What is everyone advice on the anabolic diet?

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    What is everyone advice on the anabolic diet?


    So I stumbled across this diet and have to say... It' seems very intriguing.... Eggs n bacon for breakfast, cheeseburgers fr lunch, steak for dinner, no carbs like breads..... Sounds really really good..... But does it work?

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    more or less yep. watching total calories is still important though, but overall you are somewhat less likely to store calories from eaten fat as fat than calories from carbs.
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    Yeah atkins diet is legit. Works better the more you weigh though, and I personally wouldn't do it if your bodyfat % is below 15%.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    more or less yep. watching total calories is still important though, but overall you are somewhat less likely to store calories from eaten fat as fat than calories from carbs.
    I think you meant fats get stored more easier because the process required is easier then protein or carbohydrates!
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    Quote Originally Posted by JajaNe20 View Post
    I think you meant fats get stored more easier because the process required is easier then protein or carbohydrates!
    nope, sure don't. The insulin effect from additional carbs is more likely to force fat storage than the same amount of additional calories from fat, just due to that insulin difference.
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    Well I am not going to argue, sorry to inform you I learned this in Nutrtion II which is an advanced course last semester! I am not trying to be a smart a$s, I am just trying to relay "Correct" information instead of myths.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JajaNe20
    Well I am not going to argue, sorry to inform you I learned this in Nutrtion II which is an advanced course last semester! I am not trying to be a smart a$s, I am just trying to relay "Correct" information instead of myths.
    I've heard that used plenty of times by nutritionists spreading incorrect information.
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    Low carb (no sugar) / high protein / moderate fat = epic win

    works for me no matter what my goal is. If it's a cut, then be very strict with the carbs, if it's a bulk, don't shy away from the carbs.

    lost 44 lbs on a 3-month cut with this diet, and recently put on 20lb lean mass with the same diet...go figure
    -It's not about what you're doing, it's about how you're doing it.
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    There were studies done on individual groups eating isocaloric diets of either fat, protein, or carbohydrates. Each group was to ingest 1000 calories with ~90% coming from their respective macronutrient. The fat and protein groups lost weight while the carb group either stayed the same or gained some. There are numerous physiological mechanisms behind this, and that study was well as many others shows you that the traditional dietetics courses base their curriculum on outdated information.

    My advice for the OP on his attempt at the anabolic diet is to really watch the carb load time. Based on my personal, as well as many others, experiences, the 5-on-2-off approach outlined in the book is simply too great a window for carbs. I found that having an entire weekend for carbs gave me too much "spillover". I feel a 4-on-1-off approach provides the greatest results while also being psychologically easier.

    For the low carb days jus make sure to eat your fatty protein/meat sources, get some fiber, and watch the carbs from nuts and some high starch veggies.
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    I always thought staying away from carbs became catabolic or at least wasn't anabolic?
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    Hmm no use arhuing with a lost cause. You guys have to realize limitations, exercise, and others before you "bark" with your studies. Someone being sedentary will not need carbohydrates as much as someone being vigorously active. EASY it's okay to be wrong sometimes lil man
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    The fat and protein groups lost weight while the carb group either stayed the same or gained some
    ^ Also carbs hold onto water therefore could have caused the weight to stay steady as opposed to the other people's diets who didn't have carbohydrates in which they would have lost a significant amount of water weight. Let's use our heads here guys instead of reading an abstract! BAHAHA
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    I'll start throwing in some studies now. Granted, these are on fat loss, rather than fat gain for the most part.

    http://www.annals.org/content/140/10/769.full

    http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5304a3.htm - this one is relevant to fat gain + obesity.

