[Big Masa]

I have heard about synthetic DHT gel named Andractim 2.5% Gel. It's been around for years, but some study lately showed it may reduce severity of Gynecomastia, aka ***** Tits, in addition to its original use in hormon replacement therapy.

Info
http://www.thebody.com/catie/andractim.html
Source
http://www.farmamondo.com/vista.cfm?ID=161&LI=e
http://www.secure-sales.org.uk/sexua...osterone.shtml

Andractim Gel is not readily available in the USA, but we may order it from online sources, with or without prescription.

The active ingredient is a synthetic DHT, namely Androstanolon. Is there any pro-hormon or pro-steroid that converts to DHT or androstanolon? If we can make a homebrew version of it, we have Gyno Gel!! What would you name it? T-G(T-Gyno), or T-D(T-DHT)?

I am not a specialist of PS, PH or ASS, so I would be sorry if it doesn't make any sense.

[ndn diablo]

Originally posted by Big Masa
I have heard about synthetic DHT gel named Andractim 2.5% Gel. It's been around for years, but some study lately showed it may reduce severity of Gynecomastia, aka ***** Tits, in addition to its original use in hormon replacement therapy.

Info
http://www.thebody.com/catie/andractim.html
Source
http://www.farmamondo.com/vista.cfm?ID=161&LI=e
http://www.secure-sales.org.uk/sexua...osterone.shtml

Andractim Gel is not readily available in the USA, but we may order it from online sources, with or without prescription.

The active ingredient is a synthetic DHT, namely Androstanolon. Is there any pro-hormon or pro-steroid that converts to DHT or androstanolon? If we can make a homebrew version of it, we have Gyno Gel!! What would you name it? T-G(T-Gyno), or T-D(T-DHT)?

I am not a specialist of PS, PH or ASS, so I would be sorry if it doesn't make any sense.

I believe 5aa converts directly into DHT.

[Sean]

Heh, In-Rage?
1-test converts (though through an unknown mechanism) to some extent into DHT. That's what's responsible for the hairloss.

[ndn diablo]

There are references as well that show that DHT applied in areas with high prolactin can reduce gyno. Here is one:

Benveniste O, Simon A and Herson S. Successful percutaneous dihydrotestosterone treatment of gynecomastia occurring during highly active antiretroviral therapy: four cases and a review of the literature. Clinical Infectious Diseases 2001;33:891-893.

But, 5-aa needs to be converted so would it convert into dht as soon as it hits gets into the blood?

[ndn diablo]

Originally posted by Sean
Heh, In-Rage?
1-test converts (though through an unknown mechanism) to some extent into DHT. That's what's responsible for the hairloss.

Yes but 5aa would probabbly be a better choice since its target hormone is DHT, where as 1-test would only convert into DHT in small amounts.

[Big Masa]

I agree that 5aa may be the better choice, since its target hormone is DHT.

5aa needs to get into the blood stream to be converted to DHT, but here is a problem: once getting in blood stream, it doesn't work directly on nipples or breasts.

To combat against Gyno, do we need to use a straight DHT, not its precursor or pro-hormone? This could be a problem for homebrewers, because I think DHT is illigal without a prescription. Is there any cheap and easy source for DHT? As far as I know, no cattle growth implants contains DHT.

[DevilSmack]

I have six tubes of Andractim. I'm not currently using them because I have been having some hair-loss and I don't want to aggravate it futher. Andractim does not have some fancy ingredient that localy delivers the DHT right to your tit. What I mean is it does not just deliver locally and it has systemic effects. If you don't suffer from hair-loss this really is not much of a problem. I have asked Par Douche several times if his Lipo-Gel would help deliver the Andracim localy and he won't give me an answer. Here is a cut and paste my post from his board: *** "I had been using Andractim for gyno treatment at the recomended dose of 5 grams a day. After using it for about four or five days, one monrning after washing my hair, I found a lot more hair in the bath tub than I normally do. I sort of speculated that is was due to increased DHT levels. This was the only time though that I had more than normal loss, but I still stopped taking it after two weeks. I want to get some Tamoxifen and an aromatase inhibitor to run w/ the Andractim next time. I have six tubes of Andractim. Also I have read that a few have had very good results using Vitex to reduce nipple puffyness. I was thinking of thowing in Bromo or Deprenyl with my gyno treatment stack to lower prolactin. If this does not work in reducing the size of my lumps, then I will know that surgery Is my only option. I don't believe that Andractim has anything special to use in delivery of the androstanolone. I mean I want to get a local effect w/ very little systemic effect for the obvious reasons of DHT's nasty side effects. Now Would it help to mix the Andractim W/ the Lipo-Gel or not?

ut/paste my post from the Avant Board:

[Big Masa]

Correct me if I am wrong. You don't really need Tamoxifen (Nolvadex) for DHT medication.

What Tamoxifen does is binding to estrogen recepters so that real Estrogen has less effect. DHT doesn't readily convert to Estrogen, if my memory serves me right.

