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    opinions on a workout i built


    heres a new workout i built a minute ago, some feedback would be cool. workouts is probably the place where im least knowledgeable...i guess im moving more toward a 5x5, strength/dont hurt myself workout lol i think 5 day split is better than 4 for me, more time between muscle groups. i currently do a 4 day split and shoot for 8-13 reps

    5 day and 1or2 off days (OP is optional)
    1. chest/abs
    2. back
    3. shoulders/abs
    4. bis/tris
    5. legs/abs

    1. CHEST
    warm up - db flys - 2x12
    incline db - 4x5
    hanging dips - 4x8
    OP cable internal rotation - 2x12
    OP cable external rotation - 2x12
    smith machine decline - 4x5
    smith machine flat - drop set
    ABS
    laying leg lifts 3x50
    laying leg side to side - 3x25

    2. BACK
    warm up - wide grip pull ups 5x5
    high row - 5x5
    low row - 3x12
    lat pull machine - 5x5
    smith machine shrugs front - 2x12
    smith machine shrugs back - 2x12
    smith machine deadlift - 5x5
    OP smith machine row - burnout

    3. SHOULDERS
    warm up - db shrugs - 2x12
    db foward raises - 3x12
    seated lateral raises - 3x12
    military db - 5x5
    rear delt fly - 3x12
    OP upright rows - 3x12
    OP behind neck barbell - burnout
    ABS
    hangin leg lifts - 3x25
    crunch machine 3x25

    4. BI'S
    warm up - close grip chin ups - 2x12
    standing barbell curls - 4x8
    db hammer curls - 4x8
    concentration curls - 4x5
    OP incline bench curls - dropset
    TRI'S
    warm up - push downs 2x12
    arm cable kick back - 4x8
    close bench - 4x8
    weighted bench dip - 4x5
    OP rope - dropset

    5. LEGS
    warm up - seated calf raises 3x12
    leg press - 5x5
    leg curls - 3x12
    leg extensions - 3x12
    squats - 5x5
    front squat - burnout
    OP thigh abduction - 2x12
    OP thigh adduction - 2x12
    ABS
    crunches 3x50
    planks - 3x1min
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...

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    U can say it sucks lol its cool
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    What I like: Calves first on leg day(I have my own reasons.)
    Pullups.
    Abs every other.
    Pullups on back and bi day.

    What I don't like:
    Too much smith
    Heavy compounds halfway through or last.

    Just personal preference though.
    •   
       

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    thanks for the input, actually i like your advice. i had smith machine shrugs from a previous workout, i can change that up. i was considering smith for deadlifts cause i recently hurt myself and am scarred it will happen again, so now i decided to take the deadlift out. ill stick to a light low back like weighted hyperextensions. once im in the smith machine i figured i might as well stay since sometimes its hard to get equiptment, so i can so upright and reg rows with a barbell now. really easy fixes. i also have a weak rotar cuff from benchin with barbell so ill stick with db's for flat and do decline bb where ill be less likely to get hurt. i am so injury prone and i really watch my form. for some reason or another i still seem to get hurt, o well lol. lastely was the heavy lifts later in the workout, recently ive been doing flat db's first and other heavy lifts but then im wore out for my other lifts. im gonna try it this way and see if i like the difference. just like you said it will be a preference thing i need to work out.

    thanks again for the input, repped!!!

    1. CHEST
    warm up - db flys - 2x12
    incline db - 4x5
    hanging dips(weighted) - 4x8
    OP cable internal rotation - 2x12
    OP cable external rotation - 2x12
    flat db - 4x5
    decline barbell - drop set
    ABS
    laying leg lifts 3x50
    laying leg side to side - 3x25

    2. BACK
    warm up - wide grip pull ups 5x5
    high row - 5x5
    low row - 3x12
    iso lat pull - 5x5
    lat push down – 5x5
    barbell shrugs front - 2x12
    barbell shrugs back - 2x12
    hyperextensions – 4x8

    3. SHOULDERS
    warm up - db shrugs - 2x12
    db foward raises - 3x12
    seated lateral raises - 3x12
    military db - 5x5
    rear delt row - 3x12
    upright rows - 3x12
    behind neck barbell - dropset
    ABS
    hangin leg lifts - 3x25
    crunch machine 3x25
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    First, I like your signature.

