Is my CKD working right?

Page 1 of 2 12 Last
  1. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Unhappy Is my CKD working right?


    Alright, I can personally testify that this diet is effective for weight loss. Many people have commented on the slimness in my face (and my neck ) The scale says I've lost 16 pounds (226 to 210) but I cant see it in my waist and the Omron BF analyzer results have not changed. What kind of weight am I losing?

  2. New Member
    rrm's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  197 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    173
    Rep Power
    159
    Level
    11
    Lv. Percent
    91.45%

    fat and water. For men the stomach is one of the last places fat is lost. Just keep at it and it will come!
  3. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Any theory on why my BF% has stayed the same according to the electric impulse analyzer?
    •   
       

  4. New Member
    wild12's Avatar
    Stats
    5'7"  170 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    49
    Rep Power
    97
    Level
    6
    Lv. Percent
    67.5%

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    Any theory on why my BF% has stayed the same according to the electric impulse analyzer?
    Well those bodyfat analyzers can be completely off sometimes...I've seen it being off as much as 5-9%! So it could have just been a bad reading that day or something, it would be much better to try and get a caliper bodyfat measurement if possible.
  5. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    I've used the same ones consistently and they fluccuate between 20 and 22%. Is it possible that this is correct and somehow different factors are equating to the same percentage? I am just baffled about how I've lost 16 pounds but no bodyfat (according to the omron). FYI, my strength has not changed on my lifts, although I get exhausted late in the week-of course.
  6. New Member
    WILL DA BEAST's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  187 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Age
    24
    Posts
    319
    Rep Power
    243
    Level
    15
    Lv. Percent
    14.26%

    i'm on CKD now too, i can tell i'm leaner because I have more definition in my shoulders, traps, quads, bi's....pretty much everywhere but my belly area lol. so you're not alone on this. but i do agree with rrm, i heard the abdomen is the primary storage area of fat so i would think it would take longest to lose it from there. just keep it up man
  7. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Yea I've been on 5 weeks now, so I would consider 16 pounds pretty significant. I guess I want to see numbers (BF %) I'm ready to smash this omron with a sledge!

    Someone did mention cleverly the other day that the belly is the first place it accumulates and the last place it leaves.
  8. Senior Member
    youngandfree's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  185 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,296
    Rep Power
    56037
    Level
    28
    Lv. Percent
    79.43%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    I'm not familiar with the machine you are using, but if you lost pounds and people see it in your face, then you are losing fat. I don't know how accurate those things are, and based on the replies so far, they aren't. I would make sure your scale is as accurate as possible, check your weight once a week, first thing after waking and taking a piss and before consuming anything. Just log it and keep on keeping on. If scale weight is going down and belt and pants start getting loose, you will know. you can also take progress pics once a month or so because you can't be objective looking at yourself in the mirror. You can put two pics side by side and analyze them objectively to see where your improvements are. You are on the right track averaging 3 lbs per week so far, so you probably aren't lossing tons of muscle.
  9. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    I dont think I'm gonna be on a keto diet long enough to do a monthly comparison. I know the diet is muscle sparing, and I'm now down to 206 with same strength and muscles look fuller on weekends when I'm carbed up, so I'm content. I just wanna hear that the BF% device is garbage! Thanks everyone
  10. New Member
    mikeyb123's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  187 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    306
    Rep Power
    226
    Level
    14
    Lv. Percent
    83.91%

    My body fat % device was bull ****!

    I did the following test...

