4 day split

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    4 day split


    G'day,

    Just thought id post my split, not for the beginner

    4 Day Split, 3 Days Off:

    Monday: Back/Biceps/Abs

    Back
    Front Pulldowns: 4 sets x 8-15 reps
    Barbell Rows: 4 sets x 6-12 reps
    Dumbbell Rows: 3 sets x 10-12 reps
    Dumbbell Pullovers: 3 sets x 8-12 reps
    Hyperextensions: 3 sets x 12 reps

    Biceps
    Preacher Curls: 4 sets x 8-15 reps
    Incline DB Curls: 3 sets x 8-12 reps
    BB curls: 3 sets x 10-15 reps

    Abs
    Machine Crunches: 4 sets x 25 reps

    Tuesday
    Chest, Triceps

    Chest
    Incline Barbell Press: 4 sets x 6-12 reps
    Flat Dumbbell Press: 3 sets x 6-12 reps
    Decline Dumbbell Flyes: 3 sets x 10-12 reps
    Cable Crossovers: 3 sets x 15 reps

    Triceps
    Cable Pushdowns: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Skullcrushers: 4 sets x 8-12 reps
    (used to do) 3 sets of overhead extensions too but after skullcrushers i don't have the energy lol

    Wednesday: Off

    Thursday
    Quads/Hams/Calves

    Quads
    Squats: 5 sets x 6-20 reps
    Front Squats: 3 sets x 12-15 reps
    Leg Extensions: 3 sets x 15-20 reps

    Hamstrings
    Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Standing Unilateral Leg Curls: 4 sets x 10-15 reps

    Calves
    Standing off of block Calf Raises: 4 sets x 15-25 reps
    Seated Calf Raises: 4 sets x 12-15 reps

    Friday
    Delts/Traps/Abs

    Delts
    Seated Dumbbell Military Press: 4 sets x 8-12 reps
    Side Dumbbell Lateral Raises: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Bent Dumbell Rear Raises: 3 sets x 10-15 reps
    Front Dumbbell Raises: 3 sets x 10-12 reps

    Traps
    Barbell Shrugs: 4 sets x 8-12 reps
    Dumbbell Shrugs: 4 sets x 12 reps

    Abs
    Decline Bench Crunches: 4 sets x 15 reps

    Saturday: Off

    Sunday: Off

    Comments welcome.

    Cheers-

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    Make a max effort for each body part then supplement the rest of the other exercises for that body part as a super set. Lactic acid=growth
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    I would have either dips or close grip bench as my first tricep movement, then follow with the extension movements. Looks solid otherwise.
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    Thanks fellas, i like to make changes to my split every 4 weeks so i may ad those ideas. Cheers-
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    Quote Originally Posted by runner_79
    Make a max effort for each body part then supplement the rest of the other exercises for that body part as a super set. Lactic acid=growth
    No, protein synthesis > protein degradation = growth. Lactate is important for providing a buffer by pyruvate accepting hydrogen during anaerobic situations, being used for energy through the Krebs cycle, and being converted to glucose in the liver.

    Back to the OT, what's your training age (ie, your lifting experience)? Intricate splits won't have the same payout as a more primary lift-focused routine if you're young in your training age. Your goals also play a role if you're further along in training.

    Regardless, I will suggest you place the more taxing day (your leg day) earlier in the week so you're able to train your squats effectively. Your volume is high throughout the week (assuming you're lower in training experience; if you have more, the volume may not be as extreme), which is going to beat you up by the time you reach Thursday.

    Also, your set/rep scheme is pretty spastic. Again, what are you trying to achieve? How much training do you have? Your set number is pretty high alone (I only achieve 100+ sets in a week when I train 4x10 or 5x5 at 5 exercises per session, and that's counting warm up and cooldown sets), but couple that with the huge rep ranges and your goal becomes pretty fuzzy.

    Not hating, just questioning.
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    Age- 29.
    hight- 5' 9"
    weight- currently 93-94 kg
    BF%- roughly 14%, looks more like 13.
    Experience- Been bodybuilding for going on 13 years now.