    As for your workout:

    There is no need for internal shoulder rotations
    External rotations should NOT be optional, and 2-3 sets of 12-15 should be done every few workouts for RC health. You should also add in face pulls and prone scaptions every few workouts.

    Abs: Add in some bridging work. Remove the hip-flexor dominated ab work (leg raises up the butthole) and add in some rotational and weighted movements.

    Back: Pull ups and bent over barbell rows should be the crux of this workout. Switch the regular shrugs for snatch grip barbell shrugs. If you want more, than add in single side (or rotating right, left right left) dumbbell shrugs

    Shoudlers: You need a better warm up. Look up defranco's upper body mobility.

    Up right rows and behind the neck presses are a death sentence for your shoulder joint.
    Forward raises are useless, and will in most cases cause more harm than good.
    Build this day around a strict military press.

    Where are legs?
    Based on your previous post:
    Ditch seated calf raises. There's little potential for soleus growth, and you want to stretch the calves before thigh work.
    Squats should come before all that other stuff. If you want more quad work, then do front squats or olympic high bar squats.
    You need to do hip extension for hamstrings. Glute ham raises or single leg RDL's preferably.
    Add in another isolateral leg movement: split squat, pitcher squat, lunges, travelling lungers, etc.
    I don't think you need the adduction work, but the hip abductor machine is a good idea.

    Br
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    BR, if you're still around, please help me understand why upright rows are so damaging. I literally haven't skipped them in 3 years, and this comes as a huge shock. I value your knowledge in this area greatly. Thanks.
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    Matt, it puts the shoulder in a vulnerable position whereby impingement occurs.

    When the bar passes above the nipples the supraspinatus tendon is impinged upon, especially if the shoulder blades are not retracted. Over time this will lead to inflammation, tendinitis, damage, and weakening of the SS tendon, and eventual RC issues.

    They can adapted to be safer by keeping the shoulder blades retracted and not elevating the bar past the lower chest.

    Br
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    Ahhhhh, once again I thank you for the info. The phone app limits me at the moment but I'm sure you don't even need the reps at this point.
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    My RC thanks you also.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    Matt, it puts the shoulder in a vulnerable position whereby impingement occurs.

    When the bar passes above the nipples the supraspinatus tendon is impinged upon, especially if the shoulder blades are not retracted. Over time this will lead to inflammation, tendinitis, damage, and weakening of the SS tendon, and eventual RC issues.

    They can adapted to be safer by keeping the shoulder blades retracted and not elevating the bar past the lower chest.

    Br
    holly **** i dont knwo where to start on your other post lmao, thanks so much for the help....

    real quick, i stopped doing upright rows a while ago because they didnt feel like a safe lift, just weird and stuff, i was adding them for more rear delt i guess. and i only reposted the parts i changed, so legs and bi's/tri's are the same as above...

    i guess ill tackle one at a time i have back tomorrow and ill try to fix that workout tonight before bed, its 4 am here lol i need to sleep. but hopefully you can help me with the rest some more tomorrow.
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    heres the thing, i have a herniated disk l3/l4 that always gets f'ed up, just hurt it about 8 days ago doing deadlifts. so its sore alot and i try and be careful. bent over rows put alot of tension on that lower part of the back. i had them in my first post, on the smithmachine, i will try a reg light set and report back how it goes tomorrow. gotta go with how i feel though and i hate getting hurt, proper form or not sometimes damage is already done.
    i will also try the snatch grip instead of the reg grip, do you think the behind the back is benificial and should i use snatch grip for that too?
    2. BACK
    warm up - wide grip pull ups 5x5
    high row - 5x5
    low row - 3x12
    iso lat pull - 5x5
    lat push down – 5x5
    barbell (snatch) shrugs front - 2x12
    barbell shrugs back - 2x12
    hyperextensions – 4x8
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    Given the herniated disk, I'd suggest then using a prone supported T-bar row.