    Got my bodyfat reading of 13%
    went to my room and picked up a 5kg weight
    Went back on the scales and my bodyfat had hit 16%

    It was obviously just calculating my weight against my height and age.... total ****.
  11. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Yes! thats what I want to hear! I'm finished with the CKD now and lost 15-20 pounds, most of which I'm sure has to be fat. Now I just have to watch the late day carbs!
  12. Senior Member
    benj851's Avatar
    Stats
    6'4"   lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    1,396
    Rep Power
    768
    Level
    28
    Lv. Percent
    3%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    go get yourself a caliper test done. through a university or a doctor. then u will know your real bf, to me those bio electric machines aren't worth it.
  13. Professional Member
    TheDarkHalf's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  198 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    4,398
    Rep Power
    10717
    Level
    45
    Lv. Percent
    91%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    I'm down 28 lbs and i'm into week 12. Calipers are the best way to go - those electronic things are bull**** - they are all dependent on how much you've eaten during the day, how much water you're holding, etc.

    How do you guys structure your cheat meals? I've read that people do the 24-36 hour carb load - but I generally just have one big ass cheat meal as my last meal of the day on sunday.
  14. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    "Cheat Meal" meaning a carb meal? Each week, I started the carb up immediately after the friday depletion w/o and kept it going until late sunday. I could get into ketosis fairly quickly by at least tuesday afternoon with the two heavy workouts monday and tuesday, followed by HIIT.
  15. New Member
    HarryManback's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  175 lbs.
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Age
    35
    Posts
    193
    Rep Power
    177
    Level
    11
    Lv. Percent
    68.73%

    Yea on Sunday ill just eat a bunch of corn tacos all day. Maybe some ice cream since i love the stuff. I have never got real deep in Ketosis though. What the average count? Do you just have to go longer without a cheat day to get deeper or go no carbs at all?
  16. Professional Member
    TheDarkHalf's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  198 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    4,398
    Rep Power
    10717
    Level
    45
    Lv. Percent
    91%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    "Cheat Meal" meaning a carb meal? Each week, I started the carb up immediately after the friday depletion w/o and kept it going until late sunday. I could get into ketosis fairly quickly by at least tuesday afternoon with the two heavy workouts monday and tuesday, followed by HIIT.
    Yes. Cheat meal being a carb meal. I got my diet from Evan Centopani, he does a 1:1 calorie ratio of proteins to fat (based on LBM). Cheat meal is only once a week, and is the last meal of the day and as close as you can get it to bedtime (i usually eat it about 2 hours prior to jumping into bed). The cheat should consist of atleast 200g of carbs and you can eat whatever you want, and as much as you want in an hour time frame.

    I was just curious if results were better doing the 24-36 hour feed or as I just described above.

    Quote Originally Posted by HarryManback View Post
    Yea on Sunday ill just eat a bunch of corn tacos all day. Maybe some ice cream since i love the stuff. I have never got real deep in Ketosis though. What the average count? Do you just have to go longer without a cheat day to get deeper or go no carbs at all?
    What do you mean by the average count? I always go 7 days before a cheat and make it the last meal of the day.
  17. New Member
    HarryManback's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  175 lbs.
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Age
    35
    Posts
    193
    Rep Power
    177
    Level
    11
    Lv. Percent
    68.73%

    I meant the Ketosis count. Yea im always on day 7 too. I didnt know how far IN to Ketosis people usually made it.
  18. Professional Member
    TheDarkHalf's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  198 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    4,398
    Rep Power
    10717
    Level
    45
    Lv. Percent
    91%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by HarryManback View Post
    I meant the Ketosis count. Yea im always on day 7 too. I didnt know how far IN to Ketosis people usually made it.
    To be honest, I really don't even bother with the count/piss strips. I can feel the difference between being in ketosis and not in ketosis - if your diet, cardio, and training are in order (which they should be) then full steam ahead.
  19. Senior Member
    benj851's Avatar
    Stats
    6'4"   lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    1,396
    Rep Power
    768
    Level
    28
    Lv. Percent
    3%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    I've only been in deep keto twice off of the pee sticks. Most of the time I'm in the light colors of the stick, but I burn alot of energy I w/o 6 days a week and I work at a very intense job five days a week. remember when you use alot of enery the pee stick will be pale'er. your body uses whatever energy can get. for the most part tho. I carb up on sat morning and end sunday evening. Sat I eat low GI foods except for icecream in the evening. then sunday again except for the eveing meal.

