Best Injectables for a cutting cycle?

[jtmartin18]

What’s up fellas,

Been bulking basically since covid started and I was planning to start a cutting cycle of 300mg test iso and 50mg Var a day, but my body is not handling orals very well right now. Tried some MSten that I have as well and the heartburn from both are not pleasant.

I want to add something injectable in (not tren), what would you recommend? I’ve ran mast before and didn’t feel like it was worth it. Anything else?

 

[NattyBeast]

Test, mast are pretty much your best bet. EQ would work, and give a nice dry look and increase vascularity. The only downside is the increase in appetite, which can make cutting more difficult.
Heard of ppl using npp on a cut, but never tried it

 

[Nac]

For me, the most enjoyable cuts are where I retain as much muscle fullness and strength as possible, ideally with strength still going up. Keeps motivation high when kcals are lower than normal. I've always found NPP really good at this. It's no sdrol or tren of course, but the upside is its much more tolerable. I've also always run it with a bit of Mast though (and test, of course); at the very least I find Mast helps swing libido etc in a favorable way.

 

[jtmartin18]

For me, the most enjoyable cuts are where I retain as much muscle fullness and strength as possible, ideally with strength still going up. Keeps motivation high when kcals are lower than normal. I've always found NPP really good at this. It's no sdrol or tren of course, but the upside is its much more tolerable. I've also always run it with a bit of Mast though (and test, of course); at the very least I find Mast helps swing libido etc in a favorable way.

Thanks brotha, and thanks natty beast as well. I’ve always wanted to try NPP and was definitely considering that. How would you recommend dosing NPP and mast while cutting? I’d probably drop test to 200 if adding those in.

I think my goal is pretty similar to yours - retain as much muscle as possible while dieting hard and ramping up cardio. Maybe exactly the same as yours haha

 

[jtmartin18]

Also, would it make any difference whether I pinned mast E twice a week with my test Iso or mast prop EOD with the NPP? I’d prefer mast E I think

 

[NattyBeast]

The only difference is that the mast e will take longer to kick in and reach peak plasma levels than the prop. Now along with the npp you could run mast or Proviron to help with libido issues and freeing up more test for your body to use as well.
Im going to start a cutting Cycle once I get my package, test e mast e and Proviron. Its a solid cycle, I expect good results

 

[Nac]

I tend towards convenience, so would just go with MastE as you said, and NPP is fine eod.

Dosing...bit tricky, there's a million ways to do this. I know what I prefer, but only due to personal experimentation. Also, what's the context of this cut? What kind of dosing/mg has preceded it, and what are you planning after?

Generally speaking, I think a 1:1 of test:Mast is adequate, NPP 400 is also reasonable. I've run it as low as 200 on a cut, and also much higher. I think 300-400 is a good starting point to get familiar with it.

 

[jtmartin18]

I actually do have some proviron in my stash but was trying to avoid anything oral even if it’s not. That sounds solid though man I’m interested to see how the cut goes for you!

And I have just been on 300mg test iso for 3 weeks with 3-6mg aromasin daily, however small I can chop the tablets, I find it works best for me daily at a very low dose. Plus I was taking 50mg Var for maybe 10 days then took msten for two. Been off orals for 5 days. My plan for after the cycle is to cruise on 150-200mg for a while and reassess things maybe 6 months down the road depending on my progress.
What do you think about something like 200mg test 200mg mast 450mg NPP? Or a little lower on the NPP? I’ve always preferred low test with orals but I just can’t do them right now.

 

[NattyBeast]

I tend towards convenience, so would just go with MastE as you said, and NPP is fine eod.

Dosing...bit tricky, there's a million ways to do this. I know what I prefer, but only due to personal experimentation. Also, what's the context of this cut? What kind of dosing/mg has preceded it, and what are you planning after?

Generally speaking, I think a 1:1 of test:Mast is adequate, NPP 400 is also reasonable. I've run it as low as 200 on a cut, and also much higher. I think 300-400 is a good starting point to get familiar with it.

I've never run npp so I can't comment on that. I'll be on 500mg test e 400 weekly mast e 25-50mg daily. 16 weeks. I believe it would be a good cutting cycle before an off season bulk with test deca sdrol

 

[jtmartin18]

For some reason if I take any oral DHT derivative, not just winny, my SHBG drops and free test soars so I love winny and var they’ve always been good to me.

 

[NattyBeast]

I actually do have some proviron in my stash but was trying to avoid anything oral even if it’s not. That sounds solid though man I’m interested to see how the cut goes for you!

And I have just been on 300mg test iso for 3 weeks with 3-6mg aromasin daily, however small I can chop the tablets, I find it works best for me daily at a very low dose. Plus I was taking 50mg Var for maybe 10 days then took msten for two. Been off orals for 5 days. My plan for after the cycle is to cruise on 150-200mg for a while and reassess things maybe 6 months down the road depending on my progress.
What do you think about something like 200mg test 200mg mast 450mg NPP? Or a little lower on the NPP? I’ve always preferred low test with orals but I just can’t do them right now.