    With the lat push downs (shoulder extensions) I'd suggest using ropes and performing higher reps > 12

    Shrugs. Snatch grip and rotating dumbbell (in place of behind the back) if you feel you need it. The snatch grip shrugs really work the entire upper and some of the mid trap. They are a great exercise, and (in my opinion) far more useful than a regular shrug).
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    Ok good plan the lat push down is just what I called it sorry its this machine I tried I really liked, u sit in it and bring your elbows from above your head to behind your back in a half circle motion besides that good plan for tomorrow if u don't mind I would love to discuss my shoulder day after I get back from the gym tomorrow, thanks again
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    Real quick u think I should add t bar rows and keep everything or drop the "cool" machine lol this is a big workout, low and high cable pulley rows good?
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    I know the machine you are talking about. I think cable shoudler extensions are a more effective version of it.

    Br
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    check out this shoulder workout...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i45WpmWmCrI

    i am scarred of the behind the neck exercises, but with the smith machine i feel like i can control how far down i go and not stress it too much.
    i know im no professional but go this video sure does get me pumped and you always want to do what the pros do, ya know. here it is...
    2 sets bent over cable extensions
    2 sets behind neck smith military
    2 sets seated bent over lateral db
    2 sets shoulder machine elbow laterals
    2 sets standing cable extensions
    2 sets leaning incline db lateral raise
    2 sets incline db front raises
    superset
    smith machine military
    cable front raise

    zir red, why is a front raise useless? this workout has the behind the back and front raise, what do you think?

    heres my back workout today, it was so good. those tbar rows were awesome, also i did 5 sets of snatch grip shrugs, you can really feel those throughout the back. the grip was difficult for me to go up in weight but i liked it alot. thanks again!!!
    wide pull ups
    5, 5, 5, 4, 4
    high row - tried 130 on set 3 and could only get 3
    120x5, 120x5, 120x5, 120x5, 120x5
    low row
    70x12, 70x12, 70x10-lost form
    isolat pulldown one arm
    80x5, 90x5, 95x4, 90x5, 90x5
    hammerstrength pullover - really light, used kinda like a stretch
    90x12, 90x12, 90x12
    snatch grip bb shrugs - this grip was hard to hold but i could really feel it in my whole back
    175x10, 195x10, 205x10, 205x10, 205x10
    T bar rows - was careful with my back, i enjoyed this lift. will start heavier next week
    45x10, 70x10, 80x6, 90x5, 105x5
    weighted hyperextensions
    3 sets 25lbx12
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srt4Muscle View Post
    check out this shoulder workout...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i45WpmWmCrI

    i am scarred of the behind the neck exercises, but with the smith machine i feel like i can control how far down i go and not stress it too much.
    i know im no professional but go this video sure does get me pumped and you always want to do what the pros do, ya know. here it is...
    2 sets bent over cable extensions
    2 sets behind neck smith military
    2 sets seated bent over lateral db
    2 sets shoulder machine elbow laterals
    2 sets standing cable extensions
    2 sets leaning incline db lateral raise
    2 sets incline db front raises
    superset
    smith machine military
    cable front raise

    zir red, why is a front raise useless? this workout has the behind the back and front raise, what do you think?

    heres my back workout today, it was so good. those tbar rows were awesome, also i did 5 sets of snatch grip shrugs, you can really feel those throughout the back. the grip was difficult for me to go up in weight but i liked it alot. thanks again!!!
    wide pull ups
    5, 5, 5, 4, 4
    high row - tried 130 on set 3 and could only get 3
    120x5, 120x5, 120x5, 120x5, 120x5
    low row
    70x12, 70x12, 70x10-lost form
    isolat pulldown one arm
    80x5, 90x5, 95x4, 90x5, 90x5
    hammerstrength pullover - really light, used kinda like a stretch
    90x12, 90x12, 90x12
    snatch grip bb shrugs - this grip was hard to hold but i could really feel it in my whole back
    175x10, 195x10, 205x10, 205x10, 205x10
    T bar rows - was careful with my back, i enjoyed this lift. will start heavier next week
    45x10, 70x10, 80x6, 90x5, 105x5
    weighted hyperextensions
    3 sets 25lbx12

    Front raises: You get plenty of anterior delt work during chest presses. In fact, most people have over developed anterior delts. Further, this exercise works scapula protractors (pec minor, serratus). In the bodybuilding population scapula protraction is already excessive.