    I know I'm in keto because unless I drink alot of water, or take alot of vitamins my pee is always pale (antiquish) yellow. just fyi, not that you wanna know the color of my pee or anything. lol.

    for what its worth tho. I've gone days on keto eating 150g of low GI carbs a day while maintaining keto. just fyi. if your body needs the gylcogen it needs it.
  20. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkHalf View Post

    I was just curious if results were better doing the 24-36 hour feed or as I just described above.
    Yea. Sorry. I have just never associated "cheat meal" with carbs. Typically, during normal diet, it means a cheeseburger or something. I can't imagine just eating one carb meal per week. The whole concept of the 24-36 hour refeed is "glycogen supercompensation", a suppossed "anabolic" action where the body rebuilds any muscle lost during the week, plus more! (due to very high insulin sensitivity- a topic being discussed in a thread you and I have partaken in about caffiene and insulin resistance... uh yea. profound one!) The one and one-half day carb up gives me adequate energy to perform my heavy workouts on monday and tuesday, then like I said I can usually hit ketosis by tuesday evening. You might want to try this method, simply due to the anabolic properties.
    Suffer now.. and live like a champion later.
  21. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by benj851 View Post
    I've only been in deep keto twice off of the pee sticks. Most of the time I'm in the light colors of the stick, but I burn alot of energy I w/o 6 days a week and I work at a very intense job five days a week. remember when you use alot of enery the pee stick will be pale'er. your body uses whatever energy can get. for the most part tho. I carb up on sat morning and end sunday evening. Sat I eat low GI foods except for icecream in the evening. then sunday again except for the eveing meal.

    I know I'm in keto because unless I drink alot of water, or take alot of vitamins my pee is always pale (antiquish) yellow. just fyi, not that you wanna know the color of my pee or anything. lol.

    for what its worth tho. I've gone days on keto eating 150g of low GI carbs a day while maintaining keto. just fyi. if your body needs the gylcogen it needs it.
    Precisely, therefore it's not necessarily good to be in deep ketosis. You actually want to keep constantly burning those ketones:1. to keep burning fat. 2. to prevent cell membrane damage from low PH due to ketoacidosis.
    Suffer now.. and live like a champion later.
  22. Professional Member
    TheDarkHalf's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  198 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    4,398
    Rep Power
    10717
    Level
    45
    Lv. Percent
    91%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    Yea. Sorry. I have just never associated "cheat meal" with carbs. Typically, during normal diet, it means a cheeseburger or something. I can't imagine just eating one carb meal per week. The whole concept of the 24-36 hour refeed is "glycogen supercompensation", a suppossed "anabolic" action where the body rebuilds any muscle lost during the week, plus more! (due to very high insulin sensitivity- a topic being discussed in a thread you and I have partaken in about caffiene and insulin resistance... uh yea. profound one!) The one and one-half day carb up gives me adequate energy to perform my heavy workouts on monday and tuesday, then like I said I can usually hit ketosis by tuesday evening. You might want to try this method, simply due to the anabolic properties.
    I may try this out. However, i've been losing weight just fine having just the one cheat meal on sunday evening. I'm starting week 15 of keto and i'm down 30 lbs. I'm probably going to come off of keto in a week or two and carb cycle for about 8 weeks and then see where i'm at.
  23. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkHalf View Post
    I may try this out. However, i've been losing weight just fine having just the one cheat meal on sunday evening. I'm starting week 15 of keto and i'm down 30 lbs. I'm probably going to come off of keto in a week or two and carb cycle for about 8 weeks and then see where i'm at.
    Wow, 30 lbs is impressive! I bet your'e close to being shredded. CKD is great for preserving muscle so if your'e getting enough protein, I'm sure your not burning any, even with just one cheat meal. I'd have liked to accurately kept track of my fat loss, but well... piece of s*** Omron.
    Suffer now.. and live like a champion later.
  24. Professional Member
    TheDarkHalf's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  198 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    4,398
    Rep Power
    10717
    Level
    45
    Lv. Percent
    91%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    Wow, 30 lbs is impressive! I bet your'e close to being shredded. CKD is great for preserving muscle so if your'e getting enough protein, I'm sure your not burning any, even with just one cheat meal. I'd have liked to accurately kept track of my fat loss, but well... piece of s*** Omron.
    Thanks man. Unfortunately i'm prolly sitting around 12% at 200ish at 6'0, still got some work to do! I'm doing 1.5g protein per lb so i'm covered. I don't feel like i've lost any muscle since my last bulk, all my cardio is low intensity incline treadmill or stairmill.
  25. JDK5386
    Guest
    JDK5386's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    Alright, I can personally testify that this diet is effective for weight loss. Many people have commented on the slimness in my face (and my neck ) The scale says I've lost 16 pounds (226 to 210) but I cant see it in my waist and the Omron BF analyzer results have not changed. What kind of weight am I losing?
    For what its worth, I've lost over 50 pounds since my peak and my waist has barely moved at all. This is despite hitting abs 3-5 times per week pretty hard.

