RoidRage gets Revenge II

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by Distilled Water View Post
    or 20gr

    J/k you know your body best so do what you do.

    Thanks for those studies and links X. I'll get a better look at them later on 2day.
    ahh so many different opinions and options.

    But in the end, its all about how your body reacts to it. No "one" study will prove what is the perfect amount for anybody.


  2. Quote Originally Posted by RoidRageX10 View Post
    ahh so many different opinions and options.

    But in the end, its all about how your body reacts to it. No "one" study will prove what is the perfect amount for anybody.
    Actually, there are lots of studies showing the same thing.

    http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=...r=&btnG=Search

    I'm pretty sure that high dose recommendation came from EAS / Bill Phillips when they were charging like $50 for a hundred grams of creatine. Had to support the 'purple palace' you know...


    Muscle creatine loading in men

    E. Hultman, K. Soderlund, J. A. Timmons, G. Cederblad and P. L. Greenhaff
    Department of Physiology and Pharmacology, University Medical School, Queen's Medical Centre, Nottingham, United Kingdom.

    The effect of dietary creatine and supplementation on skeletal muscle creatine accumulation and subsequent degradation and on urinary creatinine excretion was investigated in 31 male subjects who ingested creatine in different quantities over varying time periods. Muscle total creatine concentration increased by approximately 20% after 6 days of creatine supplementation at a rate of 20 g/day. This elevated concentration was maintained when supplementation was continued at a rate of 2 g/day for a further 30 days. In the absence of 2 g/day supplementation, total creatine concentration gradually declined, such that 30 days after the cessation of supplementation the concentration was no different from the presupplementation value. During this period, urinary creatinine excretion was correspondingly increased. A similar, but more gradual, 20% increase in muscle total creatine concentration was observed over a period of 28 days when supplementation was undertaken at a rate of 3 g/day. In conclusion, a rapid way to "creatine load" human skeletal muscle is to ingest 20 g of creatine for 6 days. This elevated tissue concentration can then be maintained by ingestion of 2 g/day thereafter. The ingestion of 3 g creatine/day is in the long term likely to be as effective at raising tissue levels as this higher dose.
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”
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  3. isnt more ingestion - on the order of 5 - 10 grams ed -necessary for people who lead more active lifestyles. ie lifting and cardio regularly, as well as play a sport and/or have an active job.

    many people in this category say they feel noticeable improvements when going from 5 - 10 g per day.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by ahenage View Post
    isnt more ingestion - on the order of 5 - 10 grams ed -necessary for people who lead more active lifestyles. ie lifting and cardio regularly, as well as play a sport and/or have an active job.

    many people in this category say they feel noticeable improvements when going from 5 - 10 g per day.
    Perhaps, but I don't know what 'noticeable' affects you would feel, other than increased endurance and the initial weight gain (water). Maybe a LARGE football player doing 2-a-days could benefit from slightly higher doses, but it takes almost 30 days for intramuscular levels to return to 'normal' after cessation. You would still have plenty in you, even after a hard workout/physical job. 2-3g should bring your levels back up to saturated.

    The purported strength increases have been shown to be mostly placebo effect. It does aid in getting stronger though, as your lactate levels are lowered, so endurance is increased, and you are able to do more volume, more volume = muscle/strength.
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”

  5. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    Actually, there are lots of studies showing the same thing.

    Creatine - Google Scholar

    I'm pretty sure that high dose recommendation came from EAS / Bill Phillips when they were charging like $50 for a hundred grams of creatine. Had to support the 'purple palace' you know...


    Muscle creatine loading in men

    E. Hultman, K. Soderlund, J. A. Timmons, G. Cederblad and P. L. Greenhaff
    Department of Physiology and Pharmacology, University Medical School, Queen's Medical Centre, Nottingham, United Kingdom.

