with 6-OXO, and have been running it topically for the past 2 weeks. It is working quite well.
I haven't tried it with formestane, but I have successfully filtered both 3-Alpha caps and Viratase caps (both by Molecular), so I would guess that it should work just fine.
Why would you even filter 3-Alpha, I'd suppose for transdermal administration? 3-Alpha has a 40%+ bioavailability and the gel is roundabouts there at best guestimates.I haven't tried it with formestane, but I have successfully filtered both 3-Alpha caps and Viratase caps (both by Molecular), so I would guess that it should work just fine.
Just out of curiousity, what means did you use to filter and do you happen to know the approx yield? I'd suppose you could/would lose a substantial amount of active if you filtered through a coffee filter and not a whatman.If you are going to do this, I recommend filtering the filler from the caps, before adding to the topical gel.
I have done this with 6-OXO, and have been running it topically for the past 2 weeks. It is working quite well.
I’m not certain what the filler that is used in the 6-OXO caps actually is. It looks a lot like a rice bran filler, though.
All that there is to filter out is the micro crystalline cellulose and i thought that the gel had been corrected so as to compensate for the filler.
I have read these threads that you have posted. To me, it is not a question of whether you can get the solution to gel properly with the filler left in.
This thread deals with the topic of fixing T-Gel to compensate for the binders/fillers: http://www.anabolicminds.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1715
This thread deals with an actual user's issue with binders/filler:
http://www.anabolicminds.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1166
Yes. I ran it topically with 1-test on a 4-week cycle. I'm using the 6-OXO topical for post-cycle.
Why would you even filter 3-Alpha, I'd suppose for transdermal administration?
Actually, 3-Alpha has a conversion rate of 40+% (43% to be precise, according to Molecular's website).
3-Alpha has a 40%+ bioavailability and the gel is roundabouts there at best guestimates.
I just used an ordinary coffee filter and iso.
Just out of curiousity, what means did you use to filter and do you happen to know the approx yield? I'd suppose you could/would lose a substantial amount of active if you filtered through a coffee filter and not a whatman.
Thank you very much for the detailed explanation ShadowJack, very appreciative! I will filter the 6-oxo(hadn't gotten my scale yet to weigh out how much filler was actually in the product. I hadn't assumed it'd be so high, but as such, I will filter the active for the reason/s you've stated!) Once again a big thank you and I will give feedback on how the 6-oxo and formestane perform as topicals!
I’m not certain what the filler that is used in the 6-OXO caps actually is. It looks a lot like a rice bran filler, though.
I have read these threads that you have posted. To me, it is not a question of whether you can get the solution to gel properly with the filler left in.
It is an issue of better absorption. Removing the filler will decrease the amount of powder that has to be dissolved in the gel, and will increase solubility.
For example, the contents of a 6-OXO capsule weigh ~0.50g. And they are 100mg caps. So, the filler is ~80% of the contents. If the filler is filtered out first, you can dissolve more actual 6-OXO in the gel without over-saturating it.
Yes. I ran it topically with 1-test on a 4-week cycle. I'm using the 6-OXO topical for post-cycle.
Actually, 3-Alpha has a conversion rate of 40+% (43% to be precise, according to Molecular's website).
We don't know the exact bioavailability of 3-Alpha, but even Bill L. has commented that "its bioavailability is probably very low actually." I have seen no reason to believe that it has a bioavailability any higher than 4-AD.
BTW, I never mixed Viratase into a topical. I only filtered some as I had part of a bottle remaining, to experiment with filtering a PH, as I had only filtered UA and SU up until that point.
I just used an ordinary coffee filter and iso.
I can’t accurately say what the yield was, but I will give you an estimate. When I first started experimenting with filtering caps, I filtered 2g of SU with some iso, through a coffee filter and into a glass jar (which I weighed beforehand). I then completely evaporated the iso, to the point that the SU was stuck/dried to the bottom and sides of the glass jar. I then weighed this and came up with a difference of 1.9g. At the time, I was using a scale that has only 0.1g accuracy, so the test was far from ideal. But it did give me the confidence that the filtering was 90%+ accurate.
I didn’t repeat the weighing process when I filtered the SU, as I never evaporated the iso. I used the iso/filtered 6-OXO mixture as the base for the topical gel. I guess I am assuming that the 6-OXO filtering is similar to the SU that I filtered in yield, as the actual filtering process went about the same.
I have since obtained a scale with 0.01g accuracy, so perhaps I will repeat this experiment in the future to try to achieve more accurate numbers.
I filtered one bottle of 6-OXO and made it into a 240ml gel. I am running that over 30 days. One bottle contains 6g of 6-OXO, so that works out to ~200mg per day (using no yield loses in the filtering process).
Another question, what dosages of 6-oxo are you running topically ShadowJack?
Curious again, what doses did you run of the topical 3-alpha, what did you stack it with, and what were the results? Would you consider buying raw 3-alpha powder from BAC?(beyond-a-century.com), a much cheaper alternative to filtering molecular 3-alpha, or is BAC not "trustworthy."?Actually, 3-Alpha has a conversion rate of 40+% (43% to be precise, according to Molecular's website).
We don't know the exact bioavailability of 3-Alpha, but even Bill L. has commented that "its bioavailability is probably very low actually." I have seen no reason to believe that it has a bioavailability any higher than 4-AD.