    My face looks much leaner, my man boobs are gone, and my legs are now solid, but the difference in the belly is barely noticeable.
  26. Board Supporter
    slipondajimmy's Avatar
    Stats
    5'7"  197 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Age
    39
    Posts
    84
    Rep Power
    168
    Level
    9
    Lv. Percent
    13.49%

    Sorry for sounding like a dummy but what is CKD?
  27. Professional Member
    TheDarkHalf's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  198 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    4,398
    Rep Power
    10717
    Level
    45
    Lv. Percent
    91%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by slipondajimmy View Post
    Sorry for sounding like a dummy but what is CKD?
  28. New Member
    HarryManback's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  175 lbs.
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Age
    35
    Posts
    193
    Rep Power
    177
    Level
    11
    Lv. Percent
    68.73%

    Yea that stomach fat is a biotch. I also lost 30 lbs, but figured i would be shredded. Nope. I am certainly leaner, and look better, but no where near where I want. Stupid body(Chris Griffin voice).
  29. Board Supporter
    slipondajimmy's Avatar
    Stats
    5'7"  197 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Age
    39
    Posts
    84
    Rep Power
    168
    Level
    9
    Lv. Percent
    13.49%

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkHalf View Post

    Sure I have search. But When there are 10 pages of results on the google search and when you get "Please specify some words or valid user names to search on. There were no matches for those that you specified." for the board search, its easier to just ask.
  30. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    CKD= Cyclical Ketogenic Diet
    Suffer now.. and live like a champion later.
  31. Senior Member
    youngandfree's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  185 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,296
    Rep Power
    56037
    Level
    28
    Lv. Percent
    79.43%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by JDK5386 View Post
    For what its worth, I've lost over 50 pounds since my peak and my waist has barely moved at all. This is despite hitting abs 3-5 times per week pretty hard.

    My face looks much leaner, my man boobs are gone, and my legs are now solid, but the difference in the belly is barely noticeable.
    keep up the hard work. You know that you can do abs 150 times a week and it won't burn off belly fat, right? Abs 2-3 times is sufficient. You are building the muscle under the flab so once it's gone, there is your 6 pack. Don't waste more time than necessary on abs that you could spend on extra cardio or something else.
  32. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by youngandfree View Post
    keep up the hard work. You know that you can do abs 150 times a week and it won't burn off belly fat, right? Abs 2-3 times is sufficient. You are building the muscle under the flab so once it's gone, there is your 6 pack. Don't waste more time than necessary on abs that you could spend on extra cardio or something else.
    Yep. It's called "spot reduction" and no such thing exists. But maybe if you do them very rapidly, it will increase your heart rate and therefore burn belly fat.
    Suffer now.. and live like a champion later.
  33. Advanced Member
    ThomasRivera's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  217 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    814
    Rep Power
    486
    Level
    22
    Lv. Percent
    2.11%

