Nolva vs Clomid - Opinions...

[ozHarris]

I've found alot of mixed opinions... What do you guys think?

Currently I'm on my 3rd cycle.. Sus250, pinning 375 twice a week for 10 weeks.
I have HCG for during the cycle and also have both Clomid and Nolva on hand.

What do you guys think of Clomid or Nolva during cycle incase of gyno or should I hold off and only add if symptoms arrise (no issues in the past but have usually only run 500 of Sus per week before).

My biggest drama is Clomid or Nolva for PCT? What is everyones opinion? Should I try both or would that just be a waste? Any major advantages or just personal preference.

Cheers..

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

old school thought is: nolva for on cycle gyno, clomid for PCT. I believe in the old school

 

[Celorza]

old school thought is: nolva for on cycle gyno, clomid for PCT. I believe in the old school

I support this claim completely, after another discussion (and some reads today) I found yes it kinda is ok to run Nolva as a precautionary method for gyno on AAS cycles (specially long ones) WITHOUT 19-NORS!

And well, Clomid has always been King of PCTs.

Hm...we can agree in some stuff it seems.

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

I support this claim completely, after another discussion (and some reads today) I found yes it kinda is ok to run Nolva as a precautionary method for gyno on AAS cycles (specially long ones) WITHOUT 19-NORS!

And well, Clomid has always been King of PCTs.

Hm...we can agree in some stuff it seems.

I post script what I said with the fact that I am the guy trying to find ways around using clomid for PCT (like less suppressive cycles or on cycle test boosting etc etc)....but when it comes right down to it, if I use any sort of injectible AAS or hardcore PH/DS....I'm gonna just suffer and use clomid. We actually usually agree on most things.....just sometimes you get a bit fired up when posting stuff,, so I attribute any drama from my end to your posting style to be honest ......

 

[LiveToLift]

I post script what I said with the fact that I am the guy trying to find ways around using clomid for PCT (like less suppressive cycles or on cycle test boosting etc etc)....but when it comes right down to it, if I use any sort of injectible AAS or hardcore PH/DS....I'm gonna just suffer and use clomid. We actually usually agree on most things.....just sometimes you get a bit fired up when posting stuff,, so I attribute any drama from my end to your posting style to be honest ......

What you don't like to get emotional? Good post bro.

 

[Celorza]

I post script what I said with the fact that I am the guy trying to find ways around using clomid for PCT (like less suppressive cycles or on cycle test boosting etc etc)....but when it comes right down to it, if I use any sort of injectible AAS or hardcore PH/DS....I'm gonna just suffer and use clomid. We actually usually agree on most things.....just sometimes you get a bit fired up when posting stuff,, so I attribute any drama from my end to your posting style to be honest ......

It is true, I can be a pain in the a*s most of the times due to my...emotions and drama getting into my posts. And true, it is correct not to go all the way into Clomid all the time...I think Torem can be a good option too, the thing with Clomid is the emotional side effects and they can be...REALLY hard for some, not to mention sight-sides too.

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

What you don't like to get emotional? Good post bro.

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

It is true, I can be a pain in the a*s most of the times due to my...emotions and drama getting into my posts. And true, it is correct not to go all the way into Clomid all the time...I think Torem can be a good option too, the thing with Clomid is the emotional side effects and they can be...REALLY hard for some, not to mention sight-sides too.

I think you can avoid using SERMS sometimes....but its hard to say what you did was the correct choice w/o doing it yourself then getting bloods done....I'm pretty confident I know when to use clomid (and in what dosages), when to use pure OTC natty PCT (just cort control, test boosting, and AI), and when to use something like erase pro which is sort of a natty SERM. but yeah, of course its always wise to use clomid, provided you can find legit clomid, and feel up to battling/surviving the sides (which can be a BITCH for many guys, esp guys with anxiety type issues or emotional issues).

 

[Celorza]

I think you can avoid using SERMS sometimes....but its hard to say what you did was the correct choice w/o doing it yourself then getting bloods done....I'm pretty confident I know when to use clomid (and in what dosages), when to use pure OTC natty PCT (just cort control, test boosting, and AI), and when to use something like erase pro which is sort of a natty SERM. but yeah, of course its always wise to use clomid, provided you can find legit clomid, and feel up to battling/surviving the sides (which can be a BITCH for many guys, esp guys with anxiety type issues or emotional issues).

Precisely my point, I don't battle that going SERMless is immediately stupid, but without previous experience of shutdown (so you know what to look for in your body) and without Before Cycle and End of Cycle bloods, its best to play it safe most times...although I do admit there's many PHs out there that don't need a serm at all because likelihood of shutdown is close to nada...BUT then again...everyone is different. For my first cycle I plan to get bloods before cycle and after cycle to know...still battling over just starting with a mild Hdrol or Epi run...or go straight into just 12 weeks of test-e by itself (which I know WILL need PCT with a SERM+AI+Tbooster and maybe Adex or Aromasin on cycle and of cource...hCG on cycle...) Still thinking about it...

