[Emerge]

Hey guys, I just finished my summer recomp/cut and I'm getting ready for my winter bulk. Last year I did a very succesful dirty bulk, but I gained a lot of fat to go along with it and I want to avoid that this time around.

I was doing a 5-6 day split this summer, but for the winter bulk I want to switch to a 3 day split mainly because of a new job I got and school that is going to kick my ass, so I'll need extra days to study.

This winter I want to focus on growing my shoulders, lats, and legs as much as possible. I was thinking of this type of split:

1 - Shoulders, Chest, Tris
2 - Lats, Back, Bis
3 - Legs

My whole lifting career I focused on chest before shoulders, and lower back before lats, so now I'm a little uneven for my liking. However, I do not want to lose any of the gains I've made this far on my chest or any other body part.

Can I work my shoulders before chest and not have any negative impact? Also how many sets and exercises should I use for each body part?

[suncloud]

if you're bulking and can't spend much time in the gym, get a partner and do DC training. or do 5x5 three times a week.

i have no idea if you can work shoulders before chest, though i don't see why not - if shoulders is what you want to build, by all means, do them first since any chest workout you do will be to maintain your gains rather than to build up on them. if you're bulking, 4 sets of 8-10 is what i would recommend. 4 sets is usually optimal for maximum testosterone output. you can also do 4 sets of 6, then try for one extra rep the next workout, one more, and so on until you get to 10 reps, then add 5 pounds and start at 6 reps again. this will give you strength gains as well as mass. that way when you cut, you'll also be stronger. and its an easy way to measure progress.

i've never been able to gain much fat while bulking, so hopefully someone with a more similar body type to yours answers this as well. hopefully my advice is good for all body types, but i really don't know whats optimal for you.

[Emerge]

I'm trying to figure out how many sets per body part.

Something like this

9 Sets for Shoulders with 3 different exercises
4 Sets for Chest on 1 exercise
and 6 Sets for Triceps on 3 different exercises

That is more along the lines of what I'm asking.

Can I get a link to 5x5 or DC training?

[suncloud]

Everything & Anything DC!!!!!!!!!!
thats our DC forum. kinda wish we had a 5x5 area - look it up on google, or PM renegaderows - he's probably our "in house" expert on this style of training by now.

here's how i'd break it down for you since you're bulking up - and this is by no means perfect:
do compound movements first. do 4 sets of 6-10 of whatever you are training - example: start shoulders with military press and upright rows. then do 2 sets of 6-10 for the smaller muscles that aren't getting hit properly (rear delts, etc). 4 sets of 10 is what builds mass, and 2 sets of 10 will maintain any area you think needs additional "maintenance". sure, those areas won't grow as much, but compound moves will put on the most muscle the fastest.

here's the list of compound moves and body part (IMHO)
back - pull ups
back - deadlifts (increases free flowing testosterone by 15%)
biceps - barbell curls
biceps - chin ups (weighted if needed)
calves - donkey calf raises
chest - barbell bench (increases free flowing testosterone by 8%)
chest - dips (body forward, legs back)
hamstrings - straight legged deadlifts (ask Kai Greene) - forces your hamstrings to act as the main stabilizer muscles.
legs - squats (raises free flowing testosterone by 20%)
legs - the sled (a.k.a. leg extension)
shoulders - military press
triceps - dips (weighted if needed, body upright, legs as straight as possible)
triceps - close grip bench
overall - overhead squat (best growth hormone booster)
overall - clean and press

[Hbs6]

DC was good for hypertrophy, but I dont know if you are concerned with raw strength at all but if you want to prime yourself so to speak by getting your CNS firing I would really look into a solid powerlifting type routine. I know you might hate me for saying that but I have had amazing results using that style of training.

[Emerge]

I do a lot of power cleans, hang cleans, and clean & press so I am not close minded to the power lifts as long as they get me what I ultimately want.

