- 05-19-2011, 06:25 PM
I have never done an all out cut and have decided to make it my goal this summer, starting in 2 weeks. I have a target of losing 40lbs in 3 months. I am open to any substance except DNP and GH. T3, clen, albuterol, all cutting steroids will be considered.
I want to lose this weight and maintain strength as much as possible as i train for powerlifting.
Background - 31 yrs old. 264lbs, BF betweeen 23 and 25% depending on scales. Been training for 6 years.
2 PH cycles - 1 x SD, 1 X p-plex and 1-t. Both successful.
Training - westside (raw). Cardio 3 x per week - slow/steady or HIIT; just depends on my energy levels.
Diet - good. Have carb cycled, low carbed and carb backloaded with varying results. Low carb - i.e only for breakfast and pre workout on training days and none on non-training days was my most successful run.
Other supplementation - am in the middle of my second ECA run and will run 2weeks of benadryl prior to starting any other cutting agents.
At the moment I have havoc on hand, all pct and ancilliaries etc. I am not sure though if this will successfully negate the catabolic effects of the t3. I am keen to hear opinions on this as I was planning on a 6 week havoc run. I still have half a bottle of 1-t and half a bottle of p-plex left as well but i am not keen on using them on a cut as I held water quite badly on them and the bloat was ridiculous. I have letro on hand though if i go down this road.
I can get most steroids readily and have been looking at the likes of test-e, winny or masteron, but i would preferably like to go down the oral route at the moment if possible.
Any and all opinions welcome.
MODS - by the way I have posted this in the Anabolics forum as well as i thought it was relevant there.
- 05-20-2011, 06:14 AM
05-20-2011, 09:12 PM
05-22-2011, 06:36 PM
05-23-2011, 10:45 AM
Too bad more haven't replied as I am in a similar situation and would love to hear what everyone has to say. I do have a couple of questions though. How long is your cardio? Have you thought about doing some fasted cardio in the morning in addition to the regular cardio. 40 lbs is a lot to lose, so you're probably going to have to pull out all the stops. Really no carbs on non-workout days, sounds painful. Also I am particularly interested to hear what people think about t3 with a prohormone. I have some t3 on the way and wonder whether people think adding a ph with it will be useful for preventing muscle wasting.
In any event, I hope you keep us updated as I would like to hear how it goes.
05-23-2011, 12:32 PM
Ok, I will pop out my 2 cents as no one has replied.
My goal set up March 1 st was to lose 40 lbs in 40 days. My Fiance laughed at me and said why dont we do by memorial day and the pool being open. I started out at 282lb. Very over weight, didnt do much of anything except eat and well, do stuff around the house when I get off work. So it might have been more attainable for me.
Ok so first, figure out what you need to stay alive. BMR -- find a calculator and times it by 1.2 and this is what you need to sustain (so they say). Next subtract 500 cals for 1 lb a week or 1000 cals a week for 2lbs. No one on this board will tell you to do anything different.
Here is what is key. Grab an app that will count calories and be true to yourself. Weigh your food for the first week, measure your food for the first week and really get an accurate count/measure of what you are putting into your body. I dont think there is a need to go to huge extremes, just simply make it easy and follow the guidelines. Sometimes you will go under, sometimes you will go over. Everyone does this and there is a synonym called "cycling" that fits this. Dont make it out harder than what you have to.
My supplements that I took: (Did they work, well I have dropped closed to 47 lbs...is it the supps? I will outline 1 that I know helped, all the rest, who knows?!?!)
Supplements: JACKED, OEP, ERASE, SHIFT, ALPHA T2, DIM
Upon waking (5AM): 2 scoops of Jacked + 1 OEP (Oxy Elite Pro)+ 2 PES Alpha T2 + 1 ERASE I did this first thing upon waking. Regardless of how lazy you feel, this will wake your butt up.
2 hours later (7AM), I mix 2 scoops of Isopure Low Carb Dutch Chocolate Protein Shake. 50 grams of Protein, 1 net carb and 220 cals. I also took 2 DIM pills (helps with lack of cruciferous vegetables; green beans, broccolli)
Around 10 AM, I eat 1 prepackaged MOTTS apples, its about a half an apple that is cut up. 60 cals/4 carbs.
Noon, I have another round of supps. 2 OEP, 1 ALPHA T2, 1 ERASE
Thirty Minutes Later: 1 ISOPURE SHAKE 220 cals, 1 carb, 50 grams of protein.
about 2 hours later: 1 package of Planters NUT-TRITION (Healthy Heart) 250 cals, 9 protein, 4 fat.
From this point, I make sure to eat a dinner that is compliant with my family. I am already at a calorie deficit on the day, my fat is in good, my protein is strong and I generally feel very strong. My Fiance and kid are slender so they dont suffer like I do. I make sure to cook healthy and "cleaner" but still give them what they need.
