Ketogenic Diets Suppress IGF-1

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  1. Ketogenic Diets Suppress IGF-1


    The body produces ketones, such as acetone, acetoacetate and beta-hydroxybutyrate, during low calorie intake and carbohydrate restriction. Low-carbohydrate diets-sometimes called ketogenic diets-are more effective than low calorie, mixed-or high carbohydrate diets for short-term weight loss. The brain and nervous system use mainly glucose(blood sugar) as fuel but can also use keytones when carbs are unavailable. Keytones, however, suppress the appetite center of the brain, which might explain why low-carb diets cause rapid weight loss. Keytones cause an improved sense of well-being and produce mild euphoria. Ketogenic diets have been used to suppress epileptic seizures since the 1920s. A study from Karolinska University Hospital in Stockholm, Sweden showed that ketogenic diets slowed growth rates and suppressed IGF-1 levels in children with epilepsy. IGF-1 is a powerful anabolic hormone produced mainly in the liver in response to growth hormone release. Many bodybuilders follow ketogenic diets to promote fat loss. These diets inhibit IGF-1 production in healthy bodybuilders, which might compromise gains in muscle mass and strength. (Epilepsia, published online)
    I mean if you really hate your balls, go for it. But, what did they do to you?


  2. Im from Stockholm, Sweden, and live very very close to Karolinska University! Haha!
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  3. Very informative!

  4. I need to go on a cut and soon. I had a friend tell me I'm jacked, and asked 'Creatine'? wink. lol. I just gotta cut the midsection down a tad.
    I love ketogenics, but wow, once you drop from it, bam. You gotta take care cuz those carbs come a calling.
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  5. Quote Originally Posted by justhere4comm View Post
    I need to go on a cut and soon. I had a friend tell me I'm jacked, and asked 'Creatine'? wink. lol. I just gotta cut the midsection down a tad.
    Well, from what I have read Keto does work good for short periods. Such as 6 weeks, and going complete Keto Monday-Friday and adding Carbs back in on the weekend. But no longer than 6 weeks. And we must use the same "Creatine". Lol
    I mean if you really hate your balls, go for it. But, what did they do to you?

  6. I don’t know. It takes around 6 weeks of proper keto before my body fully makes the switch and things really take off and I start feeling like I’m running off of a nuclear reactor. I feel distinctly different stages of keto. At two weeks, there’s an adjustment, another shift at about a month and then he big one at 6 weeks or so. Why stop just when it’s getting good?
    High Intensity Training log, wedding prep:
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/305228-wedding-preparation-next.html

  7. Quote Originally Posted by jrock645 View Post
    I donít know. It takes around 6 weeks of proper keto before my body fully makes the switch and things really take off and I start feeling like Iím running off of a nuclear reactor. I feel distinctly different stages of keto. At two weeks, thereís an adjustment, another shift at about a month and then he big one at 6 weeks or so. Why stop just when itís getting good?
    Your not stopping it. Your running it Monday-Friday every week, and reintroducing carbs on the weekends, then going back to Keto Monday-Friday for a total of 6 weeks. And you say why stop when its getting good, but if its suppressing IGF and your losing muscle, is it really good.
    I mean if you really hate your balls, go for it. But, what did they do to you?

  8. Quote Originally Posted by DemntedCowboy View Post
    Your not stopping it. Your running it Monday-Friday every week, and reintroducing carbs on the weekends, then going back to Keto Monday-Friday for a total of 6 weeks. And you say why stop when its getting good, but if its suppressing IGF and your losing muscle, is it really good.
    In my experience, you’re not losing muscle as long as you’re actively burning fat.
    High Intensity Training log, wedding prep:
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/305228-wedding-preparation-next.html

  9. Quote Originally Posted by jrock645 View Post
    In my experience, youíre not losing muscle as long as youíre actively burning fat.
    But as you see in my post studies show it suppresses IGF so you ain't building muscle
    I mean if you really hate your balls, go for it. But, what did they do to you?

  10. Quote Originally Posted by DemntedCowboy View Post
    But as you see in my post studies show it suppresses IGF so you ain't building muscle
    When does anyone build muscle on a cut? Keto is a weight loss method. It’d be seriously misguided to ever go into a weight loss phase expecting to build muscle.
    High Intensity Training log, wedding prep:
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/305228-wedding-preparation-next.html

  11. Quote Originally Posted by DemntedCowboy View Post
    But as you see in my post studies show it suppresses IGF so you ain't building muscle
    When does anyone build muscle on a cut? Keto is a weight loss method. Itíd be seriously misguided to ever go into a weight loss phase expecting to build muscle.
    High Intensity Training log, wedding prep:
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/305228-wedding-preparation-next.html

  12. Quote Originally Posted by jrock645 View Post
    When does anyone build muscle on a cut? Keto is a weight loss method. Itíd be seriously misguided to ever go into a weight loss phase expecting to build muscle.
    True but you want to maintain muscle and the suppression of IGF is not initiative for that either.
    I mean if you really hate your balls, go for it. But, what did they do to you?

