Working too hard?
- 05-26-2009, 07:51 PM
Working too hard?
Just curious if you guys think i'm hitting it too hard.
I have never been able to get big, always been the skinny guy but in recent years i put on a little bit of a gut. I also have a very high tolerance for exercising and pushing myself. More normal routine has been:
AM - 100 crunches, 100 oblique crunches, 100 leg lifts, as many pull ups and dips for one set(hft)
PM - 20min hiit, Chest, Back,abs (usually 4 sets 8-10 reps and 4 different exercises per part)
AM - pull ups, dips
PM - 20min hiit, 100 flys, 100 lat pulls, 20min 80% mhr cardio
AM - 100 situps, 100 in and outs, 100 fifer scissors, dips, pullups
PM - 20min hiit, arms, shoulders, abs (usually 4 sets 8-10 reps and 4 different exercises per part)
AM - pull ups, dips
PM - 20min hiit, 100 curls, 100 tricep kickbacks, 100 shoulder lifts, 20min 80% mhr cario
Friday & sat same pattern with legs i think you get the point. Sunday I rest.
I also want to note i'm using novedex to try and get some gains as well as using sizeon.
Should i tone it down some?
- 05-26-2009, 10:23 PM
'Normal routine' is a problem in itself. If you're muscles are used to something, they aren't going to grow. They've adapted to your routine.
Your workouts seem to be designed to keep someone small...could just be me.
If you're trying to gain some size, spend 45 minutes to an hour on one muscle group per day. This allows for 2 days off a week for recovery. Heavy weight, 4-5 exercises, 4 sets per exercise, 6-8 reps per set. Take some time between sets 90+ seconds so you can crank out another set with the same strength and intensity as the set before.
Also, diet. How many calories are you taking in?
Welcome to the board."I am legally blind and if I can Squat,deadlift and over all get myself to the gym then anyone can get their a$$ in gear and get strong!!" - malleus25
- 05-26-2009, 10:37 PM
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05-26-2009, 10:52 PM
Thanks for the welcome! Well i have been following the p90x pattern. Though p90x seemed not very hard (went from couch potato to doing plyometrics on the first try, which everyone said was impossible). I'm following the muscle group routines but i'm using heavier weights. So instead of pushups i'll bench, or do heavier curls where i max at 8-10 reps instead of 20.
If the exercise i'm doing doesn't look like it will hurt me then i guess it's okay, i don't want to be super huge but would rather aim for a ryan reynolds in blade type build.
Thanks for the replies!
05-27-2009, 09:46 AM
look into a 3-4 day split and start doing it... Im sure it will workout much better than your current routine...
and no one can tell you when you are overtraining... you have to listen to your body. It will let you know when you are overtraining...
One way to tell is to weigh yourself after you go the bathroom every morning... if you suddenly drop 5 lbs or more overnight for no reason then you are over training...
SFW and GFH
05-27-2009, 10:04 AM
What is your actual goal? If you want to put on even a little muscle and lean out, I agree with the above suggestions of changing your split up. Do you need to be athletic and have a bunch of muscle endurance for sports? Then your workout might be ok. If you really break down what you are doing during the week, it looks like you are doing abs in 4 different sessions on just mon and tues. Then prob on fri as well, didn't understand how the end of your week goes. You are doing something for each muscle group it looks like at least 4 times a week. Pullups and dips in Am and flyes and lat pulls in PM is chest and back, twice in 1 day. Then you do it again later in the week. That's quite a bit of work for each muscle group. If your stats are correct, you would have to do quite a bit of targeted lifting and a ton of eating to get huge at 6'3". So I don't think you have to worry about that part. Are you working too much? I think so.
Again tell us what your goals are and we can give you a better response. Also what is your diet like? If you are wanting to shed some fat, we can help you there as well. If you are eating enough, you could possibly recover enough to do more work later on, but we could help you become more effective and efficient and possibly free up some more of your time away from working out.
05-27-2009, 12:44 PM
Diet is usually:
wake up at 6:45 and do AM exercise
8:00 protein shake (myoplex 42g protein, 23g carb, 3g fat)
10:00 oatmeal with cinnamon, splenda, and 1/4cup soy milk
12:00 lunch i usually try to do something decent like salmon and veggies
3:00 protein shake (nectar 46g protein, 0 carb, 0 fat)
3:30 PM workout with Sizeon (0g protein, 31g carb, 0g fat)
5:00 protein shake (nectar 46g protein, 0 carb, 0 fat)
8:00 dinner (usually el pollo loco or chicken wrap)
10:00 bedtime protein shake (nectar 46g protein, 0 carb, 0 fat)
as for my goal
http www sixpacknow com/ryanreynolds_marie_claire.jpg
(had to remove stuff because i can't post links yet)
I'm aiming for something like that so not huge at all just very cut and low body fat.
and 12%bf according to 7 point caliper test
When i started working 9 weeks ago i was:
Also my weight usually does go down 3-4 lbs a night if i don't eat junk food before bed but i only change weight by +-.4 lbs from morning to morning
So i'm assuming that i'm not working too hard being as that i still have the energy to do more?