    Behind the neck press: Again, this puts the shoulder in highly vulnerable position - be it with a lot or little of weight, free weights, etc. The arm is fully abducted and externally rotated. The combination results in the impingement of the biceps tendon and the supraspinatus tendon - ie: they rub against the acromium (that bone at the outside of your shoulder).

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    Just because a pro does something doesn't mean its very effective.

    You want big shoulders, perform over head presses using good form: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rhkA9jMifs

    Notice at the bottom of the rep the elbows are facing forward, not out to the sides. This means that there is not excessive external rotation nor full abduction - much healthier.

    Br
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    got it, thanks again. i dont want to damage myself anymore lol video got me hyped though...hows this
    2 sets bent over cable extensions
    4 sets standing military bb
    2 sets seated bent over lateral db
    2 sets shoulder machine elbow laterals
    4 sets db military - what about db military, standing???
    2 sets standing cable extensions
    2 sets leaning incline db lateral raise
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    Thats a lot of wear and tear on the shoulder joint. I'd suggest (and this is pushing it. Personally, i would remove the laterals)

    4x6 Standing military
    3x10 DB arnold press
    3x10 DB lateral raises
    3x10 rear delt raises
    Face pulls, band pull aparts, external rotations, prone scaptions

    Br
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    my attempt to meet you halfway i respect your knowledge...

    4x6 Standing military
    3x10 DB arnold press
    2x12 bent over cable extensions
    2x12 standing cable extensions
    2x12 external rotations
    3x10 db rear delt raises
    2x12 sets leaning incline db lateral raise
    Face pulls
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    Deal, thanks.

    I would put the external rotations, scaptions, and face pulls at the end and perform 2-3 cicruits of these. They don't require a lot of rest. You could even throw your rear delt work in there too.

    Br
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    i suck at building workouts i feel like i need bigger shoulders. i think theyre my weakest point and these lifts are hard to do heavy.

    the reason i laid it out this way is its hard to go from a bench to cables, especially in a circuit, more than once. the gym is packed most of the time, so ill throw face pulls in with the cable workouts and scaptions in with the incline bench workouts. since they are a easy light lift, i might try and superset them in to save time. well see how it goes tomorrow.

    again big thanks to zir red for steering me toward the shoulder rehab workouts and away from dangerous inpingement lifts. not your exact recommendations but i took alot of your advice...final cut for shoulders tomorrow!

    4x6 Standing military
    3x10 DB arnold press
    3x10 bent over cable extensions
    2x12 external rotations
    3x10 standing cable extensions
    2x12 face pulls
    3x10 db rear delt raises
    2x12 scaptions
    3x10 leaning incline db lateral raise

    i will adjust at the gym, i understand this is a huge workout. cuts will be made during the workout...
    Last edited by Srt4Muscle; 12-17-2011 at 02:51 PM. Reason: added changes
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    here was my shoulder workout for today, man my shoulders were literally hot half way through. i was very happy with it...had to jump around a bit, when the cables were open i just went for them asap cause its hard to get both at one time.
    arnolds
    35x12, 40x7, 35x9
    standing military barbell
    75x7easy, 95x7, 105x5, 100x6
    rear delt-elbows straight, with proper technique this way different than ive been doing
    10x15, 10x15, 10x15
    scaptions-new workout to me, hope i did it right, felt good
    5x20, 10x20
    bent over cable extensions-these were so great ripped my shoulders apart
    10x8, 5x15
    standing cable extensions-felt these were more effective then bent over, burnout like crazy
    5x14, 5x13
    external rotations-10 was all i could do, shoulder were on fire since arnold press
    5x10, 5x10
    ----tried one set of face pulls and did not like it at all, dropped from workout plan
    leaning incline db lateral raise-nice slow movement to finish the day
    10x12, 10x12
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    bi and tri day tomorrow, im happy with the way i have this built already...critques are welcome though