    Goal is to add mass plain and simple, once im happy with my size ill change my diet to drop the body fat, then i usually do a maintenance diet for a while then repeat.

    This is a new split and is no way near perfect, like my diet i keep making changes till im happy. At the moment im ok with it, its hard work but ive noticed a increase in condition since starting.

    the reps being up and down is to find a sweet spot, generally most people say 8-10 is the best rep range for muscle growth, ive always felt that i grow better on higher reps and multiple sets. Whatever works right.

    Cheers-
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    Quote Originally Posted by runner_79 View Post
    Make a max effort for each body part then supplement the rest of the other exercises for that body part as a super set. Lactic acid=growth
    Lactic acid has nothing to do with growth.. Soreness has nothing to do with growth either.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt. Swole View Post
    G'day,

    Just thought id post my split, not for the beginner

    4 Day Split, 3 Days Off:

    Monday: Back/Biceps/Abs

    Back
    Front Pulldowns: 4 sets x 8-15 reps
    Barbell Rows: 4 sets x 6-12 reps
    Dumbbell Rows: 3 sets x 10-12 reps
    Dumbbell Pullovers: 3 sets x 8-12 reps
    Hyperextensions: 3 sets x 12 reps

    Biceps
    Preacher Curls: 4 sets x 8-15 reps
    Incline DB Curls: 3 sets x 8-12 reps
    BB curls: 3 sets x 10-15 reps

    Abs
    Machine Crunches: 4 sets x 25 reps

    Tuesday
    Chest, Triceps

    Chest
    Incline Barbell Press: 4 sets x 6-12 reps
    Flat Dumbbell Press: 3 sets x 6-12 reps
    Decline Dumbbell Flyes: 3 sets x 10-12 reps
    Cable Crossovers: 3 sets x 15 reps

    Triceps
    Cable Pushdowns: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Skullcrushers: 4 sets x 8-12 reps
    (used to do) 3 sets of overhead extensions too but after skullcrushers i don't have the energy lol

    Wednesday: Off

    Thursday
    Quads/Hams/Calves

    Quads
    Squats: 5 sets x 6-20 reps
    Front Squats: 3 sets x 12-15 reps
    Leg Extensions: 3 sets x 15-20 reps

    Hamstrings
    Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Standing Unilateral Leg Curls: 4 sets x 10-15 reps

    Calves
    Standing off of block Calf Raises: 4 sets x 15-25 reps
    Seated Calf Raises: 4 sets x 12-15 reps

    Friday
    Delts/Traps/Abs

    Delts
    Seated Dumbbell Military Press: 4 sets x 8-12 reps
    Side Dumbbell Lateral Raises: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Bent Dumbell Rear Raises: 3 sets x 10-15 reps
    Front Dumbbell Raises: 3 sets x 10-12 reps

    Traps
    Barbell Shrugs: 4 sets x 8-12 reps
    Dumbbell Shrugs: 4 sets x 12 reps

    Abs
    Decline Bench Crunches: 4 sets x 15 reps

    Saturday: Off

    Sunday: Off

    Comments welcome.

    Cheers-
    This is very high volume and may be more than you need.

    First off, I'd recommend decreasing the number of sets for direct arm training. Less volume is good when it comes to arms if you're already working your back and chest. If I'm working biceps or triceps in a workout, I'll usually do no more than 4 total sets per muscle group. Yeah, it's fun to work arms, but they don't need that much extra stimulation. I mean, if I could and this was the way it worked, I'd be doing 20+ sets for arms. But that's not the way it works. Decrease your number of sets for arms and you'll make just as much progress if not more.

    Get rid of the front DB raises for your shoulders. You're already hitting your front delts hard with any pressing movement you do (chest workout included), so an isolation exercise doesn't make any sense.

    Only need one isolation exercise for chest, so ditch the crossovers. But I do like DB pullovers, so think about switching the crossovers for pullovers. They don't hit the chest very hard, but they do make the serratus muscles do a lot of pulling, and the better those muscles look, the better your overall chest looks.