05-28-2009, 09:55 AM
So i'm assuming that i'm not working too hard being as that i still have the energy to do more?
Not necessarily, could be yes, could be no. Your diet seems ok, could use some more dietary fat. Based on what you wrote, and making assumptions on macros for the items that sometimes vary, you are probably hitting 220-240g prot. depending on how much oats and what you have at dinner, 100-150g carbs, and fairly low fat. Losing 15lbs in 9 weeks is a good solid progression, not to drastic. If your bodyfat tests are accurate, and my math is coroect, you went from 158lbs Lean body mass at start weight of 208, to a Lean body mass of 169 lbs with lower bodyfat. On paper, you seem to be on track of your goal. I just don't know how long you can continue this workout plan before you start to possibly have negative effect. You might be getting to the point where the fat is harder to burn and you start too much muscle. I would assume, you probably don't want to get much lower than 185-180 at most as tall as you are. If you can hit 185, and maintain as much muscle, at 8%, you would have about 14lbs of fat and 171lbs LBM. If you don't know this, one school of thought when cutting is to contiunue to lift fairly heavy, sets of 6-10 or so. This way you still stress your muscles and they generally keep their harder appearence. As opposed to doing multiple sets of 15-20 reps, "to burn the fat", your muscles won't continue to "damage and repair stronger" so to speak. When You get your BF down to 8% or so, I would suggest doing a 3-4 split liek mentioned. If today, you revamped your workout so you did each muscle group once a week, but hammered them in each workout, it will be such a shock to your muscles since they have been doing the same thing, same stress, same motion, for 9 weeks. It might help maintain the muscle better as bf% gets lower.
"Also my weight usually does go down 3-4 lbs a night if i don't eat junk food before bed but i only change weight by +-.4 lbs from morning to morning."
Explain this a little better, it's kind of confusing.
Also, if you have been super strict on diet for 9 weeks, with no real cheating, it might help to have a cheat day. Not a ton of crap food, just more total calories for the day. Maybe even as high as 750-1000. It can shock your system with the influx of calories and may "stoke the fire" if your system has slowed a bit from reduced calories.
How do you look in the mirror? Do you look like you want to? If you can post a before and after pic, it might help.
Again, I think you can acheive exactly what you want, and spend almost half the time. You don't have to workout 3-4 hrs day, 6 days a week to reach your goal. You didn't start out 100lbs overweight, so it's not like you are on the biggest loser.
Sorry for the long post, sitting at work with nothing to do. I know others can add plenty of knowledge as well. Hope this helps some.
05-28-2009, 01:01 PM
Well my AM workout is only 10-20 minutes, and my PM workout is about an hour. I don't have a before pic, but i was never "fat" just started getting more belly fat than i wanted. I feel like i could use a little more muscle, and since i'm around 11%BF now i want to get down to 5-8%.
My workouts are usually 8-10 reps for my sets, i do the 100's on cardio days just to get that burn. It seems that no matter how hard i lift i don't really feel it.
To explain the weight loss thing i posted, someone said if i lose 5 pounds overnight that it is bad. I always lose around 4 pounds when sleeping (water weight i guess). I was trying to say that day to day though my weight doesn't change much at most a half pound.
Also i do have some cheat days, sometimes In'n'out just sounds to good to resist lol.
What is the split? I've heard i should eat a lot more and build some more muscle first then try to lose fat, but really and rather have low body fat and not be huge over having tons of muscle and being undefined.
05-28-2009, 01:39 PM
The good news is it's not too late to learn. Get on a routine mentioned above, learn how to actually squeeze the muscle you are working, no matter which one, and I promise you won't be able to complete a week of your current routine. Quality reps count more than how many and how much weight.
