Step By Step Keto Diet Plan!
02-26-2003 11:01 PM
hear ya, I live in college too... don't subscribe to the meal plans and **** though, so can't help you there... but a day's worth of spinach and **** is like a dollar fifty, so it ain't bad... but hey no one is making you do the diet
02-26-2003 11:02 PM
yeah i hear ya... be a fun diet to do but seems expensive.. can someone give me a rough estimate of what they spend per week and what they get?
02-26-2003 11:35 PM
I shop at aldi and usually spend 40-50 bucks for two weeks worth of food. I stock up on chicken, ground beef, cheese, broccoli, eggs, milk, peanut butter, etc... They are cheap if you can find one in your area. Its not top of line quality food, but in this game, we are about saving money
02-26-2003 11:39 PM
it aint expensive... all you're buying is meat, cheese, oil and veg
02-27-2003 10:02 AM
whose your daddy.. thought they said milk has carbs in form of lactose? someone just toldme that
03-03-2003 01:12 AM
I am faster than 80% of all snakes
Yes but lactose is low on th GI list. Plus you can still use this pre or post workout. Remember these diets are not no-carb diets. They just use carbs at the proper times. Originally posted by LakeMountD whose your daddy.. thought they said milk has carbs in form of lactose? someone just toldme that
03-03-2003 01:39 AM
oh i c.. thanks for clearing that up... yo bobo im still kind of confused though on what to eat when.. and hell besides eggs what can i eat for breakfast?
or better yet can you give me your typical days worth of food? like what you would eat? thanx
03-03-2003 03:52 AM
Breakfast? hell, for the eggs - try adding cheese or ham to them. Sausage and bacon is another popular option. Or you could try some of the atkins blueberry muffins or pancakes...not bad..
03-20-2003 08:51 PM
For the guys asking about breakfast foods, here is a short list but good.
If you live in a dorm they can be made fairly easy if you get an electric skillet.
Omlets: eggs, cheese, sausage, thrown in some oinions and peppers, great low carb meal.
Sausage patties and bacon are great.
Poached eggs, scrambled eggs.
Another life saver for me was cottage cheese (check labels some have carbs) and sugar free jam. Wal-mart had a sugar free jam that only had a few grams of carbs per table spoon. Half a table spoon and cottage cheese was pretty good.
Other staple foods that are cheap are wal-mart hamburger patties. Throw them on the Foreman grill with cheese! Bacon and what not also. Fish is good, chicken breasts it is easy to do cheap on a college budget (did it last year and will this year again )
Also if your looking at R-ALA to do the TKD search of the version that uses slin. Hehehe I know I talk alot bout slin, but I love the stuff it is so usefull if you respect it's danger. Makes it possible to gain a lil' muscle while cutting hard. Probably work really good with some 1-test thrown in. Besure to use 4-ad or eca because the lethargy from 1-test plust keto lethargy could be killer for motivation to study.
04-08-2003 10:40 PM
I've seen articles to get into keto, but I haven't really seen articles on getting off keto.
I know you want to reintroduce carbs slowly, right? Well would 50 carbs a day be good? Or what would you guys recommend?
04-09-2003 05:41 PM
by two weeks in that would be 700 grams of carbs per day or 2800 cals from carbs... so you tell me.... Obviously 50 isn't the right number, but I need to look up my info on reintroducing carbs over a period of time..
04-16-2003 06:24 PM
The Axe Man Cometh!!
I dont see this being feasable for a type I diabetic, type I has to take insulin since the body produces NONE. May be possible if checking BG before every meal but since test strips are around 1.00 per strip that could get real expensive real quick. Also no long acting insulin could be taken so BG could rise in the morning, this is a natural reaction, and therefore you could still be in ketosis but have a high BG which would require you to take insulin which kind of defeats the purpose of the diet. And if you take too much insulin you got to eat some carbs again defeating the purpose of the diet.
If anyone has any ideas on how a typeI could do this diet please let me know, I've researched it and I find no plausible or possible way to succesfully implement the diet but I would like to try. I'm hoping one of the mods could shed some light here. Any ideas??