    http://www.ers.usda.gov/publications...frjan2000b.pdf

    http://www.thelancet.com/journals/la...748-4/abstract - somewhat indirect, showing insulin causes cholesterol + fat synthesis on arterial walls

    http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa022637

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...00273-0082.pdf

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/662209

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15971409

    I can find hundreds more. Your teacher taught what he believed, which is not necessarily related to reality, but more to what his teacher believed when he was learning.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JajaNe20 View Post
    The fat and protein groups lost weight while the carb group either stayed the same or gained some
    ^ Also carbs hold onto water therefore could have caused the weight to stay steady as opposed to the other people's diets who didn't have carbohydrates in which they would have lost a significant amount of water weight. Let's use our heads here guys instead of reading an abstract! BAHAHA
    Right use your head, carbs don't hold an unlimited amount of water. you are pretty lucky in average individual if water retention from glycogen amounts to 4lbs, in longer term studies that difference would disappear over a 12 week study. Try again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JajaNe20 View Post
    Hmm no use arhuing with a lost cause. You guys have to realize limitations, exercise, and others before you "bark" with your studies. Someone being sedentary will not need carbohydrates as much as someone being vigorously active. EASY it's okay to be wrong sometimes lil man
    Hey, when i'm wrong, i'll admit it, but i'm not here. In large scale demographic studies involving thousands, at similar calories higher carbohydrate intake (particularly sugar + refined flour) is very strongly correlated with higher bodyfat, higher heart disease, higher triglycerides and higher VLDL fat.
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    So as you all understand, most of the incorrect nutritional information that is still pressed by nutrition educators and specialists is based off the early (WWII) discovery of the ability to measure serum cholesterol and the erroneous assumption that it was particuarly related to heart disease. Ancel Keys ran some horribly flawed studies, disregarded anything contrary, dropped non-agreeing results from his papers, ignored the actual results from his study and came to a different conclusion than the data showed, and ran a huge basically political and marketing campaign forcing his low fat high carbohydrate strategy onto the masses. Once the American Heart Association glommed onto his work and pushed it as well, the fate was sealed.

    Most nutritionists still believe in and follow this as on most campuses, attempting to disagree with those theories is akin to disagreeing with evolution. But science doesn't support it.
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    Hmmmm anabolic diet? Is this popular with many pros? Sounds like a nice diet in aas
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    It seems more of a cutting diet
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    I agree with you Easy. But how is this an anabolic diet? It definitely is a great diet for weight loss, but I don't see it being good for building muscle either.
    Always thought thats why a lot of people carb cycled?
    Last edited by jaycuda; 08-18-2011 at 04:19 PM. Reason: forgot with*
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaycuda View Post
    I agree you Easy. But how is this an anabolic diet? It definitely is a great diet for weight loss, but I don't see it being good for building muscle either.
    Always thought thats why a lot of people carb cycled?
    Well, vs lower fat diets and/or protein diets, at least it insures maximum testosterone levels, as well as abundant protein.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JajaNe20 View Post
    Well I am not going to argue, sorry to inform you I learned this in Nutrtion II which is an advanced course last semester! I am not trying to be a smart a$s, I am just trying to relay "Correct" information instead of myths.
    And you do realize that most teachers have curriculums that they have to adhere to even if this disagree with right? Most likely your teacher was just an idiot. I was told in my nutrition class that eating more than 60g protein would damage my kidneys for Christ sake. Easy is 100% correct! The lipid hypothesis is unfounded and has been challenged and debunked several times already.

    Quote Originally Posted by kevinhy View Post
    There were studies done on individual groups eating isocaloric diets of either fat, protein, or carbohydrates. Each group was to ingest 1000 calories with ~90% coming from their respective macronutrient. The fat and protein groups lost weight while the carb group either stayed the same or gained some. There are numerous physiological mechanisms behind this, and that study was well as many others shows you that the traditional dietetics courses base their curriculum on outdated information.

    My advice for the OP on his attempt at the anabolic diet is to really watch the carb load time. Based on my personal, as well as many others, experiences, the 5-on-2-off approach outlined in the book is simply too great a window for carbs. I found that having an entire weekend for carbs gave me too much "spillover". I feel a 4-on-1-off approach provides the greatest results while also being psychologically easier.

