Playing with SuperSap and 1-Carboxy Dosing

[GoHardOrGoHme]

So after stacking up on all my favorite USP lab goodies Im going to hit up a a super stack for the next 3 months:

Jack3d- 3 times a week
Prime- starting at 5 pills going up to 10 pills( 5 days on 2 days off)
Anabolic Pump- 2 x a day (morning and pre-lift meals)
Pslin- 1x a day (post-lift)

1-Carboxy- up to 3 grams a day (5 days on 2 days off)
SuperSaponins- up to 6 grams a day (5 days on 2 days off)
(The above doses are not my starting doses they will be worked up to over a 2-3 week period)

I would like to get some opinions on those more knowleadgable then myself on various techniques for how to dose for ultimate effectiveness:

Now i was wondering if with 1-carboxy and Supersaps can anyone attest to the difference in taking three 1 gram doses morning, pre-workout, and pre-bed vs 2 grams pre-lift 1 gram prebed?

Same with Supersaps with the 2 grams 3 times a day for 3 grams twice a day?


Reason I ask is because I was thinking to change up the dosing protocol depending on the day. For example i lift Sunday, Tuesday, and thursday's so these day take 2 grams pre-lift 1 gram prebed of 1 carboxy and 3 grams pre lift and 3 grams in the morning of SuperSaps.

Monday and Wednesday i do cardio in the morning and judo in the evening so these days spread out the 1-carboxy and supersaps throughout the day in a 1/1/1 for carboxy and 2/2/2 for super saps. The morning and pre-judo doses will be taken with a stimulant (adrenalean since i wanted to try it out since it was on sale)



The goal of this is to maximize the fat burning properties of GH release on cardio days and then maximize the strength component on lift days so that i may effectively burn fat and gain strength for the next 12 weeks.


Any thoughts?

 

[carpee]

i think those dosages would be sick.

on workout days i'm only at like 2.4 grams and on non workout days 1.6 grams of bulk 1-c and its been great.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

thanks for the input bro

 

[carpee]

keep me updated. i'd like to see your results. I get great sleep just from 800 mg of carboxy

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

so on the tub is says 1/4 tsp for 800 mgs....but on the website NP it says 1/3 tsp for 800 mg.

Which one do i go by?

And im guessing for SuperSaps 1/4 tsp is 900 mg right?

Just double checking

 

[carpee]

good point.

i've been using the js-100xv digital scale, so its accurate to mg

 

[Chops89]

I just weighed out 1/4 tsp (level, not rounded). Came out to ~800mg (give or take 20mg).

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

I just weighed out 1/4 tsp (level, not rounded). Came out to ~800mg (give or take 20mg).

PERFECT! I gotta get me one of those scales.

 

[Chops89]

PERFECT! I gotta get me one of those scales.

Definitely. One of the best investments I've ever made.

 

[carpee]

Definitely. One of the best investments I've ever made.

worth so much more than $30

 

[carpee]

whats the update gohard?

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

So I have been hitting up 1/4 tsp of 1-carboxy and 1/2 tsp of supersaps...


The supersaps got m libido through the roof

The 1-Carboxy im expecting the strength gains to kick in at around week 2-3 but the nice relaxing sleep is very nice.

I ordered a scale so now im gonna get to be really accurate dose from 1 gram 2x a day to 2 grams pre-lift to 1.2 grams pre-bed and super saps ill go up to 6 grams a day. I dont plan to go over 3-4 grams of 1-carboxy.

5 days on 2 days off for both

 

[Steveoph]

so on the tub is says 1/4 tsp for 800 mgs....but on the website NP it says 1/3 tsp for 800 mg.

Which one do i go by?

And im guessing for SuperSaps 1/4 tsp is 900 mg right?

Just double checking

It should be 1/4tsp. I'll get the website updated, thanks.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

It should be 1/4tsp. I'll get the website updated, thanks.

No thank you!


I wonder if 1-carboxy can be taken effectively with a meal that has no carbs?
Something like Tilapia and cheese

(you would need to but 20 slices of cheese to get around 15 grams of carbs and i use 1-2 slices so less then a gram of carbs wont release insulin)

I think i will try that out tonight. Should work in theory....