    close grip chin ups 2x12
    push downs 2x12
    standing barbell curls 4x8
    close grip bench 4x8
    db hammer curls 4x8
    weighted bench dips 4x8
    concentration curls 4x8
    cable kick backs 4x8
    cable straight bar dropset
    rope dropset
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    Pictures after shoulder workout, just for fun lol

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    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    I used this work out for the last couples months and my shoulders have separation on almost all 7 heads

    db upright rows
    military press or seated db press
    incline side laterals
    bent over rear delt raises ( elbow out and up and moving in a path perpendicular to your body ~ kai style)
    behind the back cable laterals
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    here was my bi/tri day, i dropped the 2 drop sets at the end they were not necessary lol huge workout. also a great success...

    close grip pull ups, palms in
    8, 6
    push downs
    60x20 easy, 60x10 not so easy
    straight bar curls
    79x9, 79x8, 69x8, 69x6
    close bench
    155x10easy, 175x8, 185x5, 165x7
    hammer curls
    35x8, 30x8, 30x8, 30x8
    weighted bench dips
    25x10easy, 50x10, 50x10, 50x8
    concentration curls
    30x10, 30x8, 30x7, 25x7
    cable kick backs-just got to say this was the best workout
    17.5x10, 17.5x8, 17.5x6, 12.5x8
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    help with legs please, i think im gonna like some of these workouts zir red suggested for legs. i youtubed them lol so i could learn whats up..
    im really new to legs, always been the retarded only upper body guy lol

    warm up - stretch
    squats - 5x5
    hip extensions - 3x12 recommended
    front squat - 5x5 recommended
    thigh abduction - 3x12 recommended
    seated leg press -5x5
    seated calf raises 3x12 ive gained a inch in my calfs doing these in 3 months, IDK
    db lunges - 3x12 recommended
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    What are your goals? Strength? Size? Both?
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    Drop the front squats for Rumanian dead lifts or good mornings. You need more PKC work
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    Quote Originally Posted by thestein1016 View Post
    What are your goals? Strength? Size? Both?
    right now my overall goal is to cut up. i guess it depends on the body part your talking about...for size, i need a bigger bicep peak, and bigger shoulders all around. everywhere else mostly strength.
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    heres how my leg day went...my legs are my weak point, just started working on them so bare with me lol i felt it was a short and sweet day. this was 2 days ago im still hurting from the lunges im sure, great suggestion for those.

    squats
    135x5, 175x5, 185x5, changed form to past parrelle 135x10, 145x9
    glute machine
    120x10, 120x10, 130x10
    hip abduction
    75x12, 75x12, 85x12
    iso knee leg curl
    45x12, 45x12, 55x13,
    db lunges
    30x12, 30x10, 30x8
    calf raises
    90x15, 90x15, 90x15
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    well, if your going for size and staying natural you need to focus on the sarcoplasm or energy fluid of the muscle. Ive been using the 4X routine for quite a while and it has done wonders for me. You could use this for size on your biceps and shoulders and modify it for strength for all the other areas. The 4X also will help you get cut up due to its short rest periods.
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    any comments about leg day would be greatly appreciated, figure i could do my hammy.

    this is alot of chest, what do you think?
    warm up - db flys - 2x12
    incline db - 5x5
    hanging dips(weighted) - 4x8
    flat db - 5x5
    decline barbell - 5x5
    flat barbell - drop set
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    For legs I would move all the free weighted exercise to the front IE: squats and db lunges
    I would do that because you can go heavier with these exercises and theyll require the most core stabilization. If you want you can throw a hack squat into the pic. Everything else seems fine. I actually do a lot of the same movements, however I train more for definition/volume then strength.