Dinners are always proportionate: Protein, Fat, CHO's. If my cals are higher in the day, I lower them at night by making sure we have more green beans at dinner. You can have a cup of greens and its only 20 cals. Chicken, Lean Meats, broccoli, whole wheats are always staples for dinner.
After Dinner/Before Bed I have 2 SHIFT and 1 ERASE. I dont eat after 7pm ever!!!! If its after 7, I drink water and call it a day. I "fast" from 7pm till 7 AM every day.
I stay around 1750 cals. People will say this is to low and I am going to burn muscle over fat. But at this stage in the game, I am looking to Cut and Melt Fat. I still incorporate weights in the morning (fasted) and I do cardio (fasted) as well. At first, it was a little rough as I would overdo stuff, but I got to where I can sense and feel my body react to certain things. Light headed (simple sugar/carb) .... Hunger Pangs (fill it with water).. cut out the crap that made you fat!!! Its simple and easy.
I would have to agree with Rosie from this board. Nutrition first, supplements second. I dont know how much anything helped accept the fact of my morning supplements always made me get off my arse. I never was lazy, cuz I couldn't sit still OEP may not be the best thermogenic on the market and 5% increase in body temp aint gonna help us fatties. But I will say, the ability for it to make your hunger dissappear is 1000% key. No hunger = greater ability to say "NO!". The weight will fall off, but you have to work. No miracle pills, just a whole lot of saying no and will power.
People will confuse you by telling you this and that...but if you look at what you do, you probably do a lot of what they say.
Intermittent Fasting -- not eating after 7 and fasting 12 hours.. big whoop..we already do it.
Fasted Training -- doing something first thing before eating, again, big whoop, we already do it.
Cardio vs Weights and which is better.... if you are cutting, do both. Cardio helps immediately and while your doing it. Weights help rebuild muscle and has caloric burning effects to rebuild.
Good Sleep -- does the most/best good.
I am sure my supps helped and I am now at 233.
If your outta shape, anything will work. Eat Cleaner, Move More and you WILL LOSE weight. When you hit a wall ... take a simple look at what your doing. As you lose weight your BMR will lower and you will need to adjust what your doing. Also, as you get your weight down, quit looking at the scale and look at the mirror. The scale will play tricks with your head. We want to lose fat more than we care about weight anyways Just as a fatty, its hard to not look at the scale!
I really hope this helps you out! I wish you the best and I will check back later. I may not have it 100% right, but you cant argue with the results. I went from 42 pants to 36 and my fiance is loving it. Prove'm wrong, you will win in the end
05-23-2011, 12:36 PM
05-23-2011, 12:39 PM
Wow davesfx, nice long reply, thank you. Just in from work and need to eat as for varying reasons i haven't for 6 hours. Will look at your post in more depth and get back to you. again, thanks and reps
Drudkh, will get back to you as well, thanks for showing an interest
05-23-2011, 12:44 PM
Anytime man, I will help as much as I can. I gained a lot of knowlede from this board... and will be honest, read a lot of stuff that doesn't make sense and seems very contradictory. Everyones body is different and we all respond to different measures. What works for one, may not work for others. Also, a lot of these folks are more advanced than the average fatty. Losing weight is easy. Get your mind right and your body will follow
05-23-2011, 08:54 PM
According to the Harris Benedict formula for daily caloric needs, you multiply BMR by 1.2 if you lead a sedentary life. You will need to multiply by more if you want to find the caloric needs for someone who is more active. You can find out how much more by google-ing the formula. You could, on the other hand, start with the daily caloric needs for you when you are sedentary and then add whatever calories that you burn through cardio and weights on a daily basis and that may be more accurate. This makes sense of Dave's 50 lbs lost in three months. If you lose 50 lbs in three months, you need to lose an average of about 4 lbs/week (4x12=48). In order to lose 4lbs/week one needs a calorie deficiency of 14,000/week (4x3500=14,000). In order to do that one needs a calorie deficiency of 2000/day. As Dave pointed out 1000 of those came from diet restriction. Therefore the rest had to have come from calories burnt.
This tells us two things. (1) Dave has an iron will. (2) We need some vet to tell us under what circumstances one could maintain their strength with calorie restriction approaching Dave's level.
05-23-2011, 09:24 PM
Oh forgot to talk about the effect of the supplements. All I really know in that respect is that ECA is supposed to allow you to drop about 2 extra lbs/month. That translates to about 250 calories extra/day. I have no idea how much extra stuff like clen and/or t3 are supposed to help. However, some did arrive today that I will use to lean out my dog. She is currently at the beginning of a month of EC though, so the data won't be available for some time.
