Total Noob needs advice.
- 04-23-2008, 02:09 PM
Total Noob needs advice.
Hey guys... I am a complete, 100% noob when it comes to supplements. I have done a little research, and I have found a few things that definitely interest me, I'd just like to talk to a pro (or at least someone that knows what they're talking about!) before I start putting combinations of supplements in my body.
Without flaming, would someone like to help me figure out what items I should purchase?
My situation: I am 23 years old, I weigh 125lbs (give/take), and I am 6'1. Yeah, really. I have worked out off and on for years with no impressive results. I am a hardgainer, and I feel like supplements/anabols may be my best bet at this point.
I really just want my arms to be bigger. My chest would be next, but I really want my arms to be bigger than the twigs they are now. I am not as much concerned with energy/etc as this is not for sports, purely appearance.
I am looking to use something extremely effective (and fast!), injectable or not. I would like to use something along the lines of a growth hormone, possibly in combination with a testosterone supp as well as protein.
I would really like to talk to someone via e-mail or AIM/Yahoo Messenger if someone would be willing to help me. Or, if you have any general advice, please post it here! Thank you so much.
- 04-23-2008, 02:17 PM
I can already tell you what kind of advice you're gonna get from here. Eat, Eat, and Eat. And after you've done that, Eat again. At 6'1 125 thats your best bet. You could definately throw some protein and some creatine in there, but other than that diet should be your #1 priority.
04-23-2008, 02:18 PM
1) Quit rooting for OU
2) diet and exercise on a consistent basis will show results
3) You are toooooooooo new to even think about anything Pill or injectable that resembles a steroid. Don't be stupid in thinking it will make you Ronnie Coleman overnight. You still have to work out and have a good diet.
Remember it is a marathon not a sprint.
The only way to get lean mass and KEEP IT, is exercise, diet and TIME.
There are no shortcuts. Go to BB.com for that.
04-23-2008, 02:21 PM
I plan on ordering a protein supplement of sorts, but I also would really like some advice on the other kinds of supplements I mentioned.
Any help would be greatly appreciated! I know you probably can't advertise products here, but I would love to know some products to look up. What are some good products for beginners that are effective?
04-23-2008, 02:23 PM
04-23-2008, 02:26 PM
You should be eating at least 6,000 calories per/day. I would recommend lots of protein and an appetite stimulator.
04-23-2008, 02:29 PM
I dont know why people jump to the conclusion that their bodies arent going to grow. First off you havent been consistant. Second off your diet sucks. Third off im sure your training sucks ass. With this said, you still think that you cant grow? You havent been doing anything right to begin with. How would you know that your body refuses to grow?
Do a bulk, stop worrying about your abs, and arms. In order to grow just eat. Do some searching around.
In my opinion you have been tainted with poison already. Your mindset that you cant get big and that steroids is the answer makes me kind of hesitant to help you out if you ask me. My mindset when I got into this was, I need to grow, and I need to do it naturally. I first started asking about diet/training and here you are asking about anabolics. Just seems to me that no matter what we will say, your social acceptance to anabolics so early on in this point will drive you to a dead end.
04-23-2008, 02:30 PM
Test or hgh would be a very dumbazz thing to do. At 6'1" and 125 your diet and exercise regiment is what is holding you back. If you do not eat right and exercise it doesn't matter what you take. Save the money you would blow on this and join a good gym, then go to the gym and exercise. And eat good food, lose the snacks if they are junk, Protein, Creatine, Bcaa's, food, water(lots).
And Dude, You aren't going to wake up huge. It takes work to get big, You may never get there but you will look better once you start to do the things you need to.
04-23-2008, 02:34 PM
04-23-2008, 02:41 PM
04-23-2008, 02:44 PM
Oh, and just to reiterate, there's no way that @ 125 you couldn't make massive gains by paying a little attention to your diet!
04-23-2008, 03:22 PM
04-23-2008, 03:23 PM
Diet yes I agree completely but also learn how to train. Your not going to put on mass by trying to just and size to your arms. You have to lift heavy duty and first you have to learn how properly to do the heavy duty lifts. Bad training is a really big problem in gyms these days. It's always been bad but it seemst to be getting worse. I have to bite my tongue continuously when I go to a public gym.
When I trained my son, who is admittedly an easy gainer he was 16 with 18 inch arms and he did not train arms directly. What does this tell you, yes he was able to add overall mass performing compound lifts.
Knowledge is key, learn how to diet and lift. Know how to use the 2 P's periodization and progression. Learn that intensity is the most important thing in planning routines, and that if you can even stand after on hour you intensity is to low. Know that technique is always superior to load, never be afraid to take weight of the bar. Learn the movements and routines you tend to repsond to, keep a log. All this takes years and when you've done all this... maybe.. maybe we can talk supplements. All the product in the world will do you little good untill you master these principles.