 

[carpee]

No thank you!


I wonder if 1-carboxy can be taken effectively with a meal that has no carbs?
Something like Tilapia and cheese

(you would need to but 20 slices of cheese to get around 15 grams of carbs and i use 1-2 slices so less then a gram of carbs wont release insulin)

I think i will try that out tonight. Should work in theory....

The new tactic with PowerFull is to take it with food to get the LH raising properties out of it.

I wonder if 1-c works the same with food

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

The new tactic with PowerFull is to take it with food to get the LH raising properties out of it.

I wonder if 1-c works the same with food

Im guessing that is Chloro B in the Powerfull to bring up the LH surge b/c the velvet bean is where they extract for L-Dopa.

With 1-carboxy im not too sure it will cause anything beyong a GH surge which is why one needs to dose 1-carboxy at least an hour after carb intake. The tribulosin in Supersaps should go nicely with meals high in fat though and i dont think will be effected by carb intake.

 

[carpee]

Im guessing that is Chloro B in the Powerfull to bring up the LH surge b/c the velvet bean is where they extract for L-Dopa.

With 1-carboxy im not too sure it will cause anything beyong a GH surge which is why one needs to dose 1-carboxy at least an hour after carb intake. The tribulosin in Supersaps should go nicely with meals high in fat though and i dont think will be effected by carb intake.

I figured the LH was due to the chlorophytum.

let me know how 1-c goes with fat/protein only...

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

slept like a baby

the fat and protein didnt seem to effect the 1-carboxy

 

[MorningMetal]

That sounds great man! I like the dosage. I made myself something simliar with the SuperSap and the 1-Carboxy. I bought the bulk powders and got some Avena Sativa, and some Grape Seed Extract for a mild anti-aromatase/antioxidant, got a 440-Z digital scale, mixed all the powders into a blend, and capped them. I dose them pretty much like I dose prime(usually 3 caps 3x day). I take it about halfway in between when I take my Anabolic Pump and when I actually eat, that way, I can get, I figure, the most out of the 1-Carboxy and the Supersap put together.
I calculated the theoretical dosages of each ingredient in the capsules, being that I couldn't be very accurate because it was a prop. blend, but it was so long ago and it worked so damn well that I threw the dosages away and just kept making it. Supersap is INSANE. My girlfriend is walking bow-legged on a regular basis and she has an ear-to-ear grin all day.
My last dose of course I take about a half hour prior to crashing to get the nice GH spike throughout the night. I've been sleeping like a baby to say the least.
I usually take a break from it and prime over the weekend, and just stick to the AP.

So in a sense, I guess what I've done is make a kind of makeshift PowerFull, but the supersap is concentrated on the tribulosin, and the Powerfull is the Chlorophytum B? Is that right?

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

That sounds great man! I like the dosage. I made myself something simliar with the SuperSap and the 1-Carboxy. I bought the bulk powders and got some Avena Sativa, and some Grape Seed Extract for a mild anti-aromatase/antioxidant, got a 440-Z digital scale, mixed all the powders into a blend, and capped them. I dose them pretty much like I dose prime(usually 3 caps 3x day). I take it about halfway in between when I take my Anabolic Pump and when I actually eat, that way, I can get, I figure, the most out of the 1-Carboxy and the Supersap put together.
I calculated the theoretical dosages of each ingredient in the capsules, being that I couldn't be very accurate because it was a prop. blend, but it was so long ago and it worked so damn well that I threw the dosages away and just kept making it. Supersap is INSANE. My girlfriend is walking bow-legged on a regular basis and she has an ear-to-ear grin all day.
My last dose of course I take about a half hour prior to crashing to get the nice GH spike throughout the night. I've been sleeping like a baby to say the least.
I usually take a break from it and prime over the weekend, and just stick to the AP.

So in a sense, I guess what I've done is make a kind of makeshift PowerFull, but the supersap is concentrated on the tribulosin, and the Powerfull is the Chlorophytum B? Is that right?

I like what you did. I thought of doing something similar but i get real anal about dosing and what not so mixing it to me leaves me paranoid im not taking in exactly what i want every time. But in a sense I had the same idea as you and make a makeshift powerfull. And let me tell you the supersaps contain a way bigger libido kick then powerfull but the sleep i get in powerfull seems to be better then 1-carboxy...but i have yet to dose over 800 mg on 1-carboxy. Let's see how it goes when im up towards 1.2 grams pre-bed.