  13. I have been keto for 2 years now for epilepsy. It has done wonders for controlling breakthrough seizures. My last lab work (2 monthd ago) igf-1 was high (no tumor, yet). I have no problems adding muscle.

  14. The one reason why I just do everything traditional is because they work for me without any trouble. When I want to cut I reduce my carb and keep the protein a little high. I think the best diet is when you can have a Balanced Diet. So, all this carb cycling, Keto diets etc.. doesn't interest me.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by jtmass View Post
    The one reason why I just do everything traditional is because they work for me without any trouble. When I want to cut I reduce my carb and keep the protein a little high. I think the best diet is when you can have a Balanced Diet. So, all this carb cycling, Keto diets etc.. doesn't interest me.
    @jtmass I'm with you on this, maybe I'm just too old to change.
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  16. Quote Originally Posted by Rocket3015 View Post
    @jtmass I'm with you on this, maybe I'm just too old to change.
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it.\

  17. Quote Originally Posted by jrock645 View Post
    When does anyone build muscle on a cut? Keto is a weight loss method. Itíd be seriously misguided to ever go into a weight loss phase expecting to build muscle.
    Iíam on a cut now and building muscle.

  18. Keto diets get too much hype in the media. The cells in our body run better on glucose, they are designed to run on glucose and there is no way around this. Fat is a "backup" plan. There are all kinds of pathways in our bodies that can break, and evolution has created redundancy in these pathways - when one breaks or is impaired or just isn't available because of a lack of chemical supply - we have 2 or 3 ways to accomplish the task.

    This is true of energy production - glucose is preferred, but when sh1t goes wrong, we have backups. And energy supply has to be tightly regulated to demand - so not only is fat the backup, but it's also the solution to the situation where supply is outpacing demand.

    Elevated glucose? Release insulin and burn what you can. Still elevated? hit the insulin harder and start converting it to fat. Elevated fat? Release insulin and burn what you can. Still elevated? Start packing it into storage and get it out of the blood.

    The issue is - obese people become REALLY good at burning fat and this makes burning carbs difficult. This means carbs can't be burned, so hit the insulin harder and start converting to fat.

    Only problem is, this is like converting gasoline to rocket fuel. Once you make a carb into fat - you need to burn more energy to burn the same amount of mass.

    A low carb diet circumvents this entire process of handling carbs though. It eliminates the broken pathway altogether. It just focuses on the one pathway that obese people have already gotten good at using. Unfortunately, caloric deficits, starvation and low carb diets all make this broken pathway even more broken...so once they are lean, they still have a fat burning switch turned up full blast and carbs make them rebound hard.

    At least that's the light version of my theory..
    "I've never seen anyone change his mind because of the power of a superior argument or the acquisition of new facts. But I've seen plenty of people change behavior to avoid being mocked." -Scott Adams

  19. Quote Originally Posted by HIT4ME View Post
    Keto diets get too much hype in the media. The cells in our body run better on glucose, they are designed to run on glucose and there is no way around this. Fat is a "backup" plan. There are all kinds of pathways in our bodies that can break, and evolution has created redundancy in these pathways - when one breaks or is impaired or just isn't available because of a lack of chemical supply - we have 2 or 3 ways to accomplish the task.

    This is true of energy production - glucose is preferred, but when sh1t goes wrong, we have backups. And energy supply has to be tightly regulated to demand - so not only is fat the backup, but it's also the solution to the situation where supply is outpacing demand.

    Elevated glucose? Release insulin and burn what you can. Still elevated? hit the insulin harder and start converting it to fat. Elevated fat? Release insulin and burn what you can. Still elevated? Start packing it into storage and get it out of the blood.

    The issue is - obese people become REALLY good at burning fat and this makes burning carbs difficult. This means carbs can't be burned, so hit the insulin harder and start converting to fat.

    Only problem is, this is like converting gasoline to rocket fuel. Once you make a carb into fat - you need to burn more energy to burn the same amount of mass.

    A low carb diet circumvents this entire process of handling carbs though. It eliminates the broken pathway altogether. It just focuses on the one pathway that obese people have already gotten good at using. Unfortunately, caloric deficits, starvation and low carb diets all make this broken pathway even more broken...so once they are lean, they still have a fat burning switch turned up full blast and carbs make them rebound hard.

    At least that's the light version of my theory..
    Thanks for the input. What I have also read shows that keto works for short blast say may 6 weeks and it would look something like this:

    Week 1
    Monday-Friday 50%P/50%F/0%C, Saturday and Sunday 50%P/40%F/10%C

    Week 2
    Monday-Friday 50/50/0, Saturday-Sunday 50/30/20

    Week 3
    Minday-Friday 50/50/0, Saturday-Sunday 50/20/30

    Week 4-6
    Monday-Friday 50/50/0, Saturday-Sunday 50/10/40
    I mean if you really hate your balls, go for it. But, what did they do to you?

  20. Tyson fury used keto to lose 140 lbs in a year before last nights fight. So we know it can work for fat loss plus it can enable you
    to rise from the dead......