Proviron is not that harsh on the liver, if at all. But by all means go with a cycle that makes you feel good, and doesn't suck, because you'll be able to stick to it and not tax your body if you feel that it can't handle some stuff.

 

[NattyBeast]

For some reason if I take any oral DHT derivative, not just winny, my SHBG drops and free test soars so I love winny and var they’ve always been good to me.

Mine as well, that's why I include proviron in my cycles. I find that dht derivatives affect my lipid profiles too much, especially Winny, it tanks my hdl levels, so I don't run it anymore

 

[Nac]

I actually do have some proviron in my stash but was trying to avoid anything oral even if it’s not. That sounds solid though man I’m interested to see how the cut goes for you!

And I have just been on 300mg test iso for 3 weeks with 3-6mg aromasin daily, however small I can chop the tablets, I find it works best for me daily at a very low dose. Plus I was taking 50mg Var for maybe 10 days then took msten for two. Been off orals for 5 days. My plan for after the cycle is to cruise on 150-200mg for a while and reassess things maybe 6 months down the road depending on my progress.
What do you think about something like 200mg test 200mg mast 450mg NPP? Or a little lower on the NPP? I’ve always preferred low test with orals but I just can’t do them right now.

I think your doses look fine. Some might say your total weekly MG is fairly aggressive for a cut but given your dosing looks "mild" either side of the cut it's going to be something you'll want to try regardless and it's hardly reckless. If you stick to your dietary plan I think you'll be happy with the results.

 

[Hyde]

For some reason if I take any oral DHT derivative, not just winny, my SHBG drops and free test soars so I love winny and var they’ve always been good to me.

Because that’s exactly what that family of drugs do, and orals generally as well are worse than oils for that too.

Sounds like you have a new plan already, but I was going to suggest an injectable oral since you have similar issues to me with them. Injectable Rad or Msten are pretty available. Injectable winny makes a lot of sense as a replacement here, but damn if I haven’t heard more infection stories from that than anything else combined.

Not sure your reasoning for avoiding Tren so depending on that you may or may not be interested in Dienelone. Really let me slap on some size and strength while cutting down last winter.

Pepcid Complete is a terrific bandaid getting through orals if you need some relief.

 

[jtmartin18]

Because that’s exactly what that family of drugs do, and orals generally as well are worse than oils for that too.

Sounds like you have a new plan already, but I was going to suggest an injectable oral since you have similar issues to me with them. Injectable Rad or Msten are pretty available. Injectable winny makes a lot of sense as a replacement here, but damn if I haven’t heard more infection stories from that than anything else combined.

Not sure your reasoning for avoiding Tren so depending on that you may or may not be interested in Dienelone. Really let me slap on some size and strength while cutting down last winter.

Pepcid Complete is a terrific bandaid getting through orals if you need some relief.

Thank you brother much very helpful advice right here. I actually haven't placed an order yet so I'm still trying to decide. I really want to run injectable winny but I don't know if its worth ordering because of how painful I've heard it can be? If my whole arm is throbbing from pinning in my delt I don't know if its worth running because it will effect my workouts. What do you think? Ever ran it?

Also I've never seen injectable msten before, but I'm sure I can find it. Any experience with it?

And the main reason I was wanting to avoid tren is its effect/stress on the heart. I can't think of any specific article/study, but just overall from what I recall hearing or reading about it. Is there any merit to that or does it tend to be exaggerated in terms of side effects?


I was eating costco pepcid like it was candy with the orals lol, finally decided it wasn't a good idea to be putting additional strain on the kidneys from the famotidine and just ditched the orals.

 

[Hyde]

Thank you brother much very helpful advice right here. I actually haven't placed an order yet so I'm still trying to decide. I really want to run injectable winny but I don't know if its worth ordering because of how painful I've heard it can be? If my whole arm is throbbing from pinning in my delt I don't know if its worth running because it will effect my workouts. What do you think? Ever ran it?

Also I've never seen injectable msten before, but I'm sure I can find it. Any experience with it?

And the main reason I was wanting to avoid tren is its effect/stress on the heart. I can't think of any specific article/study, but just overall from what I recall hearing or reading about it. Is there any merit to that or does it tend to be exaggerated in terms of side effects?


I was eating costco pepcid like it was candy with the orals lol, finally decided it wasn't a good idea to be putting additional strain on the kidneys from the famotidine and just ditched the orals.

I can totally relate to the acid reflux from orals. They are awesome in their immediate and potent effects, but they are just so tough on the body taken orally.

I haven’t used injectable Msten but have ran regular oral and found it to be very dry, all glycogen in the muscle and great recovery. Really cranks my bp and works my liver hard, but it was potent in effect. In general it seems like most orals that are injected seem to be drier as well. Less water size/mineral retention, less stress on liver and gut, more potent true effect per mg. Injectable LGD at 25-30mg was a real oral for me, while 20mg oral is kind of a joke.