04-17-2003 01:59 AM
As a type one diabetic, you are subjective to the potentially fatal state of diabetic ketoacidosis. The lack of insulin in type 1 diabetics further increases the ketone body formation in these types of individuals. While a non-diabetic may product 115-190 grams of ketones per day, type 1 diabetcs have been found to produce up to 400 grams of ketones per day. This increase in ketone formation is coupled with an inability in the type 1 diabetic to use ketones in body tissues. Presumably this occurs because blood glucose is present in adquate amounts making glucose the preferred fuel. Thus there is a situation where ketone body formation is high but ketone body utilization by the body is very low, causing a rapid building up of ketones in the bloodstream. Non-diabetics have a few feedback loops to prevent dangerous levels of ketones building up in the body. With the following risks outlined above and no feedback loops to regulate the amount of ketones produced, I would recommend against a ketogenic based diet.
06-02-2003 03:37 PM
The CKD is almost the same thing as the Anabolic Diet, except they recommend going 5 days on low carb and having two full days of carbing up with no restraints placed.
Have a question.
"My opinion for those who practice Atkins is that while they do lose fat, there is much water loss and most importantly muscle loss."
You also wrote:
"On the other hand, during fat metabolism, protein cannot be converted into free-fatty acids for energy."
If the goal of the Atkins Diet is to get into ketosis and to stay there throughout your weightloss, how can you have muscle loss if your second statement is true?
You replenish your glycogen levels in 1½ days. I can see that. You will also deplete those very same levels in about 2-3 days. That leaves those last 2½-3 days with no glycogen for energy levels. Where does this energy come from? Your anaerobic work will then be fueled by protein, right (you wrote: we cannot simply deplete all stores while working out and not fill them back up. If that does happen, be rest-assured that the body WILL use protein for fuel then)?
While we are on the topic of energy production, why is it that glycogen is the preferred source of energy for anaerobic training? I really want to see your theory. Maybe you could make a separate post and we could discuss it at length?
06-03-2003 10:14 PM
if you're carb sensitive and want some post-workout carbs then don't use the traditional dextrose/whey combo and just try out 30g of a lower GI/II more complex carb such as sweet potatoe or brown rice The glycogen synthesis will be exactly the same, but it will take a little longer and won't spike insulin. This pretty much defeats half the purpose for taking in p/w carbs though. The little bit of insulin really helps with shuttling aminos and keeping muscle.
06-11-2003 07:29 PM
About 8 years ago this very topic was discussed on a "newsgroup" kind of board. This was a popular topic and there were a few (3 or 4) Postgrad students doing their masters' degree on the ketogenic Diets.
One of them, named Jeffrey Krabbe, was detailing exactly what was going on in terms of biochemistry on this diet, on each phase. As I remember, the action of a few hormones not mentioned here, namely glucagon and maybe another one, are completely different during ketosis than on a "normal" diet, which made it very obvious that not much glycogen was burned during exercice after the first 3-4 weeks on the diet.
Part of his explanation was that all the enzymes took quite a bit of time to get all activated, but that once they were, protein was spared quite thoroughly and also ALL ENERGY EXPENDED CAME EASILY FROM FAT... In other words, there is NO PROBLEM doing a heavy weights workout or anything while all the carb is depleted.
I kinda wish I could get him on this board and have him drop us a few lines as well as links to any published studies of his, as he was incredibly knowledgeable about this diet and the biochemistry of it. Anyways, I once did 4 weeks straight taking like 3-4 g carbs a day, and my energy levels were still sky-high at the end of that... Around 6%bf... Lifting hard all the time... Gaining in strength and keeping the mass...
06-11-2003 10:22 PM
Freaking awesome - thats great on only 3-4g of carbs. One question - though. How the heck did you keep your carbs so low, were you eating strictly beef chicken and eggs - no veggies no dressings or sauces of any kind, no insulin spike post-workout? My only problem with the keto diet is that it doesn't take advantage of cell volume and it's growth promoting potential. Taking creatine on a keto diet stinks too. Insulin is sooooo powerful and the keto diet throws it right out the window. I believe that you can get to 6% without going straight keto like that. If you wanted to be 4% then that might be a different story.
