My back recovery thread - AnabolicMinds.com

My back recovery thread

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    My back recovery thread


    All are welcome to comment.


    Feb 5 2013 : herniation L5-S1 left sided and central

    May 5 2013: re injured no MRI. But better in 11 days

    Feb 4 2014: re injured, new MRI. Same herniation. But now bilateral pushing on S1 nerve

    Day 1 of injury, chiropractor, acupuncture

    Day 2, acupuncture

    Day 3,5,7 tried PT could not do any thing suggested

    Day 5 started Vax-D decompression

    Couple decompression sessions feels like its "off" the nerve and just insane amount of tightness

    Still doing decompression but ready to call it quits BC I don't consistently see improvement.

    Been supplementing

    Glucosamine/chindroitin
    Joint help
    Achilles
    Perna
    Ruta graveolas
    7keto
    Gota kula
    Burdock

    Few other things I'm probably missing

    Fast forward to 2 days ago. I felt pretty good, next day pain. Today almost immobile

    Can't find any comfortable position to sit, lay, stand.

    First 11 days I was on a boatload of pain meds. Stopped them completely on Sunday. Haven't used any since.

    I'm looking into a place where they are mckenzie certified and spine specialists

    Www.onephysicaltherapy.com. For those interested and want to see credentials

    Today is 15 days since injury.

    Going to Arnold in 8 days. Freaking out

    Will continue to post what I'm doing for exercise if any, and therapy.

    If you want to follow
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    Im am genuinely interested and hope they can help you on the right path ASAP!
    Bigger and Better Is all I KNOW!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMovement View Post
    Im am genuinely interested and hope they can help you on the right path ASAP!
    Thanks man. Will give details on appointment tomorrow
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    Interested to c how ur recovery goes.....
    Back injuries r a b!tch .....
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    Update. Injury is extrusion which is a tear in annulous leaking nucleus pulpous(? Duno spelling or if this is right)


    Injury is acutely affecting some nerve firing in lower extremities based on certain tests administered.


    The guys I went to suggested some stuff I speak about below.

    Essentially I need to try and clear that fluid from the extrusion to allow for the tear to heal and scar putting me out 8 more weeks with respect to going back to the gym and healing (if I do all therapy and goes well)

    I'm being extremely proactive and therapies for te specialist ,go figure, are all out of network. And the doctors on my plan have opted out of the network even though they take the insurance. Need approvals and referrals so I spent a lot of time on the phone trying to change primary to make an apt and it was a mess.

    So seeing PCP (new one) today so I can get referral to spine/neuro specialist

    Review on some stuff I been reading


    Came across some cool stuff while trying to figure out what to do with my back.

    Icariin
    Osthole
    Psoralen
    Betulinic acid

    All help bone development. Via bmf-2 However I'm unsure how any of this affects the annulous of the spine to heal.

    Also since my back is an extrusion and the fluid I'd leaking out I supposedly need to look into something to increase phagocytes(?) in the area to help clean up the leaked material. Problem is blood flow to the area. Stim only affect 2 inches deep where the disc is 5.

    Any thoughts on supplementation??? I duno I started osthole yesterday


    Also after reading this....
    http://www.nature.com/nrn/journal/v7...l/nrn1955.html

    I think ill give nerve restore a go. I went to a specialist I have poor nerve firing. Due to injury? I don't know

    What you think about topic ABliderate advanced over the area, does it have forskolin in it. It seems as tho there are so many things involved with the spine and I need to be extremely proactive

    Cortisone may not be beneficial, given amount of time after Injury according to the text I just sent you. So looking into hyperthermia treatment and pulsed electromagnetic field therapy. But having trouble seeing resources pertaining to my specific injury.

    So long winded update with no real therapy done yet.

    Keeping it all here as help for those who need it or suffering. Hopefully it'll help someone
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    Update:


    Finished session 12 of vax d decompression

    Been feeling decent

    Did a **** load if research on my options and compiles a list of;

    Supplements with MOAs to discuss

    Journal articles with info on how they may help

    Journal article for risks and outcomes of surgery

    Questions on exercise, rehab, potential risks and the % of those risks in the surgeries he's done

    Covering all bases
    3 pages worth
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    Lls, not going to lie you have your work cut out for yourself and your cluster of Docs, and Physicians ,but I'm praying for ya man!
    Bigger and Better Is all I KNOW!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMovement View Post
    Lls, not going to lie you have your work cut out for yourself and your cluster of Docs, and Physicians ,but I'm praying for ya man!
    Yea man I see April training as a possibility at this point.
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    So update