 

[southparkbbb]

i personally prefer clomid, but i dislike the emotional sides with it; turns me into a girl

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

Precisely my point, I don't battle that going SERMless is immediately stupid, but without previous experience of shutdown (so you know what to look for in your body) and without Before Cycle and End of Cycle bloods, its best to play it safe most times...although I do admit there's many PHs out there that don't need a serm at all because likelihood of shutdown is close to nada...BUT then again...everyone is different. For my first cycle I plan to get bloods before cycle and after cycle to know...still battling over just starting with a mild Hdrol or Epi run...or go straight into just 12 weeks of test-e by itself (which I know WILL need PCT with a SERM+AI+Tbooster and maybe Adex or Aromasin on cycle and of cource...hCG on cycle...) Still thinking about it...

just depends on whether you want to jump straight into the deep end, or splash around on the lower safer side for a while (although your liver wouldn't call it the safer end of the pool now would it? lol) due to your age I'd mess with the PH's, natty stuff and the like first before I'd run any test....Personally I believe in waiting until you have a 3 in front of your age before starting any test or injectibles (or damn close to it)....but thats just me, everybody is different. I have friends who started when they were 18 on heavy duty cycles, and I don't tell them what to do....I let them do WTF they want....

 

[Celorza]

just depends on whether you want to jump straight into the deep end, or splash around on the lower safer side for a while (although your liver wouldn't call it the safer end of the pool now would it? lol) due to your age I'd mess with the PH's, natty stuff and the like first before I'd run any test....Personally I believe in waiting until you have a 3 in front of your age before starting any test or injectibles (or damn close to it)....but thats just me, everybody is different. I have friends who started when they were 18 on heavy duty cycles, and I don't tell them what to do....I let them do WTF they want....

FWIW I don't think I'll be doing any AAS (be it PH/DS or gear) for some years, and I have said it many times here and gotten flamed for it, no pinning before 30, anyhow a Hdrol cycle at 27~ wouldn't be that bad IMO. I'm patient haha

 

[supermanjow]

Toremifene Citrate - Reduces gyno like Nolva and helps you rebound like Clomid.

 

[howwedo107]

USE ALL THE SERMS!!!!!!!!

 

[broda]

Torem is definitely the best.

Clomid is more effective than Nolva IMO but it depends if you feel like being a menopausal b*tch for a couple of weeks or not.

 

[Celorza]

To my understading Torem doesn't go well with 19-nors either, why do you both recommend using Torem? Main reason behind, it just wondering.

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

FWIW I don't think I'll be doing any AAS (be it PH/DS or gear) for some years, and I have said it many times here and gotten flamed for it, no pinning before 30, anyhow a Hdrol cycle at 27~ wouldn't be that bad IMO. I'm patient haha

Oh OK....thought you were saying you were contemplating a first cycle SOON.....not WAY later....yeah I believe the same thing, and practiced what I preached. started at 30 myself. the natty stuff and borderline stuff is so damn good nowadays, you can gain muscle and lose fat essentially naturally during your 20's.....oh and using the greatest anabolic of all, FOOD

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

never tried torem, but anything I do in the next year or so will be incorporating deca.....so there goes that idea .....

 

[krakken]

So, someone who has mood swings normally or "anxiety" type behavior should use?..... Torem or Nolva? Not a girl or anything but I do tend to get hung up on the little things and don't need the extra "b1tch" mode behavior. About to begin 1st cycle and was planning on using clomid but I read more and more about the girl/bitch side effects and def don't wnna deal with that... So, torem or nolva? Get away with nolva pct 20/20/10/10 coming off of hdol or epi (helladrol or havoc) ? 4-6 wk max. What would you dose torem?

 

[broda]

To my understading Torem doesn't go well with 19-nors either, why do you both recommend using Torem? Main reason behind, it just wondering.

Haven't done it yet (obviously) but reading about it seems that it's the best SERM to get your HPTA functioning properly the quickest with little side effects.

 

[broda]

So, someone who has mood swings normally or "anxiety" type behavior should use?..... Torem or Nolva? Not a girl or anything but I do tend to get hung up on the little things and don't need the extra "b1tch" mode behavior. About to begin 1st cycle and was planning on using clomid but I read more and more about the girl/bitch side effects and def don't wnna deal with that... So, torem or nolva? Get away with nolva pct 20/20/10/10 coming off of hdol or epi (helladrol or havoc) ? 4-6 wk max. What would you dose torem?

Nolva would be fine.

Torem...
120/90/60/60 (For harsher cycles, obviously)
or
Wk1- 120/120/120/90/90/90/90
Wk2/3 - 60
Wk 4 - 30

 

[supermanjow]

I'm not the best guy to write on the torem and 19 nors. I've only just started taking PH's within the last year. However, I have done a fait amount of reading on the different SERMs. The main reason I started using Torem over the others was not only my personal experiences with each but also some pretty well researched opinions written by Swifto on steroid.com.

 

[krakken]

Nolva would be fine.