05-28-2009, 03:35 PM
ah i think maybe i didn't explain the 100's very well...
on monday i do curls with dumbbells at like 45lbs(no laughing) each hand i'll do 3-4 sets of 8-10 reps. Then on tuesday as part of my cardio i do 100 curls with maybe 15lbs the goal with this apparently from what i've read (and felt) is to activate more fast twitch muscle and increase fat burning as part of cardio. So i'm trying to build by lifting heavy weights on my weight training days (mon,wed,fri) and doing the 100's as part of cardio. As for the pull ups and dips i just do one set as many as i can each morning as part of high frequency training. The goal of this is to just increase the reps of whatever exercise it is. For example i was only to do 6 pull ups a week and a half ago and now i'm up to doing 9.
So tldr version is
-I do highfrequency training to increase reps and i do this daily (takes 5 minutes)
-I do normal weight training on monday wed and friday and switch between super sets and standard sets every 3 weeks to keep muscle confusion
-I do cardio on tue thur and sat which includes hiit, abs and doing 100's at light weight for the previous days muscle group
100's being one set of 100 reps to "feel the burn"
and my abs workout is based off of the p90x abripperx program
05-29-2009, 08:34 AM
The slow twitch muscle fibers are for endurance-sets of 100, P90x style training. The problem is they don't "grow" like the fast twitch. Fast twitch are for short bursts of energy-sets of 8-10. To develop more muscle growth for that more defined, hard, ripped look, you have to work on these. No matter what you do, you have to give your muscles time to recover=a couple days. You can train this way, 3-4 day split, targeted muscle group training, so that each muscle group gets worked hard, ONE day a week, and your muscles will recover better, and will grow. Muscles don't grow when you are throwing weights around doing sets. They grow at night, and days after with rest as they repair the damage you do during your sets. Maybe you didn't know this, but this is one of THE MOST IMPORTANT parts of building muscle, even not a ton of muscle, like you want.
The good news is you have shed quite a bit of BF already. It's easier to gain lean mass starting at a lower BF, since the extra BF you will gain in the process won't turn you into a tub-o-lard. You should be able to gain mass without going much above 15% or so.
You obviously have the work ethic, and desire needed. I suggest since the weekend is here, take the next week off from training. Maybe go for a slow relaxing stroll 3-4 days, but nothing taxing. Even if you insist on doing your same program, your body needs a break from it. During the week, work on developing a 3-4 day lifting program. I recommend each muscle group once per week starting out. Chest/shoulders, back, legs, arms, with abs 2-3 days at most. You should do no more than 2 days in a row, a day rest in between lifting days. Since you like to do AM and PM style, you can do cardio in AM with abs maybe, and lift in PM. Get 2 days complete rest during the week, split up preferrably. On those days you could go for a leisurely walk, but not much more than that.
For me personally, I like to lift in a split like this based on my schedule I ususally lift PM after work
tues-am light cardio and abs sometimes, nothing in PM
thurs-either arms or legs, just depends
fri- arms or legs (i like legs on fri since I don't do much cardio on weekends while legs hurt like hell and they are recovered enough to do cardio back on monday)
Sat-arms/abs if I didn't get arms done earlier in week. Otherwise REST
Pick 3-4 exercises for each muscle group, do 3-4 sets of 8-10, with the tenth rep being hardest, but still using proper form. Pyramid weight up each set, meaning first set do 10, add a little, try 10 again, add a bit more for 8, add enough weight each set, but don't go lower than 6 reps.
You should feel a burn in your targeted muscle you are working. If you don't, you have to correct your form until you do. When you are done with your arm workout, your arms should be jello and have a hard time reaching up to scratch the back of your head. Then you will know you hit your target.
Do this type training for 4 weeks, using different exercises or different order of same exercises each week. After 4 weeks, do 3-4 weeks using reps in the 6-8 range. Then do 4 weeks in 12-15 rep range. After 12 weeks, you should notice your muscles getting better shape, more dense, even if you aren't taking in a ton of extra calories. They won't really get alot bigger until you go about 500 more calories over maintenance, but they should start to look better and get harder.
One other question is , go you go to a gym or workout at home? If at home, what do you have to use? It's going to matter when determining what kind of exercises you do.
Post up a proposed plan, let us tweak it if need be, and just relax for a week. You aren't going to lose your progress in a week and your body will respond better to training again afterwards. Hope this helps some.
05-29-2009, 11:21 AM
Thank you for your reply.
So this last weds i did my arms (bi, tri, delts).
20 min Hiit
Curls 85lbs 8-6reps then 65lbs 8-8reps
Tricep Overhead 60lbs for 8-8-6-6 reps
Side should raise 20lbs each hand for 10-10-10-10 reps
chinpull 70lbs 10-10-8-8 reps
arnold press 35lbs each hand 7-7-6-6 reps
I think that maybe i do understand. I think my problem is i am to over eager to get rid of the remaining fat i have before vacation I have 3 weeks left. I'm going to take the next couple days off.