Honestly injectable winny is probably the only AAS I would never try. Too many horror stories of infection. And I would try a lot. PIP is one thing - you can change sites or just stop using it, but infection is a serious issue. Winny just sounded like it really meets your needs, because it sounded like you really want the dramatic effect of an oral while in a deficit, but many injectable orals/SARMs would probably give you the same strength/fullness I expect you are craving. Winny is just drier and harder than most everything else by most accounts.

19-Nors in general are bad for your heart. They don’t inherently bring estrogen, which is cardioprotective, they tend to raise BP a lot (bad for kidneys, makes the heart work harder), and I think Tren especially remodels the heart some. And it’s fairly hard on lipids (so is dienelone, from experience). But all AAS are bad for the heart, and I think the overall amount of exposure to Tren is probably the bigger culprit. I personally expect that someone adding 25mg/day of tren ace to a low dose of test for 8 weeks isn’t going to be worse off than using most other orals at effective doses.

If health & gut comfort was the complete priority, test and Masteron just make the most sense. Everything else I’ve discussed is gonna probably trash lipids.

 

[jtmartin18]

Because that’s exactly what that family of drugs do, and orals generally as well are worse than oils for that too.

Sounds like you have a new plan already, but I was going to suggest an injectable oral since you have similar issues to me with them. Injectable Rad or Msten are pretty available. Injectable winny makes a lot of sense as a replacement here, but damn if I haven’t heard more infection stories from that than anything else combined.

Not sure your reasoning for avoiding Tren so depending on that you may or may not be interested in Dienelone. Really let me slap on some size and strength while cutting down last winter.

Pepcid Complete is a terrific bandaid getting through orals if you need some relief.

I can totally relate to the acid reflux from orals. They are awesome in their immediate and potent effects, but they are just so tough on the body taken orally.

I haven’t used injectable Msten but have ran regular oral and found it to be very dry, all glycogen in the muscle and great recovery. Really cranks my bp and works my liver hard, but it was potent in effect. In general it seems like most orals that are injected seem to be drier as well. Less water size/mineral retention, less stress on liver and gut, more potent true effect per mg. Injectable LGD at 25-30mg was a real oral for me, while 20mg oral is kind of a joke.

Honestly injectable winny is probably the only AAS I would never try. Too many horror stories of infection. And I would try a lot. PIP is one thing - you can change sites or just stop using it, but infection is a serious issue. Winny just sounded like it really meets your needs, because it sounded like you really want the dramatic effect of an oral while in a deficit, but many injectable orals/SARMs would probably give you the same strength/fullness I expect you are craving. Winny is just drier and harder than most everything else by most accounts.

19-Nors in general are bad for your heart. They don’t inherently bring estrogen, which is cardioprotective, they tend to raise BP a lot (bad for kidneys, makes the heart work harder), and I think Tren especially remodels the heart some. And it’s fairly hard on lipids (so is dienelone, from experience). But all AAS are bad for the heart, and I think the overall amount of exposure to Tren is probably the bigger culprit. I personally expect that someone adding 25mg/day of tren ace to a low dose of test for 8 weeks isn’t going to be worse off than using most other orals at effective doses.

If health & gut comfort was the complete priority, test and Masteron just make the most sense. Everything else I’ve discussed is gonna probably trash lipids.

Thanks brotha I really appreciate your insight! I am convinced to stay away from the injectable winny haha, sounds like it just isn't worth it. I've been looking for injectable msten since you mentioned it, it seems it's a little harder for me to find than I was expecting, haven't been able to find it anywhere yet.

I am concerned about lipids but in the end have been okay with paying the price of low 20s HDL for 6-8 weeks for the results that orals have provided. The bigger concern for me when it comes to tren is potential changes in the heart's structure, thickening of the heart walls (which I know happens from other steroids as well), and then bp for the kidneys like you mentioned. It seems excessive dosing is the worst thing for these organs with any compound, even just test.

My body tolerates mast pretty well so that is a solid plan B if I'm not able to get ahold of any injectable msten, I'm really interested in trying that now though, I love msten.

 

[Hyde]

Thanks brotha I really appreciate your insight! I am convinced to stay away from the injectable winny haha, sounds like it just isn't worth it. I've been looking for injectable msten since you mentioned it, it seems it's a little harder for me to find than I was expecting, haven't been able to find it anywhere yet.

I am concerned about lipids but in the end have been okay with paying the price of low 20s HDL for 6-8 weeks for the results that orals have provided. The bigger concern for me when it comes to tren is potential changes in the heart's structure, thickening of the heart walls (which I know happens from other steroids as well), and then bp for the kidneys like you mentioned. It seems excessive dosing is the worst thing for these organs with any compound, even just test.

My body tolerates mast pretty well so that is a solid plan B if I'm not able to get ahold of any injectable msten, I'm really interested in trying that now though, I love msten.

I am not sure I know of anywhere that stocks it actually currently. There was a sponsor here that did but I think they discontinued that and their oil-based Epistane.

But I know there are definitely UGLs out there somewhere with injectable Anadrol, and Superdrol (that could be run in lower doses). I don’t know them but I know guys get ahold of it.

More than a few places have injectable SARMs if you are feeling experimental and don’t want to order UGL. And this weekend all the RC places are doing Independence Day sales in the US.