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    Precisely, therefore it's not necessarily good to be in deep ketosis. You actually want to keep constantly burning those ketones:1. to keep burning fat. 2. to prevent cell membrane damage from low PH due to ketoacidosis.
    In healthy non diabetic subjects I don't think ketoacidosis is even possible. And it's the other way around, the burning of fat produces ketones.
  34. Advanced Member
    ThomasRivera's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  217 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    814
    Rep Power
    486
    Level
    22
    Lv. Percent
    2.11%

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    Yep. It's called "spot reduction" and no such thing exists. But maybe if you do them very rapidly, it will increase your heart rate and therefore burn belly fat.
    http://www.bennadel.com/blog/635-Dan...ing-Works-.htm

    Kinda works
  35. Advanced Member
    ThomasRivera's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  217 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    814
    Rep Power
    486
    Level
    22
    Lv. Percent
    2.11%

    Quote Originally Posted by youngandfree View Post
    keep up the hard work. You know that you can do abs 150 times a week and it won't burn off belly fat, right? Abs 2-3 times is sufficient. You are building the muscle under the flab so once it's gone, there is your 6 pack. Don't waste more time than necessary on abs that you could spend on extra cardio or something else.
    You want to do stuff that targets visceral body fat. Something like HIIT.
  36. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasRivera View Post
    In healthy non diabetic subjects I don't think ketoacidosis is even possible. And it's the other way around, the burning of fat produces ketones.
    Yes, I know it's possible.
    8.2.2 Starvation Ketosis
    When hepatic glycogen stores are exhausted (eg after 12-24 hours of total fasting), the liver produces ketones to provide an energy substrate for peripheral tissues. Ketoacidosis can appear after an overnight fast but it typically requires 3 to 14 days of starvation to reach maximal severity. Typical ketoanion levels are only 1 to 2 mmol/l and this will not much alter the anion gap. The acidosis even with quite prolonged fasting is only ever of mild to moderate severity with ketoanion levels up to a maximum of 3 to 5 mmol/l and plasma pH down to 7.3. This is probably due to the insulin level, which though lower, is still enough to keep the FFA levels less than 1mM. This limits substrate delivery to the liver restraining hepatic ketogenesis. Ketone bodies also stimulate some insulin release from the islets. The anion gap will usually not be much elevated.
    http://www.anaesthesiamcq.com/AcidBaseBook/ab8_2.php

    Also, the breakdown of fat (lipolysis) yeilds three ketone bodies (acetoacetate, beta hydroxybuterate and acetone) which are then burned for quick energy. So they can build up in blood plasma over time and cause the mild, non-diabetic ketoacidosis. This is why ketone levels will be low or trace after a cardio session while on the diet.
    Suffer now.. and live like a champion later.
  37. Advanced Member
    ThomasRivera's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  217 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    814
    Rep Power
    486
    Level
    22
    Lv. Percent
    2.11%

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    Yes, I know it's possible.
    8.2.2 Starvation Ketosis
    When hepatic glycogen stores are exhausted (eg after 12-24 hours of total fasting), the liver produces ketones to provide an energy substrate for peripheral tissues. Ketoacidosis can appear after an overnight fast but it typically requires 3 to 14 days of starvation to reach maximal severity. Typical ketoanion levels are only 1 to 2 mmol/l and this will not much alter the anion gap. The acidosis even with quite prolonged fasting is only ever of mild to moderate severity with ketoanion levels up to a maximum of 3 to 5 mmol/l and plasma pH down to 7.3. This is probably due to the insulin level, which though lower, is still enough to keep the FFA levels less than 1mM. This limits substrate delivery to the liver restraining hepatic ketogenesis. Ketone bodies also stimulate some insulin release from the islets. The anion gap will usually not be much elevated.
    http://www.anaesthesiamcq.com/AcidBaseBook/ab8_2.php