Ok I'm done now.
Unremarkable is no way to go through life... Doug
04-23-2008, 03:27 PM
Sorry I lied, I'm not done. I just wanted to add the hardest gainer I ever knew was my former partner and he too 3rd in the world 2 years back.
Unremarkable is no way to go through life... Doug
04-23-2008, 03:31 PM
Thanks for your advice. I appreciate your input. I am not sure why test/hgh are such horrible ideas, but everybody here seems to think so, and you guys know much more about this than I do.
I have heard that a good rule for the amount of protein you should intake daily is 1 or 1.5x your body weight. At 125, that would be around 190g. Is there any danger in pushing that over 200g?
Also, when taking protein supplements/shakes, when are the best times to take them? I have heard immediately after working out, and just before sleeping. Will a shake/drink work as well if I drink it in the morning, but don't have the time to work out until later in the evening?
Thanks again for your advice guys, I really appreciate it.
04-23-2008, 03:45 PM
04-23-2008, 03:45 PM
I prefer people use cottage cheese before bed for slower digestion.
As far as powders go, yes about 30 minutes after a workout is really the only time that you could argue that powders are an absolute benefit. The rest of your protein should come for wholesome food sources.
Unremarkable is no way to go through life... Doug
04-23-2008, 03:58 PM
all i have to say is that u are lucky, some ppl would love to have a metabolism like u. but the only way to beat ur metabolism is to eat everything in site, u need to actually train urself to eat whether u want to or not. and for those in between snacks, thats a perfect time to throw in some protein powder.
Diet + Proper Training + Time = Desired Results
04-23-2008, 10:49 PM
Your diet is what will help you pack on some mass. A good rule of thumb is multiply your weight by 15 to get your calorie intake.
125x15= 1875. By eatting more than 1875 calories, you can gain weight. Want to add on a pound a week? 1875+500 calories per day. The math would come out to 500x 7(days)= 3500 (equal to one pound)
1975+500=2375. So start to consume 2375 calories per day if you plan on bulking up. Also what I might want to add is that dont try to go overboard on the calories. Think of it in this type of mindset. A worker can build a house in X time. He needs bricks to build the house. By not fueling enough bricks to him, he cannot build the house. Fueling him with more will allow him to build the house more but there is a limit to how much he can work. Consider the worker your metabolism. Even as the strongest and fastest metabolisms will slap on fat if you go overboard. Try to count calories.
It's much easier than you think.
Try it like this.
1 cup milk (fat free)
1 scoop whey (clean whey meaning 100 calories / 25g of protein or so)
1/2 cup dried oats (big hearty ones, not the instant oats)
1 table spoon of honey
2 scoops of NATTY peanut butter (not skippys or any of that junk. Natty PB shouldnt have salt or sugar, if any verry very minimal amounts of it. If you look at the profile of the PB it should just say peanuts. A good indicator of natty PB is when you can see seperation between the oil of the peanuts.)
Cook the 1/2 cup of oats. in microwave for a minute with water.
Take it out, stick the oats in a blender. Add 1-2 cup milk, 1 scoop whey or caesin protein. 1 table spoon honey, 2 or 1 scoop of PB depending on your preference. Add some crushed ice and blend. I use ON caesin protein with this mix. After drinking down that bad boy you will have consumed about 600+ calories. It's really not that hard. If you start to eat try to keep contents of calories in a 40/30/30 breakdown on bulks. 40 % of your cal come from protein. 30 from carbs 30 from fats.
If you do manage all this 500+ calories per day for say 3 weeks, I am SURE that you will add on a pound or two, reguardless of what type or how fast metabolism is.
Supplements are not needed at all at your point.
When I started asking around, learning I managed to add on 1 pound of mass per week. Started from 170-190 where it stopped and slowed down. You should be able to manage 10-15 pounds on your own. Will all of this be pure mass? Probably not, but depending on how clean you eat will determine the fat contents of the gains you have made. Good Luck. If you want to fix up your diet even more PM me Ill give you a link to general bulking nutrition where you can learn even more.
How's that for a "rude" person? :]
04-23-2008, 11:55 PM
04-24-2008, 06:44 AM
work your legs anmd lower back (squats, deadlifts), back (bent-over rows, pull-ups), chest (dips, bench press), shoulders (shoulder press), and you will "bulk" up, if you eat a lot.
As you "bulk" up, your arms WILL grow too (due to all the growth hormones and testosterone released in training your "larger" muscles, and due to the indirect stimulation).
The only time I've seen a guy with "big" arms but small legs is this freaky hairdresser dude on TV with arm "impants". He had chest implants that look like boob implants, and he was getting butt implants. Really freaky looking dude.