I really don't want to take a break quite yet being as that i was really trying to get under 10%bf before my vacation, especially since i don't think i'll be working out for that week and i'll be eating badly.
Do you think that for the next three weeks i could focus on some fat burning program and take a break from the lifting? Then after my vacation I'll start a new plan of lifting?
I work out at home and at a gym.
At home i have dumbells and a dip/pullup tower.
And i can go to 24 hour fitness or my works gym.
So any recommendations for getting rid of this last few pounds of body fat in 3 weeks? Other than supps.
For my new lifting plan
Would a plan like this work:
Mon - Chest Delts Traps
Tue - Cardio Abs
Wed - Arms, Mid Back(rows)
Thurs - Cardio Abs
Fri - Legs, Lower Back
Sat - plyometrics
sun - off totally
Or should i just throw cardio on the days i'm actually lifting and take the tue and thursday off?
05-29-2009, 12:08 PM
That new program looks pretty good. You could probably take one of those cardio days out and do 20 mins after lifting on those days. On non llifting days, do more intense cardio, and lifting days, more moderate after since you will be spent already. As far as last couple weeks, do what you proposed. Give yourself 60 seconds rest between sets, or do supersets to increase the intensity. You can just do the extra cardio. Others will probably have more ideas on last bit of fat burning. I think you will be suprised at how your body will respond. Going overboard at crunchtime when trying to reach your goal, usually doesn't go to well. Ask anyone that tried something new or extreme the last week before a BB Comp and ended up worse than they should have.
05-29-2009, 12:12 PM
Here is a good basic 4 day routine that I like pretty well because it has the basics, changes reps and sets, and is fairly quick to get through each workout. Just click download and print the pdf file.
06-03-2009, 10:02 AM
you are working each muscle group WAY TO OFTEN.
06-05-2009, 09:52 AM
Originally Posted by Matt6969
Incline T-bar rows 3 sets x 10 reps
One arm dumbell rows 3 sets x 8 reps
Bent-over barbell rows 3 sets x 8 reps
Lat pull downs 3 sets x 15 reps
Seated upright row machine3 sets x 15 reps
Hammer strength pull downs 3 sets x 15 reps
Seated low cable row 3 sets x 20 reps
Rear delts on fly machine 4 sets x 10 reps
Bent over dumbell rear laterals 4 sets x 10 reps
Incline bench press 2 warm-up sets and then 3 sets x 8-12 reps
Flat dumbell press 3 sets x 10 reps, drop set on last set
Hammer strength incline press 3 sets x 10 reps
Weighted dips (with chains) 3 sets to failure
Cable crossovers 3 sets x 15 reps
Standing dumbell curls 3 sets x 8 reps
Standing barbell curls 3 sets x 12 reps
Preacher curls 3 sets x 12 reps
Tricep pushdowns 3 sets x 15 reps
Seated dip machine 3 sets x 15 reps
Rope pushdowns 4 sets x 12 reps
Leg extensions 2 warm-up sets x 100 reps
Squats 2 light sets then 2 heavy sets to failure
Hack squats 3 sets x 10-15 reps
Leg press 3 sets x 30 reps
Seated leg curls 3 sets x 15 reps
Standing leg curls 3 sets x 10 reps
Lying leg curls 3 sets x 12 reps
Deadlifts 3-4 warm-up sets then 4-5 heavy sets x 5-8 reps
Military press 2 warm-up sets and then 3 sets x 10 reps
Squats3 sets x 12 reps
Side laterals 3 sets x 8-12 reps
Dumbell front raises 3 sets x 8 reps
Upright rows 3 sets x 12 reps
Working them TOO OFTEN seems to be what you are doing too.
06-05-2009, 12:07 PM
Well i've switched to a GVT style workout for now
Monday Chest Abs
Wed Cardio - Abs
Fri Arms/Shoulders Abs
Sat off (swimming)
I do 30 minutes of cardio every day but i dedicate wed to more cardio.
And GVT seems to really be working
06-05-2009, 12:24 PM
06-05-2009, 12:42 PM
I'm actually trying the anabolic diet, still making me feel like crap but tomorrow is carb day so hopefully i'll get through it.
06-05-2009, 12:58 PM
CURRENT 2014 Log http://anabolicminds.com/forum/old-school-hormone/252748-cherry-poppin-test.html
06-05-2009, 12:59 PM
06-05-2009, 01:14 PM
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