And i believe you are correct in that powerfull extract is extracted more for the Chloro B and supersap more for the tribulosin even though each contains both. But thats something that USP will keep under wraps since the minute they let that kind of info out there will be tons of copy cats. Which is something i have noticed that there are alot of relatively new supps out there that are based in what USP has been doing for years and in my opinion still do a lot better.

 

[MorningMetal]

Thanks man. Yeah it was a great mixture, you'll have to let me know what happens when you up your pre-bed dose. From what i've heard though, higher doses of 1-Carboxy can cause some lethargy. Didn't notice it on my end.
Agreed. Anyone who does their research will see that not only does USP do it first, they still do it better. The proof is in the pudding. Every single supplement of USP's ive ever used has been, you know, real results and completely backs up the hype. IMO, Anabolic Pump is still the best supplement out there. Period. Been using it for years, since it was first released and it came in those plain looking maroon-colored capsules. I have a little panic attack when im running low and I have to order it online and i'm worried it wont show up before i'm completely out. Ive told women to use it as well, and my GF, and my buddy's GF have all shed 5+ pounds of bodyfat within 2 weeks, not even with a dialed-in diet.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

New dosing protocol

So i had a fun leg day on thursday and during that day i had an idea for a new protocol.

So we all know that SuperSap is a combination of PureSap and Tribulosin correct? And the purpose of these two little extracts is to naturally raise your test levels if i am not mistaken. So i thought to myself...when do i want my natural test to be at a high? Well while i work out and while i heal up. ALso i want my test to negate the effects of cortisol post lift. Therefore here is my new supersap dosing protocol for the next 2 weeks.

Lifts days: pre-workout and post-workout

Non-lift days: Morning, noon, before bed

Days off: 1

Dosage: 4 grams a day for the next 2 weeks

Current dosage: 3-4 grams a day



In the future i will raise the dosage and take an extra day off reaching up to 6-9 grams a day. But I want to see what is the most effective dosing scheme for strength gains.

1-carboxy is currently dosed:

Lift Days: pre-lift/pre-bed

Non-lift days: pre-fasted cardio/pre-bed

1-2 days off

Current amount: 1.6 grams a day

Future Amount: 3 grams a day
Future dosing: 2 grams pre-lift, 1 gram pre-bed
1 gram pre-cardio/1 gram midday/ 1 gram pre-bed
2 days off



Just for reference i am stacking this with:

Prime (69 protocol for 4 weeks then i will start megadosing)
anabolic Pump: 3x a day(on lift days 1 dose is post lift)
Pslin: 1x a day on workout days pre-lift and post-cardio
Adrenalean: 2-3 caps daily for 6-8 weeks
Supercissus: 6-9 grams a day
Cordygen V02: pre-cardio/pre-judo
Na-r-ALA: cheat days and pre-lift meals

 

[AK32408]

Nice stack.

I used to play around with 1-Carboxy doses before bed and did 8 grams one time. I was lucid dreaming for most of the night, haha, it was crazy ! I remember that I could run down my street and right before the edge of the big hill near my house I could jump and fly down through the town. :sleeping:

I don't recommend that though, I only did it once, lol.

When is your last carb meal / meal with fats of the day GHOGH ??

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

Nice stack.

I used to play around with 1-Carboxy doses before bed and did 8 grams one time. I was lucid dreaming for most of the night, haha, it was crazy ! I remember that I could run down my street and right before the edge of the big hill near my house I could jump and fly down through the town. :sleeping:

I don't recommend that though, I only did it once, lol.

When is your last carb meal / meal with fats of the day GHOGH ??

My last meal is normally my post lift/post judo meal which is between 2-3 hours before bed normally. The other night i tried a protein and fats meal 40 minutes before my 1-carboxy dose and it seemed to work well.

 

[AK32408]

My last meal is normally my post lift/post judo meal which is between 2-3 hours before bed normally. The other night i tried a protein and fats meal 40 minutes before my 1-carboxy dose and it seemed to work well.

