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5x5 volume help

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    5x5 volume help


    Hey guys, I've been thinking about bulking up and getting stronger for football coming up. I play linebacker so size is necessary. I just cut from 210 to 185 and got down to 9-10% BF. I stick to bodybuilding type training and include powerlifts such as deads,bench, push press/jerk, and squats. I'm trying to get to at least 205, but with lean mass this time. I play outside backer so I need more speed than anything. I'm 5'10 190 right now after a week of bulking. The question I have is how much volume I should be getting in my 5x5 workout. I know I should use the 5x5 method on compound movements such as bench, squats, pull-ups, and military press, but what about the other isolation movements, and how would I train arms using this method?? And if my arms are my weak point, should I try training them twice a week? Here's what I do so far...

    Chest/tris Mon:
    Flat bench 5x5
    Incline DB,or barbell 3x8-10
    Heavy dips or barbell decline 3x8-10
    Machine incline isolation 2x8-12 (focusing on squeezing)
    Pec deck or DB mid flys 3x15-20
    Cable pushdowns 2x12
    Chair weighted dips 2x15
    Overhead ext. 2x15


    Shoulders Tues:
    Barbell or DB military press 5x5
    Machine front delt Iso. 3x8-12
    Lateral raises 3x15-25
    Ez curl or DB front raises 3x12
    Rope pulls 3x12
    Bent over rear delt DB 3x12

    Weds Back/Bis
    Weighted pull-ups 5x5
    Deads 5x5
    Bent over BB or DB rows 3x10
    Mid rows 3x10
    Lat isolation(lay pull down or single arm) 3x10
    Incline DB curls 2x 15
    Machine curl Iso. 2x15
    Reverse curls 2x15

    Thursday legs
    Back squats 5x5
    Front squat 5x5
    Hack squat 3x10-12
    Leg press 3x10
    Leg ext. 2x 20
    Leg curl 2x20
    Calves various exercises

    Friday rest

    Saturday arms
    Barbell curls 5x5
    Single arm preacher curl 3x10
    Incline curls 3x10
    Hammer curls 3x10
    Close grip bench 5x5
    Skull crushers 3x10-12
    Rope or bar pushdowns 3x10
    Underhand ext 3x10

    Sunday rest

    Now, I work in forearms and calves 2-3 times a week also.. I only do contraction and squeezing type arm exercises on days I put it with larger muscles, as seen above. Then on arm days I do more compound type stuff and go heavy. Critique this plan and please suggests any changes I should make in order for a good mass/strength building routine... Any help is wanted! Thanks!

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    squat, deadlift, barbell rows, bench press, pull ups and OHP's. that's what will get you big and strong, along with some good programming. arm only days just plain suck...

    toss all that other crap...
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    Strength

    What you need...

    Linebackers strength is constantly being tested no matter what technique you play we need to take on lead blockers and shed them immediately. This will take an extremely powerful lower body foundation, a stable core, and a powerful upper body. This will allow you to take on blocks shed then make the play.

    What to do...

    Squats and deadlifts need to be a staple in your training, make sure to increase the sets and decrease the reps. We want you pushing heavy weight and resting more in between to really tax your nervous system. Also add power cleans, snatches, jerks, and heavy overhead/bench presses, this will develop explosive hips and give you the strength to toss runningbacks around

    Speed

    What you need...

    Speed can be tricky for linebackers because many do not know how to train this. The key movements in the game for a linebacker will be your lateral burst and your forward burst. Rarely will you be running the 100 yard dash so why would you focus your linebacker drills on that? Before worrying about your 40 time, you might want to make that play in the game. Linebackers are ever evolving but it has stayed consistent that they need to be just as shifty and explosive as runningbacks.

    What to do...