The fact that you experienced unusual hairloss means that DHT in the gel got absorbed into the blood stream and thus impacted your hair. We need a base gel that lets DHT work only locally.

[Lifeguard]

Anybody here ever heard of Viritase by Molecular Nutrition?...

5-aa while in the blood coverts into DHT, yes.

Currently there are 2 versions of 5-AA on the market:

the 3 beta reductase enzyme version (9% DHT conversion) Viritase
and the 3 alpha reductase enzyme version (43% DHT conversion) 3-Alpha

both products made my Molecular Nutrition.

DHT competes for the same receptors as Estrogen (i.e. receptors in the male breast tissue)

so the DHT occupies the E receptors in the breast tissue and it is similar to Proviron (1-methyl-DHT, I think) as a steroidal anti estrogen.

hope this clears of the minor confusion.


LG.

[SteveDFW]

The only thing I know about Viratase is that Wardog said he used with his 1,200mg a day 4AD cutting cycle and it did a nice job of keeping water retention down.

Now the 3-alpha might be interesting to use as a transdermal to get more bang for your buck on conversion in the body.

[Lifeguard]

Originally posted by SteveDFW

Now the 3-alpha might be interesting to use as a transdermal to get more bang for your buck on conversion in the body.

the thing is though that I havn't been able to find a bulk powder distributor of the 3 alpha stuff....


LG.

[DevilSmack]

Originally posted by Big Masa
Correct me if I am wrong. You don't really need Tamoxifen (Nolvadex) for DHT medication.

What Tamoxifen does is binding to estrogen recepters so that real Estrogen has less effect. DHT doesn't readily convert to Estrogen, if my memory serves me right.

The fact that you experienced unusual hairloss means that DHT in the gel got absorbed into the blood stream and thus impacted your hair. We need a base gel that lets DHT work only locally.

Did you not read all of my post? I am using Andractim for Gyno treatment. I know what tamoxifen does. I'm going to include it in the treatment of my gyno, it has nothing to do w/ the hair-loss issue. Yes I want a "local effect" for the Andractim, DUH, that was the whole point of my question to Par. Sorry I'm a little crankie today.

[Sean]

How about just plain transdermal yohimbe instead? Many people use it to combat gyno, although it can cause some water retention.

[Big Masa]

Originally posted by DevilSmack
Did you not read all of my post? I am using Andractim for Gyno treatment. I know what tamoxifen does. I'm going to include it in the treatment of my gyno, it has nothing to do w/ the hair-loss issue. Yes I want a "local effect" for the Andractim, DUH, that was the whole point of my question to Par. Sorry I'm a little crankie today.

I am sorry that I was mistaken. Tamoxifen as a gyno treatment...that's what you meant.

However, I understood your point of the question to Per Deus. I also want to hear Per's opinion.

I apologize again for making such a confusion.

[DevilSmack]

Originally posted by Big Masa


I am sorry that I was mistaken. Tamoxifen as a gyno treatment...that's what you meant.

However, I understood your point of the question to Per Deus. I also want to hear Per's opinion.

I apologize again for making such a confusion.

No problem. Sorry if I sounded like a ****.

[DevilSmack]

Originally posted by Sean
How about just plain transdermal yohimbe instead? Many people use it to combat gyno, although it can cause some water retention.

I tried it. It didn't work. I have hard lumps and most likely surgery is the only thing that is going to get rid of them. However if you guys want you could try dissolving some 5-alpha-androstane-diol or dione in some LipoDerm-Y. This in my opinion should work just as well as Andractim.

[dazed]

None of these topical dht treatments are not supposed to be as good at treating gyno as good old arimidex. I don't have the references handy but I know I've read that.

[DevilSmack]

You are Dazed from Mind and Muscle, right? I'm glad you joined the thread. I tried using Arimidex for treament of my gyno. I used up to a whole 1mg tab a day. After a few weeks their was not even a slight reduction of the tumors. I even used Nolvadex for up to three months with no luck. I would like to try Aromasin, if I knew where to get it at a resonable price. Aromasin, Nolvadex, bromocriptine, and Andractim would be a nice stack for treament, hitting gyno from every possible angle. What do you think?

[dazed]

Thats me...If I remember correctly the andactrim was only effective in about 50% of those who used it, and when I say effective I mean that there was a reduction in gyno size, not a "cure".
At 1mg of arimidex a day, you should have had almost no estrogen in your system. Something like aromasin is a different kind of aromatase inhibitor(steroidal), so it may have different effects, possibly better for gyno. The andactrim is also a steroidal aromatase inhibitor, but a weaker one, so I would not stack that. I'm not sure if you would want to use nolvadex at the same time, since the purpose of nolvadex is to outcompete estradiol for binding in the breast tissue, but since you would be using aromasin, there should be no estradiol to bind. I think the bromo is a good idea to try with it though.