Then once again, what is the difference between testosterone to achieve normal levels and a cortisone shot. Both are prescription only.
One works in 4-6 weeks IF you train...the other is instant. How is the drug that lets run if you have a blown knee not cheating vs normal levels of test?!?!
The gear will allow him to perform a super-physiological levels that he never would be able to without them. The cortisol masks the pain so they can perform. It is to use words used later in this thread correcting a problem... IE sever inflammation. So it is seen as a treatment and not a perfomrance enhancing drug. If you take it without having severe inflammation it does nothing for your performance. So it requires there be a problem in order for it to bring you back to your normal level of performance.
Testosterone will increase your gains so long as you continue to train like an athlete, so we will assume both people would be training like an athlete to remove the "Test does nothing if you don't work out from the equation" The difference there is for test to work you need to do something, for cortisol to work you need to BE something and that something is injured. Since talking about athletes both are training.
And that's his choice...and I understand when you chose to do that you have to abide by the rules.
I just think what they seem legal and illegal ridiculous at times. Like I said, treatments that help recovery that are prescription injections are fine...yet steroids are not. It seems odd.
Things that treat injuries or ailments to get you back to your normal performance levels do not improve your normal performance levels they simply get you back to them more quickly so not a performance enhancer so much as a healing enhancer.
That's my point.
Steroids were developed to help recovery and they are legal by prescription. They are banned.
Cortisone shots and platelet rich therapy are injections by prescription and they are legal in most sports.
Why?
Because steroids were demonized in the early 90's. You had crack heads like Lyle Alzado lying to everyone saying his brain cancer and other issues were caused by steroids which was one of the big pushed to get them made into a schedule 3 drug... I remember him making such a HUGE deal about it. Same as this other guy on Youtube now professing that eating 10,000 calories a day to get to 280 is what caused him to get cancer. He doesn't want to talk about the HGH he probably pumped into himself making the tumors grow like wildfire...
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/12/02/doping.golfer/index.html
Doug Barron sued the PGA to get an answer. In November, the 40-year-old from Memphis, Tennessee, became the first player in professional golf to be suspended for doping.
The dope in this case is synthetic testosterone and beta blockers.
Barron, a journeyman who has played Tour events for more than a decade, says he had been taking the blockers to treat a heart condition since 1987. Long banned in Olympic sports from bobsled to diving, beta blockers also reduce anxiety and muscle tremor and can sharpen focus and precision.
Barron has another health problem: extremely low testosterone. Since 2005, he has been getting monthly shots of synthetic testosterone, which is also banned from most professional sports. Testosterone, naturally occurring or synthetic, promotes muscle mass and strength, among other things.
The golfer's natural testosterone count when he was prescribed the shots was 78 nanograms per deciliter of blood. Most healthy men his age have a testosterone level between 300 and 500.
Banned!!!
Is this guy cheating or just trying to live a normal life.
First in my opinion this guy got screwed!!!!!
Now we are onto the heart of the subject. The question is not really is HRT natural because I honestly don't think there is anyone here who has stuck a needle in themselves felt like it was the natural thing to do. HRT is not natural, it is not something that your body made, and our natural test doesn't come with various different esters attached. Definitely man made and not natural. There simply is no denying that.
The question is really is it ethical to compete in sports that do not allow the use of steroids, if you are being medically treated for low testosterone and are competing you should seek out a medical waiver. Many sports associations have them, and if so then do what is needed to ensure it is all legit.
Now if we are talking about TRT and competing in Natural competitions then most of the federations I looked at will allow TRT within the normal ranges, however you have to provide your prescription from your doctor and will definitely be tested if you place. Of course that is bodybuilding where they obviously already knew that people on HRT would be likely to want to compete. I am sure many other sports have simply not crossed that threshold, and it makes sense that bodybuilding would be on the cusp of making exceptions for hormone based treatments. I don't think it will take too many law suits before things change. I think the guy above has a pretty good case to make something happen.
I didnt say anything needs to b banned. I said there are rules and if you dont comply you get in trouble.
I got to 230lbs at 5'7" drug free w less than 10% bodyfat. If i was a,running back then went on "HRT" you saying I woudnt notice any increase in fav muscle to fat ratio? Recovery?
For the short term then you would shut down and things would more than likely level out. Now if you were those stats and had lower test that actually needed replaced you would definitely continue to see improved gains for a bit.
There is no such thing as "ur normal levels" then all of a sudden your on test shots and still at your "normal levels"
No not all of the sudden but over a few weeks shut down takes place then people by your products!
if a guy is 240lbs with less than 10% bf with a total test of 78 and then you bring him up to 700 you don't think he would see improvement?
There obviously would be but he is more than likely just coming off a cycle and not recovered yet if maintaining 240 and 10% bodyfat & test at 78.
A guy wouldn't be 240lbs with than 10% bf with a total test of 78.
Stop thinking of theoretical extremes and look at the case in front of you.
Only likely way would be right after a cycle before the HPTA recovery process. I know several people who have gotten on TRT right after a cycle due to this.
The case above though is ridiculous, and should be handled better. I hope he sues the hell out of them and wins.
I've said it before, but I think it bears repeating. You are natural if you are working with what you are naturally producing ie endogenously. If you alter that with exogenous testosterone, you are introducing a product that was synthetically made. While you may be bringing levels into "normal" levels, you aren't doing it naturally.
I'm on TRT and I would never consider myself natural.
BOOM!!!! My boy
kisaj laying it down!
I think this thread has shed a little light on the subject. I have come out of this with a new classification for those of us on TRT/HRT.
We are definitely not natural, but are elevated unnaturally to be what is considered a normal natural range. Confused yet. LOL
Dieting, stress, cortisol or even sleep deprivation does not lower our testosterone levels, our levels are already super-physiological to what our bodies can naturally create. Yet remain within the natural normal ranges for the "average male" I think that makes it obvious... we are Super Natural!
