Overtraining vs. Training too little
01-16-2008 03:03 PM
Overtraining vs. Training too little
I've noticed that a lot of people do quite a few different exercises each workout day to really hit their specific muscle groups hard. I've always trained where I'll do a compound exercise and then 1, maybe 2 isolating exercises for each muscle group being worked. I often feel like I could train harder and just blast my muscles with all sorts of exercises, but I don't. As I do a 3 day split twice a week (Mon/Thurs - Chest, Tris, Shoulders Tues/Friday - Back, Bi, Forearms Wed/Sat legs and every other day abs), I like to have some exercises for the first day and switch them up and do different ones the second day.
What's better? I take Drive/AP/IGF-2, Citrulline Malate, Creatine, Beta Alanine, AAKG, Xtend + Bulk BCAAs, ALCAR, Glycerol monostearate as well as the basic supplements. I virtually do not tire out in the weight room or in the pool so I don't really know what's too much or too little. Should I just try and go all out and just completely burn out my muscles or should I stick to what I'm doing right now? I am seeing good results right now, but I always wonder if I could train harder and see better results, but I dont want to overtrain.
01-16-2008 06:04 PM
wow what a question - I wrote a section in my book on this - this depends on your fitness level - as far as how many muscle groups to work in a single training session. Full body for the 1st 3 months, then a split of 1/2 the body in one session, and 1/2 in another, and rotate back and forth. For the Advanced body builder is gets more complex since you could go to a 3 to 6 day rotation before going back to the 1st muscle group. I recommend that you change the order of exercises more often as you get more experienced, and every 3-4 weeks --- when you stop seeing results, change up what muscle groups your pair up. This is all detailed in my book along with sample 3 month plans, and workout journals. You also can see that there are several ways to structure a workout. You mentioned one - another is with preexhaustion - for example for chest, flys before presses. These are good for muscle gain, for fat loss - you will do more supersets, giant sets, etc, check out DIALED IN
01-22-2008 06:13 AM
Listen Soopaman,it is not so easy to overtrain yourself,especially with all suplements you are taking,I would say imposiblle.
Real overtraining is something that hapens to only few people and that is one unpleasend,cronic,depresive disease,that can't be healed for many years,in opossite small overtraining is normal thing,which with glutamine(in double doses),creatine and good sleep is vanishing.Although somethimes rest depends of thing like,how experienced you are,how many years you have...
I would suggest for this kind of program one week of regeneration rest,every 4-6weeks.
01-22-2008 11:35 AM
100% correct!!! the term overtraining is just as overused as 1rm. most ironheads will never know the meaning of either, myself included.
Originally Posted by Westerner
if you're adding weight to the bar, why change?
best of luck,
01-22-2008 12:34 PM
I got some good advice from someone a while back stating "there is no such thing as overtraining, just under-eating and under-resting. All one has to do is look at elite athletes who train 6x per week at upwards of 3 hours per day.
Originally Posted by tunnelrat
01-22-2008 09:15 PM
Thanks for all the responses today.
I'm definitely going to start trying to wear myself out more in the gym. Today was a helluva workout and I got all my exercises done in an hour and was primed and ready for more, but there just wasn't too much else to do. I love my supplements though, and I can't wait to see what adding Cordygen5 to the list does for me.
And additionally, I get enough rest, but it is hard to get in 4400 clean calories, so that is my only real problem area I think I need to work on.
01-22-2008 09:20 PM
I think overtraining is all about CNS really. the muscles can't really be overtrained, but as SureShot said you can be under rested. Your CNS only recovers from rest and sleep, so even if the muscles can handle more, the nervous system can't. Thats why powerlifters do a deload before competition, to give maximum CNS healing time to go in fresh.
01-22-2008 10:19 PM
I agree, I think overtraining is a load of sh*t. Go hard or go home. Justeat enough and get enough sleep.
Originally Posted by Westerner
Edit: wow, we are all in agreement here. cool.
01-22-2008 11:22 PM
You can over train, for instance when I got my bike I rode for approximately 8 hours through the night, having amazing fun, fuelled by stimulants. There was no way I could possibly eat or sleep enough to recover, but it was fun.
Working out causes catabolism, resting causes anabolism, if your muscles start to cramp, or you cannot keep proper focus on your form, you should take a rest.
01-23-2008 10:37 AM
Here we have two different things neural fatigue what EasyEJL said,syptomes of neural fatigue are:
-loss of motivation
-apathy and boredom
-inability to concentrate
-lethargy and or being awake very late night when you should have been sleeping.'
-frequent upper respiratory infenctions
After this happens lose of body weight,decreased tonus of muscles and loseing strength.
Symptoms of overtraining or adrenal fatigue are
-elevated resting heart rate upon waking
-low body temperature upon waking
-trouble getting to and staying a sleep
-increased body fat levels
-compromised bone health, muscle and joint aches
-impaired immune function that leads to frequent sickness
-insatiable thirst or dehydration
You see,what happens in body that lead to overtraining?When adrenal glands are under so big stress after which they cannot recover succesfully,they start to relase cortisol,and cortisol is breaking muscle proteins bringing them into blood,then these proteins are used like energy in human system.When someone overtrain himself his body is always under this kind of proces,on and on,no matter if you are training,sleeping or kissing girlfriend.
This is survival proces and is something that could save human in early history,get him energy that he could never dreem of,this occurs when humans try to run away from wild animalls,body start to give everything just to not be eaten...There were some methods of training,when athlete need to put extra efforts in time he is exhausted,you need to imagine that wild bull(or some animall which you fear of) is chaseing you.
Unfortunatlly this can happen to people who also train for sport,but real overtraining is not posiblle to heal 100%,and if you heal it you are already old iron.I said again it happens very rarely,and only to people who train like proffesionals but without any kind of suplements,without corect nutrition,enough sleep,rest etc.
I know one men who overtrain him self,he was talented young soccer player,comitted for his goal,training 2-3times a day,far awey from home.He train alot but didn't have enough money for suplements and good food,it was 3years ago that he end in hospitall and now he is still sick and have all these syptoms,not able even to train recreatively.Very sad.
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