Getting Confused w/ Carb Cycling

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    Getting Confused w/ Carb Cycling


    I've read a few articles and every other one conflicts with the other, one will say low carb day means next to no carbs and the other low carb day is 200gr w/ high being 400+.
    Another thing is on says only have high carbs on weight training days and the other just gives a suggested schedule and not to have back to back high carb days. I'm following the later right now.

    Monday = Med Carb
    Tuesday = Low Carb
    Wednesday = High Carb
    Thursday = Low Carb
    Friday = Med carb
    Saturday = Low Carb
    Sunday = High Carb

    Current w/o schedule is

    Tu/Fri Chest/back,
    Deadlift 3x5
    Bench 3x12
    Row 3x5
    Chest fly 3x12
    Pullup/Chinup 3xfailure
    Dip 3xfailure

    Wed/Sa Legs/Shoulders
    Squat 3x5
    Pushpress 3x5
    Stiff leg DL 3x12
    Seated press - 3x12
    Lunge 3x10
    Face pull 3x12

    Macro breakdown

    Hi - 2808cals 96f/183.7c/309p 31%f/24%c/44%p
    M1 - 1/2 cup Oatmeal w/ 1 banana, 1 scoop MPI
    M2 - 2 scoop MPI Shake w/ flax
    M3 - 7 oz Chicken, 1 cup rice or quinoa, 1/2 cup broccoli and snow pea pods
    M4 - MPI Shake w/ flax
    M5 - PB Sandwich or Egg Salad Sandwich
    M6 - PWO Shake (just whey/water)
    M7 - 4oz Chicken and 1/2 cup rice or quinoa

    Med - 2,584cals 92.3f/142.2c/302.3p 33%fat/20%c/47%p
    M1 - 1/2 cup Oatmeal w/ 1 banana and 1scoop MPI
    M2 - 2 scoop MPI Shake w/ flax
    M3 - 7oz Chicken, 1 cup broccoli, 1 cup snow pea pods
    M4 - 2 scoop MPI Shake w/ flax ,
    M5 - PB Sandwich or Egg Salad sandwich
    M6 - PWO Shake (just whey/water)
    M7 - 4oz Chicken and 1/2 cup rice or quinoa

    Low - 1,803cals 97.7f/39.0c/193.4p 49%f/7%c/44%p
    M1 - 1cup Better'n Eggs, mushrooms, onions, peppers, cheese
    M2 - 2 scoop MPI Shake w/ flax
    M3 - 7oz Chicken, 1cup broccoli, snow pea pods
    M4 - MPI Shake w/ flax,
    M5 - celery w/ pb
    M6 - Chicken

    Only variable is almonds.
    On non w/o days for M5 I'll have a MPI shake.

    Currently I'm 5'8" 237 trying to get down to 200 or below. Been trying different workouts and meal plans for the past 8 months and I'm 7lbs heavier than when I started and still look the same.
    Last edited by system60; 09-09-2008 at 11:27 PM. Reason: Updated meal plan and macros

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    Also just wanted to add that all my lifts have also been pretty much stagnant after 3 or 4 months in. I'm really getting sick of this
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    looks like your planning & working hard. it's frustrating for sure. i have been eating like a small bird some days while doing 5x5 style training (all compounds) & doing mod level cardio 5 mornings a week, just to lose maybe a lb a week? the way i have been looking at it, i need a method i can (am willing to) sustain more than just a couple of months. it's awfully ungratuitous. i am raising my cardio level starting tomorrow ala Venuto style. hopefully things will pick up for us both. best of luck with the battle.
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    well, that diet looks more like calorie cycling than carb cycling. beyond the carb difference you have a 30g difference in fats, and 60 in protein. no real reason for that, if you are carb cycling, then carb cycle, if you are varying total cals then try to stick to a certain set of macros % wise.

    If you are trying to loose fat, then i'd say forget about the cycling either way, and just go with a 500-700 cals a day below maintenace diet, and fit your macros to suit yourself.

