Strength Not Size - AnabolicMinds.com

Strength Not Size

  1. Prraimm's Avatar
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    Strength Not Size


    Anyone know a workout or HOW to workout only for strength gains, but not really size? New to all this... Thanks !

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    Quote Originally Posted by Prraimm View Post
    Anyone know a workout or HOW to workout only for strength gains, but not really size? New to all this... Thanks !
    If you are new look for Rippetoe's Starting Strength guideline and workouts.

    Once you move up the ladder and get some experience and real PROPER FORM with all Barbell Compound movements, move up to 5x5.

    When you have milked everything out of the 2nd step, go on to Jim Wendler's 5/3/1. These are all geared towards STRENGTH training and gains.



    If you want the best of both worlds (not Hanna Montannah) go for Layne Norton Phat after your learn the basics of Starting Strength, or West Side for Skinny Bastards.

    So to sum it all up: Read up all the past mentioned routines and programs (which some come in books actually) and do your proper personal research to find what works for you .
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    Woah thanks ! Yeah i think i'll start with rippetoes, and work my way through everything.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    If you are new look for Rippetoe's Starting Strength guideline and workouts.

    Once you move up the ladder and get some experience and real PROPER FORM with all Barbell Compound movements, move up to 5x5.

    When you have milked everything out of the 2nd step, go on to Jim Wendler's 5/3/1. These are all geared towards STRENGTH training and gains.



    If you want the best of both worlds (not Hanna Montannah) go for Layne Norton Phat after your learn the basics of Starting Strength, or West Side for Skinny Bastards.

    So to sum it all up: Read up all the past mentioned routines and programs (which some come in books actually) and do your proper personal research to find what works for you .
    Great advice right here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prraimm View Post
    Woah thanks ! Yeah i think i'll start with rippetoes, and work my way through everything.
    Anytime bro, strength training is my passion too. Admittedly I am not the strongest around, and it does take YEARS, but one day I'll be lifting big, all this programs help you learn the basics and the gist of it. It's all about progression and pushing yourself harder and harder, then taking it a bit easy and do it all over again haha.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza

    Anytime bro, strength training is my passion too. Admittedly I am not the strongest around, and it does take YEARS, but one day I'll be lifting big, all this programs help you learn the basics and the gist of it. It's all about progression and pushing yourself harder and harder, then taking it a bit easy and do it all over again haha.
    Yeah it does take years, but the dedication pays off ! When a beefy man gets off a machine and can get on and do the same thing? Best feeling.
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    Diet is still very important even if you don't want to add very much size. You will want to eat slightly over maintenance to prevent overtraining while doing all those heavy compound movements. Sleep is also key to adding strength and preventing overtraining.

    For myself, I found the less is more approach works very well for adding strength. The route Celorza suggested is pretty much the exact way I went. I am just starting Wendlers now and I think I'll like it a lot. I am very glad I did SS and some 5x5 first though, you add strength much quicker on those routine while a novice/intermediate lifter. I see to many people jumping right to a 531 or Westside way to early and I feel they are leaving the strength games on the table. I am all for the "it takes a long time" and "in it for the long haul" mentality, but why hold yourself back with a more advanced program if you can easily progress with the newbie ones.

    SS=adding weight every workout
    5x5=adding weight every week
    531=adding weight once a month
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    Celorza gave really solid advice.

    Main thing to remember is always try and increase the weight on major lifts around 2.5-5lbs each week. Not a huge science guy, so that's the way I put it.

    Don't discouraged if some weeks you don't get it either. Make sure you're getting your rest and fueling your work outs properly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AaronJP1
    Celorza gave really solid advice.

    Main thing to remember is always try and increase the weight on major lifts around 2.5-5lbs each week. Not a huge science guy, so that's the way I put it.

    Don't discouraged if some weeks you don't get it either. Make sure you're getting your rest and fueling your work outs properly.
    All about progression and persistence. Well said, and if a week isn't spectacular either deload or push even harder next week. It's all a constant battle and struggle with the iron.
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    Yeah I'm also in for the long term slow gains, instead of just going crazy in the beginning. Thanks everyone !
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    Quote Originally Posted by boogyman View Post
    Diet is still very important even if you don't want to add very much size. You will want to eat slightly over maintenance to prevent overtraining while doing all those heavy compound movements. Sleep is also key to adding strength and preventing overtraining.

    For myself, I found the less is more approach works very well for adding strength. The route Celorza suggested is pretty much the exact way I went. I am just starting Wendlers now and I think I'll like it a lot. I am very glad I did SS and some 5x5 first though, you add strength much quicker on those routine while a novice/intermediate lifter. I see to many people jumping right to a 531 or Westside way to early and I feel they are leaving the strength games on the table. I am all for the "it takes a long time" and "in it for the long haul" mentality, but why hold yourself back with a more advanced program if you can easily progress with the newbie ones.