    Include some supersets in your workouts. This is a fantastic way to increase workout intensity. Anytime you can increase workout intensity effectively, do it. I say effectively because if you just wanted to increase sheer intensity, that wouldn't be a problem (no rest at all! haha). You want to make it effective and supersets are a great way to do that. Almost every set I do is part of a superset.

    I would add more but I'm in a hurry to leave. Will be back to this thread though. Good luck for now!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt. Swole View Post
    Age- 29.
    hight- 5' 9"
    weight- currently 93-94 kg
    BF%- roughly 14%, looks more like 13.
    Experience- Been bodybuilding for going on 13 years now.

    Goal is to add mass plain and simple, once im happy with my size ill change my diet to drop the body fat, then i usually do a maintenance diet for a while then repeat.

    This is a new split and is no way near perfect, like my diet i keep making changes till im happy. At the moment im ok with it, its hard work but ive noticed a increase in condition since starting.

    the reps being up and down is to find a sweet spot, generally most people say 8-10 is the best rep range for muscle growth, ive always felt that i grow better on higher reps and multiple sets. Whatever works right.

    Cheers-
    With ~13 years of experience and likely some pretty high volume throughout those 13 years, you probably have a pretty high tolerance for volume. Regardless, a few points...
    1. High volume being performed constantly will inhibit optimal progress and can lead to overtraining (this is often thrown around as a buzzword by people who don't understand what overtraining really is; OT will occur after prolonged periods of extreme stress--see months--with inadequate recovery). Overreaching, a short burst of high volume (maybe 4-6 weeks) followed by lower training volumes for a period of time result in a supercompensation effect by your body. Essentially, once you have time to recover, the changes you see will be much higher than you would have seen performing low volume or high volume training only. Your fluctuations in volume might look a little different than someone training for sport performance, but you should still cycle (i.e., periodize) your training.
    2. Following point 1, some rigidity should be in your program. You don't have to be a robot and follow every point to a T, but the body requires a certain amount of similar training to progress the best. A range of 6-20 reps on squats, for instance, emphasizes three different goals: 6 reps are more strength oriented, 10-12 (maybe 15) emphasize strength-endurance, and 20 is pretty much straight endurance. Coming in one week and doing six reps, then doing 15 the next, and 20 the next--just an example--won't allow you to familiarize to the training to the same degree as focusing on a certain goal during each training block would. I would encourage you to give more structured training (in terms of reps) a shot for a few blocks of 4-6 weeks each and see what happens.
    3. Each set-rep range has its role in training, and none of them should be completely overlooked. 3x10s and 4x10s (12 would be okay, maybe 15s) really help with work capacity and hypertrophy, while 5s and 3s will bring greatest benefits on the strength side of things. Strength will help you grow as well, as the only the only two ways to increase strength are via increased neuromuscular coordination and increased CSA of a muscle. Also, greater strength will allow you to move heavier loads during higher volume training, again inducing greater work capacity and hypertrophy through the higher volumes involved.
    4. I'm not a huge fan of high-rep sets (over 10-12), but if you want to keep the reps higher for accessory work during higher volume blocks, that's fine. The higher volume will likely lead to better gains during blocks of lower volume (if you choose to go that route). Front squats and RDLs/SLDLs, though, are not accessory movements. They still require a ton of muscle to perform correctly and shouldn't be thrown under the bus. I would suggest alternating squat types between training blocks and knocking the reps back on SLDLs to be more in line with your squats. Some alternate accessory moves might be Bulgarian squats, lunges, and overhead squats for squat variants and barbell hip thrusts, reverse-hypers, and glute-hams for hamstring/glute/lower back development.
    5. As far as supersets are concerned (Type O's post), I wouldn't recommend them for your main lifts, as you want to maintain a high level of effort across sets. The high level of neurological fatigue from supersetting primary moves and the muscular fatigue from supersetting a primary with an accessory that targets the same muscle(s) will really inhibit your force producing capabilities.
    Finally, are you training to failure every set, or do you follow a more periodized approach to loading?