    Is everything you are eating measured + weighed? Once I got a scale I realized that I was a good bit off on my estimations of beef/chicken, but comically I was right on with peanut butter.
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    You should decide what you want to do, build muscle or cut, i know carb-cycling works wonders for me and I can do it without loosing muscle, but I CANT GROW any muscle while doing this.

    Also when I carb cycle, Low days include 50-70G of oat in the morning and only Fibrous veggies throughout the day until 3-4PM. On NO carb days I eat NO CARBS except for fibrous veggies for 3 meals throughout the day but no later than 3-4PM
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    Agree with orange.


    You won't gain strength if you're cutting, so no wonder.



    You have to either plan to maintain, cut, or bulk.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    You have to either plan to maintain, cut, or bulk.
    That's what is frustrating me the most, I'm cutting calories but I haven't lost any weight. I was down to 1700/day for almost a month and all that went down were my lifts, which I'm still trying to get back to.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    well, that diet looks more like calorie cycling than carb cycling. beyond the carb difference you have a 30g difference in fats, and 60 in protein. no real reason for that, if you are carb cycling, then carb cycle, if you are varying total cals then try to stick to a certain set of macros % wise.

    If you are trying to loose fat, then i'd say forget about the cycling either way, and just go with a 500-700 cals a day below maintenace diet, and fit your macros to suit yourself.

    Is everything you are eating measured + weighed? Once I got a scale I realized that I was a good bit off on my estimations of beef/chicken, but comically I was right on with peanut butter.
    I reread the article and saw what I was doing wrong. New schedule is Hi carb tu/fr, med carb wed/sat low carb thurs. med sun, low monday. Also I redid foods where I'm at 94fr fat everyday, proteins in the upper 200s and carbs are 39,144,185. (I'll post everything in full when I'm not at work)

    I weigh and measure my food.



    past effort

    Refine my Diet
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    This is the split I do and it works great for me, 2LOW, 1NO, 1LOW, 1NO, 1HIGH and then repeat. The keys are:

    -On all days eats 2-3 meals with fibrous veggies, but cut them off around 3-4PM

    -On LOW days eat 50G-75G of oats in the morning (i kinda judge this by how active my day will be) and try to get some good fats in at night, maybe a 1-2 whole eggs, 96/4 Beef, Tilapia

    -On NO days eat NOO carbs (I sometimes allow foods with 1 or 2 G of carbs but not much more) also on this day eat ALOT of good fats, I generally save my fats for night time so I can have 2 good meals, 3-4 whole eggs, steak, chicken (marinated in EVOO) I found some good reduced fat block cheese that has only like 1.5 sat. fat, and if you can find them I like to snack Marcona Almonds at night (17F, only 1.5Sat. 2C, 7P) so it makes for a good snack on no carb days as opposed to peanuts or normal almonds that have 6-7-8G of carbs.

    -On the HIGH day, once I make it there, I make this a good day, I eat as many carbs as I want this day but the key is to make them good carbs, I usually eat yams, or heathly harvest pasta, salsa's, and there not the best source of carbs but I like to eat those mini whole-grain bagels with FF cream cheese (last time I carb-cycled I went through 2 bags of these on my high day) the key to this day is eat NOOOO fat!

    CARDIO:
    The best option to cut would be run everyday, but since I usually am more worried about keeping muscle and I can dropped good weight without cardio while carb cycling I usually don't. The are however 4 times I always do cardio. On the NO carb days at night I will do cardio, and the very next day as soon as you wake up BEFORE you eat. So thats 4 times throughout these 6 days that I do cardio and I usually just do 30-45 minutes of cardio at a medium intensity. Obviously the more you tackle the cardio the more fat you will drop but if you do cardio more than those 4 times makes sure the times you do it the longest/hardest, you do it at those 4 times.

    anyways, Goodluck! hope it works out for ya!
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    Quote Originally Posted by system60 View Post
    That's what is frustrating me the most, I'm cutting calories but I haven't lost any weight. I was down to 1700/day for almost a month and all that went down were my lifts, which I'm still trying to get back to.