    Yesterday

    Dr beers. North shore LIJ

    Reads MRI as a ;

    PROTRUSION: annulus tear on inner layers but didnt break outter layer this caused a bulge

    It is not an EXTRUSION: all layers if annulus torn

    Looking at returning slowly next week to the Gym

    However since radiologist read it one way, specialist read it another way, I will be going for another opinion even though what dr beers said what I wanted to hear. I feel a 3rd eye would keep me safe

    Started PT last night. Exercises completed in 2 sets of 10

    Piriformis stretch
    Straight leg raises
    Bridges
    90/90 with to tap
    Prone pres ups
    Cat/camel
    Bird dog
    Psoas stretch

    No pain this morning

    Will do this again today. Then add some mckenzie side bends in.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    So update

    Yesterday

    Dr beers. North shore LIJ

    Reads MRI as a ;

    PROTRUSION: annulus tear on inner layers but didnt break outter layer this caused a bulge

    It is not an EXTRUSION: all layers if annulus torn

    Looking at returning slowly next week to the Gym

    However since radiologist read it one way, specialist read it another way, I will be going for another opinion even though what dr beers said what I wanted to hear. I feel a 3rd eye would keep me safe

    Started PT last night. Exercises completed in 2 sets of 10

    Piriformis stretch
    Straight leg raises
    Bridges
    90/90 with to tap
    Prone pres ups
    Cat/camel
    Bird dog
    Psoas stretch

    No pain this morning

    Will do this again today. Then add some mckenzie side bends in.
    Bumping above post

    Did same exercises added variation to bird dog

    Also added small twist to psoas stretch

    Added mckenzie side bends

    Added push-ups. Got 45 in one set. Felt really heavy

    I did 15 body weight squats

    Focusing on trying to stay more upright

    Focus moving forward is

    Balanced flexibility

    I need to work hip flexor n quads and better dorsi flexion
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    Good stuff, and looking at the exercises Im def. hoping for better things in the future.
    Bigger and Better Is all I KNOW!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMovement View Post
    Good stuff, and looking at the exercises Im def. hoping for better things in the future.
    Yea. Thank you

    My split come Monday is as follows

    Monday back
    Tuesday legs
    Wed chest
    Thurs back shoulder
    Friday arms
    Sat legs
    Sun chest

    Yes it's 7 days I know. But it's also very low intensity and more on the volume side and will be done in te amounts which won't leave me terribly sore


    It'll be enough to keep me sane

    I have PREHAB that ill be doing as well compliments of my friend from cali who does a full body crossfit warm up
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post

    Yea. Thank you

    My split come Monday is as follows

    Monday back
    Tuesday legs
    Wed chest
    Thurs back shoulder
    Friday arms
    Sat legs
    Sun chest

    Yes it's 7 days I know. But it's also very low intensity and more on the volume side and will be done in te amounts which won't leave me terribly sore

    It'll be enough to keep me sane

    I have PREHAB that ill be doing as well compliments of my friend from cali who does a full body crossfit warm up
    Last nights (above) exercises went well. But I'm pretty tight and feeling a dull pain by my SI joint

    Doesn't radiate but I do feel weakness in my left knee.

    The pain has always been there. This recovery shows good days and some bad.

    All in all super upset about the rate of recovery.
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    So I tried bending forward today and wow. A lot of pain.

    Icing in prone press up position
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    So I tried bending forward today and wow. A lot of pain.

    Icing in prone press up position
    Wouldn't flexion feel like stabbing yourself or not necessarily? Still learning from your case as I go
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMovement View Post

    Wouldn't flexion feel like stabbing yourself or not necessarily? Still learning from your case as I go
    Bending forward is flexion

    I am very "stiff" I guess you can say.

    Almost like if you pull a dead lift with rounded back type feeling. Or going to deep on leg press

    My pain tolerance is apparently really high. I've had a lot injuries. I fractured my knee, appendicitis , broken ankle and wrist, dislocated shoulder
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    So pain for me is just like different when explaining. So sharp and dull I can't physically distinguish same with radiating. Nothing travels all the way through from back to a particular part

    I feel it in my back and in knee. But it's not "traveling" through my glute or hamstring which is why I'm afraid when I talk to people about pain they say its not that bad

    I was still leg pressing with a fractured knee BC that didn't hurt, but I couldn't walk. It was strange
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    So pain for me is just like different when explaining. So sharp and dull I can't physically distinguish same with radiating. Nothing travels all the way through from back to a particular part

    I feel it in my back and in knee. But it's not "traveling" through my glute or hamstring which is why I'm afraid when I talk to people about pain they say its not that bad

    I was still leg pressing with a fractured knee BC that didn't hurt, but I couldn't walk. It was strange
    Def. was talking about flexion being anything bending forward but I work as a PT Tech at a clinic so stuff like this interests the crap outta me. And you def have to have a good threshold for pain with all that behind ya. How ya been sleeping?