    Sorry if I'm long-winded...
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattsams89 View Post
    With ~13 years of experience and likely some pretty high volume throughout those 13 years, you probably have a pretty high tolerance for volume. Regardless, a few points...
    This is a great post with many excellent points.

    My major concern with your (OP) program is the lack of balance and core, fixator, and stabilizer movements resulting in the potential for muscular imbalance and overuse related injuries.

    Your anterior kinetic chain work far over powers your posterior KC work. I.e.: you need more mid trap, lower trap, rhomboid and rear delt work on the upper body, and more hamstring and glute work on the lower body.

    As for stabilizer/fixator work...
    There is a lot more to the core than rectus abs. Furhter, most "ab" exercises are working simply the rectus femoris and other hip flexors. A series of planks and rotational movements will work wonders for both your physique and performance.

    Second, the shoulder joint. The external rotators are always ignored in bodybuilding (and many powerlifters and even some athletes). Perform 2-3 sets of external rotations 3 times a week. Prone scaptions, scapula dips, scapula pull downs, etc. will strengthen your lower traps and improve all your pushing movements. Finally, face pulls, band pull aparts, etc. will go a long way in building and strengthening the rhomboids and mid traps.

    Finally, if your goal is to build size, why aren't you dead lifting?

    Br
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    Quote Originally Posted by runner_79 View Post
    Make a max effort for each body part then supplement the rest of the other exercises for that body part as a super set. Lactic acid=growth
    As a side note, lactate is associated with the GH response to exercise. But there is much more to hypertrophy than just an increase in post exercise GH, otherwise we would see very muscular cyclists.

    Br
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    Thanks for the replies and advice everyone, its the end of the week and these are the changes ive made so far. feeling strong and hard but am having a tough time in other departments, i quit smoking just over 2 weeks ago, started the filthy habit 4 years ago, although i definitely feel over it and know ill never smoke again ive been suffering with depression and sleeplessness since quitting, bloody pissing me off.

    Any more tips or changes you would make?

    here is the revised diet-
    Monday: Back/Biceps/Abs

    Back
    Front Pulldowns: 3 sets x 10-15 reps
    Barbell Rows: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Dumbbell Rows: 2-3 sets x 10-15 reps
    Dumbbell Pullovers: 3 sets x 10-15 reps
    Deadlifts: 3 sets x 12 reps

    Biceps
    Preacher Curls: 3-4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Incline DB Curls: 3 sets x 10-15 reps
    BB curls: 2 sets x 10-15 reps

    Abs
    Rope Crunches: 3 sets x 25 reps

    Tuesday
    Chest, Triceps

    Chest
    Incline Barbell Press: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Flat Dumbbell Press: 3 sets x 10-15 reps
    Flat Dumbbell Flyes: 3 sets x 10-15 reps


    Triceps
    Cable Pushdowns: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Skullcrushers: 3 sets x 10-15 reps
    DB kickbacks: 3 sets x 10-15


    Wednesday: Off

    Thursday
    Quads/Hams/Calves

    Quads
    Squats: 5 sets x 10-15 reps
    Front Squats: 3 sets x 10-15 reps
    Leg Extensions: 2 sets x 10-15 reps

    Hamstrings
    Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Standing Unilateral Leg Curls: 4 sets x 10-15 reps

    Calves
    Standing off of block Calf Raises: 3 sets x 15-25 reps
    Seated Calf Raises: 3 sets x 15 reps

    Friday
    Delts/Traps/Abs

    Delts
    Seated Dumbbell Military Press: 2 sets x 10-12 reps +2 x 10-15 Arnold press
    Side Dumbbell Lateral Raises: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Bent Dumbell Rear Raises: 2 sets x 10-15 reps