    SS=adding weight every workout
    5x5=adding weight every week
    531=adding weight once a month
    Have you ever run Westside? You max out every week for a double or single. The only problem with people running Westside too early is that most do not have the technique development, GPP, and/or discipline to stick with it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Have you ever run Westside? You max out every week for a double or single. The only problem with people running Westside too early is that most do not have the technique development, GPP, and/or discipline to stick with it.

    I have not run it, but I am familiar with it. I still think for a beginner SS and 5x5 should be run first. Squatting 3 times a week works well for beginners.

    I do not agree with beginners using 531, but i see it recomended a lot.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prraimm View Post
    Anyone know a workout or HOW to workout only for strength gains, but not really size?
    with strength gains, will come corresponding size gains, generally speaking.
    there are some strong skinny-type dudes to be sure (altho not that many), but you will never see a 175lb rail thin dude entertaining us on world's strong man competitions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by boogyman View Post
    I have not run it, but I am familiar with it. I still think for a beginner SS and 5x5 should be run first. Squatting 3 times a week works well for beginners.

    I do not agree with beginners using 531, but i see it recomended a lot.
    IMO, 5/3/1 is a better template for a beginner than SS or 5x5 because of the assistance lifts to keep balance within the kinetic chain.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    IMO, 5/3/1 is a better template for a beginner than SS or 5x5 because of the assistance lifts to keep balance within the kinetic chain.
    I think we went over this before, and I disagree. I feel the first few months are not the time to worry about the kinetic chain, addressing weaknesses, ect. Learning and working on the squat and deadlift should be priority for the beginning strength trainer. I don't think SS should be used for more than a few months. 5x5 are customizable enough that they can be used forever if you wanted.

    I do agree there is not enough pulling and I did rows and face pulls during both routines.
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    Quote Originally Posted by boogyman View Post
    I think we went over this before, and I disagree. I feel the first few months are not the time to worry about the kinetic chain, addressing weaknesses, ect. Learning and working on the squat and deadlift should be priority for the beginning strength trainer. I do agree there is not enough pulling and I did rows and face pulls during both routines.
    If there is a weakness and/or misalignment in the kinetic chain, then all of the work the trainee puts in will be counterproductive as it will reenforce bad habits, further the gap between strength/weakness, and potentially set up an injury down the road. Neophyte or elite, proper balance is essential.

    For example, I had a client once whose kyphosis and posture was so poor that he could not complete a back squat without rounding his thoracic. All of the time that I would have spent teaching the squat would have been in vain since the foundation was so poor. Instead, I had to focus on thoracic strength and positioning before even addressing the proper technique for a back squat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    If there is a weakness and/or misalignment in the kinetic chain, then all of the work the trainee puts in will be counterproductive as it will reenforce bad habits, further the gap between strength/weakness, and potentially set up an injury down the road. Neophyte or elite, proper balance is essential.

    For example, I had a client once whose kyphosis and posture was so poor that he could not complete a back squat without rounding his thoracic. All of the time that I would have spent teaching the squat would have been in vain since the foundation was so poor. Instead, I had to focus on thoracic strength and positioning before even addressing the proper technique for a back squat.
    I don't feel the average trainee will develope these imbalances in a few months.

    There are exceptions, but on a message board without knowing the person asking the question I would give general advice unless something is specified.

    BTW, I must have been editing my post while you were replying, sorry for that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by boogyman View Post
    I don't feel the average trainee will develope these imbalances in a few months.

    There are exceptions, but on a message board without knowing the person asking the question I would give general advice unless something is specified.

    BTW, I must have been editing my post while you were replying, sorry for that.
    It doesn't take long to develop a muscular imbalance and 99.999% of new trainees will have pre-existing imbalances that will be exacerbated unless specifically addressed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    It doesn't take long to develop a muscular imbalance and 99.999% of new trainees will have pre-existing imbalances that will be exacerbated unless specifically addressed.
    These can be addressed on either of those programs. I know Rippetoe is anal about not changing it at all, but really you can do whatever you want. I added some accessory movements to address weaknesses and it worked fine for me.
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    IMO even if someone is new to training, its vital to make sure that they do not develop muscular imbalances and teach them how to avoid it as early as possible. The main logic for me behind it is that if you teach them ALL the exercises now, they can develop the habit that these movements are necessary, and will most likely continue them for the duration of training.

    If you start off with only the movements you think are vital, then the trainee makes them habit, it can be very hard to incorporate new movements into an exercise program where the trainee doesn't see the benefit of such an exercise.

    Obviously you can argue this around in circles, but thats my 2cents
  

  
 

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