That's good !

I too noticed that good fats about 2hrs. before bed did help with pre-bed dosing. I used to take 1-Carboxy with WMS in a protein shake before bed knowing WMS helps get the supplements in your system faster but carbs also block proper GH release before bed. I learned my lesson, lol.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

That's good !

I too noticed that good fats about 2hrs. before bed did help with pre-bed dosing. I used to take 1-Carboxy with WMS in a protein shake before bed knowing WMS helps get the supplements in your system faster but carbs also block proper GH release before bed. I learned my lesson, lol.

Haha oh the lessons we learn!

You know USP supps i have come to the conclusion are not for beginners in lifting and supplementation. To a large degree those who are more experienced and more educated tend to use the supps more effectively and yeild the most gains. I've seen more "non-responders" that are relative beginners making a whole lot of mistakes in dosing, protocol, diet, and routine and get little to nothing out of it, as for the veterans in the game tend to really enjoy the various supps.

 

[AK32408]

Haha oh the lessons we learn!

You know USP supps i have come to the conclusion are not for beginners in lifting and supplementation. To a large degree those who are more experienced and more educated tend to use the supps more effectively and yeild the most gains. I've seen more "non-responders" that are relative beginners making a whole lot of mistakes in dosing, protocol, diet, and routine and get little to nothing out of it, as for the veterans in the game tend to really enjoy the various supps.

That especially goes for supplements like Anabolic Pump and PowerFULL. Both yielded great results for me, but a friend of mine just starting out didn't seem to respond the same.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

That especially goes for supplements like Anabolic Pump and PowerFULL. Both yielded great results for me, but a friend of mine just starting out didn't seem to respond the same.

anabolic pump is def a supp that if you dont eat right...you get nothing out of it

Powerfull is all about timing and dosing

Even prime I found if i dont dose it correctly i dont get maximum gains. For example...i cant just hit up 3 times a day spread out. I'd rather focus on a pre-lift and post lift dosage and have 1-2 other doses before my lift. The important thing for me is the pre and post doses. Those really get me to that next level.

 

[MorningMetal]

Yeah if you don't eat right while you're on Anabolic Pump, your body will DEFINITELY let you know... Enter the Anabolic Dump.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

So dosing SuperSaps after training with Prime feels amazing!!

It def feels like my body starts to recover within an hour or so. I go from drained and weak to back to par.

Kicking the dosage up to 6-7 grams of supersaps a day and will continue this for 5 weeks on a 5 on 2 off protocol

Carboxy will be 2 grams pre-lift/pre-cardio and 1.2-1.6 grams pre-bed


Im gonna post up a log soon of my progress on my current stack but ill just post it up when its complete or close to complete.



Looking into a Fat loss stack now to icing on the cake to a 6 week cut. Going keto and 500-600 calories below maintenance with 3 days of HIIT cardio and 3 days of lifting. Im thinking of:

OEP
Dicana
TNA
and either Dermathern Target, Eviscerate, or extra Forskolin

 

[oufinny]

That is some serious dosing on those two... the most I ever got up to on SuperSap was ~5.25 grams a day. Most of mine was like yours though with it pwo and a small amount before bed. I do like the 1-carboxy dosing though, I took pretty much the same amount and slept like a baby most of the time. I like your cutting stack as well though am not really familiar with Dicana less what I can read about it; not too many Thermolife products logged on here that I see.

So dosing SuperSaps after training with Prime feels amazing!!

It def feels like my body starts to recover within an hour or so. I go from drained and weak to back to par.

Kicking the dosage up to 6-7 grams of supersaps a day and will continue this for 5 weeks on a 5 on 2 off protocol

Carboxy will be 2 grams pre-lift/pre-cardio and 1.2-1.6 grams pre-bed


Im gonna post up a log soon of my progress on my current stack but ill just post it up when its complete or close to complete.