    Traps
    Barbell Shrugs: 4 sets x 10-15 reps
    Dumbbell Shrugs:2 sets x 10

    Abs
    Decline Bench Crunches: 4 sets x 15 reps

    Saturday: Off

    Sunday: Off

    Cheers-

    Swole
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    I could not agree more mate (reply to 'type o hero', about latic acid and soreness)
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    • I would put deadlifts at the beginning of your Monday session and nix the pulldowns and (maybe) DB rows in favor of pullups or chinups. If you have to, break for 20 or so minutes after deadlifts for some recovery before you hit the rest of your routine. Training them following several low-back-intensive exercises is asking for trouble; not to mention your overall force generating ability (thus overall load) will be lower due to fatigue. You could probably also drop the preachers and incline curls and still have plenty of bicep work. Chin-ups and rows will accomplish most of your work there, so one emphasis exercise should get the job done.
    • Get dips in your life for your chest session. I would nix the flyes, but that's just me. Also, you can drop the kickbacks. The mass you can lift is insignificant in comparison to movements such as close bench, pressdowns, dips, etc.
    • Leg extensions and curls are pretty low on the totem pole, and you're already doing 8 work sets of squats. If you want another posterior chain exercise, reverse-hypers, glute-hams, or BB bridges will provide far more benefits than leg curls. For the anterior side of things, lunges, split squats, etc. will be much more beneficial. You are doing 8 work sets of prior squats, though, so you may be able to get away with one posterior chain movement post-squats. Remember, there's a difference between working your body and tearing it down.
    • Standing overhead presses and perhaps one DB press will be plenty for your anterior/mid delt work (especially considering your chest work earlier in the week). You should also include a reverse flye/face pull-esque movement to get a little rear delt work in.
    • Finally, rotational movements and planks, bridges, etc. should be part of your abdominal work. Our abs do, after all, perform more tasks than just trunk flexion.
    Just be sure to keep an eye on your training volume (including warm-up sets). Extended periods of high volume should definitely be followed by lower-volume phases of training and restitution/off weeks to allow for recovery.
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    The above post makes some great points.

    Also, I don't know how long you plan on running this set up for, but I would advice incorporating some sort of periodization. Non-linear periodization seems to produce the best results, at least in the research and many of my experiences. Try arranging your work into 2 or 3 movements, and running different set/rep schemes for 2-4 weesk with each.

    For example:

    week 1-3:
    Pushing: 11-15
    Pulling: 7-9
    Lower: 4-6

    Week 4-6:
    Pushjing: 4-6
    Pulling 12-15
    Lower: 7-9

    Week 7-9:
    Pushing 7-9
    Pulling 4-6
    lower 11-15


    Br
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    I tend to take the block approach most of the time when it comes to periodizing, but I see where you're coming from, from a general population standpoint. Most normal people (I don't mean that in a negative sense) aren't overly concerned with RFDs, power numbers, sprint times, etc. I will say we've seen great results with our athletes utilizing block periodization--findings we'll hopefully publish in the near future. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattsams89 View Post
    I tend to take the block approach most of the time when it comes to periodizing, but I see where you're coming from, from a general population standpoint. Most normal people (I don't mean that in a negative sense) aren't overly concerned with RFDs, power numbers, sprint times, etc. I will say we've seen great results with our athletes utilizing block periodization--findings we'll hopefully publish in the near future. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose.
    What time frame are you infering here?
    Always open light. Itís not what you open with, itís what you finish with. Louie Simmons
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattsams89 View Post
    I tend to take the block approach most of the time when it comes to periodizing, but I see where you're coming from, from a general population standpoint. Most normal people (I don't mean that in a negative sense) aren't overly concerned with RFDs, power numbers, sprint times, etc. I will say we've seen great results with our athletes utilizing block periodization--findings we'll hopefully publish in the near future. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose.
    You'll have to point me in the direction when those come out.

    Periodizing for bodybuilders where competition is soley based off muscular development and leaness, and periodizing for athletes where competitions is based off several performance variables are two entirely different animals; especially if you take into acount peaking for a single competition vs. a season or multiple comps, in season vs. off season, etc.

    What sports/events are you working with up there in placid?

    Br
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZMIDLYF View Post
    What time frame are you infering here?
    Not sure if you're referring to long-term or short-term training, but I'll assume short term.