    Im a firm believer in asking ?s as you can see plenty and never still see it all so I will apologize in advance for the kid nosing around lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMovement View Post

    Def. was talking about flexion being anything bending forward but I work as a PT Tech at a clinic so stuff like this interests the crap outta me. And you def have to have a good threshold for pain with all that behind ya. How ya been sleeping?

    Im a firm believer in asking ?s as you can see plenty and never still see it all so I will apologize in advance for the kid nosing around lol
    I sleep on my right side BC if I sleep on left it hurts

    Ask as many questions as you'd like

    But as you can see, I haven't added straighter raises 3 ways yet or with my foot turned out. Those will follow

    Haven't done ball squeezes or "clam shells" yet either

    It's important to note I'm doing PT myself. I didn't do any tonight except mckenzie side bends and mckenzie probe press ups

    Hopefully plane ride won't kill me
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    Started gym Saturday. Going easy


    Had specialist today

    3 different MRI readings 1 bad back fml

    . He didn't care what kind issue (protrusion extrusion ect) there fore didn't care to tell me what it is aside from degenerative disc

    Nothing to do apparently
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    Started gym Saturday. Going easy


    Had specialist today

    3 different MRI readings 1 bad back fml

    . He didn't care what kind issue (protrusion extrusion ect) there fore didn't care to tell me what it is aside from degenerative disc

    Nothing to do apparently
    That bad of news that he didnt want to fully disclose or him just being a jerk? Feel like the 2nd happens alot more these days.

    So whats the gameplan now?
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMovement View Post

    That bad of news that he didnt want to fully disclose or him just being a jerk? Feel like the 2nd happens alot more these days.

    So whats the gameplan now?
    No gameplan

    Another opinion.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    No gameplan Another opinion.
    Agreed! 2nd opinion is needed ....
    Hope u find a better doc n the sooner the better..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magdalena View Post

    Agreed! 2nd opinion is needed ....
    Hope u find a better doc n the sooner the better..
    It'll be a third

    Radiologist: extrusion
    Specialist 1: protrusion
    Specialist 2: didn't care to tell me what kind although I asked, but said I have good height on disc. And it's degenerative

    So I want another opinion
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    It'll be a third Radiologist: extrusion Specialist 1: protrusion Specialist 2: didn't care to tell me what kind although I asked, but said I have good height on disc. And it's degenerative So I want another opinion
    Bummer...
    A year ago or so , I woke up one day n my neck was completely stiff! Very painful...
    Went to my doc, had some X-rays done, n he told me I have degenerative disk disorder...
    ( cervical region) ... Had to take some meds, but thank god, it got better within a few days ..I'm no longer taking any meds and the stiffness never came back....
    6 months ago, had a CT scan done n my doc said I have 2 compressed discs( lumbar region)...
    News to me cause I've never had any lower back pain( accept for after my car accident)....
    So far so good... ( fingers crossed)....
    I'm still able to perform all my exercises without any trouble....for how long? Who knows...

    I hope ur back issue is not going to get in the way of ur training...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magdalena View Post

    Bummer...
    A year ago or so , I woke up one day n my neck was completely stiff! Very painful...
    Went to my doc, had some X-rays done, n he told me I have degenerative disk disorder...
    ( cervical region) ... Had to take some meds, but thank god, it got better within a few days ..I'm no longer taking any meds and the stiffness never came back....
    6 months ago, had a CT scan done n my doc said I have 2 compressed discs( lumbar region)...
    News to me cause I've never had any lower back pain( accept for after my car accident)....
    So far so good... ( fingers crossed)....
    I'm still able to perform all my exercises without any trouble....for how long? Who knows...