I had a post on this on another board. After reading the following post, if you have any other questions, I will be happy to try to answer them.
Curious again, what doses did you run of the topical 3-alpha, what did you stack it with, and what were the results?
I am currently running a 1-test/3-Alpha topical, that may be of some interest. Systematic, of course. I wish I was smart enough to figure out a localized carrier. 6g of 1-test and 6g of 3-Alpha, applied over a total of 30 days. 200mg of each per day. I've been running it for 3 weeks so far, and I have 1 week left.
Strength gains have been good, though they have slowed in the last week. I was lifting at maximal loads when I started, however, so I guess I shouldn't expect dramatic increases. It's also been about 3 months straight of 6-day per week lifting, without a week off, so I'm a little burned out, as well. After I get through the final week of this cycle, and 3-4 weeks for post-cycle recovery, I will be taking a week off from lifting, and start something new. I'll be using a 6-OXO topical for post-cycle, with no other anti-e, so it should prove to be a good test of how well 6-OXO works when applied topically. I have used it post-cycle orally in the past, so I have something to compare it to. I'll also be running a 7-Keto DHEA topical, to go along with the 6-OXO.
Getting back to the 3-Alpha topical, I have never used it orally before, so it is difficult for me to compare. Vascularity and muscle hardness are very good, even though I am on bulking level calories (~5000/day on average). I have gained 10 pounds in the past 3 weeks, and I would say that none of it is water weight. Some of it is fat, of course, although I would say it is limited, as my pants are still fitting very well.
As far as side effects. Acne is worse than using 1-test alone, or 1-test with 4-AD. Actually, it is the worst acne I have experienced, although it is still not "bad" per se, or anything I would consider to be a major problem. Lethargy is about the same as using 1-test alone. Noticeable, and slightly problematic at times, but nowhere near the major lethargy I get when taking SU or UA.
The biggest problem that I have had is (workout) stamina. It has gotten worse the longer I have gone in this cycle. It has been very difficult having enough energy to get through a full workout. So, my workouts have taken longer, as I have needed more time in-between sets. Because of this, I have gone to split AM/PM workouts, doing about half each in the morning and at night. This has helped me continue at a high volume and high workout frequency. Recovery between workouts is very good. I'm ready to go again the next day, it's just that during the workout, my recovery in-between sets has not been good.
Also, joint pain is fairly bad. Worse than I have experienced when using 1-test alone. It hasn't kept me from working out, or forced me to reduce the weights, but near the end of workouts, and definitely right after, it is quite painful at times. The joint pain doesn't last; I'm fine the next day. It is only during and right after lifting. The only time I have experienced worse joint pain is when I was using Viratase on-cycle (with ONE and a 4-AD topical), to eliminate water bloating and itchy nips.
Blood pressure is definitely up. I haven't actually measured it, but I can tell, as it is normally quite low. Cardio workout stamina is an absolute joke right now. I am having great difficulty getting through HIIT workouts, even at lower duration and intensity than I normally go at. Also, back stiffness is quite bad. I normally get this on-cycle, but it has been worse this time (from the added 3-Alpha?). It's probably as bad at the 3-week point right now, as it has been in the past at the 7-week point on a 1-test/4-AD cycle. So, it has come on sooner than usual for me. The back stiffness is the biggest thing holding me back during HIIT workouts. I'm not really challenging my cardiovascular system to the extent I normally do, because the back pain sets in too quickly for me to reach the intensity that I am used to.
I think that addresses most of what I have noticed. In conclusion, I like the addition of 3-Alpha. I will be trying it again, but next time during a cutting cycle, as I am presently bulking. Am interested in seeing the results. I may also run 3-Alpha alone, next time, without the 1-test, to get a better feel for what the 3-Alpha can accomplish (by itself). Either way, I will definitely be running it topically, as I have no plans to run 3-Alpha orally.
BAC sells the 3-beta isomer of 5-AA in bulk powder. Mike (1fast400) has it as well.
Would you consider buying raw 3-alpha powder from BAC?(beyond-a-century.com), a much cheaper alternative to filtering molecular 3-alpha
I have been very fortunate in that regard. I have run numerous 1-test cycles over the past year, and not had any adverse effect on the hairline. The 1-test/3-Alpha cycle also did not have a noticeable effect on my hairline.How was that 3-alpha on your hairline shadowjack?
Using Formasin, I havent noticed any joint pain at all. (just as a comparison to the viratase...)Also, joint pain is fairly bad. Worse than I have experienced when using 1-test alone. It hasn't kept me from working out, or forced me to reduce the weights, but near the end of workouts, and definitely right after, it is quite painful at times. The joint pain doesn't last; I'm fine the next day. It is only during and right after lifting. The only time I have experienced worse joint pain is when I was using Viratase on-cycle (with ONE and a 4-AD topical), to eliminate water bloating and itchy nips.
Thread starter | Similar threads | Forum | Replies | Date |
---|---|---|---|---|
What time of day to take Formasin? Does it matter? | Anabolics | 3 | ||
Can Formasin be taken post cycle? | Supplements | 2 | ||
Formasin vs Clomid during cycle | Anabolics | 5 | ||
6oxo vs aromazap vs formasin | Supplements | 11 | ||
The battle of OTC Anti-Estrogens! 6OXO or Formasin?? | Supplements | 18 |