  21. Quote Originally Posted by HIT4ME View Post
    Keto diets get too much hype in the media. The cells in our body run better on glucose, they are designed to run on glucose and there is no way around this. Fat is a "backup" plan. There are all kinds of pathways in our bodies that can break, and evolution has created redundancy in these pathways - when one breaks or is impaired or just isn't available because of a lack of chemical supply - we have 2 or 3 ways to accomplish the task.

    This is true of energy production - glucose is preferred, but when sh1t goes wrong, we have backups. And energy supply has to be tightly regulated to demand - so not only is fat the backup, but it's also the solution to the situation where supply is outpacing demand.

    Elevated glucose? Release insulin and burn what you can. Still elevated? hit the insulin harder and start converting it to fat. Elevated fat? Release insulin and burn what you can. Still elevated? Start packing it into storage and get it out of the blood.

    The issue is - obese people become REALLY good at burning fat and this makes burning carbs difficult. This means carbs can't be burned, so hit the insulin harder and start converting to fat.

    Only problem is, this is like converting gasoline to rocket fuel. Once you make a carb into fat - you need to burn more energy to burn the same amount of mass.

    A low carb diet circumvents this entire process of handling carbs though. It eliminates the broken pathway altogether. It just focuses on the one pathway that obese people have already gotten good at using. Unfortunately, caloric deficits, starvation and low carb diets all make this broken pathway even more broken...so once they are lean, they still have a fat burning switch turned up full blast and carbs make them rebound hard.

    At least that's the light version of my theory..
    For the obese, the theory is that going on a Keto diet resets insulin sensitivity and muscle cells are able to accept glucose again. This is consistent with my experience on a strict Keto diet for four months.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by HIT4ME View Post
    Keto diets get too much hype in the media. The cells in our body run better on glucose, they are designed to run on glucose and there is no way around this. Fat is a "backup" plan. There are all kinds of pathways in our bodies that can break, and evolution has created redundancy in these pathways - when one breaks or is impaired or just isn't available because of a lack of chemical supply - we have 2 or 3 ways to accomplish the task.

    This is true of energy production - glucose is preferred, but when sh1t goes wrong, we have backups. And energy supply has to be tightly regulated to demand - so not only is fat the backup, but it's also the solution to the situation where supply is outpacing demand.

    Elevated glucose? Release insulin and burn what you can. Still elevated? hit the insulin harder and start converting it to fat. Elevated fat? Release insulin and burn what you can. Still elevated? Start packing it into storage and get it out of the blood.

    The issue is - obese people become REALLY good at burning fat and this makes burning carbs difficult. This means carbs can't be burned, so hit the insulin harder and start converting to fat.

    Only problem is, this is like converting gasoline to rocket fuel. Once you make a carb into fat - you need to burn more energy to burn the same amount of mass.

    A low carb diet circumvents this entire process of handling carbs though. It eliminates the broken pathway altogether. It just focuses on the one pathway that obese people have already gotten good at using. Unfortunately, caloric deficits, starvation and low carb diets all make this broken pathway even more broken...so once they are lean, they still have a fat burning switch turned up full blast and carbs make them rebound hard.

    At least that's the light version of my theory..
    I'm glad we got the "light" version ;-)
    Twenty-Two Until None
    I Am My Brothers Keeper

  23. Quote Originally Posted by Humble View Post
    For the obese, the theory is that going on a Keto diet resets insulin sensitivity and muscle cells are able to accept glucose again. This is consistent with my experience on a strict Keto diet for four months.
    I understand that...but it can actually increase insulin resistance. You have stayed strict keto for months...try going off.
    "I've never seen anyone change his mind because of the power of a superior argument or the acquisition of new facts. But I've seen plenty of people change behavior to avoid being mocked." -Scott Adams

  24. Quote Originally Posted by DemntedCowboy View Post
    Thanks for the input. What I have also read shows that keto works for short blast say may 6 weeks and it would look something like this:

    Week 1
    Monday-Friday 50%P/50%F/0%C, Saturday and Sunday 50%P/40%F/10%C

    Week 2
    Monday-Friday 50/50/0, Saturday-Sunday 50/30/20

    Week 3
    Minday-Friday 50/50/0, Saturday-Sunday 50/20/30

    Week 4-6
    Monday-Friday 50/50/0, Saturday-Sunday 50/10/40
    This is likely a good way to do it. I view keto as an effective tool or tactic, but not a good long term or sole strategy. Kind of like trying to use a hammer...it works great, but don't try to put screws into drywall with it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whisky View Post
    Tyson fury used keto to lose 140 lbs in a year before last nights fight. So we know it can work for fat loss plus it can enable you
    to rise from the dead......
    Lol, yeah...it will definately work on people. It avoids the underlying metabolic issues altogether. So it can be effective.

    Quote Originally Posted by SFreed View Post
    I'm glad we got the "light" version ;-)
    Where you been?

    I have some crazy theories that nobody is ready for, you know that.
    "I've never seen anyone change his mind because of the power of a superior argument or the acquisition of new facts. But I've seen plenty of people change behavior to avoid being mocked." -Scott Adams
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