    The effect of dietary creatine and supplementation on skeletal muscle creatine accumulation and subsequent degradation and on urinary creatinine excretion was investigated in 31 male subjects who ingested creatine in different quantities over varying time periods. Muscle total creatine concentration increased by approximately 20% after 6 days of creatine supplementation at a rate of 20 g/day. This elevated concentration was maintained when supplementation was continued at a rate of 2 g/day for a further 30 days. In the absence of 2 g/day supplementation, total creatine concentration gradually declined, such that 30 days after the cessation of supplementation the concentration was no different from the presupplementation value. During this period, urinary creatinine excretion was correspondingly increased. A similar, but more gradual, 20% increase in muscle total creatine concentration was observed over a period of 28 days when supplementation was undertaken at a rate of 3 g/day. In conclusion, a rapid way to "creatine load" human skeletal muscle is to ingest 20 g of creatine for 6 days. This elevated tissue concentration can then be maintained by ingestion of 2 g/day thereafter. The ingestion of 3 g creatine/day is in the long term likely to be as effective at raising tissue levels as this higher dose.
    Hmm thats pretty intresting. Now were these test subjects lifting as well? Or would 3g/day be sufficent for high intensity weight traning?

    Very good articles though X.


    EDIT: Nevermind about the lifting question. Your previous post cleared that up.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by RoidRageX10 View Post
    Hmm thats pretty intresting. Now were these test subjects lifting as well? Or would 3g/day be sufficent for high intensity weight traning?

    Very good articles though X.
    Usually they have them do high intensity work, ie. cycling or sprinting @ 125% VO2Max. There are studies where they did leg press or leg extension exercises, but those were looking for 'strength increases' from creatine supplementation.

    Creatine is an endurance supplement (similar to Beta Alanine), not a 'strength' supplement.
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    Usually they have them do high intensity work, ie. cycling or sprinting @ 125% VO2Max. There are studies where they did leg press or leg extension exercises, but those were looking for 'strength increases' from creatine supplementation.

    Creatine is an endurance supplement (similar to Beta Alanine), not a 'strength' supplement.
    Maybe creatine isnt meant for me. I try to limit my workouts to under 45 minutes MAX. I would rather have strength then endurance.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by RoidRageX10 View Post
    Maybe creatine isnt meant for me. I try to limit my workouts to under 45 minutes MAX. I would rather have strength then endurance.
    I'm not saying its not worth it. 'Endurance' and lowered lactate levels means decreased recovery time. Less recovery time + more volume in a given workout == STRENGTH/Growth.

    It is a worthwhile supplement, it is cheap insurance and has benefits, just not going to cause your bench to jump 10lbs overnight.
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    I'm not saying its not worth it. 'Endurance' and lowered lactate levels means decreased recovery time. Less recovery time + more volume in a given workout == STRENGTH/Growth.

    It is a worthwhile supplement, it is cheap insurance and has benefits, just not going to cause your bench to jump 10lbs overnight.

    Oh alright, I see what you mean.

    Yea, I understand that I wont have amazing results instanley. Its the diet and traning that REALLY matter. But creatine will help boost your progress.
  10. 12-31-07


    Diet was sub-par due to me cousins invading my kitchen and eating lots of food which sucked. It's odd having other people cook in YOUR kitchen.

    I did some benching not as a WO, but just to see what I could do.

    160lbs x 5
    185lbs x 5


    Im suprised that after 2 weeks of rest, I could still put up 185
  11. Loading up on Creatine


    Im going to start my creatine cycle tommorow. 15g/day for 6 days at 5 g/dose 3 times daily.

    Im gonna hit Back and Soulders tommorow

  12. why back and shoulders same day - thats two primary muscle groups.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by ahenage View Post
    why back and shoulders same day - thats two primary muscle groups.
    Yup I know.

    It's just how my schedule works out for me. I work all my body parts except biceps 3 times a week.

  14. Im bumping my diet to 4,000 kcals per day.

    I forgot to add in my can of tuna.

    I may take out pasta,but I dont want to short-change my gains so Im eating tons of food until March.

    My offical start date is 1-7-07 for this bulk.

    Im getting my body used to weights again after taking a 2 week break.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by RoidRageX10 View Post
    Im bumping my diet to 4,000 kcals per day.

    I forgot to add in my can of tuna.

    I may take out pasta,but I dont want to short-change my gains so Im eating tons of food until March.

    My offical start date is 1-7-07 for this bulk.

    Im getting my body used to weights again after taking a 2 week break.

    Looking back through your diet, I would make one change.