    As far as chest goes, im a firm believer that you know your body best. If your body is able to recover from high training like what you posted, then go for it. The only thing I might recommend is switching the rotation of exercises to that of a contract/stretch rotation.
    This is my chest routine
    incline
    flat bench fly (i go super heavy on this)
    flat db
    cable fly (high - med - low)
    decline
    dips till failure

    I train chest twice a week and alternate between starting with incline and decline
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    Quote Originally Posted by thestein1016 View Post
    well, if your going for size and staying natural you need to focus on the sarcoplasm or energy fluid of the muscle. Ive been using the 4X routine for quite a while and it has done wonders for me. You could use this for size on your biceps and shoulders and modify it for strength for all the other areas. The 4X also will help you get cut up due to its short rest periods.
    its hard to explain but im super injury prone. like worst you ever saw lol i swear i stretch, take my vitamins, and use proper technique, dont matter if its light or heavy weight. i seem to strain something somewhere it sucks. so i been lifting high reps for a couple months just thinking i needed to heal or something IDK. but now im leaning toward 5x5 at least trying to keep my reps under 10ish. with a new workout it will take me a week or two to get on track and find out weights and reps for what sets too.
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    Well, IMO i wouldnt stretch before lifting. Stretch in between sets or exercises to "stretch" the fascia tissue. Stretching before lifting loosens the ligaments and actually makes things become non stable

    what do you mean by strain?
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    what exercises can you do with free weights for hammys, i really like the glute machine and abduction, first time i used them.

    far as size goes my chest its my strongest muscle group, strenth isnt bad but my shoulders damaged from beginner years. thats why i try and stick with db's. i like the contract/stretch set up...i do lighter with db flys but i also have my elbow barely bent. i leave cables out cause i dont like waiting for machines and theyre always taken.

    maybe this...
    incline db - 5x5
    incline db flys - 2x12
    flat db - 5x5
    flat db fly - 2x12
    decline barbell - 5x5
    hanging dips(weighted) - 4x8
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srt4Muscle View Post
    what exercises can you do with free weights for hammys, i really like the glute machine and abduction, first time i used them.

    far as size goes my chest its my strongest muscle group, strenth isnt bad but my shoulders damaged from beginner years. thats why i try and stick with db's. i like the contract/stretch set up...i do lighter with db flys but i also have my elbow barely bent. it
    I do deep squats and german valume training so my hamstrings are usually fried after that but you could do stiff legged deadlifts which I do as well.

    I have shoulder injuries as well. You should def stick with dbs but if you are doing flys right, you shouldnt be using any shoulders IMO
    I always warm up my shoulders before I train, even on leg day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thestein1016 View Post
    Well, IMO i wouldnt stretch before lifting. Stretch in between sets or exercises to "stretch" the fascia tissue. Stretching before lifting loosens the ligaments and actually makes things become non stable

    what do you mean by strain?
    recently i "strained" my neck doing slow/negative preacher curls, ****ing 40lbs that was it, my neck cramped on me and i was hurt. had it rubbed out my a massage therapist, iced after. i was hurt for a week or two, but i got in a car wreck in march and had whiplash so the soft tissue damage is probably sensitive.

    was deadlifting about 3 weeks ago, kept good form, back was straight, butt down, looking up, just a little too much stress at the hip and felt like a little pull. stopped the lift and it got worse for 3 days staight. heat pad and ice again...

    i dont know, if those are strains...just injuries. i dont feel like it was because of bad form but i could be wrong. one time i got injured from bad form though, literally tore my tricep bouncing the ezbar doing skullcrushers, put me out for a couple months. it looks funny now lol hangs over my elbow some. never went to get it checked out but it was sick, all swole and red, just felt a ping and tear...dont know if thats exactly what it was but i definetly looks deformed a little when i straighten my arm and my tri hangs out over my elbow by a half inch.
    Corn is to popcorn as, prohormones are to steriods...
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