Torem...
120/90/60/60 (For harsher cycles, obviously)
or
Wk1- 120/120/120/90/90/90/90
Wk2/3 - 60
Wk 4 - 30

Thanks buddy. Your not saying that the two cycles im contemplating are harsh cycles are you? Saying go with the nolva for now and use the torem when I hit harsher cycles?

 

[broda]

Thanks buddy. Your not saying that the two cycles im contemplating are harsh cycles are you? Saying go with the nolva for now and use the torem when I hit harsher cycles?

It's really up to you. Torem is more expensive and a little harder to find which is why I think Nolva is so much more popular (it's also been around for a long time). Torem just seems to have the least amount of side effects. And no, Hdrol/Epi aren't overly that harsh.

 

[krakken]

It's really up to you. Torem is more expensive and a little harder to find which is why I think Nolva is so much more popular (it's also been around for a long time). Torem just seems to have the least amount of side effects. And no, Hdrol/Epi aren't overly that harsh.

Noted. Thanks for the quick replys. Going to research into nolva and torem more before I decide on which to run.

 

[Tmac22314]

So, someone who has mood swings normally or "anxiety" type behavior should use?..... Torem or Nolva? Not a girl or anything but I do tend to get hung up on the little things and don't need the extra "b1tch" mode behavior. About to begin 1st cycle and was planning on using clomid but I read more and more about the girl/bitch side effects and def don't wnna deal with that... So, torem or nolva? Get away with nolva pct 20/20/10/10 coming off of hdol or epi (helladrol or havoc) ? 4-6 wk max. What would you dose torem?

Bro...the mental sides from clomid aren't anything to be worried about, just don't go crazy on the dosage and you'll be g2g. Follow the standard protocol of 100/50/50/25, if it's too much just adjust accordingly.

 

[krakken]

Bro...the mental sides from clomid aren't anything to be worried about, just don't go crazy on the dosage and you'll be g2g. Follow the standard protocol of 100/50/50/25, if it's too much just adjust accordingly.

Idk man I may just go with Nolva or Torem. That seems high of a dose for clomid though. 100mg a day for a week of clomid seems hardcore.
If I were to run Clomid I would do..

wk 1 - 100/100/75/50/50/50/50
wk2- 50
wk3-25
wk4-25

maybe even lower than that... Clomid, torem, or nolva will not be my only pct supp. Will include AI/natty booster/pct cycle supp etc..

 

[broda]

Bro...the mental sides from clomid aren't anything to be worried about, just don't go crazy on the dosage and you'll be g2g. Follow the standard protocol of 100/50/50/25, if it's too much just adjust accordingly.

It's different for every person. Honestly, why risk it if you know you have a chance of it being bad? That's like saying since some people can take 30mg of SD with minimal side effects means that everyone can do it.

It's kind of like stereotypes. They're there for a reason since it happens frequently within certain groups. That doesn't mean that ALL people in those groups fit those stereotypes. Clomid obviously has a knack for making people a moody mess which is why it comes up when talked about it. It's not going to happen to everyone obviously but it has that stigma attached to it for a reason.

 

[heckler7]

old school thought is: nolva for on cycle gyno, clomid for PCT. I believe in the old school

this is good, for just sus, I would drop and save the HCG.

 

[chestbrother]

I use both.

For my next cycle, 500 sust a week, 12 weeks, 40/50 dbol ed for 4 weeks. Hcg and ai. My pct will be

Nolva 40/40/20/20
Clomid 100/100/50/50

Gonna start ostarine mid pct too.

 

[Tmac22314]

It's different for every person. Honestly, why risk it if you know you have a chance of it being bad? That's like saying since some people can take 30mg of SD with minimal side effects means that everyone can do it.

It's kind of like stereotypes. They're there for a reason since it happens frequently within certain groups. That doesn't mean that ALL people in those groups fit those stereotypes. Clomid obviously has a knack for making people a moody mess which is why it comes up when talked about it. It's not going to happen to everyone obviously but it has that stigma attached to it for a reason.

Good point sir, and you are correct, I was only speaking from my own experience.

 

[ozHarris]

Thanks for all the input guys.
Just one thing, I was always lead to believe that Nolva was the strongest of the two? Believing it was superior to Clomid.
Seems Clomid is everyone's preference.

Will give my feedback once I've finished my pct.

Cheers..

 

[Johnnyboy004]

I use both.

For my next cycle, 500 sust a week, 12 weeks, 40/50 dbol ed for 4 weeks. Hcg and ai. My pct will be

Nolva 40/40/20/20
Clomid 100/100/50/50

Gonna start ostarine mid pct too.

I've actually been hearing/reading about Nolva and clomid combo pct a lot lately. But if they both do the same thing, (bind the the estrogen) it seems like overkill. Nolva is better at binding to breast tissue to prevent gyno. Bro science says clomid is better at stimulating LH and FSH. But I would like to see some real science behind it.

Nolva has been proven to have less sides. The emotional sides and blurred vision that clomid might cause is enough to steer me away. But a lot of dudes swear by clomid.

 

[Jitbjake88]

drop the nolva and pick up some adex. Nolva inhibits igf levels which will hinder your gains.