05-23-2011, 11:50 PM
@Drukdh -- Thank you. I do have an iron will when it comes to dieting. I can not say the same for exercising. It is very easy once you can count everything you put in your body.
There is a reason each of us let ourselves go. Sure there is a small percent that has some type of clinical issue or thyroid problem, but the othre LARGE percentage just have to be accountable for what we do to ourselves. Plain and simple. Losing weight is not hard, burn more cals than you consume. Most try to overcomplicate and try to make it hard or use confusing terms. Call it exactly what you want, but Nutrition is key to living a healthier lifestyle. Everything else is second. And to actually requote myself earlier with correction. Diet is 1st, Exercise is 2nd, lastly we should be looking at supplements.
I am no vet, but I am 35 years old. I have constantly battled my weight. Like most of us, we started very young, had some type of injury, combined with a loss and it leaves us empty. Nothing to strive for. Being overweight and seeing a belly flap is disgusting. I lost my dad to heart disease and he was very overweight and I am quickly following his footsteps. Call my "Iron Will" a will to live past the years of my parents due to poor health. This is what drives me now.
For years, I pumped soda, crap, fast food in my body. Ate whatever I wanted becaue I wanted to be happy. I am a big boy, big boys need to eat. Since the beginning of march, I haven't stressed over the silly stuff. I found out what I needed, I found out what foods I could use and then when I craved something, I ate it. Just in smaller portions. I am now to a point, where I dont want the crap food that I lived on for years prior to this change.
They tell us that strict dieting doesn't work, because eventually we will have to come off of it and will rebound. Restricting calories to my extent may not work for most, but it did work for me. Have I lost some muscle in the process. I am sure I have, but I continue to workout and I continue to make gains. But to think that one could lose 40+ lbs and some of it not be muscle is a foolish thought. Gains were a little easier for me, cuz of the sudden shift. I do not lose as fast now, but I still adhere to my 1750 cals or really close to it But more importantly, my so called "restricted diet" has become more of a staple. I literally feel like crap if I eat out. I feel it if I carb out. I am more attune with my body than I ever have been and I still have a long way to go. I thought I would stop at 240, but that is not the case. I now have a new goal of 225 and hopefully, be able to see the bottom of my belly. Sounds kind of gross, but once you have the gut, its hard to get to the bottom of it
I am willing to share any of my journey, I only wish I would have logged more. I log my food and my supplements, but I didn't the progress along the way. I just watched the fat melt off, I watched my belts run out of loops and eventually, I watched my old wardrobe be replaced with fitting clothes.
Good Luck to all!
06-01-2011, 12:28 PM
Davesfx you are an inspiration and if i can even approach your results then I will be happy. I am the opposite to you; I have a weakness for food but the exercise comes easy. My wife is polish and is a great cook and I like to cook so it can be hard to say no but i do 90% of the time.
Ok so after much deliberation I am leaning towards a test p/Albuterol/t-3 cut, incorporating 10 weeks on the test due to commitments that may arise after that...
I have ketotifen as well which i am taking at the moment having taken a few weeks off ECA, so i hope to take the albuterol continuously over the cycle.
Test-p @100mgs EOD, [email protected] ED to start and ramping up, T-3 @25mcg and working upto a max of 75mcg ED, Ketotifen taken every night.
All support ancilliaries and PCT are in place, and depending on the water retention from the test i may run 0.5mg EOD letro alongside it.
Fasted cardio most mornings (I work shifts and sometimes this will be impossible), and a modified Westside routine along with a TKD eating plan and I think I am all set.
Diet-wise I ensure that I get at least 300gms of protein ED (it can vary according to workdays) and the rest of the calories come mostly from fats. As a rough idea a typical TRAINING day looks like the following;
breakfast - 50gms protein and 30gms coconut oil in a shake + 5gms creatine
breakfast 2 - 5 whole eggs + 5 whites scrambled w/ jalapeno's and 2 small smoked pork sausages
Lunch - greek salad w/ chicken
afternoon - 50gm's protein from a bar or chicken breasts and handful walnuts
Pre-training meal - meat or chicken based w/ pasta/rice/sweet potatoes or wraps (normally about 50-60gms carbs)
PWO shake - 50gms protein = 5 gms creatine
Dinner (1 to 1.5 hrs later) - lean protein source and greens
50gms protein from casein shake before bed.
On a non-training day I cut out the carbs pre workout and replace the PWO shake with a whole-food meal.
Any feedback is welcome.
Like I said, my main aim here is to lose as much BF as possible while maintaining my strength, it will also be my first forray into the dark side and if all goes well my next cycle will be a clean bulker.
I will most likely log this but not too frequently. Photos might be posted at some stage, we will see.
Anyway I want to start this proper next week, having taken the ketotifen for a while to flush the receptors and I will let you all know how I get on
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