[Jag]

i've been trying in vain to find this article i read on Testosterone where it said that too much fiber can decrease test levels but can't find it anywhere

i can't remember exactly what it said but it did make sense though.

can anyone provide me any info on this?

also what is the maximum you can eat before it has an effect on test levels.

i eat plenty of broccolli, cauli & All Bran. in fact you could say my diet is pretty much protein and fiber.

Jag

[Physicist]

I don't know of any article, but I did a search on Pubmed.

There's several studies that found a positive correlation between sex hormone binding globulin (SHBG) and fiber intake. Higher SHBG would leave less testosterone available for use.
Most of those studies didn't independently test fiber, they tested low fat/high fiber, and thier main interest was prostate or breast cancer.

This 21-year old article comes closest to what your asking about.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...t_uids=6298507

[Dan]

Maybe its not the high fiber that does it, but rather the low fat. I remember reading something about diets without enough fat lowering test levels. Could also be from low carbs. I don't see how fiber would have any impact since your body doesn't systemically absorb it.

[Cardinal]

Some people claim that very high amounts of fiber might meaningfully impair fat absoprtion. I have no clue if it does this significantly or not. I have certainly consumed metric tons of various fibers each day. I take my fish oil separately from the fiber to be safe.

[stryder]

Another aspect is fiber contains high amounts of phytates which hinders phytase, an enzyme that helps the absorption of certain minerals such as calcium, magnesium, and zinc. Key minerals which aids in the manufacturing of testosterone...

[Yukon Cornelius]

hmm.....


wonder why certain people are taking calcium, magnesium and zinc....

[xil]

What are the differences between things like calcium citrate, carbonate etc? I remember reading about how say zinc, different forms are absorbed better than others... Also, other than antioxidant properties, would supplementing with these really matter? Honestly I never notice the difference between taking multi's and other extra vitamins... i just take it for the sake of taking it

[Dan]

Calcium citrate has better bioavailability than carbonate (chalk). Zinc and other minerals ar best absorbed when they are bound to protein (in meat or in a supplement that has protein bound minerals). Multis aren't really anything you notice a difference from because the effect they have on your body is more long-term.

[200wannabe]

You need to be careful with zinc supplimentation or you can cause a copper deficency.

Zinc is depleted by the following drugs: Penicillamine, steroids, ethanol, diuretics, and oral contraceptives. Zinc is often promoted to "enhance immunity". It is an essential mineral for immune function. Perhaps because of its immune promoting role, deficiencies in zinc may be helpful in autoimmune diseases. Zinc concentrations are referred to copper, and the minerals tend to have a reciprocal relationship. A low tissue concentration of copper may result from zinc supplements. A suggested optimal zinc to copper ratio is 8:1.



Copper intake of 2-3 mg / day is usually suggested for adults. Copper is actively transported through the intestinal wall, carried in a special protein, ceruloplasmin, in the blood, and stored in the liver. Vitamin C and zinc in excess interfere with copper availability. Copper deficiency results anemia, that may be indistinguishable from iron deficiency.

[Yukon Cornelius]

Originally Posted by xil

Also, other than antioxidant properties, would supplementing with these really matter?

Of course it matters. Depeding on your diet calcium excretion can be rather high on high protein diets. Resistant training (especially while dieting) alone can make you zinc deficient and all three help with hormone levels, immune function, fat loss, etc....

Just because yo cant feel anything doens't mean they are not helping.

[Yukon Cornelius]

Originally Posted by 200wannabe

You need to be careful with zinc supplimentation or you can cause a copper deficency.

Zinc is depleted by the following drugs: Penicillamine, steroids, ethanol, diuretics, and oral contraceptives. Zinc is often promoted to "enhance immunity". It is an essential mineral for immune function. Perhaps because of its immune promoting role, deficiencies in zinc may be helpful in autoimmune diseases. Zinc concentrations are referred to copper, and the minerals tend to have a reciprocal relationship. A low tissue concentration of copper may result from zinc supplements. A suggested optimal zinc to copper ratio is 8:1.



Copper intake of 2-3 mg / day is usually suggested for adults. Copper is actively transported through the intestinal wall, carried in a special protein, ceruloplasmin, in the blood, and stored in the liver. Vitamin C and zinc in excess interfere with copper availability. Copper deficiency results anemia, that may be indistinguishable from iron deficiency.

This is true with about every Vitamin and mineral. Too much can cause problems and there is always a balance but I would take this with a grain of salt. There is always someeone reminding us how bad it can be if abused. I don't recommend anyone taking over an extra 50mg per day. IN fact all you really need is around 30mg if you are consistenly weight training.

BTW- The above arguument can also be used for iron (by interferring with transferrin) as well as copper but as long as you don't megadose frequently, there won't be a problem.

[Jag]

Originally Posted by Bobo

hmm.....


wonder why certain people are taking calcium, magnesium and zinc....

Bobo,

does calcium really have that much of a negative effect on zinc if taken at the same time?
i read this only once (bb.com i think).

i follow a high protein diet most of the time swapping between carbs & fats to make up calories.
i take a cal/mag combo before bed which has 2.5 mg of zinc gluconate

would adding another 50 mg of zinc have any negative affect? this has caused much confusion in my brain.

i sometimes have a shake with cassein & a few whole eggs before bed as well.
would that have any effect on absorbtion of the supps?

sorry for alll the questions but i'd really like to get clear on this once & for all.

thanks Bobo.

Jag

[stryder]

I've read the general rule of thumb is that vitamins and minerals actually absorb better when taken with food...

[Yukon Cornelius]

Originally Posted by Jag

Bobo,

does calcium really have that much of a negative effect on zinc if taken at the same time?
i read this only once (bb.com i think).

i follow a high protein diet most of the time swapping between carbs & fats to make up calories.
i take a cal/mag combo before bed which has 2.5 mg of zinc gluconate

would adding another 50 mg of zinc have any negative affect? this has caused much confusion in my brain.

i sometimes have a shake with cassein & a few whole eggs before bed as well.
would that have any effect on absorbtion of the supps?

sorry for alll the questions but i'd really like to get clear on this once & for all.

thanks Bobo.

Jag

1. No, I don't believe it.

2. No, it would be fine.

3. No, as stryder said, they absorb better with food.

Hope that helps.

[stryder]

Also, chelated minerals (minerals bound to an amino acid) actually absorb better, because aminos are so essential to the body (read Bobo's protein articles) the body goes to "grab" the aminos and takes in the mineral along with it...

[Jag]

[quote=Bobo]1. No, I don't believe it.

2. No, it would be fine.

3. No, as stryder said, they absorb better with food.

Hope that helps.[/QUOTE

yes it has, thanks.

i think Big Cat said it in one of his articles and everyone just thought it was gospel & spread the word!!

Jag