    You've let your metabolism slow down too much. You have to increase your calories every 5-7 days or so to boost leptin, let your body think it's in a fed state, and then lower the calories again. If you just go low calorie forever, your metabolism slows down to match the calories you consume and you lose no fat and actually lose strength and muscle.
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    i'm in the same boat as system 60. been eating nothing but egg whites, oat meal, grapefruits, brown rice, chkn brsts, super lean beef, tins of sardines, etc.heavy weight training 3 nights a week, low level cardio (fast walk uphill) 30mins x 5 mornings/week. week 3 on epidrol. fatloss is very hard to see per week. should be able to see waist measures rolling down each week for God's sake. it's been almost 3 months. was following tom venuto concepts. ready to try carb cycling. this is rediculous. does anybody have a link possibly to help develop a plan like this? TIA
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    Quote Originally Posted by julius kelp View Post
    i'm in the same boat as system 60. been eating nothing but egg whites, oat meal, grapefruits, brown rice, chkn brsts, super lean beef, tins of sardines, etc.heavy weight training 3 nights a week, low level cardio (fast walk uphill) 30mins x 5 mornings/week. week 3 on epidrol. fatloss is very hard to see per week. should be able to see waist measures rolling down each week for God's sake. it's been almost 3 months. was following tom venuto concepts. ready to try carb cycling. this is rediculous.
    You have to up your calories for a day or two to boost your leptin levels dude, or your metabolism will slow to a crawl, and whatever you're doing now is only maintaining your weight because your body is in starvation mode.

    Venuto's stuff is blah.

    Also, are you calorie counting? Because if not, it doesn't matter what you do.
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    thanks CE, it has made me wonder if maybe eating more might help, it's just hard to get through one's thick head that if you aren't losing anything now, that eating more might make things better! i understand mostof this, but have not successfully implemented it. i have a killer program for palm pilot called "balancelog" that hospitals/dieticians use. you can change amounts, add foods quick. look at each meal, daily totals super easy. i'm going to do some more searching for a template for carb cycling so i can setup a plan. thanks again.
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    you are on week 3 of epi and not noticing anything?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangepeel View Post
    -On NO days eat NOO carbs (I sometimes allow foods with 1 or 2 G of carbs but not much more) also on this day eat ALOT of good fats, I generally save my fats for night time so I can have 2 good meals, 3-4 whole eggs, steak, chicken (marinated in EVOO) I found some good reduced fat block cheese that has only like 1.5 sat. fat, and if you can find them I like to snack Marcona Almonds at night (17F, only 1.5Sat. 2C, 7P) so it makes for a good snack on no carb days as opposed to peanuts or normal almonds that have 6-7-8G of carbs.
    The carbs on my "no" days are all from either vegetables or the peanut butter.


    But thanks for the advice right now I'm replanning my diet figure instead of the 2nd shake will have some tuna or chicken salad w/ lettuce/tomato/baby spinach/onions/celery and on carb days I'll throw in some WW pasta into it
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    well, it's not that the epi isn't working, lifts have been good despite eating pretty light alot of the time. not enough carbs to get a good pump really. i was trying to carb up an hour before weight training & a good protein/carbs shake post & eat pretty low carb the rest of the time. what do we think of this plan?

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    it's very hard to absorb the idea, that if you're not losing fat, that you need to eat more. with that said, last saturday i went to chipotle & threw down the 1000cal burrito for lunch. this is the first week i think i have seen a visible fatloss in 3 months. in addition, if anything, i think i need to do this maybe twice a week. it appears that my body adapts about every 3 days to too low cals &/or carbs. if that has been my only prob, my worries are few...
  

  
 

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