06-12-2003 07:42 PM
Well, actually, my weektime diet was just about only meats, fish, chicken, eggs, and cheese - some heavy cream with my whey. I put mustard on my steak once in a while - brown it in butter and add minced chives... Add mustard while eating - just changes the monotony of always the same taste from eating rib steak all the time.
Taking creatine does stink on CKD. You *DO* take advantage of insulin though, on the weekend. You might want to load up on creatine at that time... You will be able to take in a fair amount. AFAIK if you keep the carbs really low all week, then on the weekend, you can get both a GH spike for these 36 hours or so AND insulin AT THE SAME TIME... It seems the body, if it is kept in a long-term ketogenic state, treats the sudden intake of carbs as a stress and releases GH.
Now, please remember that it takes time to get into this diet. It is very normal to feel weak for the first 2-3 weeks. In those days, me and a bunch of others went "straight keto" as you say for 4 weeks just to make sure of the idea that we didn't NEED *ANY* glycogen for resistance workouts. And did we ever prove it beyond a doubt : EVERYONE was feeling sky-high levels of energy, both in and out of the gym.
OTOH, we all agreed that it takes between 4 and 6 weeks for the full transition to the ketogenic metabolism to occur, IF you keep the carbs to 24-36 hours a week ONLY. Doing anything else, i.e. going above 30g carbs a day makes this a partial transition to the ketosis metabolism but NOT COMPLETE.
By complete, and again I wish Jeffrey was here to explain it, I mean that what happens is that there are quite a few hormonal feedback loops that need to get settled down, enzymes to get activated, etc. And that takes time. I'm not saying you will not lose fat from the 10th day, you will. I'm saying that if you do it correctly, your fat loss will INCREASE gradually from week 1 through week 6, or your food intake will increase and your bf% will remain stable.
One variant that we found popular was to skip the first carb weekend, just to get deeper into ketosis, quicker. If you feel weak during the weektime, for example if you have trouble lifting during your friday workout, you're simply eating too much carbs. Save it for the ice cream and pizza.
06-13-2003 01:29 PM
another problem I see is that the training suffers for 2-3 weeks during the transition period, won't that sluggish training and minimal energy hinder fat loss and body composition transformation. Wouldn't it be just as easy to cut normal carbs in half and keep training hard for the entire six weeks? I'm not against keto because I've been using a CKD on and off for over a year now. My only problem is that I haven't been consistent enough with it, I go off too soon because I get sick of feeling flat all the time, plus I'm a model and it will always throw off my CKD if I have to look good on a Thursday and it's been 4-5 days since a carb up and I come in looking tired and flat.
If I skip the first weekends carb load do you think the sluggish feelings would pass by the second week? Also dude, I'm really concerned about elevated cortisol leves. I seem to get really flabby obliques and sides every time I really get into the CKD even though the rest of my body gets ripped. It's got to be due to cortisol wanting to store fat in those trouble areas. What do you think?
06-13-2003 01:48 PM
Firstly, I want to point out that any ketogenic diet is a rather long-term endeavor. If you want something for an 8-week cutting plan, this is probably not for you as yes, the first 2 weeks or so will find you lacking energy. You will get results, but how much better than a dedicated non-ketogenic effort of the same duration? That remains debatable.
About softness in the obliques and sides, that seems a little odd to me. Maybe it's the sodium? Do you eat lots of processed meats on CKD? I don't know about cortisol, but since a lot of bodybuilders use this also in their mass-gaining phases even without AAS or PH, and quite successfully at that, I would venture to say that cortisol doesn't rise on this diet, but someone else certainly will correct me if this is wrong.
One thing I know for sure is that your hGH levels are going to be much higher than normal - unless you are 18 or so - and your fat will tend to AVOID bunching up in certain places and be more equally distributed, not to mention easier to lose. Your skin will be very elastic and so this kind of flabiness that you describe is exactly the contrary of what one would normally experience on this diet... I am at a loss for a cause to this.
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