[Emerge]

Originally Posted by suncloud

Everything & Anything DC!!!!!!!!!!
thats our DC forum. kinda wish we had a 5x5 area - look it up on google, or PM renegaderows - he's probably our "in house" expert on this style of training by now.

here's how i'd break it down for you since you're bulking up - and this is by no means perfect:
do compound movements first. do 4 sets of 6-10 of whatever you are training - example: start shoulders with military press and upright rows. then do 2 sets of 6-10 for the smaller muscles that aren't getting hit properly (rear delts, etc). 4 sets of 10 is what builds mass, and 2 sets of 10 will maintain any area you think needs additional "maintenance". sure, those areas won't grow as much, but compound moves will put on the most muscle the fastest.

here's the list of compound moves and body part (IMHO)
back - pull ups
back - deadlifts (increases free flowing testosterone by 15%)
biceps - barbell curls
biceps - chin ups (weighted if needed)
calves - donkey calf raises
chest - barbell bench (increases free flowing testosterone by 8%)
chest - dips (body forward, legs back)
hamstrings - straight legged deadlifts (ask Kai Greene) - forces your hamstrings to act as the main stabilizer muscles.
legs - squats (raises free flowing testosterone by 20%)
legs - the sled (a.k.a. leg extension)
shoulders - military press
triceps - dips (weighted if needed, body upright, legs as straight as possible)
triceps - close grip bench
overall - overhead squat (best growth hormone booster)
overall - clean and press

So how would this fit in for my Shoulder/Chest/Tri day:

4 Sets of DB Military 8-12 Reps
4 Sets of Upright Rows 8-12 Reps
2 Sets of Incline Barbell Bench 6-10 Reps
2 Sets of DB Flat Bench 6-10 Reps
4 Sets of Dips 8-12 Reps

Is that a decent formula to start and from there I could either add on or take off to my adjustments?

[suncloud]

looks good. give it a shot and tweak it from there. you might want to do 4x10 for inclines (even though your chest is big) just for the added testosterone output you'll get from it. i remember it helped me out a lot.

also, some not too well known trivia, is that the less water you have in your bloodstream, the easier the free flowing testosterone can bind to a receptor (basically your blood is more heavily packed with testosterone). thats not a advocation for not drinking water, thats saying that 20 minutes post workout in a sauna will be very beneficial to your bulk. thats all i got for you brotha. hope i've answered everything i could.

[AUTO]

im presumming you are natural. get on the cables and do super sets till you can't move. loose weight gain a bit of muscle. you can't bulk without putting fat on

[Emerge]

I know I'll put on some fat, but I'd rather not go beyond 18% BF this time around. Last time I got up to 20% BF.

[AUTO]

**** you must eat like a horse, try drinking skim milk it might help take some of the hunger away. 1 litre a day

[suncloud]

you can bulk without getting body fat, but its not fun. no fun at all. i would only recommend it to masochists.

[Hbs6]

Originally Posted by Emerge

I do a lot of power cleans, hang cleans, and clean & press so I am not close minded to the power lifts as long as they get me what I ultimately want.

I love it...thats what i love to see and i bet some people reading are like.... power clean?...toss in some unilateral work and not only will you be big and strong you can also build functional strength and be able to move. DC will get you big but dont you want to be able to use that strength also?

[Hbs6]

Originally Posted by suncloud

looks good. give it a shot and tweak it from there. you might want to do 4x10 for inclines (even though your chest is big) just for the added testosterone output you'll get from it. i remember it helped me out a lot.

also, some not too well known trivia, is that the less water you have in your bloodstream, the easier the free flowing testosterone can bind to a receptor (basically your blood is more heavily packed with testosterone). thats not a advocation for not drinking water, thats saying that 20 minutes post workout in a sauna will be very beneficial to your bulk. thats all i got for you brotha. hope i've answered everything i could.

suncloud, where did you read sets of 4X10 and dehydration post workout with help with test levels?