Summer cut help?

[ReinalHot61]

I'm planning to run the following:

Clen
T3
Ketotifen
Tren

Any advice? I'm doing some research. I'm going to use Clen 2 weeks on 2 weeks off. And use T3 along with it. As well as ketotifen and taurine.

It's my first time with all of this. Is there an oral version for Tren? I'm having paranoia whenever I think about doing any syringe.

 

[LeanEngineer]

Yea if you can still find some tren there is oral versions.
For your taurine check out this page at Strong Supplement Shop.
http://www.strongsupplementshop.com/taurine

 

[ReinalHot61]

Thanks for your reply. Can you give me any advice on the stack?

 

[megamatt68]

I wouldn't do this stack. To save you from a long winded speech about using tren, t3 and clen, without having testosterone or any mention about your pct, my advice to you is to scrap the whole cycle, and consider running ostarine and an EC stack together instead. It has similar elements as your proposed stack, where ostarine is the anabolic presence and the EC stack provides help in the fat loss department. It's also a lot cheaper, safer, and you don't have to inject yourself. Tren and t3 are great drugs (clen isn't worth it in my opinion), but they are not necessary for a summer cut.

Do something like this:

Ostarine-20 to 25mg for 8 weeks (could go longer if you want to)

EC- 25mg of Ephedrine per day, split into two 12.5mg doses
200-250mg of Caffeine per day, split into two 100-125mg doses

PCT-Nolvadex/Clomid/Toremifene (choose one serm) for 4 weeks, I like clomid personally so 50mg per day for the first 2 weeks, then 25mg per day for the remaining 2 weeks

 

[ReinalHot61]

I'm currently doing EC right now.

So Ostarine + EC + Clomid? I'm using hotnfit's ec stack protocol. Thanks for the reply mate. I was desperately looking for one.

As I'm googling Ostarine, there's liquid and oral. Which one is better?

 

[jgntyce]

I'm currently doing EC right now. So Ostarine + EC + Clomid? I'm using hotnfit's ec stack protocol. Thanks for the reply mate. I was desperately looking for one. As I'm googling Ostarine, there's liquid and oral. Which one is better?

Olympus labs Ostar1ne

 

[ReinalHot61]

Olympus labs Ostar1ne

Are you running it yourself? If I'm understanding this right, the clomid/SERM is there to prevent the gyno build up on the first stages of Ostarine right? I should be fine on the remaining 4 weeks of Ostarine off clomid?

For E, I'm using Bronkaid? I'm currently at 1/1 today. Using Norcodrene as caffeine source. Hope you can help me out more here. I'm reading more threads as we speak. I really want to start this right away.

 

[max d]

I'm about to run ostarine myself but from what I've gathered if u run it below 25mg for max 8 weeks an OTC pct will suffice.

 

[ReinalHot61]

I'm about to run ostarine myself but from what I've gathered if u run it below 25mg for max 8 weeks an OTC pct will suffice.

Yeah. If I ever do go with the Ostarine route, I'll probably use Clomid and Nolva. I'm still thinking about it since a reputable member suggested that I'll be better off with 1-DHEA + 4-DHEA combo and EC Stack.

 

[megamatt68]

I'm about to run ostarine myself but from what I've gathered if u run it below 25mg for max 8 weeks an OTC pct will suffice.

Don't be afraid of using a serm for pct, considering you're already willing to put a research chemical in your body, why not use a serm that at least has years of studies behind them, and for that matter is probably safer than using a sarm like ostarine.

Yeah. If I ever do go with the Ostarine route, I'll probably use Clomid and Nolva. I'm still thinking about it since a reputable member suggested that I'll be better off with 1-DHEA + 4-DHEA combo and EC Stack.

No, you don't need both Clomid and Nolva for ostarine. If you are that worried about gyno, run a low dose aromasin during ostarine and into pct. An aromatase inhibitor really isn't necessary for ostarine. Save the 1-dhea and 4-dhea for bulking, you just need a mild anabolic for cutting and ostarine fits the bill. You said that you're not very experienced with this stuff, I think ostarine is good to get your feet wet.

 

[ReinalHot61]

Don't be afraid of using a serm for pct, considering you're already willing to put a research chemical in your body, why not use a serm that at least has years of studies behind them, and for that matter is probably safer than using a sarm like ostarine.



No, you don't need both Clomid and Nolva for ostarine. If you are that worried about gyno, run a low dose aromasin during ostarine and into pct. An aromatase inhibitor really isn't necessary for ostarine. Save the 1-dhea and 4-dhea for bulking, you just need a mild anabolic for cutting and ostarine fits the bill. You said that you're not very experienced with this stuff, I think ostarine is good to get your feet wet.

kissdadookie told me that I'll actually get more from 1-AD/4-AD rather than Ostarine since it's best for just sparing the muscle on an extremely low deficit.

Can you give any advice regarding 1-AD/4-AD?

 

[kissdadookie]

Don't be afraid of using a serm for pct, considering you're already willing to put a research chemical in your body, why not use a serm that at least has years of studies behind them, and for that matter is probably safer than using a sarm like ostarine.



No, you don't need both Clomid and Nolva for ostarine. If you are that worried about gyno, run a low dose aromasin during ostarine and into pct. An aromatase inhibitor really isn't necessary for ostarine. Save the 1-dhea and 4-dhea for bulking, you just need a mild anabolic for cutting and ostarine fits the bill. You said that you're not very experienced with this stuff, I think ostarine is good to get your feet wet.

IMHO, Ostarine is so weak so the dheas really are a much better choice for something mild and highly effective at recomping/cutting at moderate doses (1-dhea @ 300 mg, 4-dhea @ 200 mg). Far more effective than ostarine especially if the goal is to get the best results in a relatively short period (~8 weeks).