    Also, the breakdown of fat (lipolysis) yeilds three ketone bodies (acetoacetate, beta hydroxybuterate and acetone) which are then burned for quick energy. So they can build up in blood plasma over time and cause the mild, non-diabetic ketoacidosis. This is why ketone levels will be low or trace after a cardio session while on the diet.
    Thanks for the source, but I specifically wrote healthy subjects because I've never read a case about a healthy person doing ketosis that suffered from ketoacidosis. I think healthy would exclude starving, but reps for the source.

    Now I'm quoting from Lyles book, but if you have anything updated, please share. "...In non diabetic individuals there are at least two feedback loops to prevent runaway ketoacidosis...when ketones reach high concentrations int he blood stream, they stimulate a release of insulin...First it slows ffa release from the fat cell. Second, by raising the insulin/glucagon ration, the rate of ketone body formation in the liver is decreased. Third, it increases the excretion of ketones into the urine"
  38. Senior Member
    bezoe's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  218 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,229
    Rep Power
    1228
    Level
    27
    Lv. Percent
    45.03%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasRivera View Post
    Thanks for the source, but I specifically wrote healthy subjects because I've never read a case about a healthy person doing ketosis that suffered from ketoacidosis. I think healthy would exclude starving, but reps for the source.

    Now I'm quoting from Lyles book, but if you have anything updated, please share. "...In non diabetic individuals there are at least two feedback loops to prevent runaway ketoacidosis...when ketones reach high concentrations int he blood stream, they stimulate a release of insulin...First it slows ffa release from the fat cell. Second, by raising the insulin/glucagon ration, the rate of ketone body formation in the liver is decreased. Third, it increases the excretion of ketones into the urine"
    Ok. Maybe these pathways of regulation are the reason that ketoacidosis in heatlhy individuals doesn't become harmful- the body slows production and pisses out excess ketones. Whereas, in a diabetics unable to produce insulin or who's insulin receptors were diminished, it would be destructive to tissues and such. So really there is a build up of ketones, but no actual ketoacidosis. Reps.

    Man, when I was on the diet I made sure I did some cardio every day so I didn't get brain damage or something!
    Suffer now.. and live like a champion later.
  39. Senior Member
    youngandfree's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  185 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,296
    Rep Power
    56037
    Level
    28
    Lv. Percent
    79.43%
    Achievements Posting Pro

    Most unhealthy diabetics that might get ketoacidosis do so because most every other part of their diet/lifestyle is crappy also which further spirals their problems down the drain.
  40. Advanced Member
    ThomasRivera's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  217 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    814
    Rep Power
    486
    Level
    22
    Lv. Percent
    2.11%

    Quote Originally Posted by bezoe View Post
    Ok. Maybe these pathways of regulation are the reason that ketoacidosis in heatlhy individuals doesn't become harmful- the body slows production and pisses out excess ketones. Whereas, in a diabetics unable to produce insulin or who's insulin receptors were diminished, it would be destructive to tissues and such. So really there is a build up of ketones, but no actual ketoacidosis. Reps.

    Man, when I was on the diet I made sure I did some cardio every day so I didn't get brain damage or something!
    Read "The Ketogenic diet" By Lyle McDonald, its all over the net, posted somewhere on this site for free.
  

  
 

Similar Forum Threads

  1. PH not working for me?
    By lilseth0014 in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 11-15-2010, 10:10 AM
  2. this is not working, can you help
    By ShockCollar in forum Weight Loss
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 02-09-2010, 06:54 PM
  3. WHY IS M1T NOT WORKING FOR ME
    By Kachinsky in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 11-17-2004, 02:44 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Log in
Log in