04-24-2008, 08:28 AM
^^Good stuff all in this thread. Yea the only other thing I would mention is invest in a blender, it is better to get ur protein from whole foods but when ur throwing oats, PB, I like to throw fruit in too(banana for instance), you'll be getting some good calories from a shake. Also try strength/ bulk training style such as 5x5 training(just google it) or there's another training style I just found on the forum it's called 20 rep squats. Either of those I think would help a lot.
04-24-2008, 08:43 AM
I understand where you are coming from. I started lifting my junior year of college at 5'11, 140lbs. My arms were twigs, and so was the rest of me. Here is what I learned that really helped me out. Two of my best friends were heavy into lifting, and lifting the right way. They were probably some of the strongest dudes in the gym for their sizes 175 and 195 respectively. Both were pushing 275 and 300 lbs bench press respectively, and sick dead and squat weights as well.
First and foremost, find the motivation to get big. For me it was always being skinny, and always being called scrawny.
Second, find a good training partner, as I can't tell you how much this helps you stay focused and on track. Mine were my two friends and they were a wealth of knowledge.
Third, eat everything you can see. This is the first thing they taught me, Nutrition. I would go to the dining hall and eat 3-4 plates of the healthiest food I could find. Chicken, pasta, bagels w/ pb, rice, olive oil (at the self cook station), hard boiled eggs, burgers, beans, veggies, salad, 3 glasses of milk, and 3 of water. I kid you not, we'd eat 2000+ calories in a sitting because I was a "serious hardgainer" as well. We'd eat until we felt sick, then eat a little more. Then we would get EVEN more, and put it in tupperware containers and fill our backpacks with tupperware containers full of dining hall food (not the best quality but we were poor). In the evening before bed, we would eat spoonfuls of peanut butter.
Fourth, train right. I can't be more grateful for the proper form and technique that they taught me, as they laughed at all the guys who were jerking around with terrible form. Compound lifts will get you bigger faster. You want arms to grow? Do heavy squats, heavy deadlifts, and heavy bench. But those aren't arms you say! No, but these heavy lifts release the most testosterone and HGH in your body, which will make you big everywhere.
Fifth, sleep. Get as much quality sleep as you can. I went from 5'11 140-145lbs and not even being able to bench 115lbs to 175lbs in a little over a year with food, training, and sleep (whey protein and creatine were also included).
So, my advice to you is to follow those steps. Anabolics only make you bigger if you are already successfully accomplishing those things above. My senior year of college I watched a friend of mine take Phera-plex, an oral steroid. He lifted with us, but he didn't eat right or train right; he still partied and did whatever he wanted. He got a little bit stronger...but that was it. They aren't the answer boss, and I think thats what people here are trying to get across to you. Steroids or HGH aren't going to turn you into a monster or give you bigger biceps. Eating, training, and sleeping. Those are the three basic building blocks of building yourself a better body. I made the mistake of trying the alternatives (oral steroids), too early, and although it got me bigger (I was already training and eating right), because I was uneducated I lost all my gains soon after. Good luck boss, and I hope you take the advice you get here seriously.
04-24-2008, 10:22 AM
woah woah, really? I see a LOT of guys in my gym with huge upper body but they dont train their legs at all. And if they do, they consider 3 sets of leg presses a good leg workout.
I think the reason why this happens is because theres a lot of "stuff" being passed around in the gym. One of the gyms which were busted for steroids was closed down. One of the guys involved was this guy in jordan and the pro boxer cindy serrano.
For some reason, they moved over to our gym now with their own boxing area. Ever since then I see some of the guys whom were just beginners catch up to me in terms of size and strength. What took me a year almost took them a month or two.
It's okay though, At least I know of symmetry. SOme of the guys are really stupid. They juice and they only hit arms and chest and they look retarded with flat shoulders and a flat back. It's almost laughable because of the way he grew. It's like seeing a guy on the street with nothing but a unevenly large chest compared to his other body and unevenly large arms compared to his back/shoulders.
This is the reason why it's important also to train other body parts. Dont be an ab,chest,arms kinda guy. When you start to get bigger the lack in training with legs/shoulders/traps/back really give it away that your a juicing baboon with no sense of symmetry.
04-24-2008, 10:26 AM
for sure dude. blenders AWESOME. So much easier to pack in food if you can drink it down. If I didnt do what I was doing now with a blender, I would have to make oats and eat it. drink down protein by itself, eat the banana by itself, and have a natty pb sandwich by itself. you'll get sick of eatting that many things. It's convient as hell to blend everything together and chug it down.
04-24-2008, 02:11 PM
Nabisco - Thanks so much for your advice, that helps me a lot!
Cellar Dude - Thank you too! You are so not rude! I really appreciate your help.
Thanks again everyone, I got lots of useful info from this thread! I hope it helps others in my situation as well!
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