    Focus on training very short, high intense sprint movements. Some of my favorite drills are box drills where you are constantly cutting at full speed. Another great one is to have a friend give commands either forward/reverse and side to side with a point of his finger. This will allow you to read him and react, exactly what a linebackers job is. For that initial explosive burst train jumps. Set up a series of hurdles or stack boxes up and perform high box jumps, anything to train hip extension/flexion. Placing your focus on these 2 staples in your training can increase your game tremendously. It becomes a matter of, is your training design tailored into your particular needs in the game.
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    I enjoy working out, I can stay in the gym for 2 or 3 hours.. but I feel like I would lose my mind if I'm just doing the lifts you posted.. are you saying to cut out everything else? It seems as if you're suggesting a powerlifting approach...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Czervos View Post
    I enjoy working out, I can stay in the gym for 2 or 3 hours.. but I feel like I would lose my mind if I'm just doing the lifts you posted.. are you saying to cut out everything else? It seems as if you're suggesting a powerlifting approach...
    there's no need to be in the gym for 2-3 hours. if you are, you're talking too much...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moose45 View Post
    Strength

    What you need...

    Linebackers strength is constantly being tested no matter what technique you play we need to take on lead blockers and shed them immediately. This will take an extremely powerful lower body foundation, a stable core, and a powerful upper body. This will allow you to take on blocks shed then make the play.

    What to do...

    Squats and deadlifts need to be a staple in your training, make sure to increase the sets and decrease the reps. We want you pushing heavy weight and resting more in between to really tax your nervous system. Also add power cleans, snatches, jerks, and heavy overhead/bench presses, this will develop explosive hips and give you the strength to toss runningbacks around

    Speed

    What you need...

    Speed can be tricky for linebackers because many do not know how to train this. The key movements in the game for a linebacker will be your lateral burst and your forward burst. Rarely will you be running the 100 yard dash so why would you focus your linebacker drills on that? Before worrying about your 40 time, you might want to make that play in the game. Linebackers are ever evolving but it has stayed consistent that they need to be just as shifty and explosive as runningbacks.

    What to do...

    Focus on training very short, high intense sprint movements. Some of my favorite drills are box drills where you are constantly cutting at full speed. Another great one is to have a friend give commands either forward/reverse and side to side with a point of his finger. This will allow you to read him and react, exactly what a linebackers job is. For that initial explosive burst train jumps. Set up a series of hurdles or stack boxes up and perform high box jumps, anything to train hip extension/flexion. Placing your focus on these 2 staples in your training can increase your game tremendously. It becomes a matter of, is your training design tailored into your particular needs in the game.
    I forgot to mention I do include powercleans/ over head press/split jerk... I do these lifts twice a week. And i also do agility training and straight line speed training including speed ladders.
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post
    there's no need to be in the gym for 2-3 hours. if you are, you're talking too much...
    I agree with This!!! Lol Way to long!
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    Haha well its always worked for me.. Ive always been more into the bodybuilding type training but would always include some powerlifting movements.. Lets just say I want to get the best of both worlds in a sense.. So is there any way to include bodybuilding into an athletic training routine that focuses primarily on strength? Or will that totally ruin the point?
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    Your OP was to get into football shape for the linebacker position. I would look up and hunt down programs specifically design for that..... They are out there!

    Save the bodybuilding physique for later.
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    Yeah, if football is your goal train for it. Program your body specifically.
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    Flexibility & mobility in addition to what Napalm posted. Your key issue at OLB will be hip flexibility. If you have stiff hips, you'll be slow into coverage & changing directions.

    Work the big lifts, core strength, short distance speed work (shuttles, boxes, anything that combines speed & direction change) and mobility.
    Don't worry, man, someday I'ma be nobody too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moose45 View Post
    Your OP was to get into football shape for the linebacker position. I would look up and hunt down programs specifically design for that..... They are out there!