Looking into a Fat loss stack now to icing on the cake to a 6 week cut. Going keto and 500-600 calories below maintenance with 3 days of HIIT cardio and 3 days of lifting. Im thinking of:

OEP
Dicana
TNA
and either Dermathern Target, Eviscerate, or extra Forskolin

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

That is some serious dosing on those two... the most I ever got up to on SuperSap was ~5.25 grams a day. Most of mine was like yours though with it pwo and a small amount before bed. I do like the 1-carboxy dosing though, I took pretty much the same amount and slept like a baby most of the time. I like your cutting stack as well though am not really familiar with Dicana less what I can read about it; not too many Thermolife products logged on here that I see.

i was dosing supersaps at 4 grams a day for 2 weeks then bumped it up to 5 for a week...and now for the next 5 weeks i wanna see if i can get continual gains at 6 grams. Anything over 6 is due to capping inconsistancies where id rather go a little over then under.

The 1 carboxy i feel i found my sweet spot at these doses. At 1 gram im out like a baby. Wake up really refreshed. At 1.2-1.6 grams im pretty sure my body goes into wolverine like recovery mode haha.

Im going to really put these doses to the test during my next 5/3/1...5 week cycle and see if how much i gain compared to the cycle that just ended. Then the last 5 week cycle Ill mega dose Prime to compensate for the lack of 1-carboxy and SuperSaps....or i may continue carboxy and just take out supersaps to get my body ready for TNA.


Dicana is something i wasnt interested in till i started seeing ppl really prefer TTA...then that led me to look at tt-33 by accident. Then I saw a post by Andrew72 about him preferring Dicana when stacked with OEP...so now im researching Dicana from thermolife b/c Andrew is the **** when it comes to building ridiculously effective stacks.

Now i just dont know if i wanna add in a transdermal or hit up 12 weeks of coleus....

Im going a little heavy into the stack this time around b/c after my last cut, with the help of Kleen i got my cutting diet down to a science. My goal is 6lbs in 6 weeks on diet alone....im adding these babies in to see if i can push it more then while retaining or adding muscle and strength.

 

[oufinny]

I would say if you are going for TTA why not go the DCP root? I know Casey loves the effects he is getting from Recreate and DCP but Dicana looks like a solid product.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

I would say if you are going for TTA why not go the DCP root? I know Casey loves the effects he is getting from Recreate and DCP but Dicana looks like a solid product.

actually im not looking at TTA now...i started looking at it and my attention got diverted to TT3 then to Dicana

DCP is another i may consider trying while on Recreate...but maybe later

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

Possibly scratch the Dicana...after a little research Im finding that it suppressed the Thyroid and possibly requires PCT

Still researching but what im finding is kinda scaring me

May just stick to Dermatherm, OEP, TNA, and coleus.....i like how there are very few ingredients in dermatherm all easily researchable which will be done after i have formed a conclusion about Dicana

 

[carpee]

throw in recreate

the Recreate OEP stack is unreal.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

throw in recreate

the Recreate OEP stack is unreal.

Yeah i know but im thinking about running 6 weeks OEP and 6 weeks Recreate back to back to have a shred and maintain 12 weeks.

But during the OEP add some Coleus, raspberry ketones and green tea....but im thinking thats more placebo with the rasp ketones and green tea is just good for health purposes.

As of now the best natural stack that doesnt suppress your thyroid or has 7-keto in it is the USP Recreate/OEP stack....

 

[carpee]

Yeah i know but im thinking about running 6 weeks OEP and 6 weeks Recreate back to back to have a shred and maintain 12 weeks.

But during the OEP add some Coleus, raspberry ketones and green tea....but im thinking thats more placebo with the rasp ketones and green tea is just good for health purposes.

As of now the best natural stack that doesnt suppress your thyroid or has 7-keto in it is the USP Recreate/OEP stack....

I'm in love with the OEP/Recreate stack.

I have Prime in play too though, so my appetite is perfect for cutting.

Not starving, but not forcing myself to eat either

 

[borobulker]

I'm in love with the OEP/Recreate stack.

I have Prime in play too though, so my appetite is perfect for cutting.

Not starving, but not forcing myself to eat either

I like this... Key for retaining muscle in a caloric deficit/increase cardio environment.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

Ive yet to hit up Prime during a cut....but it will be done!


Switching up the doses of SuperSaps to two large doses one morning/mid-day and one pre-workout

See how i like it compared to three doses a day.

 

[GoHardOrGoHme]

for all those curious to see how this stack is treating me, here is my new log

One day I will be Great, and this is how...