    In M5 (post workout shake) I would take the EVOO out of that. It will blunt the insulin spike that you are looking for in regards to rapid protein uptake.

    If anything, guzzle some at night straight or replace the 'milk only' with another shake and add it to that, prior to bed to slow down digestion overnight.
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”

  16. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    Looking back through your diet, I would make one change.

    In M5 (post workout shake) I would take the EVOO out of that. It will blunt the insulin spike that you are looking for in regards to rapid protein uptake.

    If anything, guzzle some at night straight or replace the 'milk only' with another shake and add it to that, prior to bed to slow down digestion overnight.
    good point i'll take that out. should I buy some cassein protein? Or will plain old whey be ok?

  17. Quote Originally Posted by RoidRageX10 View Post
    good point i'll take that out. should I buy some cassein protein? Or will plain old whey be ok?
    Whey + EVOO is ok. FF Cottage Cheese w/ PB is good too.
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”

  18. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    Whey + EVOO is ok. FF Cottage Cheese w/ PB is good too.
    I will try the EVOO + whey tonight.

    Im not a fan of CC, but I will give it another go sometime soon hopefully.

  19. Quote Originally Posted by RoidRageX10 View Post
    I will try the EVOO + whey tonight.

    Im not a fan of CC, but I will give it another go sometime soon hopefully.
    The Fat Free isn't too bad, just expensive. After eating that all the time, I hate the taste of 'regular' CC. Way too salty!
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”

  20. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    FF Cottage Cheese w/ PB is good too.
    Good lord Xodus!! You mix PB and CC??? Are you human?

  21. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    The Fat Free isn't too bad, just expensive. After eating that all the time, I hate the taste of 'regular' CC. Way too salty!
    Sometimes when I shop at Save-a-Lot, the foods are not that great. I will see what Wal-mart sells.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by Hurleyboy05 View Post
    Good lord Xodus!! You mix PB and CC??? Are you human?
    Have you tried it? Its delicious! Almond butter is good too! Only the FF CC though. It's nasty as hell with the 4% stuff.
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”

  23. I'll give it a shot tomorrow... but I'm not gonna lie, I'm hesitant!

  24. Looks good bro, i'll be following along ... good luck! :burg::burg:

  25. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    ...FF Cottage Cheese w/ PB is good too.
    So, I'm not the only one who does this. I usually load up celery sticks with PB and dip into a tub of Cottage Cheese.

  26. Quote Originally Posted by Rivet View Post
    So, I'm not the only one who does this. I usually load up celery sticks with PB and dip into a tub of Cottage Cheese.
    CC is pretty damn versatile. Makes a decent dip when blended with spices/hotsauce/salsa too!
    “Besides, it is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of man you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit.”

  27. Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    CC is pretty damn versatile. Makes a decent dip when blended with spices/hotsauce/salsa too!
    Add some Dill and blend it up and it becomes a great Dip.

  28. CC+Yogurt the best of all tastes like a cheesecake
  29. 1-7-08 Chest and Triceps


    Warmed up with some jump rope and did some "dots".

    Incline BB Press (Went to heavy for my first set of inclines.)
    45lbs x 10
    95lbs x 8
    135lbs x 3
    160lbs x 1
    145lbs x 1

    Flat BB Press
    135lbs x 4
    175lbs x 4
    180lbs x 2

    Body Weight Dips
    BW x 10

    Pull-Downs
    30lbs x 10
    50lbs x 8
    80lbs x 3 (Broke Machine)
    100lbs x 6
    120lbs x 4

    Skull Crushers
    45lbs x 8
    65lbs x 4 (Left elbow sore)

    Did some Ab Work. Supersetted Med Ball and Leg Raises. 2 sets each. Nothing Special.


    DIET for tonight will hit 3,700 calories and 280 grams of Protein
  30. 1-8-07 Biceps


    Keep in mind all my lifts have 4 second negatives and 2 second positves.

    EZ Bar Curls
    35lbs x 10
    45bs x 8
    75lbs x 7
    80lbs x 4 (Inverted Grip)

    DB Incline Curls
    15lbs x 8
    30lbs x 5


    Diet was over 4,000kcals but I had too much unhealthy fats. 290grams of Protein though with 1 Shake.
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