    Save the bodybuilding physique for later.
    I saw you on another forum talking about the west side barbell programs think. How's that?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Czervos

    I saw you on another forum talking about the west side barbell programs think. How's that?
    Not applicable to football...
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    5/3/1 with some high volume assistance. Improve your strength and keep your bodybuilder side happy
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeySon View Post
    5/3/1 with some high volume assistance. Improve your strength and keep your bodybuilder side happy
    Thanks man, I've been thinking either GVT, PHAT, or 5-3-1...
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    This is broad and generalized but one of my favorite sayings ever when playing football was "muscles in the front for show, muscles in the back for go". Strong hamstrings, glutes and upper back will take you a long way in football, my friend. The ability to stack and shed comes from hip strength and stability and then the pulling power to take that blocker where you want him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Czervos View Post
    Thanks man, I've been thinking either GVT, PHAT, or 5-3-1...
    GVT would be horrible for football.
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post

    Not applicable to football...
    The conjugate method CAN be applicable to football (when properly adapted)

    For football my recommendation is:

    DeFrancos Westside for Skinny Bastards

    Go to defrancostraining.com to read his articles on it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimbuick

    The conjugate method CAN be applicable to football (when properly adapted)
    I agree in theory, but IMO w novice trainees, by that I mean high school kids who have "worked out" for a couple yrs w/o much supervision, both the ME work AND their sport specific training would not be the best it could be.

    My concern would be recovery...
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post

    I agree in theory, but IMO w novice trainees, by that I mean high school kids who have "worked out" for a couple yrs w/o much supervision, both the ME work AND their sport specific training would not be the best it could be.

    My concern would be recovery...
    I agree, was merely clarifying. It's a pretty complex plan to keep track of and takes a lot more experience than a high school (or possibly even college) level athlete would have.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimbuick

    I agree, was merely clarifying. It's a pretty complex plan to keep track of and takes a lot more experience than a high school (or possibly even college) level athlete would have.
    We are on the same page broseph...
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post

    I agree in theory, but IMO w novice trainees, by that I mean high school kids who have "worked out" for a couple yrs w/o much supervision, both the ME work AND their sport specific training would not be the best it could be.

    My concern would be recovery...
    I wouldn't exactly say I'm novice.. I've been training since I was 13, I eat 7-8 meals a day, haven't missed a week of working out since the 7th grade.. So I don't want a beginners plan. I just need a solid strength building program. I'm thinking Jim wendlers 5-3-1 program is the best bet as far as strength goes wouldn't you say? Or maybe phat? There's only one thing proven to work and that's to eat like crazy. I'm at 190 11% BF as of now. Ever since football has been over I cut from 205 to 185.. Basically to increase my lean muscle/fat ratio and build up my speed. Like I said, I play outside linebacker. I want to get to around 205-210 before August. And get my bench to at least 300, squat to 400+, and deadlift to around 500.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Czervos View Post

    I wouldn't exactly say I'm novice.. I've been training since I was 13, I eat 7-8 meals a day, haven't missed a week of working out since the 7th grade.. So I don't want a beginners plan. I just need a solid strength building program. I'm thinking Jim wendlers 5-3-1 program is the best bet as far as strength goes wouldn't you say? Or maybe phat? There's only one thing proven to work and that's to eat like crazy. I'm at 190 11% BF as of now. Ever since football has been over I cut from 205 to 185.. Basically to increase my lean muscle/fat ratio and build up my speed. Like I said, I play outside linebacker. I want to get to around 205-210 before August. And get my bench to at least 300, squat to 400+, and deadlift to around 500.
    For athleticism I prefer the WS4SB template. But 5/3/1 would work as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean1332 View Post
    I need a copy of that.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimbuick View Post

    I need a copy of that.....
    how about "5/3/1 for stupid army runs"

    mine will be "5/3/1 for CG sand volleyball"
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean1332 View Post

    how about "5/3/1 for stupid army runs"

    mine will be "5/3/1 for CG sand volleyball"
    Lol I wont need the army one for that long.

    Football could be better for the long term training
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