    For the low carb days jus make sure to eat your fatty protein/meat sources, get some fiber, and watch the carbs from nuts and some high starch veggies.
    Kev do you have info on that study? I read a mention to this study in either protein power or 4hr body (I can't remember but I think one of them) and I tried to find the actual study and I couldn't find it.
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    I always like carbs right after my work out for the insulin spike since your blood sugar levels are lower.(you know it reduces fat storage and puts you in a more anabolic state.) Potatoes<3
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    So this turned out great... I'll start this diet probally next month.... See how it goes.... Just no carbs seems easy when I love meat and eggs and hotdogs etc....
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    Quote Originally Posted by Machwon1 View Post
    So this turned out great... I'll start this diet probally next month.... See how it goes.... Just no carbs seems easy when I love meat and eggs and hotdogs etc....
    Definitely a good diet to help you get down to a solid weight. I would never use it below 15% bodyfat since I really think it can be catabolic.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaycuda View Post
    Definitely a good diet to help you get down to a solid weight. I would never use it below 15% bodyfat since I really think it can be catabolic.
    I disagree, provided you're doing weekly refeeds theres no reason this diet would be any less catabolic than another. I live entirely on a diet thats very similar to the AD, bulking or cutting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    Kev do you have info on that study? I read a mention to this study in either protein power or 4hr body (I can't remember but I think one of them) and I tried to find the actual study and I couldn't find it.
    I cant seem to bring the full text back up, but its this study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/13347103

    Theres a wealth of knowledge that compares the effects of low carb to carb based diets, and they often conclude the same findings - Low carbohydrate diets show greater improvements in body composition and risk factors vs. opposing diets.
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    Im with the higher fat higher protein group, my only proof is in my energy levels and the improvements to my physique
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    Well in that case, I want my money back! It's bullshi* that I payed for an innaccurate class that cost me 3,000$. My apologies everyone, it was what I was taught
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    Quote Originally Posted by JajaNe20 View Post
    Well in that case, I want my money back! It's bullshi* that I payed for an innaccurate class that cost me 3,000$. My apologies everyone, it was what I was taught
    Thats the name of the game, I'm going to school to be a RD and at times you just have to accept the "traditional approaches" in order to excel in academics. Like I've said, they simply base the curriculum on outdated methodologies and studies.
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    Dont worry man i was taught similar things in my nutrition class and at my job (vitamin shoppe) lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by JajaNe20
    Well in that case, I want my money back! It's bullshi* that I payed for an innaccurate class that cost me 3,000$. My apologies everyone, it was what I was taught
    It is largely political which is sad. Look at the food pyramid and guess how much support a high fat, no grains high protein diet gets ? But all evidence points to that sort of diet having the lowest incidence of obesity, diabetes, cancer, and a bunch of other issues. Wonder why obesity has skyrocketed since the 70s? That was when children who grew up hearing the AHA's "low fat, high carb with fiber" message startes becoming adults, and began raising their children eating less eggs, less bacon, but more waffles and pancakes.

    I'll still argue though that the evidence that there is less muscle loss in a ketogenic diet as most guys do it is almost nonexistent. To be a real ketogenic diet a 15% bf 200lb guy would have to eat only around 130 g protein a day. More than that and a good amount gets turned to glucose via gluconeogenesis anyhow, ruining the ketogenic state.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    It is largely political which is sad. Look at the food pyramid and guess how much support a high fat, no grains high protein diet gets ? But all evidence points to that sort of diet having the lowest incidence of obesity, diabetes, cancer, and a bunch of other issues. Wonder why obesity has skyrocketed since the 70s? That was when children who grew up hearing the AHA's "low fat, high carb with fiber" message startes becoming adults, and began raising their children eating less eggs, less bacon, but more waffles and pancakes.

    I'll still argue though that the evidence that there is less muscle loss in a ketogenic diet as most guys do it is almost nonexistent. To be a real ketogenic diet a 15% bf 200lb guy would have to eat only around 130 g protein a day. More than that and a good amount gets turned to glucose via gluconeogenesis anyhow, ruining the ketogenic state.
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    Am on day 30 of Anabolic Diet ....