    In terms of block length, it's somewhat dependent on the athlete's training age as well as what's going on competition-wise. With our higher trained athletes, our "normal" block is about 4 weeks in duration. During interim times between competitive seasons and world championships, block length can get pretty hairy--blocks of 3 or 4, two phases of 3, etc. The primary driver is what we're focusing on. For our athletes competing in world champs, they got back about two weeks ago. We had a brief (one week) overreach followed by an increased emphasis on power and speed, as worlds begin next week. At that point, we'll be completely focused on performance, so we will have a pretty big taper this week and next week. Overall, though, 4 weeks is a "typical" training block for our athletes.

    Now, younger athletes obviously need more emphasis on the base of the "pyramid." Thus, while training blocks may still be 4-6 weeks, we might repeat the same stimulus in the following block. For instance, we have some junior developmental athletes who are between 13-16. We had them perform a strength block of 3x5s (this was a little ways into training). They're all pretty new to training so we followed up with a second block of 5s before returning to 10s the following block. For the few who are competing in junior competitions, we transitioned them to (slightly) more power-oriented training.

    Loading in a typical block follows 3:1 loading:unloading, though unloading is a pretty loose term. While down weeks typically follow a decreased intensity/volume, this is sometimes accomplished through a drop to 5s (if you're training 10s) or 3s (if you're training 5s) while maintaining a higher overall intensity for the week. You still decrease the total load on the body, but the intensity is allowed to stay higher without overly stressing the neuromuscular system.

    Hopefully that's what you were looking for.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    You'll have to point me in the direction when those come out.

    Periodizing for bodybuilders where competition is soley based off muscular development and leaness, and periodizing for athletes where competitions is based off several performance variables are two entirely different animals; especially if you take into acount peaking for a single competition vs. a season or multiple comps, in season vs. off season, etc.

    What sports/events are you working with up there in placid?

    Br
    Of course. I suppose I should rephrase. For those not interested in bodybuilding competitions (just the regular Joe looking to better his body composition, get stronger, play intramurals, etc.) I would still follow a modified block approach. For someone looking to compete in bodybuilding, though, training philosophy has to adapt. I suppose you could still perform a modified block approach--you would have different emphases, rep ranges, exercises, etc., but the overall concept would be the same. I could be off my mark, as my experience with bodybuilding is much less than with athletes.

    We mainly work with the "sliding" sports, so bobsled, skeleton, and luge, but we also train an aerialist and a few biathletes. Also, my boss works directly with canoe/kayak, so they make an appearance at the beginning of their prep phase (they snowshoe, cross-country ski, etc. for their aerobic training).
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    No kidding. Two of my classmates trained up there for a brief time as they tried out for the skeleton team back in 09-10.

    And I agree with you regarding the block approach for both weekend warriors and bodybuilders; however, for many not familiar with periodization at all I think a simple NLP is a good way to start. It also seems to produce the best gains in hypertrophy (at least, from the research I've seen) when compared with linear periodization during a split routine.

    Just out of curiosity, do you do any application with post activation potentiation? It seems everytime I open up the NSCA Journal of strength and conditioning research, a good 33% of the studies are regarding it.

    Br
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED
    No kidding. Two of my classmates trained up there for a brief time as they tried out for the skeleton team back in 09-10.

    And I agree with you regarding the block approach for both weekend warriors and bodybuilders; however, for many not familiar with periodization at all I think a simple NLP is a good way to start. It also seems to produce the best gains in hypertrophy (at least, from the research I've seen) when compared with linear periodization during a split routine.

    Just out of curiosity, do you do any application with post activation potentiation? It seems everytime I open up the NSCA Journal of strength and conditioning research, a good 33% of the studies are regarding it.

    Br
    Good point. Block can get pretty complicated when you go deeper down the rabbit hole, so it's probably best to have some knowledge before you use it.

    Most of our athletes potentiate pre competition via heavy quarter squats or midthigh pulls--movements that will get the nervous system going without inducing fatigue. We've seen results anecdotally, but their sliding schedule hasn't allowed us to directly measure its effect on the push. We have run a few unpublished pilots with jump performance with mixed results. Only time will tell.
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