    I hope ur back issue is not going to get in the way of ur training...
    I'm training just very careful with specific movements
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    I'm training just very careful with specific movements
    Oh that's good...
    Yes I had to take arthrotec before, that helped.. But as soon as the stiffness was gone, I discontinued using, lol...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magdalena View Post

    Oh that's good...
    Yes I had to take arthrotec before, that helped.. But as soon as the stiffness was gone, I discontinued using, lol...
    Arthrotech?

    I've been supplementing accordingly hoping my efforts help a little every doctor is against supplements even tho there's done solid research on the following;

    Mmp inhibition
    Bmp-2 activation
    Osteoblasts differentiation
    TGF-b activation
    Reduction in cortisol/inflammation which prevents bmp-2 from being suppressed
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    [QUOTE="EBF Inc;4390073"] Arthrotech? I've been supplementing accordingly hoping my efforts help a little every doctor is against supplements even tho there's done solid research on the following; Mmp inhibition Bmp-2 activation Osteoblasts differentiation TGF-b activation Reduction in cortisol/inflammation which prevents bmp-2 from being suppressed[/


    Yes, doctors rather prescribe something since they get a percentage of each prescription they write up....
    They don't like sups , lol, that's for sure....
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    Wow man! I feel your pain brother- I've going through basically the exact same thing for the last year. I bulged l4-l5, and bulged with protrusion l5-s1. Did a lot of the same protocols as you- MRI, chiro, acupunture, decompression, pt, etc. had some neuropathy as well and just like you it kind skipped my leg but was noticeable in my knee and foot. Spine injuries are the worst! I'm still dealing with it, but the one thing that seemed to help the most was the Mckenzie method, specifically the prone press ups. The trick is you have do them all the time- like 5-8 sessions of 10-15 reps everyday for awhile. After months and months of various treatments the press ups were the only thing which seed to alleviate the nerve pain and helped to restore the lordosis(natural curvature) to my lower back. At its worst my lower back was perfectly flat, no curve, and I'd have trouble standing up straight in the mornings- when I got religious with the press ups is when that curve starting coming back. Keep on the track your on and you will make vast improvements. I'm nowhere near 100% yet(may never be) but I am greatly improved from where I was and you will be too.
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    I will be definitely be following along! It really sucks to be dealing with an injury like this but maybe we can bounce ideas off each other in the hopes of a full recovery for the both us! I've learned a lot from your posts in the past so if there is anything I can offer(even if it's just to commiserate) I'd gladly do so.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magdalena View Post
    Went to my doc, had some X-rays done, n he told me I have degenerative disk disorder...
    ( cervical region) ... Had to take some meds, but thank god, it got better within a few days ..I'm no longer taking any meds and the stiffness never came back....
    6 months ago, had a CT scan done n my doc said I have 2 compressed discs( lumbar region)...
    News to me cause I've never had any lower back pain( accept for after my car accident)....
    So far so good... ( fingers crossed)....
    I'm still able to perform all my exercises without any trouble....for how long? Who knows...
    Just to throw this out, Sarno, did a lot of research on patients & x-rays etc. and found that quite a few young people (in their early 20's) show disc degeneration and or abnormalities and could not relate exactly, any pain to these specific models per se. Patients with these formations, but no pain.
    He also went on to say that the average 60-70^ Y/O's have most likely the most back degeneration and they are not the ones with the highest pain incidence.
    So the comparisons of the 2, were not really consistent.
    It has been a personal voyage for myself, (and I have no idea where I would be without his works) as I have/had suffered some very painful back (both upper and lower) problems with everything from a very slow onslaught eventually becoming a great stabbing pain, to going to bed fine and waking up in some good pain and of course lifting heavy and having pain afterwards.
    IMO, there are a few ways to skin a cat, so leave those doors as open and as optimistic as humanly possible.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    Started gym Saturday. Going easy


    Had specialist today

    3 different MRI readings 1 bad back fml

    . He didn't care what kind issue (protrusion extrusion ect) there fore didn't care to tell me what it is aside from degenerative disc

    Nothing to do apparently
    Ugh, the worst response "Just wait"
    It's BULKING season: http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/254139-swol-boones-quest.html
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    Quote Originally Posted by daft205 View Post
    I will be definitely be following along! It really sucks to be dealing with an injury like this but maybe we can bounce ideas off each other in the hopes of a full recovery for the both us! I've learned a lot from your posts in the past so if there is anything I can offer(even if it's just to commiserate) I'd gladly do so.
    Thank you

    I do prone press ups every day. When in pain I lay in that position for like 10-15 min to help

    It sucks.

    I try n do a lot if core strengthening
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