    This was new for me ... previously I had done Atkins with limited success ... had to go below 15 net carbs / day to drop (it's always been hard for me to lose) - i was not losing on 20net carb/day and was feeling weak during training... I decided to make a solid go with the Anabolic Diet because it was difficult to do under 15 carb or even 20/day so the 30net carb allowance on the Anabolic was really attractive, plus it promised strength gains ... lemme tell you - i feel like superwoman! my strength has gone through the roof!! I am really amazed ... i think it's the added protein ... I end up eating so much more calories then I'm used to on this plan ( I normally shoot for 1200 - 1500) but with this plan, I average 1900! Still, I managed to lose 2 pounds - not much but I hope it will continue as I want to drop at least 20pds. I agree w/ some of the other posters that 2days carb up is a bit drawn out ... I have done 2 carb ups (one was just one day and the other was a full weekend) but I think I may try to see how 4 day low carb and 1 day carb up works, maybe it will speed things up for me ... we'll see. I also plan to start dropping the calories a bit and not go over 1700 on my low carb days plus add more cardio as I don't do much. My keto stick normally reads trace to small on low carb days - is that sufficient? do I need to be registering higher on the keto stick for fat loss? I was introduced to this plan by a friend at the gym, he does 5 days on and 2 days off works great for him and he is in top shape year round and has been doing this plan for years.
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    Keto stick readings are meaningless. You'd only have high ketones in your urine if you were creating more ketones than you are burning.
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    thx for the info!


    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Keto stick readings are meaningless. You'd only have high ketones in your urine if you were creating more ketones than you are burning.
    wow, that is good to know ... i had been stressing over the keto stix readings for apparently nothing ...

    So like after a carb up day I would typically follow with 2 days of depletion style training and wonder why my stix was still reading trace / small ... it was apparently because only the ketones that I did not burn were showing up on there. is that a correct interpretation of what you said?
    I was so sure I had to go down further on the carbs due to my stix not getting really dark.

    What are your thoughts about the Anabolic Diet's 30net carb limit? like for women (with a slow metabolism like mine that needs to be built up) and for my fat loss goals (between 20 - 25pds), do you think 30net is too much? Not that I'm complaining - I like being able to eat that much net carbs ... it's just that I only dropped 2pds in this month on this and would really prefer dropping at least 1pd / wk
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    Quote Originally Posted by JajaNe20 View Post
    Hmm no use arhuing with a lost cause. You guys have to realize limitations, exercise, and others before you "bark" with your studies. Someone being sedentary will not need carbohydrates as much as someone being vigorously active. EASY it's okay to be wrong sometimes lil man
    Go watch the documentary Fathead.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fitmom110

    wow, that is good to know ... i had been stressing over the keto stix readings for apparently nothing ...

    So like after a carb up day I would typically follow with 2 days of depletion style training and wonder why my stix was still reading trace / small ... it was apparently because only the ketones that I did not burn were showing up on there. is that a correct interpretation of what you said?
    I was so sure I had to go down further on the carbs due to my stix not getting really dark.

    What are your thoughts about the Anabolic Diet's 30net carb limit? like for women (with a slow metabolism like mine that needs to be built up) and for my fat loss goals (between 20 - 25pds), do you think 30net is too much? Not that I'm complaining - I like being able to eat that much net carbs ... it's just that I only dropped 2pds in this month on this and would really prefer dropping at least 1pd / wk
    30g isn't bad, so long as its moderately spread out. Have you been tracking calories accurately? Using a scale to weigh everything, measuring cups/spoons etc ?
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    Measuring ...


    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    30g isn't bad, so long as its moderately spread out. Have you been tracking calories accurately? Using a scale to weigh everything, measuring cups/spoons etc ?
    Measure only w/ cups & spoons ... I don't have a food scale ... may need to buy one soon ... what are your thoughts on the calories tho .... i read suggestions of body wt X 15 through 18 which is even more than I'm currently having.

    The spread is throughout the day ... typically start with coffee & protien drink 8am / then work out / another protein drink 11am / real food 12pm / 3pm / 5pm/ 7pm - those times are typical, not written in stone, sometimes I'll eat as late as 9pm if I didn't get all my protein in yet. Normally do the most carbs (veggies & 1/4c greek yogurt + protien & fats) meal after workout. It's hard to eat anything other than coffee and a protein drink in the morning because on this plan I just don't have an appetite until after I work out.
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    calorie suggestions are always a guessing game, so that may be a start point, but you have to change it to suit your actual goals as you are using it. You can get a decent digital food scale from Bed Bath And Beyond for $20.

    I was just interested in the carb spread, its slightly possible that taking them in all at once interferes somewhat as it would be a bit of a spike at that one moment, but still the amount you are taking in is pretty low.
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