[cbcortez]

Hi there guys, this has been touched on before but i dont think theyve actually given a clear cut answer. Bobo's stand point with cardio in the morning is that if you are in a caloric deficit you should stay away from HIIT since it is pretty catabolic at that particular time. Its kinda logical for me so lets take that as a given shall we.....now the question before was if i consume a pre and post workout shake with protein and carbs will it help minimize the catabolic effects that i can even use HIIT with less catabolism versus if i had not taken a shake....enough for me to lose more fat due to EPOC and still keep muscle.....(disclaimer : yes i will lose some muscle what im saying is that will the shake help lessen it to a good extent that HIIT is now possible for a cardio system).

Oh and BoBo also said that we shouldnt have fats after a workout, but if we will it should be MCTs. Now what if my post workout shake is 2 scoops oats, 2 scoops optimum nutrition whey and 1 scoop muscle milk? Will it be ok? Muscle milk has some MCTs albeit not all the fat count is MCTs...im asking coz this is damn good stuff hehehe.....

Will it hinder me so much if i put that 1 scoop of MM in? Thanks guys!!


Edit: I added this.....One more thing...no one has really given their scientific and or logical answer to what to take after low to medium intensity cardio...

I was thinking pre cardio i will take my usual 1 scoop of oats and 1 scoop of ON whey...and sometimes add half a scoop of Muscle milk hehehehe (addict!). But after the workout im lost....do i still drink my usual (2 oats 2 ON and 1 MM) or is it too much?? SHould i skip the carbs and just go protein or cut it to 1 scoop oats?? thanks.....

[Chunky]

You could take a pre workout (pre HIIT cardio shake, prot and carb) but it would cancel the benefit of doing cardio on empty stomach. Sure you would boost up your metabolism for the rest of the day (burning more calories when resting) but from what I've read here, I think you're in search of a way to do cardio that will burn more fat.

If you are eating something before that will increase your blood sugar before doing cardio, well you will use the carbs ingested for energy during your cardio session, while doing a low intensity cardio on empty stomach, you will minimize muscle's use and burn fat.

[cbcortez]

Originally Posted by Chunky

You could take a pre workout (pre HIIT cardio shake, prot and carb) but it would cancel the benefit of doing cardio on empty stomach. Sure you would boost up your metabolism for the rest of the day (burning more calories when resting) but from what I've read here, I think you're in search of a way to do cardio that will burn more fat.

If you are eating something before that will increase your blood sugar before doing cardio, well you will use the carbs ingested for energy during your cardio session, while doing a low intensity cardio on empty stomach, you will minimize muscle's use and burn fat.

hmmmm, i thought that if you do low intensity cardio the preferred energy is from fat? Meaning even if you have blood glucose floating in your system after 20 mins your body turns to fat since you are doing a light enough workout that you have ample supply of oxygen. I always thought that the body uses all energy sources at the same time but it does have preferences when the activity gets too intense (glucose in blood, and muscular glycogen).

Im just interested in the fact that HIIT can actually increase my metabolism the whole day meaning more fat burned after the exercise. Which brings me to another question.

People say that you can actually feel EPOC meaning after the workout and even after taking a shower, you can still feel the heat and you can still sweat. This happened to me when i was starting out last year and a half ago but as time went on i lost that effect. Does this mean that i am not experiencing EPOC?? coz if im not then im a stupid dork who doesnt know how to do HIIT, but even after weight training i dont expereince it anymore.

And can anyone shed some light on my
2 scoops oats, 2 scoops Optimum Nutrition 100% whey, and 1 scoop Muscle Milk in water questions

1) Is this too much for me? im currently around 6'2" and 190lbs. 2 scoops oats is around 60grams (40g of carbs, approx 6g fat), 2 scoops on is 44g protein, 1 scoop MM is around 16g protein and around 9g fat. Is the fat content hurting me either coz its slowing down the absorption of nutrients into my body or 2) fat is too high in my shake

2) post a light to moderate intensity cardio, which i do during off week, do i cut out the oats pre workout shake (1 scoop oats, 1 scoop on, half scoop MM) and then cut oats from post workout shake as stated above?

Also, Bobo said that 25-30g of carbs prewokout is all thats necessary for insulin to increase? does this mean we shouldnt be taking in carbs after workout anymore? coz ive always been under the impression that we should.

2 years ago i was 275lbs. i did my workout 3-4 times a week and cardio for 30 mins first then weights. After a year i moved to weights first then cardio. All on an empty stomach, and i was wondering why the heck i wasnt building muscle....i was also on a caloric deficit....WAHHHH!!!! now i know what happened......im slimmer now but i still have this stupid GUT! damn this gut it wont come off!!

[cbcortez]

Anyone got any ideas??