 

[max d]

Don't be afraid of using a serm for pct, considering you're already willing to put a research chemical in your body, why not use a serm that at least has years of studies behind them, and for that matter is probably safer than using a sarm like ostarine.

Yeah the problem is I got burnt on my last real cycle (high dose 1-andro) and got some bunk nolva (it was way underdosed). So, since the ost isn't too bad on shut down I'd go with OTC pct as its more reliable. I have a bunch of epi but I'm waiting to find a good source of pharm grade nolva. Everytime I think I find one online I do more research of people getting jipped. Anyways, just my 2 cents on osta pct.

 

[megamatt68]

IMHO, Ostarine is so weak so the dheas really are a much better choice for something mild and highly effective at recomping/cutting at moderate doses (1-dhea @ 300 mg, 4-dhea @ 200 mg). Far more effective than ostarine especially if the goal is to get the best results in a relatively short period (~8 weeks).

I think if the OP was looking to bulk, he would see FAR better results from 1-dhea and 4-dhea. But, he will be in a calorie deficit, so I think the difference won't be as magnified. I just think that ostarine is a good option to get his feet wet, and having run all three compounds we are discussing, I think that the side effects would be worse from the 1-dhea and 4-dhea.

 

[kissdadookie]

I think if the OP was looking to bulk, he would see FAR better results from 1-dhea and 4-dhea. But, he will be in a calorie deficit, so I think the difference won't be as magnified. I just think that ostarine is a good option to get his feet wet, and having run all three compounds we are discussing, I think that the side effects would be worse from the 1-dhea and 4-dhea.

Not at all. There's even the 1-dhea study from last year showing just slight negative impact on health markers (relative, they were still in acceptable ranges that can be easily recovered from). The 4-dhea is also there as a very light test base. So the use of 4-dhea is to offset possibly lethargy, help lessen impact on libido, as well as provide a little bit of estrogen since 1-dhea does not aromatize.

Effect-wise, that 1-dhea is going to do a heck of lot more than the ostarine is going to do for both gains as well as fat loss (again, see the study from last year). Fat loss alone, it's far more effective. The anabolic effects will also be very effective at retaining lbm.

Perhaps at the typical forum-recommended doses of 1-dhea you would get compounded sides (typically forum members like to suggest a minimum of 600 mg of 1-dhea to be effective, from both personal experience as well as the data published last year, ~300 mg is quite effective).

 

[ReinalHot61]

Thanks KDD for clearing things up. I have ordered 1-AD and 4-AD. Just going to order the clomid next. I don't need Nolva anymore right?

 

[kissdadookie]

Thanks KDD for clearing things up. I have ordered 1-AD and 4-AD. Just going to order the clomid next. I don't need Nolva anymore right?

Clomid should be fine.

 

[ReinalHot61]

Thanks again KDD.

I'm just really hoping that I won't get sides from 1-AD/4-AD. Especially the hair loss. If I do experience it, is it ok to stop the cycle?

 

[kissdadookie]

Thanks again KDD.

I'm just really hoping that I won't get sides from 1-AD/4-AD. Especially the hair loss. If I do experience it, is it ok to stop the cycle?

Yes, but that's not really going to happen here. Hair loss is typically due to DHT, neither of these compounds are pro DHT.

 

[ReinalHot61]

Yes, but that's not really going to happen here. Hair loss is typically due to DHT, neither of these compounds are pro DHT.

Thanks again man. Damn. I can't really thank you enough for your help. Excited to start it already. Mind if I hit you up on updates whenever I start?

 

[kissdadookie]

Thanks again man. Damn. I can't really thank you enough for your help. Excited to start it already. Mind if I hit you up on updates whenever I start?

Sure.

 

[megamatt68]

Thanks again KDD.

I'm just really hoping that I won't get sides from 1-AD/4-AD. Especially the hair loss. If I do experience it, is it ok to stop the cycle?

Any anabolic has the possibility to cause hair loss, they don't need to be DHT derivatives. The hair loss shouldn't be that bad, although I got some from 1-dhea and I usually don't shed on cycle, but use your better judgment on when you feel like stopping the cycle.

 

[ReinalHot61]

Any anabolic has the possibility to cause hair loss, they don't need to be DHT derivatives. The hair loss shouldn't be that bad, although I got some from 1-dhea and I usually don't shed on cycle, but use your better judgment on when you feel like stopping the cycle.

Did it grow back or is it permanent?

 

[megamatt68]

Did it grow back or is it permanent?

It seemed to have grown back, wasn't that noticeable. It's just odd because I've taken more androgenic compounds and didn't shed like I did on 1-andro. The gains were good, so I'd say it was worth a few hairs and a dry itchy scalp.

 

[kissdadookie]

Any anabolic has the possibility to cause hair loss, they don't need to be DHT derivatives. The hair loss shouldn't be that bad, although I got some from 1-dhea and I usually don't shed on cycle, but use your better judgment on when you feel like stopping the cycle.

How much were you dosing at?

 

[BARKODE]

How much were you dosing at?

Wanna know the answer to this one as well.

 

[megamatt68]

How much were you dosing at?

200mg ramped up to 400mg for the final 2 weeks of the cycle. I loved 1-andro as well, despite any shedding or scalp itchiness I had. On a side note, I never shed on stano though, which was a pro dht prohormone, and ran stano up to 1400 mg per day, stacked with another high dosed dht derived prohormone. That was a different cycle that I did, which leads me to believe that I am not really prone to shedding, yet experienced it on 1-andro.