Nordiol/1,4 andro/Transdermal Math/Questions

[WoodenMan]

First off I'd like to say hello to all the members of this board.<O</O
Im a new member who is very interested in making his own transdermal homebrew and<O</O
have some questions about the amount needed to create a cycle consisting of both Nordiol and 1,4 andro and also some pct questions.
<O</O
I've been reading alot of posts here and done some research on how the process is done and it seems very straight foward.<O</O
What I need help with is the proper amounts per PH to use for a 6 week cycle of these two compounds. I recently came across an XML beta of the<O</O
transdermal calculator (curt2go's link in his profile never worked for me) and have done some calculations needed for this cycle.<O</O
<O</O
My calculations are based on a 4oz bottle of Dermabolics's Norderm. I am considering on picking up some of this and also some Molecular Nutrition 1,4 andro (oral) as my very first cycle and then reusing the bottles (Norderm) later for reusage once I've purchased some Nordiol powder and 1,4 powder.<O</O
<O</O
////////////////////////////////<O</O
// Dermabolic Bottle Data //<O</O
// and Nordiol calculations //<O</O
////////////////////////////////<O</O

<TABLE style="WIDTH: 799pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse; mso-padding-alt: 0in 0in 0in 0in" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=1065 border=0><TBODY><TR style="HEIGHT: 15.75pt"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 182pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=243>Transdermal Bottle Size:<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 132pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=176>120<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 149pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=199>ml's<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 88pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=117><O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 1.75in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=168><O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 122pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=163><O</O

</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 15.75pt"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">Transdermal Bottle's Spray Volume:<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">0.80<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">ml/spray<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 15.75pt"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">Transdermal Spray per Day:<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">10<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">spray<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 15.75pt"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 182pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=243>Transdermal absorption Rate:<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">40%<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">(approx. percentage)<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 15.75pt"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 182pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=243>Calculated PH Content:<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8">62.50<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" colSpan=3>mg/ml (62.5 mg/ml maximum, but 50.0 mg/ml recommended)<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8"><O</O

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Transdermal Dosage 500 mg<O</O
Transdermal Daily Absorption 200 mg<O</O

<OThe calculated PH content,dosage and absorption are based on me using 7.5 grams of Nordiol (which I'm assuming is correct for a 500 mg dosage per 10 sprays).
<O
////////////////////////////////<O</O
// 1,4 andro calculations ////<O</O
////////////////////////////////
<O</O

<O<TABLE style="WIDTH: 677pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse; mso-padding-alt: 0in 0in 0in 0in" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=903 border=0><TBODY><TR style="HEIGHT: 15.75pt"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 182pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=243>Calculated PH Content:<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 132pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=176>41.67<O</O

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; BORDER-LEFT-COLOR: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; WIDTH: 363pt; BORDER-TOP-COLOR: #ece9d8; PADDING-TOP: 0in; HEIGHT: 15.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; BORDER-RIGHT-COLOR: #ece9d8" width=484>mg/ml (62.5 mg/ml maximum, but 50.0 mg/ml recommended)<O</O

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Transdermal Dosage 333.3 mg<O</O

Transdermal Daily Absorption 133.3 mg<O</O
<O</O
The calculated PH content,dosage and absorption are based on me using 5.0 grams of 1,4 andro (which I'm assuming is correct for a 333.3 mg dosage per 10 sprays).<O</O
<O</O
Roughly, Im assuming that one bottle (per compound) will last me 15 days, so Ill have to brew atleast 3 bottles of each PH respectively to complete this six week cycle.<O</O
<O</O
I'm just wondering are my numbers correct for the grams needed to complete these bottles and are the dosage amounts correct for transdermal application of Nordiol and 1,4 andro. Also, Im not sure Im correct on the actual spray volume of .8 ml per spray (total guess). I based this on Dermabolics recommended appilcation dosage ( 120 ml total / (.8 ml * 5 squirts) = 30 servings of 200 mg ).<O</O

For estrogen control while "on" , I was considering using Formastane (Aromazap or Formadrol). I had read a recent article in Muscular Development where a guy recommended formastane while using tren/deca since deca is prone to produce progesterone. Is this recommended while on Nordiol and will this actually benefit me in prevention of progesterone gyno or would this increase androgenic side effects while on Nordiol (ie. baldness,etc.) or gyno?

For pct , I would be using Nolva plus 6oxo (6 weeks),trib,zma, but I had some questions about pct options concerning progesterone. Two options I have come acrossed are bromocriptine and dostinex. Nolva I can obtain, the other two are alittle bit tricker but I think I have valid sources to obtain them( I hope ). My concern is whether or not either of them will be able to combat and control early signs of progesterone gyno. Most of the posts Ive read give bromocriptine the nod while others say dostinex is the way to go given less sides.

Thanks for any advice,critques or corrections,

WoodenMan

 

[DR.D]

Welcome to AM!

First, the bromo is good for prog gyno but bad during PCT. It turns off LH secretion, not good during PCT. I'd drop the 6-oxo too, Form is much better when on. Try just the nolva PCT if possible. You calc'ed a bit on the high side so your numbers are 'safe' and realistic. The only prob w/ this combo might be acne, but that depends on your chem. Other than that, looks good! I'm sure you'll get a lot of opinions though. With your first cycle, your learning a lot. Just don't get greedy with it.

 

[WoodenMan]

Thanks for the input Dr.D , much appreciated<O</O

I kind of figured bromo might be something used during 'on' but I just wanted to get clarified on that. That and dostinex is what I have found to be good for progesterone from what ive read , just didnt know when was best time for application. Only other problems for me were both are kinda hard to find them and also finding a list of sides effects. (dizziness i think is one of them)<O</O

<O</O
As far as the calculated grams per bottle of both phs, would you recommend maybe lowering them?<O</O

nordiol 6 - 400 mg dosage , 160 absorbed (norderm dosage)<O</O
1,4 andro 3 - 200 mg dosage , 80 absorbed<O</O

As far as dropping 6oxo for pct, is that because it can further suppress HPTA since its more or less an androgen? Ive read alot of arguments on this , alot of people lean to just plain nolva since it can also increase LH secretion during pct.<O</O

Also for formastane, I was actually looking at one of the sponsor's site and came across H.M. Gear's Aromabolan, has anyone on the board used this product and is it effective as preventive measure versus progesterone?<O</O

Thanks again for the help and any input from the board,<O</O

<O</O
WoodenMan<O</O