[DieTrying]

Originally Posted by cbcortez

And can anyone shed some light on my
2 scoops oats, 2 scoops Optimum Nutrition 100% whey, and 1 scoop Muscle Milk in water questions

Main two problems I see hear are overall overconsumption and too much fat. Although I don't know what your definition of a scoop of oats is, I know that a scoop of Optimum has about 23 grams of protein, a 1/2 cup of oats has around 5 grams of protein, and however much is in a scoop of Muscle Milk= PROBABLY MORE THAN 60 GRAMS OF PROTEIN. I see your a big fan of Bobo's work (so am I)...go read his debate with Iron Addict concerning how much protein can be consumed in one sitting.

I know that a lot of people love Muscle Milk, but holy **** if that isn't alot of calories (18 grams of fat if I am not mistaken)..I would stay away from that stuff, but thats just my opinion.

[cbcortez]

I think they have 2 scoops per serving thats the one outlined in the back on their labels. which ends up as 32g protein 18g fat and some carbs....

what i do is put in just 1 scoop of MM in my shake which would be 16g protein and 9 fat.

When i say 1 scoop of oats i use the ON scooper which is like ~30g weight.

hope this helps.

my shake ends up to be around 600cals.

130 cals per scoop oats x 2 = 260
110 cals per scoop on x 2 = 220
130 cals per scoop MM x 1 = 130

equals 610cals

whatyathink?

[Yukon Cornelius]

Originally Posted by cbcortez

Hi there guys, this has been touched on before but i dont think theyve actually given a clear cut answer. Bobo's stand point with cardio in the morning is that if you are in a caloric deficit you should stay away from HIIT since it is pretty catabolic at that particular time. Its kinda logical for me so lets take that as a given shall we.....now the question before was if i consume a pre and post workout shake with protein and carbs will it help minimize the catabolic effects that i can even use HIIT with less catabolism versus if i had not taken a shake....enough for me to lose more fat due to EPOC and still keep muscle.....(disclaimer : yes i will lose some muscle what im saying is that will the shake help lessen it to a good extent that HIIT is now possible for a cardio system).

Oh and BoBo also said that we shouldnt have fats after a workout, but if we will it should be MCTs. Now what if my post workout shake is 2 scoops oats, 2 scoops optimum nutrition whey and 1 scoop muscle milk? Will it be ok? Muscle milk has some MCTs albeit not all the fat count is MCTs...im asking coz this is damn good stuff hehehe.....

Will it hinder me so much if i put that 1 scoop of MM in? Thanks guys!!


Edit: I added this.....One more thing...no one has really given their scientific and or logical answer to what to take after low to medium intensity cardio...

I was thinking pre cardio i will take my usual 1 scoop of oats and 1 scoop of ON whey...and sometimes add half a scoop of Muscle milk hehehehe (addict!). But after the workout im lost....do i still drink my usual (2 oats 2 ON and 1 MM) or is it too much?? SHould i skip the carbs and just go protein or cut it to 1 scoop oats?? thanks.....

1. HIIT will produce hormonal repsonses similar to weight training so treat it the same (pre-post workout shake).

2. MM has some MCT's but it doens't matter because the majority of fats contained are saturated. That will negate the postiive effects of the MCT's so its relatively pointless. IMO, MM sucks. Sorry

3. I have given plenty of scientific reasons on what to take after those exercises. Low intensity directly releases triglycerides better than any exercise but diet will oxidizes them. HIIT and weight trianing OTOH oxidize circulating FFA's better than any type of exercise but alos has a greater chance of increasing gluconeogenesis so you msut adjust diet accordinly. Post workout shake after low intensity with C/P. HIIT, pre and post workout with C/P. Keep fat low for both.

4. You are taking way too many calories pre workout. Dump the MM, split the shake in two and take one pre and post.


If you are weight training 4+ times per week there is no need for HIIT cardio. If you only weight train 2-3 times per week at a relatively low volume then you can incorporate HIIT.

Incorporating HIIT with BB type weight training will lead to overtraining, muscle loss, burnout and weakened immune system over the long haul.

[cbcortez]

Thanks bobo and again the clown speaks and everyones listens
Just FYI the 610 cal shake is post workout hehehe....

My Pre workout is just 1 scoop oats (130cal) 1 scoop ON (110 cal) half a scoop MM (70cal) so all in all 300 cals.

I have read that a good postworkout shake is around 0.25g per target lb bw for protein and 0.5g per lb target weight for carbs - this is for a weight training day.

Pre workout is 0.15g protein per lb target weight and 0.33g carbs per lb target weight.

so for light cardio i can dump the pre workout shake and still keep the same ratios for the postworkout shae or do i drop the carb intake a bit? what would be a good baseline carb intake 0.25g per target weight?

Thanks again dude!

oh and not too sound stupid i did get the fact that i can just split my post workout shake like you suggested....just trying to make a baseline ratio so that when people ask me in the gym i can give them good advice....people sometimes ask me stuff coz when they learn i lost 85lbs they just ask you a lot of questions....of course they dont know the difference between fat and muscle weight but then again i take it as a way to start them on the right footing and i suggest them to go here and BB.com for more reading.